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macstatic

macrumors 68020
Original poster
Oct 21, 2005
2,024
164
Norway
I've got two SSDs in my Mac Pro (both 128 GB) where one is with MacOS 10.11 and the other with 10.12 (upgraded from 10.11 -this is currently a test drive to allow me to see if 10.12 performs well with my apps etc.). For some reason the "Library" folder in 10.12 is much larger than in 10.11 and I'm wondering if 10.12 really needs this much more space, or if there are other reasons for it.

My plan is to continue testing out 10.12, then upgrade my 10.11 drive to 10.12 if all goes well.
Here's a comparison between the two OSes/drives:

"System" folder
10.11: 8.65 GB
10.12: 10.1 GB

"Library" folder:
10.11: 16 GB
10.12: 46.2 GB

"Users" folder
10.11: 2.1 GB
10.12: 905 KB

"Applications" folder
10.11: 25.4 GB
10.12: 24.1 GB
 

dsemf

macrumors 6502
Jul 26, 2014
441
114
I've got two SSDs in my Mac Pro (both 128 GB) where one is with MacOS 10.11 and the other with 10.12 (upgraded from 10.11 -this is currently a test drive to allow me to see if 10.12 performs well with my apps etc.). For some reason the "Library" folder in 10.12 is much larger than in 10.11 and I'm wondering if 10.12 really needs this much more space, or if there are other reasons for it.

My plan is to continue testing out 10.12, then upgrade my 10.11 drive to 10.12 if all goes well.
Here's a comparison between the two OSes/drives:

"System" folder
10.11: 8.65 GB
10.12: 10.1 GB

"Library" folder:
10.11: 16 GB
10.12: 46.2 GB

"Users" folder
10.11: 2.1 GB
10.12: 905 KB

"Applications" folder
10.11: 25.4 GB
10.12: 24.1 GB
You may want to try the following in Terminal. It will show the size for each file and folder. You can drill down by extending the path at the end.
Code:
sudo du -d 1 -x -c -g /Library

DS
 

macstatic

macrumors 68020
Original poster
Oct 21, 2005
2,024
164
Norway
I think I figured it out myself....
I narrowed it down to the "/Library/Application Support/" folder where "TechTool Protection" took up over 20 GB.
Likewise "/Library/Application Support/Garageband/" took up almost 3 GB and "/Library/Application Support/Logic/" used more than 10 GB (I have no idea why there's a "Logic" folder there in the first place as I don't have Logic, but it might have to do with instruments etc. used by Garageband).
Thanks to a free app called Grand Perspective I was able to see where the large files were located.

I don't know how all that stuff got installed in the first place, but at least now I know 10.12 doesn't take up that much more disk space than 10.11 ?
[automerge]1588604748[/automerge]
You may want to try the following in Terminal. It will show the size for each file and folder. You can drill down by extending the path at the end.
Code:
sudo du -d 1 -x -c -g /Library

DS

Thanks -that's pretty useful!
Is there a way to extend this so I can either see the contents of all sub-folders, or perhaps better: list the largest files or folders first, along with their path locations?
 

FarmerBob

macrumors 6502
Aug 15, 2004
313
105
I just had the same problem last week and MicroMat denied that their app was eating as much space as it was. But when pushed by them I went and really looked, it was taking up more than what I stated to them. They keep many archives a day that can add big quickly. I was finally able to direct the storage location to another drive. But you have to run TT first and have it make a couple back-ups first. I suggested that selecting where to put the Back-ups be put of the initial set-up and the Tech said: "Why?!". They're dolts. Plus all the pop-ups constantly. Once clicking OK does not tell it you saw it and stay away. It even told me that I have a failing drive that I took to a buddy with the gear to test it and it passed with flying colors. So it also lies.

I used Activity Monitor to show me where the "Action" and "Large" eaten area was.

If you have TimeMachine on. You don't need this "feature". Just turn it off. Once I got it to store the Back-ups on another drive, I pulled the frequency way back to like once a week. But their initial settings are dangerous for those that have limited space and no idea where it is storing and who is causing it. The "who" part will discovered once you discover the folder that it's being stored in. Even just having it running in the background even causes operational issues. I just turned it off.

I only got TTP to resurrect a drive directory as they claim they and are rated #2 at doing. I was told by Tech Support they don't do that. I was offered a refund. But I'm keeping it since I got a great upgrade price and to get a "competitive discount" on several other disk tools that will do what I really need. I was able to fix the drive manually, without TTP, Disk Warrior or Disk Utility (which screwed it up on the first place).

Years ago TT used to be a really great tool. As was Norton, beleive it or not. Now it's more flash than action. Unless you count eating your drive space. I am now using CCC (CarbonCopyCloner) that I have used for years to back-up, move or clone complete Partitions/Drives for years and Love It!

Go shopping, use TTP to get a discount on another "better" tool and then go get your money back.
 
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macstatic

macrumors 68020
Original poster
Oct 21, 2005
2,024
164
Norway
Thanks for your comments on TechTool Pro.
Honestly I haven't used it for a while and had forgotten all about it. I think I bought it as a means of recovering from possible disk problems, but I've never used it actively. I must have turned the "Techtool protection" feature on at some stage and forgotten about it.

Yes, I definitely use Time Machine, so I'll remember there's no need to use that feature again.
Are you saying Techtool Pro has no real use? I must admit that when I got it I ran all the tests (memory etc.) which was nice, but not much beyond that.

I only got TTP to resurrect a drive directory as they claim they and are rated #2 at doing. I was told by Tech Support they don't do that. I was offered a refund. But I'm keeping it since I got a great upgrade price and to get a "competitive discount" on several other disk tools that will do what I really need. I was able to fix the drive manually, without TTP, Disk Warrior or Disk Utility (which screwed it up on the first place).

Which other tools were those? I've been on the lookout for Disk Warrior for several years, but never got round to buying it as the price is IMHO too high, and they never appear to run discounts either. I'd be interested in hearing which other tools are worth getting, if any.
As always, making regular backups is the number one thing every computer owner can do, and I've actually set up a separate Chronosync backup drive inside my Mac Pro, so I have two backup drives (Time Machine and Chronosync).

Yes, Carbon copy cloner is nice. I used it years ago when it was still free, but Chronosync appears to do the same thing (once set up to clone -not as simple as Carbon Copy Cloner though, but this is first of all a backup app) and I'm happy with that.

Go shopping, use TTP to get a discount on another "better" tool and then go get your money back.

What do you mean? Do competitors sometimes give discounts if you sell them your current TechTool Pro license and choose their product instead?
 

FarmerBob

macrumors 6502
Aug 15, 2004
313
105
I have a 3,1 (running everything that's out), wanting a 5,1, and if you can trust the disc warning data there's that. But I have proof it's more of a toy than anything. But all the other is just for show.

I have the last update, that I know of, of Disk Warrior on Disc. A couple years ago a friend had a drive go out on him and he had a "TrashCan" and no disc reader. We were able to go online and buy a "supplemental" upgrade with my user info and it was a new version that would run from the machine, and not all that long ago. In my searches, Disk Warrior did come up, but where to buy. But what we have worked great in Sierra to fix his drive. But it couldn't fix the drive that Disk Until screwed up.

So in my looking I found two that would suit my needs "Data Rescue 5", expensive, but if you are in trouble, it's cheaper than taking it to a service. The other is "DiskDrill". Not that expensive, but . . .

Here's a link to the search I did: Data/Disk Maintenance Tools.

Good Luck!

Post back what you end up doing. I ordered 4 2T Drives for my 3,1 and will be consolidating my hoarders piles of files from the late 80's that are this machine and archive my external drives so I can use them more frequently.. And then have the box of drives tested for ancillary use.
 

macstatic

macrumors 68020
Original poster
Oct 21, 2005
2,024
164
Norway
I actually have Disk Drill Pro -I think I used it to recover deleted images on a memory card. Thanks for the suggestion for Data Rescue. I probably won't buy any disk-related software in the near future unless I come across a huge discount. Regular backups go a long way ?

I know what you're talking about regarding hoarding files as I'm in the process of cleaning up, and despite having a 3 TB drive it's almost full and I'm considering getting a 6 TB replacement.

A couple of postings back you wrote:
I used Activity Monitor to show me where the "Action" and "Large" eaten area was.

Where/how in Activity Monitor can this be seen? I can't find any option for disk use, only disk activity.

But back to the MacOS 10.12 planned upgrade -I've only superficially tested it (to make sure some legacy apps still work before upgrading), so how does it compare to 10.11 performance-wise? Any features I'll lose or drastic changes which aren't obvious at first that I should know about before I fully commit?
 
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FarmerBob

macrumors 6502
Aug 15, 2004
313
105
. . . Where/how in Activity Monitor can this be seen? I can't find any option for disk use, only disk activity. . . .

In 10.12.6 (Love It!) in Disk Util I clicked on "Disk" in the upper button row in the app, set sort to "Bytes Written" Descending Order (that's clicking on the title so that the arrow is pointing down) and the column put the Process of Tech Tool Pro writing, since it was constantly and the largest, at the top. Over in the far left column shows the name of the process, which was Tech Tool Pro. I selected that line and then click on the "i" in a circle button, got the info window, clicked on "Open Files and Ports" and you get various amounts of code that in it had the path of the folder that was being written to in the Application Support directory which told me that was it, i.e., /Users/(UserName)/Library/Application Support/Tech Tool Pro (might have something more)/(Current File being written named with Date and Time Stamp). So a long time ago I learned to have an "alias" of the "User Library Folder" in the side bar so I don't have to dig for this folder every time I need to get to it. So I click on that got the interior list of files and folders, go to "Application Support", you can set column sorting to "Date Added", which doesn't work for me, or Size, look for Tech Tool Pro and there it was in it's 43GB glory. At the time I deleted all but the latest Back Up. Then when I was able to redirect where the files were saved and created a folder on an archive drive named: "TTP Directory BU" and had the files written there. But it got so out of hand. I just killed the process and tossed all the files. And I thought TimeMachine was bad.

. . . But back to the MacOS 10.12 planned upgrade -I've only superficially tested it (to make sure some legacy apps still work before upgrading), so how does it compare to 10.11 performance-wise? Any features I'll lose or drastic changes which aren't obvious at first that I should know about before I fully commit?

High Sierra was meant to "Help" tweaking the OS to run and getting everyone ready to move into a completely 64bit environment. But for some reason many reviewers noted after Mojavé, which did the 64bit transition thing, that they didn't know why they bothered with HS. I agree, it's icky. But I have all the way up to Catalina that I can boot to and play in. And for the first time I did do a "Previous System Migration" after the install, but during the initial set up. I have found that using/doing "Migration Assistant" after the fact does not do as complete of job as during the initial setup. Plus, after the fact it creates another User that is a pain to have to deal with. During Setup it moves everything into the main use. That is if you want the "Main User" to be a Root user.

But I landed on and love 10.12(.6) which is fully 32bit compatible and it's been perfect. And I know it's no longer supported by Apple. For the most part. But 99% of the updates they send out do more damage than fixing things. So . . . I'm running Office 2011 which is 32bit along side a ton of 64bit apps, which you'll see in the Activity Monitor under "Kind". I had to update from 2008, which was wonderful, to 2011, junk, to rejigger and clean up the centuries old database that I have had problems with a couple of times over the years and couldn't afford of lose it. ALTHOUGH, I do have several, many many, copies stored on as many lose drives.

FEDEX says my drives will be here today. So CCC is going to get a major workout over the next couple of days. But I have to wait until after I relocate a sprinkler.
 
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FarmerBob

macrumors 6502
Aug 15, 2004
313
105
By the way how do you like "Disk Drill"? My drives arrived and I need to do some house cleaning before I start moving things around. I see a lot of purgable space I can regain. So I Googled how to and Disk Drill came up as a top two recommendation. And the one that I have had in the forefront all along.
 
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macstatic

macrumors 68020
Original poster
Oct 21, 2005
2,024
164
Norway
Thanks for explaining how you used Activity Monitor to find out which app created those huge files. Sounds like 10.12 is working for you, and I hope it will for me too. Among my apps is Photoshop CS4 which only runs up to 10.12, so that's my reason for not upgrading beyond that.

As for Disk Drill: it's not an app I've used regularly, so I can't say I fully understand it and have that much to compare with, but my impression is that it does what it's supposed to. I think I had it undelete some accidently deleted files from a camera's memory card.
The thing is that years ago I didn't take regular backups (because I didn't have a setup which made this simple enough as now when it's all automatic) and suffered some data loss. That's when I started buying and looking into "rescue" software of all sorts. Since then I've set up a proper backup system so I haven't really had much use for any of that software. Back in the Norton utilities days there were lots of "maintenance" sort of things you should do, but that just about appears to be gone these days. Maybe OSX does those kind of things on its own, I don't know....
 
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