14in M1 Max 24-core seems to have the nearly the same performance as the 14in m1 Max 32-core

[hefeglass]

Apple seems to be limiting the 32c in the 14in as can be seen in this video:
The 32 core GPU in the 16" peaks at around 45w, the 32 core GPU in the 14" peaks at around 33w. They run at different speeds as well..the 14in gets a little over 1100ghz, the 16in gets up to 1250ghz.

And in this video someone in the comments mentioned that they get just 1fps faster with their 32-core version with these same settings in the Tomb Raider benchmark.

Seems like in the 14in size, the 24 core may be the sweet spot. I would like to see more testing..maybe someone with the 32core 14in can do the 30 frame blender eevee render he did to see how it stacks up.

I personally have a 32 core on the way but I would definitely be willing to downgrade and up my ssd size instead if the difference in performance is negligible.

 

[TheRealAlex]

of course it just can’t properly ever cool the heat generated by the 5nm 32 Core. So in the end the performance is that of a 24 Core. I’m definite on waiting for 3nm. And get the kinks worked out. 3nm M3 Max will likely offer 16 Cores CPU and 64 Cores GPU.

 

[Jl006p]

Personally I think putting a V12 engine in a Mazda Miata is just plain stupid.


That's essentially what's happening here.

 

[Thysanoptera]

With 32 cores you're getting higher binned chip, the best of the bunch, without faults. I don't have mine yet, but I'd take lower clocked 32 than higher clocked 24 at same TDP, if that really is the case. It should be faster (Tomb Rider is not really a good benchmark on M1) - power delivery vs clock is not linear, especially at higher clocks. Plus 30% larger heat transfer area. Besides, it's $200, you won't be able to jump a single SSD upgrade level with that.

 

[Thysanoptera]

Personally I think putting a V12 engine in a Mazda Miata is just plain stupid.

That's essentially what's happening here.

You don't know what you're talking about, it's the best thing ever.

 

[Sanpete]

The differences between the 14" and 16" Maxes, where they exist, appear to be due to throttling. Can't assume the 24-core won't also throttle under the same conditions in the 14".

 

[hefeglass]

The differences between the 14" and 16" Maxes, where they exist, appear to be due to throttling. Can't assume the 24-core won't also throttle under the same conditions in the 14".

Its not due to throttling..its got a smaller power envelope. The 32 core GPU in the 16" peaks at around 45w, the 32 core GPU in the 14" peaks at around 33w. They run at different speeds as well..the 14in gets a little over 1100ghz, the 16in gets up to 1250ghz. The only time either machine throttled was when both the CPU and GPU were maxed out.

 

[3Rock]

Here’s another YouTuber talking about the 24 core compared to the 32 core, with The 14 inch

 

[Sanpete]

Its not due to throttling..its got a smaller power envelope. The 32 core GPU in the 16" peaks at around 45w, the 32 core GPU in the 14" peaks at around 33w. They run at different speeds as well..the 14in gets a little over 1100ghz, the 16in gets up to 1250ghz. The only time either machine throttled was when both the CPU and GPU were maxed out.

That's what Max is calling throttling. The point remains that the same restrictions including the processor speed difference might apply to the 24-core, so it's not clear it's the sweet spot for the 14". (The 14" peaks around 36W, btw, but that's still substantially lower.)

 

[hefeglass]

thats what I am saying...technically its not throttling because its designed for that power. The app they are using says when throttling is taking place.
I do think the 24 core might be the sweet spot. Will be interesting to see if the gaming results carry over to other workloads..like rendering in blender. Because in that case I have no reason to spend the extra to get the 24 core

 

[metapunk2077fail]

Its not due to throttling..its got a smaller power envelope. The 32 core GPU in the 16" peaks at around 45w, the 32 core GPU in the 14" peaks at around 33w. They run at different speeds as well..the 14in gets a little over 1100ghz, the 16in gets up to 1250ghz. The only time either machine throttled was when both the CPU and GPU were maxed out.

This is the answer to read. It's not throttling. It's a lower power chip than the one in the 16".

 

[Sanpete]

You can see what the performance of the 24-core is like in this video, but it doesn't get into what the limits of the processor are in wattage or frequency.

 

[JPack]

There is thermal throttling and then there is power throttling.

Apple uses fewer voltage regulation modules (evident on teardowns) on the 14-inch model which delivers less power because it wouldn’t be able to handle the resulting heat. The end result is the same - lower performance.

 

[Thysanoptera]

There is thermal throttling and then there is power throttling.

Apple uses fewer voltage regulation modules (evident on teardowns) on the 14-inch model which delivers less power because it wouldn’t be able to handle the resulting heat. The end result is the same - lower performance.

Got my 32 Max 14'', and it seems that in GPU benchmarks it is limited to 62W. Results fall between 16'' 32 and 14'' 24. It is power limited from 16'', still faster than 24 core 14''. I bet the 24 is also limited to the same wattage and difference is due to silicon power efficiency when operating at lower clocks.

 

[hefeglass]

Got my 32 Max 14'', and it seems that in GPU benchmarks it is limited to 62W. Results fall between 16'' 32 and 14'' 24. It is power limited from 16'', still faster than 24 core 14''. I bet the 24 is also limited to the same wattage and difference is due to silicon power efficiency when operating at lower clocks.

interesting..I will have both 14in 32c and 24c by the end of the month to compare them directly for my purposes (mainly blender and video editing)

 

[Jl006p]

We're so wired and conditioned to laugh at the base model of MacBooks but after seeing hours of YouTube videos I'm convinced the M1 Pro will be suffice.

 

[pi=e=3]

of course it just can’t properly ever cool the heat generated by the 5nm 32 Core. So in the end the performance is that of a 24 Core. I’m definite on waiting for 3nm. And get the kinks worked out. 3nm M3 Max will likely offer 16 Cores CPU and 64 Cores GPU.

As node size shrinks, thermal density goes up, and cooling performance suffers. More transistors packed into a smaller area = higher thermal density, and you can only remove heat so fast, regardless of what your medium is.

This is why it’s easier to cool a 14nm Intel chip at 300W than it is to cool a 7nm AMD chip at 100W.

Optimization Challenges For 10nm And 7nm

Optimization Challenges for 10nm and 7nm Experts at the Table, Part 2: Heat is becoming a serious issue as thermal densities rise and this creates problems for industries such as automotive that require robust, long-lived components.

semiengineering.com

 

[nebelargon]

interesting..I will have both 14in 32c and 24c by the end of the month to compare them directly for my purposes (mainly blender and video editing)

Hallo

And how were your experiences?

 

[CooperBox]

Personally I think putting a V12 engine in a Mazda Miata is just plain stupid.


That's essentially what's happening here.

Maybe, maybe not. But HERE's a French Citroen 2cv with a V8. And I'm told it doesn't suffer from overheating......

 

[playtech1]

As well as power and frequency limits coming into play, I suspect CPU constraints come into play, since there's no additional CPU horsepower and probably in practice a bit less if the CPU has to dial back its clocks to give the GPU thermal headroom.

In general though I don't feel like there's much Mac software out there yet that really makes great use of the Pro or Max GPUs. The Neural Engine (which is the same as regular M1) and Encoding/Decoding blocks seem to have been the real stars of the show at this early stage with Apple Silicon.

 

[acron1]

interesting..I will have both 14in 32c and 24c by the end of the month to compare them directly for my purposes (mainly blender and video editing)

Hi there... So, did you get both the 24 and 32 core GPU 14" Macs? What did you find out?