3.1 GTX 760 performance disappointment

[BConvery]

I just installed a EVGA GTX 760 2G card in my 3.1 MP with 12 g of RAM. I had been using a 4 year old 4870 that I flashed way back when. I though I'd see a huge performance increase, but I'm only getting about 50 fps. This is in Wow as its the only game I really play and what is important to me.

Is the older architecture holding things back? I have the newest system update. I have not flashed it as a boot screen isn't important to me.

Any ideas?

Thanks.

 

[Asgorath]

I just installed a EVGA GTX 760 2G card in my 3.1 MP with 12 g of RAM. I had been using a 4 year old 4870 that I flashed way back when. I though I'd see a huge performance increase, but I'm only getting about 50 fps. This is in Wow as its the only game I really play and what is important to me.

Is the older architecture holding things back? I have the newest system update. I have not flashed it as a boot screen isn't important to me.

Any ideas?

Thanks.

WoW is very likely going to be limited by your CPU. What resolution and settings are you running? You can check to see if you are bottlenecked by the GPU by getting the "OpenGL Driver Monitor" for the Apple graphics tools package, enabling "GPU Core Utilization" and seeing if it's pegged at 100% or not (percentage scale is on the right).

 

[BConvery]

I have an Apple HD Cinema display at 1920 x 1200. I put all the settings to good for comparisons sake as I had them all at fair or worse with the 4870.

 

[brentsg]

WoW isn't a great GPU test, plus it runs a lot better in windows.

 

[Gav Mack]

Wonder if the 760 works at only PCIe 1.0 link speeds if the card hasn't been flashed with a mac EFI bios to work at 2.0 speeds? Only a hunch, might want to ask MacVidCards via pm he certainly will know or have a look through the big sticky nvidia thread an the top or trawl through the netkas forum.

http://forum.netkas.org/index.php

The nvidia drivers with mavericks suck compared to ML, with 10.9.2 due soon they are supposed to be greatly improved too but like most I use bootcamp when I do occasionally play games.

 

[BConvery]

I was digging around in the forums and found a post by MVC talking about 3.1 issues using the bottom slot. I moved the card up one and it seems to have woken it up. Now getting 60 - 70 fps. I still get an error while trying to get system information on the PCI slots, but the information shows up correctly in the Graphics/Displays tab.

Thanks!

 

[AkuskaUK]

I was digging around in the forums and found a post by MVC talking about 3.1 issues using the bottom slot. I moved the card up one and it seems to have woken it up. Now getting 60 - 70 fps. I still get an error while trying to get system information on the PCI slots, but the information shows up correctly in the Graphics/Displays tab.

Thanks!

How does moving the card up a slot make it run better?

 

[riggles]

I still get an error while trying to get system information on the PCI slots, but the information shows up correctly in the Graphics/Displays tab.

That's because it has no EFI. Unflashed cards aren't recognized by the System Profiler.

 

[BConvery]

How does moving the card up a slot make it run better?

No idea, apparently the 3.1's have an issue with the #1 PCI slot...

 

[yoak]

No idea, apparently the 3.1's have an issue with the #1 PCI slot...

It´s different speeds on the different slots. It is important to put it in the fastest one. Can´t remember which one that is. Had to figure this out with my Quadro4000 card

 

[AkuskaUK]

No idea, apparently the 3.1's have an issue with the #1 PCI slot...

Ah, only the 3,1's then! I have a 4,1 and my GTX770 is in slot 1. Thanks for clearing that up though!

 

[Gav Mack]

No idea, apparently the 3.1's have an issue with the #1 PCI slot...

Maybe with certain other cards, but my 680 EFI flashed PC EVGA works fine in slot 1. Slot 2 is only 8x in the 3,1.

 

[MacVidCards]

3,1 has issue with Fan Controllers on some cards in slot 1.

I have seen it most often on GTX570/580s built on reference board. (blower style long board with fan off at one end.

Oddly, I now realize that some of these cards will sit there and overheat without turning the fan other than a coupe little jerks back and forth and other identical looking cards will work just fine in slot 1.

I imagine it boils down to fan controller on board or on the fan itself.

All unlashed Nvidia cards run at PCIE 1.0 in a 3,1 in both OSX and Windows. Nvidia put a fix in that enables PCIE 2.0 on unlashed cards but it only works on 4,1 and 5,1.

That being said, you would not see a giant improvement just from this being kicked up to 2.0.

 

[keantan]

3,1 has issue with Fan Controllers on some cards in slot 1.

I have seen it most often on GTX570/580s built on reference board. (blower style long board with fan off at one end.

Oddly, I now realize that some of these cards will sit there and overheat without turning the fan other than a coupe little jerks back and forth and other identical looking cards will work just fine in slot 1.

I imagine it boils down to fan controller on board or on the fan itself.

All unlashed Nvidia cards run at PCIE 1.0 in a 3,1 in both OSX and Windows. Nvidia put a fix in that enables PCIE 2.0 on unlashed cards but it only works on 4,1 and 5,1.

That being said, you would not see a giant improvement just from this being kicked up to 2.0.

Hi MacVidCards,

When you mention the PCIE 2.0 fix unflashed cards for the Mac Pro 4,1s and 5,1s are you referring to just in OS X or in Windows as well? Am looking at upgrading my Apple HD5870 to a GTX 760 (or something comparable).

Thanks

 

[Robert Davies]

Hi MacVidCards,

When you mention the PCIE 2.0 fix unflashed cards for the Mac Pro 4,1s and 5,1s are you referring to just in OS X or in Windows as well? Am looking at upgrading my Apple HD5870 to a GTX 760 (or something comparable).

Thanks

MVC's on time-out for a wee while, but I suggest that in general terms, the 760 may not be much of a speed hike over the 5870 to be worth the time and money - if you're feeling the need for speed the 7950 is a much better option, but only really available any more in the UK as the quite pricey Mac Edition card (about 275ukp-ish currently).

There are of course many factors that affect the perceived 'speed' of a graphics card - whether or not the apps you use are optimised for your particular card or not etc, so it is extremely difficult to make recommendations.

 

[keantan]

MVC's on time-out for a wee while, but I suggest that in general terms, the 760 may not be much of a speed hike over the 5870 to be worth the time and money - if you're feeling the need for speed the 7950 is a much better option, but only really available any more in the UK as the quite pricey Mac Edition card (about 275ukp-ish currently).

There are of course many factors that affect the perceived 'speed' of a graphics card - whether or not the apps you use are optimised for your particular card or not etc, so it is extremely difficult to make recommendations.

Didn't see this reply, but thanks for your help Robert. The idea behind the 760 is for bootcamp without the use of an external power supply (I don't wanna risk damaging my MP). In addition, I'm looking for performance per GBP. I might hang on a while more based on your thoughts since I hear the new Nvidia 800 series cards are gonna drop the power envelope again. My 5870 can cope with my monitor at medium-high settings on most games (what i do in my downtime) most of the time anyways so its all good.

 

[joevt]

I was digging around in the forums and found a post by MVC talking about 3.1 issues using the bottom slot. I moved the card up one and it seems to have woken it up. Now getting 60 - 70 fps.

I use a EVGA NVIDIA GeForce GTX 680 Mac Edition in slot 2 in a MacPro3,1 because Windows will not boot with an Accelsior in slot 2 with some newer graphics cards (Radeon 5870 included).

Slot 2 is only 8x in the 3,1.

Slot 1 and 2 are both PCIe 2.0 x16. http://support.apple.com/kb/HT2838

WoW isn't a great GPU test, plus it runs a lot better in windows.

It seems that WoW ran slower in Windows than Mac OS on a Radeon 5870 or there was something wrong with my settings. WoW ran fastest in Windows with an NVIDIA 680. I tried both Ultra and non-Ultra settings at 2560x1600.

On the Mac side, I wonder if WoW has optimizations for the Radeon 5870 that don't exist for the NVIDIA 680 that make the Radeon better for WoW. That's a question for Blizzard to answer. The reason I ask is if you run WoW from the Terminal, you get a New VideoCard message when running with the NVIDIA GTX 680 (or 780M on iMac) like this:

Joes-Mac-Pro:~ joevt$ /Volumes/Games/World\ of\ Warcraft/World\ of\ Warcraft.app/Contents/MacOS/World\ of\ Warcraft 
New VideoCard: vendorID=0x10DE deviceID=0x1180
New renderer ID: 0x00022700

The New VideoCard message does not occur with the Radeon 5870. I think it doesn't occur with the 680M either but I don't know how the performance of that compares to a Radeon 5870 or the GTX 680. Maybe things will improve with the next WoW expansion.

Diable III (and a lot of benchmarks) on the other hand are faster with the NVIDIA card.

 

[grue]

How does moving the card up a slot make it run better?

It's not just a 3,1 issue. My 570 ran like **** in my 4,1 in slot 1, fine in slot 2. I just put in a 680 today and same issue. Once I reflashed it and put it in slot 1, it was fine.