35mm slide scanners?

[MajorFubar]

Sorry I know this is only partly to do with digital photography and looks like a post from 2003.

Does anyone have any experience with slide scanners that are (a) still actually available and (b) will work with M1 Macs? Over Autumn and Winter I've got about a thousand slides to scan that were my late father's. Most of them are 35mm, but about 200-ish of them are 2¼"-square 'super slides' which use a mount the same external dimensions as a 35mm slide but the actual film itself is larger. So I need the scanner to be able to cope with those slides as well, without cropping them to a rectangle.

Intelligent noise/dust removal would be nice but I don't want the firmware to have settings you can't override which predetermine exposure/cropping/white balance and so on, like some of the cheapest ones do.

Price? Anything under a grand.

 

[mollyc]

we've actually been having a discussion about scanning in this thread. Not sure any of that will help with your super slides but worth a read.

 

[MajorFubar]

Thanks I'll have a look. Sorry if I duplicated anything

 

[mollyc]

Thanks I'll have a look. Sorry if I duplicated anything

no worries, it's a long thread. 🙂 but the current line of discussion.

 

[bunnspecial]

One of the Epson flatbeds can do Superslides. I haven't scanned a ton of them but have done a few over the years. There's a mode in the Epson software and in Vuescan where you can preview the whole area and then freely select where you want to scan. It's not as nicely automated as scanning a known film size, but works.

True, dedicated film scanners that can do pretty much would all be medium format sized ones. Most dedicated 35mm film/slide scanners have a scan width of ~26mm to scan a standard 24x36mm film frame(SuperSlide frames are ~40mm wide). I own one 35mm-sized scanner that can do it-a Polaroid Sprintscan that was pushing the limits to work in 10.4.11 on a G4, much less a computer made in the last 20 years. To be honest, I don't know that a dedicated medium format scanner like a Nikon 8000/9000 would work-I've never even unboxed the 35mm carrier on mine.

I haven't tested my V700, but I don't see why it wouldn't work in at least some capacity on an M1. I'll try to do that soon, although I don't have mine in my immediate possession at the moment.

One thing I'll also mention is that the V700/V750/V800/V850 all can basically scan any size you throw at them that's 8x10 or smaller. I have the Epson glass tray and have done formats like 110, 126, and 127 negative(SuperSlides are mounted 127 positive film) on the glass tray by either taping them down or preferably under a sheet of anti-Newton glass. That does require unmounting slides, though. You can even wet scan on them and I've done it, but TBH I don't consider it worth the hassle for most anything short of medium format shot in quality SLRs or TLRs. It's just a pain in general, although if the image is worth it it gives better results than any other technique I've used(provided that you've managed to get all the bubbles out, which is an art in and of itself). I've heard of folks taping film directly to the scanner glass if they didn't have a glass plate, but there are reasons why the proper glass mount is better.

The V800 is still available, but unfortunately does blow right past your budget. The V700/V750 are very similar and can be had often gently used under your budget. That's how I bought mine, albeit several years ago now. As much of a love hate relationship as I have with it, it really is the most versatile scanner I've owned even if my Nikons can ultimately churn out a better scan(with a lot of massaging). The V600 is well within your budget and should do what you need-the V700 just made sense for me and what all I do.

 

[lcubed]

if you can live with slight cropping, the PIE powerslide X may be able to scan the 127 super slides.
depending on where you are, these (and their reflecta cousins) are rentable.

from the filmscanner.info folks:
It's possible to scan a slide with a maximum image size of 37,5 x 37,5 mm

(i've run 35 mm slides in mixed vertical/horizontal orientation through the one my wife has, so i know for a fact that the scan area is not rectangular like most film scanners)

i would also recommend using the vuescan pro software in lieu of the included cyberview software. you can easily tweak the scan area and exposure parameters to your liking with vuescan pro.

 

[Steven-iphone]

I have use digmypics for 35mm slide scanning. They do 127 Super Slides - if this applies.

If this is a one-off, then cheaper than purchasing a scanner.

 

[jz0309]

I have use digmypics for 35mm slide scanning. They do 127 Super Slides - if this applies.

If this is a one-off, then cheaper than purchasing a scanner.

while I have no experience with these guys, that is the best option to go imho, a service ...

 

[tizeye]

Do you have a macro lens? With lightbox and transport mechanism can make your own slide/negative duplicator?

 

[MajorFubar]

One of the Epson flatbeds can do Superslides. I haven't scanned a ton of them but have done a few over the years. There's a mode in the Epson software and in Vuescan where you can preview the whole area and then freely select where you want to scan. It's not as nicely automated as scanning a known film size, but works.

True, dedicated film scanners that can do pretty much would all be medium format sized ones. Most dedicated 35mm film/slide scanners have a scan width of ~26mm to scan a standard 24x36mm film frame(SuperSlide frames are ~40mm wide). I own one 35mm-sized scanner that can do it-a Polaroid Sprintscan that was pushing the limits to work in 10.4.11 on a G4, much less a computer made in the last 20 years. To be honest, I don't know that a dedicated medium format scanner like a Nikon 8000/9000 would work-I've never even unboxed the 35mm carrier on mine.

I haven't tested my V700, but I don't see why it wouldn't work in at least some capacity on an M1. I'll try to do that soon, although I don't have mine in my immediate possession at the moment.

One thing I'll also mention is that the V700/V750/V800/V850 all can basically scan any size you throw at them that's 8x10 or smaller. I have the Epson glass tray and have done formats like 110, 126, and 127 negative(SuperSlides are mounted 127 positive film) on the glass tray by either taping them down or preferably under a sheet of anti-Newton glass. That does require unmounting slides, though. You can even wet scan on them and I've done it, but TBH I don't consider it worth the hassle for most anything short of medium format shot in quality SLRs or TLRs. It's just a pain in general, although if the image is worth it it gives better results than any other technique I've used(provided that you've managed to get all the bubbles out, which is an art in and of itself). I've heard of folks taping film directly to the scanner glass if they didn't have a glass plate, but there are reasons why the proper glass mount is better.

The V800 is still available, but unfortunately does blow right past your budget. The V700/V750 are very similar and can be had often gently used under your budget. That's how I bought mine, albeit several years ago now. As much of a love hate relationship as I have with it, it really is the most versatile scanner I've owned even if my Nikons can ultimately churn out a better scan(with a lot of massaging). The V600 is well within your budget and should do what you need-the V700 just made sense for me and what all I do.

Thanks. Unfortunately I'm UK based and the V800 seems unavailable in UK, but the V850 is available and is within budget at £850 (because Epson, unlike Apple, don't just change the $ sign for a £ sign and add a couple more percent, they actually go by the exchange rate, which currently favours the UK pound).

Do you think the V850 will do what I need? Actually the key to that answer is probably to order it from somewhere like Amazon who accept no-quibble returns, and check it for myself.

 

[bunnspecial]

Thanks. Unfortunately I'm UK based and the V800 seems unavailable in UK, but the V850 is available and is within budget at £850 (because Epson, unlike Apple, don't just change the $ sign for a £ sign and add a couple more percent, they actually go by the exchange rate, which currently favours the UK pound).

Do you think the V850 will do what I need? Actually the key to that answer is probably to order it from somewhere like Amazon who accept no-quibble returns, and check it for myself.

First of all, I assume it's the case with the V850 as with the other Epson Vx50 scanners as opposed to the Vx00 scanners that the -50 version is actually optimized for transparency scanning. Also, if I'm not mistaken, you SHOULD get the glass carrier in the box(I had to buy it separately).

I can't imagine it wouldn't work more than fine for you, and again depending on exactly what you're handling it can be made to work with basically any size transparency you can throw at it provided that it's 8x10 or smaller. I don't think you'll be disappointed.

The Epson scanners have their faults(including horrible medium format carriers, but then I throw that criticism against a lot of scanners) but the V700/V750/V800/V850 are probably the single most versatile consumer class scanners that can be had. There's a very good reason I use my Nikon scanners when I can use them, but also a very good reason why I have a V700.

 

[mollyc]

@bunnspecial have you ever done camera scanning, or always with an actual real scanner?

 

[bunnspecial]

@bunnspecial have you ever done camera scanning, or always with an actual real scanner?

Not to any meaningful results. I need to get my bellows/slide adapter back out and try again, but for now I just use scanners.

 

[MajorFubar]

I once did try 'camera scanning' but struggled to get a consistent light, even using the recommended solution of using a tablet screen as a source of flat consistent light.

I think I'm pretty much settled on the idea of getting a V850, even though the instructions on Epson's website are from the ark and make reference to it being compatible with MacOS Mavericks and Windows 8. I can see Monterey drivers are available from the Support page so I guess I should be good.

 

[Bodhitree]

This does take me back, glad you have found a solution. I‘d probably have gone with a scanning service.

 

[MajorFubar]

This does take me back, glad you have found a solution. I‘d probably have gone with a scanning service.

I thought about using a scanning service for a few microseconds then decided strongly against it for the following reasons:

1) When I thought about all the things that could go wrong posting 1,000+ irreplaceable slides to a faceless entity hundreds of miles away, scan them, then have everything posted back again, I saw so many red flags it looked like a ski slalom.

2) Most of the slides are paired in twin Kodak Carousel slide trays, prepared for dual-projection using a dissolve unit. Although all the mounts in the Carousels are labelled Ax Bx per show, it would take hours - days, probably - to additionally label them so they could be put back into the correct Carousels, when they are returned.

3) While (I assume) any pro scanning lab will have better machinery at their disposal than I am able to afford, I cannot believe, at a typical price of less than £1 per slide (with some labs offering prices of less than half that cost), they will devote the time and effort into scanning the slides to my satisfaction. The whole process will be configured to facilitate maximum speed and minimum user-input, with every 'automatic switch' flicked, particularly this day and age where the number of people wanting this service has fallen off a cliff compared to 20 years ago. And if the scan of some slide turns out irredeemably over-exposed or under-exposed in places, I'm stuck with it. It's an inevitability that I would end up spending so many hours editing and processing all the scans to my satisfaction, I may as well just do the whole job myself.

 

[Bodhitree]

You could start your own premium scanning service, especially for difficult slides, if you are investing in the equipment anyway.

 

[MajorFubar]

You could start your own premium scanning service, especially for difficult slides, if you are investing in the equipment anyway.

I seriously thought about that ten years ago when I first toyed with the idea of scanning all my father's slides while he was still alive and while there was still some semblance of a market to make the investment in first-class equipment worthwhile as a business-prospect. But then, I again considered all the red flags associated with receiving, handling, scanning and posting-back someone else's irreplaceable memories, and saw that I would be opening the door wide open to both fraudsters and genuine mishaps. I decided in the end it was such a huge 'nope' I could definitely live without.

 

[bunnspecial]

While (I assume) any pro scanning lab will have better machinery at their disposal than I am able to afford, I cannot believe, at a typical price of less than £1 per slide (with some labs offering prices of less than half that cost), they will devote the time and effort into scanning the slides to my satisfaction.

At that price, no you're not getting anything much more than maybe a quick clean-up before scanning.

If you were paying 10-20x that per slide-maybe more-you'd likely get a drum scan or equivalent done by an expert operator. Given what you've described, though, you likely don't want drum scans. Among other things, they require unmounting the slide(which, if they're currently in paper mounts, will be destroyed) so that the film can be wet mounted on the scanner drum.

 

[MajorFubar]

At that price, no you're not getting anything much more than maybe a quick clean-up before scanning.

If you were paying 10-20x that per slide-maybe more-you'd likely get a drum scan or equivalent done by an expert operator. Given what you've described, though, you likely don't want drum scans. Among other things, they require unmounting the slide(which, if they're currently in paper mounts, will be destroyed) so that the film can be wet mounted on the scanner drum.

Most are glass-mounted in anti-newton mounts but yeah it would still definitely be a chore.

 

[bunnspecial]

Most are glass-mounted in anti-newton mounts but yeah it would still definitely be a chore.

Your dad was certainly serious about his slides!

With that said, you may find those to be both a blessing and a curse when you're scanning. The "blessing" is that you know the film is going to be flat, something that's the perpetual enemy of any scanning. Also, it's a lot easier to get dust and other crud off of glass than film, and chances are good the film itself is in good shape(no scratches, etc).

The "curse" is going to be that you can introduce some extra reflections, and probably the bigger issue is that AN glass can sometimes mess with ICE.

The focus on the Epson scanners is going to assume you're scanning bare film. Glass mounts will mess with this as the RI of glass is different than air. At the end of the day, you may find that for optimum sharpness in glass mounts, a Better Scanning holder with screw legs to adjust focus is best. With that said, you might try shimming the feet of the stock holder with paper or other thin materials. It will take some trial and error to get it dialed in best, but once done it should be good.

 

[Bodhitree]

Well I consider myself lucky that my dad is not much of a photographer and my mom only got interested in the digital age, when I gave her my Canon Powershot G3. My stepfather has some slides but I don’t think I will be called upon to digitise them.

 

[MajorFubar]

My dad was always into photography, going all the way back to a young man in the mid 50's, and 90% of what he shot were slides. I kinda consider myself lucky that that I have such a large collection of images that document my childhood and even times before I existed. It's going to be a mammoth task though.

 

[USAntigoon]

Do you have a macro lens? With lightbox and transport mechanism can make your own slide/negative duplicator?

Fully agree, I used a Canon 100 mm macro and transferred 1,000 plus slides and recorded them all in RAW, allowing me to do a nice post production..No flat bed scanner or other device will come close..

 

[tizeye]

Fully agree, I used a Canon 100 mm macro and transferred 1,000 plus slides and recorded them all in RAW, allowing me to do a nice post production..No flat bed scanner or other device will come close..

Absolutely on shooting in RAW. While noted earlier, I do have a Epson scanner but the high dpi scans are slow and jpg output (never tried tif with slow scanning) was limiting in post. This tread got me to thinking and with available resources built the DIY project for free. RAW output was outstanding and while able to correct aged color degradation would be expected, but the ability to pull shadow detail from a dark slide that didn't show on standard projector viewing was amazing. While posted one today on POTD, will probably post the shadow pull tomorrow.

This was really a simple build. Wired tether to computer and 27" monitor simplifies focusing detail. Interior of box white lined and taped seams for color balance. Cut green hanging folders - didn't have black paper - to minimize reflection back to lens impacting exposure. For photo, video light turned down, but in use much brighter.

Now that I know it works and the advantages of RAW...it will cost me. Will probably rebuild as wooden box and anti skid/vibration on bottom. Cut light opening 120 film size and design 3 overlays for 35mm slides, 35mm film transport path, and 120 film transport path. Keep the straight in design rather than top as allows standard tripod setup. The only big, and expensive, issue in my macro lens needs to be upgraded. In theory, you can use extension rings with any lens for macro effect, but a true macro is far preferred both for sharpness and flatness of field. Shown is an ancient manual only Sigma 50mm macro on a Nikon mount with a Sony converter which may impact the 1:1 as I had to do slight cropping in post. Also, no electronics so nothing is transported to the camera/EFIX data. A macro in the 90-105 range should resolve those issue...but I know it works.