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Adobe Double-dipping with upcoming CS5.5 'upgrade'

RebootD

RebootD

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Jan 27, 2009
737
0
NW Indiana
I posted this over on the Adobe Creative Suite forum as well but I wanted to ask if anyone here received this survey today:

Did anyone else get and take the Adobe survey that came out recently? It asked a ton of questions about what I'd be willing to pay for Adobe Creative Suite CS5.5 (unreleased) and if I'd rather pay a one-time fee or a ridiculously overpriced option for 'yearly subscription" where all future 'updates' are 'free'.

This is disturbing due to the Adobe's track record as of late with releasing a X.0 and then having no updates until CSX comes out. Plus if you only buy the upgrade pricing of $599 every 18mo the proposed subscription model would be more than double that amount at the proposed $70-$100/mo ($1,680-$2,400 for 24 months!) listed in the survey. And the 'includes free updates' to me means "we won't issue any bug fixes or updates for your standard license but will be happy to make you pay twice for our .5 updates mid-cycle."

I hope and pray this isn't what the future of Adobe has in store for those of us that live off these programs.
 
Ugg this is probably the beginning of the end of a sane Adobe. Henceforth replace all actions by Adobe with RealNetworks and see if it sounds out of place.
 
get used to it...

RebootD said:
I hope and pray this isn't what the future of Adobe has in store for those of us that live off these programs.
Click to expand...

As a long-time professional Pshop user (1.0 yikes, lol), I used to say that pshop was the single best program written. While I do reluctantly upgrade, most of my workflow has migrated elsewhere. Adobe has surpassed Quark as a company that engenders negative feelings. While there are some significant features in this version, most of the iterations previously bought little substantive improvements. Lots to quibble about there, but it has been a long term observation that little has changed since the earlier days workflow-wise. Furthermore, the shifting make-ups of the suite packages seemed clearly constructed to extract maximum upgrade dollars.

These days I use Aperture plus the NIK suite of plug-ins for 90% of my imaging. Both brought dramatic changes to my work-flow, and dramatic improvements to my finished image results. I clean a LOT of pics too, and the combination really blows the doors off pshop in most ways. Pshop is used mostly for layering, text incorporation, sizing, final conversion to CMYK, but not too much image adjusting.

Adobe's upgrade pricing is a disgrace. I do not EVER advocate piracy, however I have to think that pricing like that encourages it happening. My two cents...
michael
 
While it would suck to pay for minor updates (most other software vendors add small, but sometimes significant features mid-cycle), I have been talking to Adobe about fixing a whole range of things in Photoshop that matter to me. If you're a web, app, screen or icon designer, they might matter to you, too.

http://bjango.com/articles/photoshopcs6wishlist/

Adobe's response has been very positive and they seem to be taking the suggestions very seriously. As crazy as it sounds, I'd pay for CS6 in a heartbeat if it contained those fixes/features alone.
 
lucidmedia said:
I don't like the idea of a subscription model, but most high-end 3d software works this way... its common in other fields as well....
Click to expand...
Is this news true (5.5)? Im about to spend 12k of company cash on CS5 upgrades :p
 
That is pure ridiculous.

CS5.5? Really? What happened to supporting the software you make?

If they want to make a new version with new features and sell it fine, but don't make it the same version, fix some bugs and try and sell it.
 
mBox said:
Is this news true (5.5)? Im about to spend 12k of company cash on CS5 upgrades :p
Click to expand...

I just got two site licenses for CS5 for 20K, so I am "thrilled". But know what? Is there REALLY anythng better? Plus we have made Design Studio our standard. Say what you will about Adobe pricing plans, but their products are spectacular.
 
Les Kern said:
I just got two site licenses for CS5 for 20K, so I am "thrilled". But know what? Is there REALLY anythng better? Plus we have made Design Studio our standard. Say what you will about Adobe pricing plans, but their products are spectacular.
Click to expand...

I agree that without their software I'd be SOL with my current career but at the same time I'm not willing to spend 3X as much for a subscription model. I will just shift my focus further away from design and more into coding. All you need is a text editor ;)
 
RebootD said:
I posted this over on the Adobe Creative Suite forum as well but I wanted to ask if anyone here received this survey today:

Did anyone else get and take the Adobe survey that came out recently? It asked a ton of questions about what I'd be willing to pay for Adobe Creative Suite CS5.5 (unreleased) and if I'd rather pay a one-time fee or a ridiculously overpriced option for 'yearly subscription" where all future 'updates' are 'free'.

This is disturbing due to the Adobe's track record as of late with releasing a X.0 and then having no updates until CSX comes out. Plus if you only buy the upgrade pricing of $599 every 18mo the proposed subscription model would be more than double that amount at the proposed $70-$100/mo ($1,680-$2,400 for 24 months!) listed in the survey. And the 'includes free updates' to me means "we won't issue any bug fixes or updates for your standard license but will be happy to make you pay twice for our .5 updates mid-cycle."

I hope and pray this isn't what the future of Adobe has in store for those of us that live off these programs.
Click to expand...

100% agreed!

Or $949 if you wait 1.5 versions between upgrades (e.g. CS4 to CS5.5).

Given how InDesign CS5 was a lackluster upgrade, I doubt 5.5 will be any better... but I digress.

if the upgrade pricing alone isn't outrageous, that's benign compared to the subscription. $aa$. Makes a a$$ out of people who are suckered into using it.
 
Les Kern said:
I just got two site licenses for CS5 for 20K, so I am "thrilled". But know what? Is there REALLY anythng better? Plus we have made Design Studio our standard. Say what you will about Adobe pricing plans, but their products are spectacular.
Click to expand...

I also have to agree with that.

My favorite instructor even says "You can do great things with Photoshop! But have you heard anyone say 'You can do great things with GIMP!'?" :eek:

Adobe's products are good if not exceptional, but as competitors catch up AND as everything moves toward the web and away from print, Adobe will invariably start to lose clout.

And, yeah, the subscription plan does have a few venues where it's cheaper to implement. But definitely not for SMBs.
 
chrono1081 said:
That is pure ridiculous.

CS5.5? Really? What happened to supporting the software you make?

If they want to make a new version with new features and sell it fine, but don't make it the same version, fix some bugs and try and sell it.
Click to expand...

Just like Windows 3.0, 3.1, 3.11... :)

Windows 7 even reads "Version 6.1" (aka "Vista service slap 1") and after Win7 SP1, it's still got bugs.
 
What's more cost-effective if you have to hire a contracted designer?

A) Buy CS5 Master Suite at regular price
B) Buy a subscription to CS5 Master Suite for the 2 or 3 months your contracted designer will be working?

So if you're complaining about the subscription model, maybe you're not the target demographic. Just sayin'.
 
usclaneyj said:
What's more cost-effective if you have to hire a contracted designer?

A) Buy CS5 Master Suite at regular price
B) Buy a subscription to CS5 Master Suite for the 2 or 3 months your contracted designer will be working?

So if you're complaining about the subscription model, maybe you're not the target demographic. Just sayin'.
Click to expand...

Why would YOU hire a contract designer who didn't have his own copy of Photoshop?...

The only people this works for are contractors themselves: you pay $30 or whatever for the month you're working, then another $30 a couple months later when you've got another job.
 
mlblacy said:
As a long-time professional Pshop user (1.0 yikes, lol), I used to say that pshop was the single best program written. While I do reluctantly upgrade, most of my workflow has migrated elsewhere. Adobe has surpassed Quark as a company that engenders negative feelings. While there are some significant features in this version, most of the iterations previously bought little substantive improvements. Lots to quibble about there, but it has been a long term observation that little has changed since the earlier days workflow-wise. Furthermore, the shifting make-ups of the suite packages seemed clearly constructed to extract maximum upgrade dollars.

These days I use Aperture plus the NIK suite of plug-ins for 90% of my imaging. Both brought dramatic changes to my work-flow, and dramatic improvements to my finished image results. I clean a LOT of pics too, and the combination really blows the doors off pshop in most ways. Pshop is used mostly for layering, text incorporation, sizing, final conversion to CMYK, but not too much image adjusting.

Adobe's upgrade pricing is a disgrace. I do not EVER advocate piracy, however I have to think that pricing like that encourages it happening. My two cents...
michael
Click to expand...

+1 I too used to praise Adobe and recently (in the last few years) fell out of love with them. Aperture is my main workflow now, I really don't use photoshop for any photography anymore, Aperture takes care of all my needs (however I do use it for texturing 3D models).
 
Bluefusion said:
Why would YOU hire a contract designer who didn't have his own copy of Photoshop?...

The only people this works for are contractors themselves: you pay $30 or whatever for the month you're working, then another $30 a couple months later when you've got another job.
Click to expand...


Okay, so then my main argument still stands -- You're not the target demographic, and in fact, you've proven that a subscription service actually *IS* useful.

Regardless, maybe I would contract a designer, but I would want them working on equipment that I have admin privileges over so that I could be sure everything was legit, licensed, and legal.

I mean, maybe. I don't pretend to know the reasons people have for doing things. Just theorizing.
 
Apple needs to make Aperture the new Photoshop, and charge more for it if necessary. But sadly I don't think they have the balls. They'd have to call it iAperture or some other such nonsense before they appropriated the R&D funding it deserves.
 
Bonch said:
Apple needs to make Aperture the new Photoshop, and charge more for it if necessary. But sadly I don't think they have the balls. They'd have to call it iAperture or some other such nonsense before they appropriated the R&D funding it deserves.
Click to expand...

Why does everyone think that all Apple has to do is release a competitor to PHotoshop and all of their problems will be solved?

Photoshop is 23 years old. And it has significantly more R&D invested in it than Apple could feasibly compete with on a professional level. Even InDesign hasn't completely killed Quark, and it's been out for 9 years. If Apple released anything, it would take at least 5 years for it to gain any sort of mainstream acceptance, and that would give Adobe 5 more years of innovation. Which, admittedly, they'd probably squander.

I agree that Adobe's Creative Suite needs competition. I just don't see it coming from Apple anytime soon.

Maybe Quark will step up to the plate and...oh...who am I kidding.
 
Many of us are still using CS4 without complaints.

My philosophy is: "The software is a TOOL for your creativity, not the SOURCE for your creativity."

I don't need the newest, shiniest, most expensive tool to put out great stuff. Print-oriented software (like InDesign, Illustrator, and to a lesser extent Photoshop) has really plateaued; it has achieved a level of competency that satisfies most (if not all) print work-flows. There's nothing more for Adobe to add to it other than bloat it with the functional equivalents of dropshadow buttons and starburst tools.

I'm sticking with CS4 because it works fine for me.

My only problem is that I need to add one work station for an intern, and I need to buy CS4 Design Premium to load on it. It's not easy to find out-of-date software for sale. They come up on ebay every so often, so I'm watching there.

There's no way I'm upgrading to CS5.
 
SwiftLives said:
Photoshop is 23 years old.
Click to expand...

Okay, that hurts! ;) I remember seeing a poster advertising this new software called "Photoshop" while tinkering away in Illustrator '88. Now if you'll excuse me, it's getting late in the evening and my prune juice is waiting.....

AND STAY OFF MY LAWN with your willy-nilly subscription services!
 
program subscriptions aren't new to me, they've been available from autodesk for ages, but this adobe system just seems so damned expensive.

Comparison:
Autodesk - one off fee for program, yearly fee (usually a couple of hundred) to get all additional updates including new versions etc (patches are free). Option to renew subscription at end of year and if you cancel you get to keep software....

Adobe - one off fee and keep it, update as you wish or a monthly 'subscription' that is no better than renting it out as once you're subscription period is up the program no longer works.

The short term rental is good for people who don't need say photoshop on a day to day basis but the long term subscription is just not good value, purely due to the fact that you never own the software.

And if I'm honest, I can actually see this new subscription option becoming the norm for adobe as a new way to combat pirate copies...if it does I can see a very sharp decline in the number of people buying new copies of photoshop etc
 
SwiftLives said:
Why does everyone think that all Apple has to do is release a competitor to PHotoshop and all of their problems will be solved?

Photoshop is 23 years old...
Click to expand...

Photoshop was released around February 20, 1990. That makes it 21 years old. However I think that a beta-like program similar to PS(however only 200 of them sold) a couple years earlier if that's what you're talking about.


Apple isn't new to stealing ideas, work, products, slapping a "i" in front of it and calling it new and "intuitive." ...In fact they've been doing it so long they've actually gotten quite good at it!! I'm not ready to say that Apple has enough PR to pull the entire design crew away from Adobe (then again many, if not most, of their BT is design professionals).. but.. if they make a attempt at it I think that it would be a interesting couple years for the design world.
 
Adobe has been on a slide, going from fantastic to okay to irritating to annoying to maddening...but I think this time they have crossed over into the criminal. Charging CS5 users for the upgrade to CS5.5 is an outrage.

As of October 2010 I had been using the Web edition of CS3. Then I bought a new computer system just so I could upgrade to CS5 (I had been on a seven year old G5 cheesegrater). I paid $1300 to go from my Web Edition CS3 to a Master Collection CS5.
Photoshop has been fairly solid, save for the occasional program crash. However, After Effects is a different story. I get frequent crashes, and worse--if I work in it for more than an hour at a stretch, it starts to "get stupid." Certain keyboard shortcuts stop functioning, renders come out with massive color shifts,and basic functionality starts to fail. I am constantly having to shut the program down and restart it.

So now CS5.5 has been announced, and it basically amounts to a large number of "stability improvements." And because I bought my last upgrade back in October, Adobe is saying I have to pay $549 for it. Seriously?

Now, apparently they have thrown in some iOS and eBook development tools so that they can claim that CS5.5 is a whole new product, but some colleagues with connections within Adobe have told me that the main thrust of the release is for bug fixes. That's where all of the development dollars have been spent since the CS5 release.

Well, I really don't want the new functions--I'm not a web developer. I just want the CS5 functionality I was promised in the brochures! And I'm being told I have to shell out another $549 to get it. Any way you look at it, that's just wrong.

I'm suspecting this move might wind up in a class action suit. I usually don't like to get involved in such things, but for this one I might have to.
 
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