Apple TV 4K (2021) model strange UI lag (not remote related)

[MacinMan]

Hey all, I recently upgraded to a 2021 Apple TV 4K, to replace an aging Apple TV 4th Generation. I also have an Apple TV 4K (2017).

I've Recently been experiencing UI lag with the 2021 model (mainly in the app switcher.) What happens is the video freezes on screen but can still hear navigation clicks, so the remote and ATV are still active. As far as media playback that works as expected, and other apps don't seem to lag, just the app switcher.

I've searched Reddit, and other forums, and have not been able to find a specific solution (only suggestions)

Here is my Setup for 4K:
2016 Sony TV 43" model (XBR-43X800D) supports HDR10, and HLG, no Dolby Vision
HDMI 2, and 3 are the enhanced ports (supporting HDR@60, and port 3, is also the ARC port)
Sound is handled by a Vizo M5ax-J6 sound bar that supports Dolby Atmos, and DTS:X as well as all other standard audio formats.
I have bravia Sync (CEC disabled on the TV for reliability and manual control)

Connection: a 5 port HDMI switch connected to the sound bar's HDMI in, and the sound bar's HDMI out port connected to TV's HDMI 3 port for video passthrough, and ARC support, when enabled. My main method is to simply set the switch to the device I want to pass through.
I am using HDMI shielded cables ( 18Gbps certified) The switch is also certified for this configuration.

I want to mention that, the 2017 Apple TV 4K works perfectly in this setup, it's only the 2021 having issues.
When I move the 2021 to my bedroom setup (which is primarily HDMI 1.4, 1080p), it works perfectly without lag, so for the time being I'm using the older Apple TV 4k in the living room, and the new one in the bedroom (where the 4th gen was.)

I wanted to also add that in comparing the two units There is absolutely no advantage to the 2021 to the 2017 for 4K, the 2021 was mainly for a speed and storage upgrade over the 32 GB 4th gen. For stuff like YouTube HDR, I use a Roku Ultra as the Apple TV doesn't support this correctly e.g. (automatic switching to HDR for YouTube.)

With all the tech details covered, does anyone know why I'm having such a weird lag issue? My own thoughts are because both the sound bar and ATV both support eARC and have a 2.1 HDMI certification, but the TV and switch do not. Because CEC can not be disabled on the sound bar, and disabled (fully on the Apple TV) that there is some conflict that doesn't show up when forcing it to HDMI 1.4 in the other setup. I've also read people suggesting 8k certified cables for the new ATV 4k, but in my setup i think that would be overkill unless it would be more friendly to bandwidth, but still it doesn't make sense that the older model would work, but not the new since nothing else had changed but the apple TV model being used.

If I've missed anything, or overlooked something, please let me know.

Lastly, wanted to include this (toggling match content settings, and chroma settings) makes no difference to the 2021 model, or which remote I pair, be it the new one it came with, an older one, or the iphone.
I have the 2017 model set to match content on both frame rate, and range, and chroma set to 4:4:4, without issues, so that should suggest the setup is correctly configured for 4k and HDR with enough bandwidth on the cabling.

 

[w5jck]

I have a similar, but a bit newer, TV, the Sony XBR-49X800H 49" model. Mine does support Dolby Vision and Atmos, as does my Sony HT-G700 sound bar. My ATV 4K is the 2017 model which you said works okay with your setup. So I really can't help much with your issue since I’ve never encountered it. However, in my setup, the TV acts as the "switch" or main control device. I have the HDMI-ARC port hooked to the soundbar, and the ATV 4K, Fire TV Cube, and Panasonic Blu-Ray player all connected directly to the TV. No switch required in my case, and the remotes for any of the connected devices can pretty much control the sound regardless of which device is running at the time. You setup sounds much more complicated.

ETA: If your streaming devices are directly connected to your TV, one thing I will say is to go into the Sony TV's Audio settings and try all three (or so) options for audio passthrough. There should be options similar to "Auto 1". "Auto 2", and "PCM". I had to find out which worked best with my sound bar. The previous sound bar actually worked best with a different setting than the new one does. PCM will probably work with almost any sound system, but it wao't pass Dolby Atmos and some other things, so only use it for older sound systems. Settings --> Display & Sound --> Audio Output --> Digital Audio Out --> select the best option.

It sounds like you have all your streaming devices connected to a switch which is then connected to the sound bar which then send the video feed to the TV. In that case, the issue is likely with the sound bar and how it plays with the ATV. I personally have had much better luck hooking the streaming devices directly up to the TV and letting the TV pass the audio feed to the sound bar.

 

[MacinMan]

I have a similar, but a bit newer, TV, the Sony XBR-49X800H 49" model. Mine does support Dolby Vision and Atmos, as does my Sony HT-G700 sound bar. My ATV 4K is the 2017 model which you said works okay with your setup. So I really can't help much with your issue since I’ve never encountered it. However, in my setup, the TV acts as the "switch" or main control device. I have the HDMI-ARC port hooked to the soundbar, and the ATV 4K, Fire TV Cube, and Panasonic Blu-Ray player all connected directly to the TV. No switch required in my case, and the remotes for any of the connected devices can pretty much control the sound regardless of which device is running at the time. You setup sounds much more complicated.

One thing I will say though is to go into the Sony TV's Audio settings and try all three (or so) options for audio passthrough. There should be options similar to "Auto 1". "Auto 2", and "PCM". I had to find out which worked best with my sound bar. The previous sound bar actually worked best with a different setting than the new one does. PCM will probably work with almost any sound system, but it wao't pass Dolby Atmos and some other things, so only use it for older sound systems.

The problem with my TV, and having the devices directly connected is, it's age. It only supports standard Dolby Digital 5.1 and DTS 5.1 passthrough. Even with ARC, it can't even pass DD+. I've read that requires at least a 2017 or newer TV. As far as the complexity of the setup, it's not that complex, It's just using one TV port with the switch in between so I can get full audio support for my devices. Think of it this way, because I don't have the space for a full receiver and speakers, and also living in an apartment with neighbors on one side, I wouldn't want a big speaker system anyway just out of respect for them. So while the receiver would have the switch built in, connecting the switch to the sound bar basically doing a custom receiver type setup. (only difference is the switch is external) Now the sound bar I use does have rear speakers that connect to the sub. So it's 5.1 plus virtual height for Dolby atmos and DTS:X I've considered a newer TV, there are just more important things to focus on at the time being, and the TV still works.

By the way before I got the newer sound bar, I had an older Vizio connected that was just 5.1 without the newer formats support, and it was limited to 1080p video only passthrough. While using that setup, I had all my devices connected to the TV and the sound bar connected by optical to the TV (since for me) ARC and optical are the same supported formats in this case. The only device I was able to connect directly was my Sony UHD player since it has dual HDMI outs. Now with the new sound bar, I can pass HDR, 4k,etc through the bar, but that doesn't fix the TV's outdated ARC configuration. That's why I switched everything through the bar in the update. I turned off the TV's CEC because the different devices caused conflicts, so as someone who prefers manual control most of the time for TV viewing, this has worked well for me. I think right now (today) the new Apple TV 4k over the 1st gen would only benefit me if I was a gamer, or watched a lot of sports, which I do neither of. Most of my content is either 24p, or 30fps. Pus I wanted to add as always when talking formats, I haven't rushed to Dolby Vision support mainly because I have a visual impairment, so it would be a big investment, and waste of money if I couldn't notice a difference over HDR10. I can tell SD, HD, SDR, from HDR, etc, but DV and HDR10 might be too similar to matter to me personally. The larger screen would be nice though but I have a 49" LG non smart HD TV in the bedroom, and while it's nice, it's not a huge difference between 49, and 43".

Thanks for the feedback though.

 

[w5jck]

BTW, I added a bit more info to my first post.

Last year I got my XBR-49X800H TV to replace a 2008 Sony Bravia which was way too old to connect much of anything too. It was made before the Smart TV era, so I had to use my sound bar to control every device. It is so much better having a more modern TV, so you might think about getting one when you can.

 

[MacinMan]

BTW, I added a bit more info to my first post.

Last year I got my XBR-49X800H TV to replace a 2008 Sony Bravia which was way too old to connect much of anything too. It was made before the Smart TV era, so I had to use my sound bar to control every device. It is so much better having a more modern TV, so you might think about getting one when you can.

Well, the LG in the bedroom is either a 2018, or 2019 model. I don't remember which year I got it, but it has 2 HDMI ports, and works good for a non smart display. I just prefer to have a dumb display with the smarts externally so if something goes wrong, it's easier to troubleshoot. The problem is, if I want to continue with 4k, and HDR content, finding a good sized dumb display is getting harder. I'm actually waiting for OLEDs to drop in price, that's another reason I've waited for an upgrade as well as being able to get smaller sizes, because I am limited to size here.

 

[w5jck]

Well, with my XBR-49X800H, it only took about 15 minutes to plug in all the cables, turn it on and turn on all the other devices, and have everything set up and running, including all the remotes working to control the TV. So there is something to be said for using a “smart” TV. It sure beat the old method of having to run everything through a sound bar, and having to run an optical cable from the TV to the sound bar so I could hear OTA TV when I wanted to watch it. The old dumb TV was a PITA to set up, and required keeping several remotes handy. It was a kluge setup to say the least.

 

[MacinMan]

Well, with my XBR-49X800H, it only took about 15 minutes to plug in all the cables, turn it on and turn on all the other devices, and have everything set up and running, including all the remotes working to control the TV. So there is something to be said for using a “smart” TV. It sure beat the old method of having to run everything through a sound bar, and having to run an optical cable from the TV to the sound bar so I could hear OTA TV when I wanted to watch it. The old dumb TV was a PITA to set up, and required keeping several remotes handy. It was a kluge setup to say the least.

I'll keep that in mind when shopping for a new TV when that time comes. I'll let you know if I figure out what's going on with the 2021 ATV. The ATV 2017 is working perfectly, watching a movie in HDR right now with it. Getting Atmos and HDR10.

 

[MacinMan]

Hey, @w5jck : just thought I would give you an update, and say I was able to solve the problem. For whatever reason a new HDMI cable i had bought a while back was apparently defective, or incompatible with the new Apple TV. I changed to an older braided cable that was sightly longer and "known good" and all lag is gone. I didn't suspect the cable because it had the right specs, and I had tried a different cable as well with the same issues, but not the cable I tried today. The cable I tried today immediately solved the problem. So I guess this new ATV is just picky, or has it's quirks.