Apples Response/Solution to Crackulous

[Trueskool]

Hey -

Well, I just wanted to know what you all think about this Crackulous "Crackulo.us" application which was released a few days ago. If you don't know what it is Google it because I'm not going to provide any info for what it does other then the absolute minimum needed to support my post.

When I first heard about this application from one of the numerous well-known media posting websites such as: wired, engadget, gizmodo, tuaw, who are inevitability giving them undeserved publicity, my first reaction was to download the application. My intentions for doing so were good I can assure you; they were simply to see if it could do what it says. So having my jailbroken iPhone inhand I downloaded the application and actually used it on an already free application. Yes it works, and it angered me so much I deleted the application and restored my phone back to an un-jailbroken version.

Personally, I'm disgusted with this application and hope the creators are punished accordingly; yes, i know the likelihood of that happening. I'm also aware that what Crackulous does is nothing new and has been around for quite sometime, but now it's been made INCREDIBILITY easy.

The reasons the developers of Crackulous are giving for its development are obscured and ignorant. Reasons such as: iPhone developers misleading buyers into purchasing applications which then in return fall short of expectations. As well as applications not being available with trail periods, a try-before-you-by type of distribution if you will. Or more so saying they want trails on all applications so they aren't wasting, in most cases, pennies on applications.

Trials for iphone applications would be just like going to a restaurant, ordering your meal, eating it and then refusing to pay once the bill comes because you didn't like it (not exactly but close enough).

Therefore, if iPhone developers are not able to break-even in this small market then they will not be able to continue to develop future applications or even fix/update current ones. I personally believe that anyone who uses this application for its intended purpose and/or downloads/uses it's product in any way will be single handily responsible for one of many problems to come of Apple, it's Developers, and the the reasons for the drastic changes which are sure to come to the iPhone/App Store.

So I would really lover to hear your thoughts on what you believe Apple will do in response or what solutions you believe they will bring to this obviously HUGE problem for iPhone Developers big & small (more small )

Please keep in mind that the purpose of this post is not to talk about how this is just the same as stealing all other types of mediums and it's not a big deal (as that's another issues), but to see what you guys think apple will do.

And just to note that while my iPhone was jailbroken I would only download applications which were legitimately released on "cydia"... applications which basically for some reasons or another are not allowed in the app store.

- Rich

 

[175170]

I can see what you mean.
However, if you look at statistics for the App Store, you will realize that most people are still buying the apps there.
It is very misleading to say that using Appulo.us is for trying a product, because that is definitely not the case with most of the people using it.
Also, you must have a jailbroken iPhone/iPod Touch, and most people, who use it ordinarily, do not jailbreak.
Thus, they do not have access to Appulo.us.
Perhaps Apple will try it's best to take it down.
We'll just have to wait and see.

 

[kdarling]

Trials for iphone applications would be just like going to a restaurant, ordering your meal, eating it and then refusing to pay once the bill comes because you didn't like it (not exactly but close enough).

I disagree with that. Trial apps are more like trying out a phone for a few weeks to see if you really like it enough to buy it.

Trial software is a good way for the user to see if the app 1) does what it says, 2) does it in a way the user wants, 3) is reliable and/or doesn't tie up resources, 4) is basically worth the money.

I can't count the number of WM trial apps that I've installed and then found after the two week period that I wanted to buy and keep them. (A corresponding number have been the other way... finding out that they weren't reliable or just had better competition.)

One major difference is that these WM apps cost from $5-20. (Okay, and $30 for Slingplayer after the trial period, for each phone I use it on.) Most of the Apple apps I have were one dollar, which is easier to part with on a whim.

Trial software is definitely needed if developers want to bring their prices up.

 

[bbplayer5]

Apple will be more motivated to stop jailbreaking if people keep doing this crap.

 

[Trueskool]

I disagree with that. Trial apps are more like trying out a phone for a few weeks to see if you really like it enough to buy it.

Trial software is a good way for the user to see if the app 1) does what it says, 2) does it in a way the user wants, 3) is reliable and/or doesn't tie up resources, 4) is basically worth the money.

Sorry, I should have elaborated in my post about trials and what I thought of it. I definitely agree that having some sort of try before you buy option could be very beneficial for everyone. Currently a fair amount of worthy applications are releasing lite versions of their applications is a trial in some form.

However just because there is currently a lack of definite solution should not be reason for someone to create something of this magnitude.

 

[Trueskool]

Apple will be more motivated to stop jailbreaking if people keep doing this crap.

Unfortunately most of the damage has already been done, now we just have to wait and see the aftermath, or the result of people's actions.

 

[cjm3113]

Unfortunately most of the damage has already been done, now we just have to wait and see the aftermath, or the result of people's actions.

How do you figure most of the damage has been done? 'Crackulous' was very recently released and I doubt that the App Store has even seen any decline at all at this point.

I am not condoning the action, I just disagree with some of your points. The "designers" make some good points about the App Store.

1. Expensive applications need a way to try them out.
2. There is a lot of crap in the App Store.

If Apple/Developers do not want to be hurt by 'Crackulous' they need to tackle those two problems. That's not to say that there will not always be people who want to steal things, but it will help control the damage.

 

[Kev1000000]

However just because there is currently a lack of definite solution should not be reason for someone to create something of this magnitude.

The only way Apple really listens to their customers though is when stuff like this happens. Do you think we'd have an App Store if the jailbreaking scene never released "Installer?" The app store is pretty much just a polished version of Installer.

Any competition, even bad competition, forces Apple to do the right thing. In this case, provide a trial solution. Not having a trial solution in the app store is really hindering sales and exposure of apps.

 

[sdsvtdriver]

Awesome! I never knew about this before I read your post. Thanks for sharing!

...and to answer your question, I think it is great. It won't hurt the app store enough for anyone to care. The #1 reason of the success of the app store is convenience... it's right there on your phone!

Sure, there's going to be some people who will use the script and spend the time to hunt down apps, but those are the same people who will hunt down music via torrent sites instead of paying a buck and downloading it in minute from amazon or (cr)itunes.

I personally pay for convenience since I'm not poor and I'm lazy, however I have always enjoyed watching the "cat and mouse game" of copy protection since the mid 80's.

 

[macduke]

You're just giving them more undeserved publicity with this forum post, so you're not much better than Engadget and the rest. With the size of MacRumors, I'm sure over the next few months several thousand people will read this post.

This will probably further delay push notifications and copy / paste. The jailbreaking community, in reality, is sustaining themselves. With the continued hacking, Apple has to keep working on patches. If there was no hacking, maybe, just maybe Apple would have pushed out several of the cool features you can only get with a jailbroken iPhone, aside from hacked apps, obviously.

 

[NeoMayhem]

Without these hacks do you really think apple will keep releasing updates/new features for the 2g/3g iPhones once the new ones come out?

We need to hack the crap out of our phones so that apple is forced to give us new features (copy and paste!) as an incentive to try the new software that they hope is harder to jailbreak.

 

[iSaygoodbye]

i hate app crackers and the people who support them!! its not fair to the developers

 

[nimda0]

Hey -

Well, I just wanted to know what you all think about this Crackulous "Crackulo.us" application which was released a few days ago. If you don't know what it is Google it because I'm not going to provide any info for what it does other then the absolute minimum needed to support my post.

When I first heard about this application from one of the numerous well-known media posting websites such as: wired, engadget, gizmodo, tuaw, who are inevitability giving them undeserved publicity, my first reaction was to download the application. My intentions for doing so were good I can assure you; they were simply to see if it could do what it says. So having my jailbroken iPhone inhand I downloaded the application and actually used it on an already free application. Yes it works, and it angered me so much I deleted the application and restored my phone back to an un-jailbroken version.

Personally, I'm disgusted with this application and hope the creators are punished accordingly; yes, i know the likelihood of that happening. I'm also aware that what Crackulous does is nothing new and has been around for quite sometime, but now it's been made INCREDIBILITY easy.

The reasons the developers of Crackulous are giving for its development are obscured and ignorant. Reasons such as: iPhone developers misleading buyers into purchasing applications which then in return fall short of expectations. As well as applications not being available with trail periods, a try-before-you-by type of distribution if you will. Or more so saying they want trails on all applications so they aren't wasting, in most cases, pennies on applications.

Trials for iphone applications would be just like going to a restaurant, ordering your meal, eating it and then refusing to pay once the bill comes because you didn't like it (not exactly but close enough).

Therefore, if iPhone developers are not able to break-even in this small market then they will not be able to continue to develop future applications or even fix/update current ones. I personally believe that anyone who uses this application for its intended purpose and/or downloads/uses it's product in any way will be single handily responsible for one of many problems to come of Apple, it's Developers, and the the reasons for the drastic changes which are sure to come to the iPhone/App Store.

So I would really lover to hear your thoughts on what you believe Apple will do in response or what solutions you believe they will bring to this obviously HUGE problem for iPhone Developers big & small (more small )

Please keep in mind that the purpose of this post is not to talk about how this is just the same as stealing all other types of mediums and it's not a big deal (as that's another issues), but to see what you guys think apple will do.

And just to note that while my iPhone was jailbroken I would only download applications which were legitimately released on "cydia"... applications which basically for some reasons or another are not allowed in the app store.

- Rich

Wow, the creator of that app didn't see the irony.

Wow, the user of the jailbroken iphone that downloaded the app onto his jailbroken iphone, does not see the irony.

I don't understand this post. The app is clearly useful to those who have jailbroken iphones. I'm having difficulty understanding how this is different then using cydia or any of the other app programs. I mean, they all provide cracked apps for free such as pacman (which costs money in the app store).

Yes the developers of these apps deserve credit... but does that mean you are willing to pay for it?

If the answer is yes, then I take it you can cancel that netflix subscription since you won't need to burn dvd's anymore... and get rid of Ares or lime wire because you won't need to download mp3's anymore.

I'm just trying to put it all into perspective. Where do you draw the line? If you pirate anything that has ever been created, then you cannot point the finger at anyone else.

 

[Tres]

Who cares? This has happened with every copy protected piece of software on the face of the planet, is it really worth getting all wound up and self-righteous over just because it's an Apple product? I'm sure your ego is absolutely huge right now though.

 

[Trueskool]

Wow, the creator of that app didn't see the irony.

Wow, the user of the jailbroken iphone that downloaded the app onto his jailbroken iphone, does not see the irony.

I don't understand this post. The app is clearly useful to those who have jailbroken iphones. I'm having difficulty understanding how this is different then using cydia or any of the other app programs. I mean, they all provide cracked apps for free such as pacman (which costs money in the app store).

If you're having difficulty seeing how this is different you need to do a bit more reading and a lot more research into the intended purpose of both/all those applications.

Yes the developers of these apps deserve credit... but does that mean you are willing to pay for it?

If the application is something I want... yes I am willing to pay for it.

If the answer is yes, then I take it you can cancel that netflix subscription since you won't need to burn dvd's anymore... and get rid of Ares or lime wire because you won't need to download mp3's anymore.

I'm just trying to put it all into perspective. Where do you draw the line? If you pirate anything that has ever been created, then you cannot point the finger at anyone else.

Not only do you have a hard time understanding but you clearly cannot read either. While I could go into a debate on the reasons I believe which this is different and falls into a grey area, that's beyond the scope of this therefore I'm not going to respond other then saying don't support your case with facts you don't know.

 

[Trueskool]

How do you figure most of the damage has been done? 'Crackulous' was very recently released and I doubt that the App Store has even seen any decline at all at this point.

The damage I'm referring to is that a good majority of the applications have now been cracked. So no matter what apples does, all of those applications code is now public and will in one way or another be able to be altered to match Apples response.

 

[pawangera]

iPhone game development

Hi i am new in iphone. Can anyone help me in iphone game development.

 

[ppc750fx]

Why should the developers be punished? Crackulous/Installous aren't illegal.

 

[deadsouls]

first of all you restaurant analogy is ridiculous and lacks any logic in context to what you're talking about.

oh please. if you really want to get all righteous, i would hunt down the crappy developers who make garbage like ifart and etc etc in order to make a quick buck.

crackulous doesnt cost you anything. its free. the developers get NO money from it. besides, people who download cracked apps are NOT the ones who would even buy apps anyway.


apple really can't do anything about it. software piracy has obviously outlasted every form of copy protection throughout the years. if anything, apple should be the one condemned for completely copying installer in its heyday, charging ridiculous 'developer' fees and then raping them another 30% off of their own app sales.

 

[MikePA]

As long as there are rules and laws, there will be arrogant and narcissistic people who rationalize why the rules and laws do not apply to them.

 

[Tokiopop]

first of all you restaurant analogy is ridiculous and lacks any logic in context to what you're talking about.

oh please. if you really want to get all righteous, i would hunt down the crappy developers who make garbage like ifart and etc etc in order to make a quick buck.

crackulous doesnt cost you anything. its free. the developers get NO money from it. besides, people who download cracked apps are NOT the ones who would even buy apps anyway.


apple really can't do anything about it. software piracy has obviously outlasted every form of copy protection throughout the years. if anything, apple should be the one condemned for completely copying installer in its heyday, charging ridiculous 'developer' fees and then raping them another 30% off of their own app sales.

That's a very good point. The people who would use Hackulous/Crackulous wouldn't buy the apps anyway, they'd either want them free or go without. I'm not sticking up for them, but people saying it's costing developers money... Well, in a way it isn't.

 

[ppc750fx]

oh please. if you really want to get all righteous, i would hunt down the crappy developers who make garbage like ifart and etc etc in order to make a quick buck.

What's wrong with those apps? The developers saw a demand and developed an application that met that demand. What's the problem? Why should you "hunt them down"?

crackulous doesnt cost you anything. its free. the developers get NO money from it. besides, people who download cracked apps are NOT the ones who would even buy apps anyway.

That's a poor excuse and you know it. If you want to pirate apps, fine. Doesn't bother me. But at least have the guts to say that you're doing it because you'd rather violate copyright laws than pay money. Hell, I've done it. When I was younger I bootlegged tapes from my friends to avoid paying for them at the store. At no point, however, did I say "well it's not really wrong because I wouldn't have bought it in the first place".

The only folks I respect less than the politicians who've extended copyright law at the behest of Disney et. al. are the folks who don't even have the balls to be honest about why they pirate applications.

apple really can't do anything about it. software piracy has obviously outlasted every form of copy protection throughout the years. if anything, apple should be the one condemned for completely copying installer in its heyday, charging ridiculous 'developer' fees and then raping them another 30% off of their own app sales.

Wait... so Apple should be condemned for refining a concept that's been around for at least a decade and providing a service that people want to use? Please explain your logic behind this -- I'm curious why you think that.

 

[deadsouls]

What's wrong with those apps? The developers saw a demand and developed an application that met that demand. What's the problem? Why should you "hunt them down"?



That's a poor excuse and you know it. If you want to pirate apps, fine. Doesn't bother me. But at least have the guts to say that you're doing it because you'd rather violate copyright laws than pay money. Hell, I've done it. When I was younger I bootlegged tapes from my friends to avoid paying for them at the store. At no point, however, did I say "well it's not really wrong because I wouldn't have bought it in the first place".

The only folks I respect less than the politicians who've extended copyright law at the behest of Disney et. al. are the folks who don't even have the balls to be honest about why they pirate applications.



Wait... so Apple should be condemned for refining a concept that's been around for at least a decade and providing a service that people want to use? Please explain your logic behind this -- I'm curious why you think that.

of course theres nothing LEGALLY wrong with those fart apps. but if you see nothing wrong with an app that just makes fart noises or one of those "call sarah!", "call todd!" etc etc individual dialer apps then thats your own problem.

secondly i'm talking about the app crackulous. crackulous isnt necessary for me to pirate apps. in fact, what incentive does any pirate even have for crackulous? absolutely NONE at all. in order to even use crackulous they have to BUY THE APP first which obviously defeats the entire purpose of being a pirate.

if apple are allowed to essentially copy installer and make a ton of money off of it then why is every apple fan boy pissed that other companies are supposedly copying the iphone? arent they just providing a service/product that people might want alternative to the iphone? see, i can fluff up a nonsensical argument in my favour too.

 

[ppc750fx]

of course theres nothing LEGALLY wrong with those fart apps. but if you see nothing wrong with an app that just makes fart noises or one of those "call sarah!", "call todd!" etc etc individual dialer apps then thats your own problem.

Rather than act surprised at my response, why not explain what you think is wrong with those applications?

secondly i'm talking about the app crackulous. crackulous isnt necessary for me to pirate apps. in fact, what incentive does any pirate even have for crackulous? absolutely NONE at all. in order to even use crackulous they have to BUY THE APP first which obviously defeats the entire purpose of being a pirate.

What the hell are you talking about? Seriously... I have no idea what point you're trying to make. Can you please try to phrase it another way?

if apple are allowed to essentially copy installer and make a ton of money off of it then why is every apple fan boy pissed that other companies are supposedly copying the iphone? arent they just providing a service/product that people might want alternative to the iphone?

Apple's App Store (which I assume is what you're referring to) isn't copying Installer. The concept of a network-accessible software repository is not unique to either company -- it's been around for a hell of a lot longer than the iPhone has.

see, i can fluff up a nonsensical argument in my favour too.

You don't appear to be very good at it.

 

[Night Spring]

secondly i'm talking about the app crackulous. crackulous isnt necessary for me to pirate apps. in fact, what incentive does any pirate even have for crackulous? absolutely NONE at all. in order to even use crackulous they have to BUY THE APP first which obviously defeats the entire purpose of being a pirate.

What the hell are you talking about? Seriously... I have no idea what point you're trying to make. Can you please try to phrase it another way?

I believe deadsoul is referring to the fact that, in order to crack an app using crackulous, one first has to buy the app from the app store. Thus, the person using crackulous may be enabling others to get the app for free, but he himself has to pay for it.