Other Apple's revenue miss--tacit admission of shady iPhone business practices?

[janeauburn]

As I expected, Apple disappointed the street today with significantly lower guidance for Q1 revenue. In its statement, Apple tacitly admitted that it has been relying upon the performance hit caused by degraded batteries to juice its revenue in the past:

While macroeconomic challenges in some markets were a key contributor to this trend, we believe there are other factors broadly impacting our iPhone performance, including consumers adapting to a world with fewer carrier subsidies, US dollar strength-related price increases, and some customers taking advantage of significantly reduced pricing for iPhone battery replacements.
​

That last sentence suggests this: you get a new battery, you discover you don't really need a new iPhone.

The way I read this is that in the past, Apple has been--perhaps stealthily, perhaps nefariously--relying on the performance hit caused by battery degradation to prod its users to upgrade. This, in my view (and that of European courts, at least), is an underhanded business practice, at best.

Shame on Apple.

 

[AppleHaterLover]

They wouldn’t ever admit to this in a press release, Legal wouldn’t allow it.

What this means is they’re subsidizing these battery replacements.

You can see from the rest of the stuff they’re blaming their bad quarter on that they’re not admitting it’s their own fault - “price increases” (as if they’re FORCED to increase the prices), consumers adapting to fewer subsidies (same).

You won’t see any listed company admitting it screwed up in a quarterly report. Never ever. Unless they’ve been under enormous pressure to do so.

 

[Knowlege Bomb]

Yeah I think this was pretty much a given when Apple got caught red-handed in the battery/throttle case. That said, this really is old news as it's just rehashing what has been said time and time again since it was all uncovered. At least they've owned up, changed their practices even went out of their way to ensure old hardware performed on iOS 12 as good as, if not better, than last years release.

Reality is, they're dealing with a waning market due to saturation just like every other smartphone manufacturer out there.

 

[neutrino23]

Seems like the opposite case to me. Apple prevented power surges which made the phone last longer with the same battery. They could have just turned this off and when the phone crashed you’d have to a new phone. Instead, they offered an inexpensive battery replacement which restored your phone’s performance.

 

[hr10]

iphone sales might not be as good as before but to Apple, i assume their user base is not shrinking . People are just not upgrading, but they are still within the Apple ecosystem. maybe good time to buy some stock when it drops tmr?

 

[boltjames]

They also mentioned carriers eliminating subsidies which for years kept hardware prices low. And China is affecting all corporations large and small, no way Apple could skate by unharmed; 100% of Apple's miss to revenue is due to one country- China.

But the real cause, be it now or in the near future, is that Apple is a victim of making products so high in quality there simply is no need to replace them frequently.

 

[JPack]

At the end of 2018, the iPhone 6 and 6s series accounted for 28% of market share.

A $29 battery feels like a new phone. It's going to blow strong headwinds for sure.

 

[joeblow7777]

As I expected, Apple disappointed the street today with significantly lower guidance for Q1 revenue. In its statement, Apple tacitly admitted that it has been relying upon the performance hit caused by degraded batteries to juice its revenue in the past:

While macroeconomic challenges in some markets were a key contributor to this trend, we believe there are other factors broadly impacting our iPhone performance, including consumers adapting to a world with fewer carrier subsidies, US dollar strength-related price increases, and some customers taking advantage of significantly reduced pricing for iPhone battery replacements.
​

That last sentence suggests this: you get a new battery, you discover you don't really need a new iPhone.

The way I read this is that in the past, Apple has been--perhaps stealthily, perhaps nefariously--relying on the performance hit caused by battery degradation to prod its users to upgrade. This, in my view (and that of European courts, at least), is an underhanded business practice, at best.

Shame on Apple.

You can interpret that however you choose. It doesn’t really allow for any definitive conclusion.

 

[willmtaylor]

As I expected, Apple disappointed the street today with significantly lower guidance for Q1 revenue. In its statement, Apple tacitly admitted that it has been relying upon the performance hit caused by degraded batteries to juice its revenue in the past:

While macroeconomic challenges in some markets were a key contributor to this trend, we believe there are other factors broadly impacting our iPhone performance, including consumers adapting to a world with fewer carrier subsidies, US dollar strength-related price increases, and some customers taking advantage of significantly reduced pricing for iPhone battery replacements.
​

That last sentence suggests this: you get a new battery, you discover you don't really need a new iPhone.

The way I read this is that in the past, Apple has been--perhaps stealthily, perhaps nefariously--relying on the performance hit caused by battery degradation to prod its users to upgrade. This, in my view (and that of European courts, at least), is an underhanded business practice, at best.

Shame on Apple.

There’s nothing nefarious except perhaps your insinuations.

Li-ion atteries are a consumable in every single device they’re used in. Some last longer than others, but chemistry and physics can’t be ignored here.

It’s a reasonable explanation for a slow down of turn-over and it’s honestly ridiculous that folks would take a reduced battery replacement program and throw it back in Apple’s face. Shame on whoever would resort to unsubstantiated low-hanging fruit.

 

[I7guy]

People are going to rub their hands in glee as they perceive apple is on the brink of disaster. It is what it is. Tim Cook isn't going anywhere (for those calling for an "impeachment") and he is smart enough to navigate the waters.

 

[C DM]

As I expected, Apple disappointed the street today with significantly lower guidance for Q1 revenue. In its statement, Apple tacitly admitted that it has been relying upon the performance hit caused by degraded batteries to juice its revenue in the past:

While macroeconomic challenges in some markets were a key contributor to this trend, we believe there are other factors broadly impacting our iPhone performance, including consumers adapting to a world with fewer carrier subsidies, US dollar strength-related price increases, and some customers taking advantage of significantly reduced pricing for iPhone battery replacements.
​

That last sentence suggests this: you get a new battery, you discover you don't really need a new iPhone.

The way I read this is that in the past, Apple has been--perhaps stealthily, perhaps nefariously--relying on the performance hit caused by battery degradation to prod its users to upgrade. This, in my view (and that of European courts, at least), is an underhanded business practice, at best.

Shame on Apple.

Seems like they are simply saying that devices perform better and can last longer these days.

 

[digitalexplr]

As I expected, Apple disappointed the street today with significantly lower guidance for Q1 revenue. In its statement, Apple tacitly admitted that it has been relying upon the performance hit caused by degraded batteries to juice its revenue in the past:

While macroeconomic challenges in some markets were a key contributor to this trend, we believe there are other factors broadly impacting our iPhone performance, including consumers adapting to a world with fewer carrier subsidies, US dollar strength-related price increases, and some customers taking advantage of significantly reduced pricing for iPhone battery replacements.
​

That last sentence suggests this: you get a new battery, you discover you don't really need a new iPhone.

The way I read this is that in the past, Apple has been--perhaps stealthily, perhaps nefariously--relying on the performance hit caused by battery degradation to prod its users to upgrade. This, in my view (and that of European courts, at least), is an underhanded business practice, at best.

Shame on Apple.

Oh, please! You really need to do a whole lot of research on whole lot of topics.

 

[janeauburn]

There’s nothing nefarious except perhaps your insinuations.

No. What's nefarious is that in the past, Apple was making it very difficult, if not impossible, to get your battery replaced. I personally tried 3 times at my local Apple store to get them to replace the battery in my 6 Plus. Each time they insisted that the battery was testing out fine (3 year old phone, mind you, used every day) and therefore they would not replace the battery. I was more than willing to pay for a battery replacement, and I had paid for Apple Care for the stupid phone on top of it!

So this, in my opinion, is a nefarious business practice because what they were doing (prior to 2018) was essentially forcing people to upgrade by refusing to replace their batteries.

Of course, the European courts slammed down on them for this. So it wasn't just me who was upset. And in 2018 they offered not only lower prices on batteries but a no-questions-asked replacement policy.

Now, the big question is what are they going to do in 2019? We already know that battery prices will be higher. The real question is whether the nefarious/unscrupulous practice of denying customers' requests for battery replacements will return. With revenues declining rapidly, I'd not trust them on this score farther than I can spit.

 

[pixel_junkie]

But the real cause, be it now or in the near future, is that Apple is a victim of making products so high in quality there simply is no need to replace them frequently.

Or so low in change and innovation there simply is no need to replace them frequently. That works too.

 

[KrisLord]

I think for most people the new battery didn’t provide extra speed, it just meant their phone lasted a full day on a single charge.

That was probably enough for some, then add in the speed gains of iOS 12 and you’re sticking with your current phone.

 

[stafil]

They should increase the iPhone prices more. That ought to fix the financial problems.

 

[C DM]

No. What's nefarious is that in the past, Apple was making it very difficult, if not impossible, to get your battery replaced. I personally tried 3 times at my local Apple store to get them to replace the battery in my 6 Plus. Each time they insisted that the battery was testing out fine (3 year old phone, mind you, used every day) and therefore they would not replace the battery. I was more than willing to pay for a battery replacement, and I had paid for Apple Care for the stupid phone on top of it!

So this, in my opinion, is a nefarious business practice because what they were doing (prior to 2018) was essentially forcing people to upgrade by refusing to replace their batteries.

Of course, the European courts slammed down on them for this. So it wasn't just me who was upset. And in 2018 they offered not only lower prices on batteries but a no-questions-asked replacement policy.

Now, the big question is what are they going to do in 2019? We already know that battery prices will be higher. The real question is whether the nefarious/unscrupulous practice of denying customers' requests for battery replacements will return. With revenues declining rapidly, I'd not trust them on this score farther than I can spit.

Seems like there's an assumption there that older hardware would be still performant some years down the line with a new battery just as good as newer more mature hardware. Even with a new battery that might not really be the case in many instances and people would still be more inclined to update with those older devices compared to more recent ones that are better and can perform fairly well for longer.

 

[Hieveryone]

As I expected, Apple disappointed the street today with significantly lower guidance for Q1 revenue. In its statement, Apple tacitly admitted that it has been relying upon the performance hit caused by degraded batteries to juice its revenue in the past:

While macroeconomic challenges in some markets were a key contributor to this trend, we believe there are other factors broadly impacting our iPhone performance, including consumers adapting to a world with fewer carrier subsidies, US dollar strength-related price increases, and some customers taking advantage of significantly reduced pricing for iPhone battery replacements.
​

That last sentence suggests this: you get a new battery, you discover you don't really need a new iPhone.

The way I read this is that in the past, Apple has been--perhaps stealthily, perhaps nefariously--relying on the performance hit caused by battery degradation to prod its users to upgrade. This, in my view (and that of European courts, at least), is an underhanded business practice, at best.

Shame on Apple.

I'm not a lawyer or anything, but in my opinion, which may be right or wrong, I don't really see it as an admission of anything other than them saying they're making less money off batteries. So like instead of $99 bucks per battery or whatever it was now they're only make $29 which is what I think it was after the discount. So like they're saying we didnt make as much money because of the discount.

But I don't know. I'm just guessing.

 

[photocat2005]

Perhaps it is because society now has much more disposable income but things like shampoo, vitamins, make-up, etc. are the true "consumable" products that are replaced frequently. Never quite understood how a several hundred dollar mini-computer became a "consumable" It wasn't that long ago if you spent hundreds of dollars on one item, you expected and demanded it last for several years, if not a decade or more. Regardless - everything plateaus, including tech, but Wall Street only rewards growth so companies such as Apple will do what they must to keep "growing"

 

[44267547]

Perhaps it is because society now has much more disposable income but things like shampoo, vitamins, make-up, etc. are the true "consumable" products that are replaced frequently. Never quite understood how a several hundred dollar mini-computer became a "consumable" It wasn't that long ago if you spent hundreds of dollars on one item, you expected and demanded it last for several years, if not a decade or more. Regardless - everything plateaus, including tech, but Wall Street only rewards growth so companies such as Apple will do what they must to keep "growing"

It’s Really simple, The general consumer is not willing to spend over $1000 for an iPhone, even though carriers do make it easier with subsidized monthly payments, most smart phones generally all do the same things, notifications, emails, etc. with Apple offering five years of iOS support for the majority of their iPhones, consumers don’t necessarily find a reason to upgrade on an annual basis just because of the hardware, only if their iPhone is in need of replacement.

 

[chrfr]

No. What's nefarious is that in the past, Apple was making it very difficult, if not impossible, to get your battery replaced. I personally tried 3 times at my local Apple store to get them to replace the battery in my 6 Plus. Each time they insisted that the battery was testing out fine (3 year old phone, mind you, used every day) and therefore they would not replace the battery. I was more than willing to pay for a battery replacement, and I had paid for Apple Care for the stupid phone on top of it!

So this, in my opinion, is a nefarious business practice because what they were doing (prior to 2018) was essentially forcing people to upgrade by refusing to replace their batteries.

I got caught by this too. My 6S battery would not last the day, yet it tested fine. Although I offered to pay the full $79, I was not able to get a new battery through Apple so I bought a new iPhone 8. Just past the return window, Apple changed the policy on battery replacements. I'd still be using that 6S today if Apple had been honest about the battery situation. I'm pretty pleased to see them suffer the consequences of this, frankly.

 

[Hieveryone]

At the end of 2018, the iPhone 6 and 6s series accounted for 28% of market share.

A $29 battery feels like a new phone. It's going to blow strong headwinds for sure.


View attachment 813730

This chart is pretty amazing. I always had my doubts a lot of people had the X, XS, or MAX and this seems to be the case from the chart. I mean a lot of people do have it, but I see way more older models. Meaning, lots of home button iPhones out there.
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I got caught by this too. My 6S battery would not last the day, yet it tested fine. Although I offered to pay the full $79, I was not able to get a new battery through Apple so I bought a new iPhone 8. Just past the return window, Apple changed the policy on battery replacements. I'd still be using that 6S today if Apple had been honest about the battery situation. I'm pretty pleased to see them suffer the consequences of this, frankly.

LOL. Gotta love the honesty of how you feel. If what you're saying is true, which I'm not saying you aren't, then I don't blame you hahaha.

I would be so mad if I had no reason to upgrade except for a new battery and they refused so I bought a new iPhone only find out shortly thereafter I wasted a bunch of my money lol

In fact, I'd instead of enjoying the iPhone phone I'd prob grudge and feel bad everytime I looked at it knowing I might have gotten ripped off at least for a good while
[doublepost=1546478707][/doublepost]

They should increase the iPhone prices more. That ought to fix the financial problems.

"We wanted to make things simple for our customers in 2019 so we're introducing the iPhone 11 for $2,019 dollars" hahahaha what a joke

 

[boltjames]

Or so low in change and innovation there simply is no need to replace them frequently. That works too.

Definitely. I kept my iPhone 7 straight until I bought my X because in that 3 year gap there was nothing new to get me excited enough to upgrade.

But the X knocked it out of the park. Great innovation, great battery life, and great reliability.

When Apple pulls the old “S” trick there is a huge thud. They need to come to grips with a 3 year release cycle and stop the nonsense in between.

 

[NovemberWhiskey]

I noticed that too, but I really think it was more of an excuse for a poor executive decision to keep iPhone prices so high (or to raise them so high).

I mean, that's the real reason why people aren't upgrading. I don't think the battery thing is having that big an impact on new phones. Those are phones that are 3+ years old, where those users wouldn't have upgraded on a yearly basis anyways. It just keeps those old people (like my parents) happy.

 

[Hieveryone]

I noticed that too, but I really think it was more of an excuse for a poor executive decision to keep iPhone prices so high (or to raise them so high).

I mean, that's the real reason why people aren't upgrading. I don't think the battery thing is having that big an impact on new phones. Those are phones that are 3+ years old, where those users wouldn't have upgraded on a yearly basis anyways. It just keeps those old people (like my parents) happy.

Basically hwat i'm reading on here is that

A) Prices are too darn high

B) Older iPhones are running just fine (people aren't seeing a slow down if they change the battery or whatever)

Maybe its a combination affect