Can someone please explain why iOS can't sync badges?!

[yalag]

We are 10 years in, and we still can't sync badges across devices. Why?

Every day I must play the game of whack-a-mole and click on each app that has a badge on it for each device I have. I have an iphone, ipad pro and ipad mini. If there are just 5 apps with badges, I have to launch 15 things a day just to clear them. Please help!

Why can't icloud just clear it for me? Can someone shed some light on what's going on?

 

[Mlrollin91]

Are you talking about the push notification number?

This is because of how APNS works. (Apple push notification service). This way it only pushes an update when it receives one. If it's constantly scanning for updates, then it would significantly reduce battery life.

 

[yalag]

Are you talking about the push notification number?

This is because of how APNS works. (Apple push notification service). This way it only pushes an update when it receives one. If it's constantly scanning for updates, then it would significantly reduce battery life.

Yes the badges. The push number.

It doesn't have to constantly scan for update. Just whenever the badge gets cleared from one device, send an update to the other two!! In fact, they even said this was a feature in iOS5. Badge syncing!!

 

[Mlrollin91]

Yes the badges. The push number.

It doesn't have to constantly scan for update. Just whenever the badge gets cleared from one device, send an update to the other two!! In fact, they even said this was a feature in iOS5. Badge syncing!!

That's keeping an open signal and would have to be scanning. How else would it know it's been cleared from another device unless the one device pushes out a signal and the other has an open channel looking for it.

I'm pretty sure the badge syncing you are referring too is iMessage only. There is a lengthy support article about APNS that describes what I'm saying.

Here is one support article: https://support.apple.com/en-ca/HT203545
Having issues trying to find the other one that gives more detail. I know this is mainly referencing mail, but its the same principle outlined in the other article if I can find it.


"If you read one of your iCloud email messages in the Mail application on your computer, that email will still appear in your unread mail count on your iPhone, iPad, or iPod touch until you open Mail on that device. Once you open Mail on the iOS device, the message status will be updated."

This applies to anything that uses APNS.
[doublepost=1491493313][/doublepost]According to some other forums the only way to bypass the channel "closing" is to have the developer implement badge syncing via background app refresh. Then it needs to be turned on on both devices.

 

[zorinlynx]

Badges are a mess in general. I've learned to just turn off badges for apps that misbehave with them; 99% of the time they are games that I turn off notifications for anyway. I don't need needy games on my device.

 

[yalag]

That's keeping an open signal and would have to be scanning. How else would it know it's been cleared from another device unless the one device pushes out a signal and the other has an open channel looking for it.

I'm pretty sure the badge syncing you are referring too is iMessage only. There is a lengthy support article about APNS that describes what I'm saying.

Here is one support article: https://support.apple.com/en-ca/HT203545
Having issues trying to find the other one that gives more detail. I know this is mainly referencing mail, but its the same principle outlined in the other article if I can find it.


"If you read one of your iCloud email messages in the Mail application on your computer, that email will still appear in your unread mail count on your iPhone, iPad, or iPod touch until you open Mail on that device. Once you open Mail on the iOS device, the message status will be updated."

This applies to anything that uses APNS.
[doublepost=1491493313][/doublepost]According to some other forums the only way to bypass the channel "closing" is to have the developer implement badge syncing via background app refresh. Then it needs to be turned on on both devices.

Huh? It's keep an open signal ANYWAY because that's how APNS works. So in reality, when you clear the badge, icloud should send a push message to all other devices to CLEAR. This is no different than sending these devices with a push to update the count anyway (from count 1 to 2 for example)

 

[Mlrollin91]

Huh? It's keep an open signal ANYWAY because that's how APNS works. So in reality, when you clear the badge, icloud should send a push message to all other devices to CLEAR. This is no different than sending these devices with a push to update the count anyway (from count 1 to 2 for example)

No. It doesn't keep an open signal. A signal is set to the device only when an update is made on the APNS. It's never a truly 100% open channel.

The device itself never pushes the update to APNS. APNS sends the signal to the device. Therefore APNS can't relay the signal to other devices.

 

[yalag]

No. It doesn't keep an open signal. A signal is set to the device only when an update is made on the APNS. It's never a truly 100% open channel.

The device itself never pushes the update to APNS. APNS sends the signal to the device. Therefore APNS can't relay the signal to other devices.

It doesn't make sense, the OS should send the signal to the rest of the devices using the SAME APNS methods to update the count.

It's not the app, I'm not talking about DEVELOPERS here. I'm talking APPLE. APPPLE already has the technology to do this at ease. They refuse to do it. WHY?

 

[Mlrollin91]

It doesn't make sense, the OS should send the signal to the rest of the devices using the SAME APNS methods to update the count.

It's not the app, I'm not talking about DEVELOPERS here. I'm talking APPLE. APPPLE already has the technology to do this at ease. They refuse to do it. WHY?

Because it doesn't work as you suggest. The device never sends a signal to APNS, APNS sends to the device. Therefore, it cannot send the update of the badge count to APNS and then APNS relay it to other devices. Its because its not a fully open channel. I'm telling you the way around this is if developers implement it via background app refresh. What you are asking is only made possible with iMessage. No other app or service does this, not even mail as I had posted above the support article for.

There are 3rd party mail apps where this works because they implemented through background app refresh and it keeps an constant open signal, but these apps use a decent amount of battery life compared to the stock mail app.

 

[yalag]

Because it doesn't work as you suggest. The device never sends a signal to APNS, APNS sends to the device. Therefore, it cannot send the update of the badge count to APNS and then APNS relay it to other devices. Its because its not a fully open channel. I'm telling you the way around this is if developers implement it via background app refresh. What you are asking is only made possible with iMessage. No other app or service does this, not even mail as I had posted above the support article for.

Do you not understand that Apple owns iOS and iCloud and APNS? I don't even understand what is it that you don't get?

I'm a app developer but here let me write it in laymen terms

1) User opens the app
2) App is told to reset badget count
3) ***** NEW ACTION***** Send to APNS an updated badge count (This command already exists, because you could always update badge count with APNS)
4) Other devices receives the updated count and execute code to update

 

[Mlrollin91]

Do you not understand that Apple owns iOS and iCloud and APNS? I don't even understand what is it that you don't get?

I'm a app developer but here let me write it in laymen terms

1) User opens the app
2) App is told to reset badget count
3) ***** NEW ACTION***** Send to APNS an updated badge count (This command already exists, because you could always update badge count with APNS)
4) Other devices receives the updated count and execute code to update

I couldn't care less if you are a developer and you definitely don't need to put it in 'layman' terms because I understand fine. You are the one that aren't understanding. Apple does NOT open the APNS channel to send signals from the device to other devices. If background app refresh is ENABLED for this action, the opening of the app on device one will send a relay signal to the app on device 2. Again its pretty obvious Apple does not offer this as mail, their own app, does not support what you are asking.

 

[yalag]

What do you not understand what I am telling you. Apple does NOT open the APNS channel to send signals from the device to other devices. If background app refresh is ENABLED for this action, the opening of the app on device one will send a relay signal to the app on device 2. Again its pretty obvious Apple does not offer this as mail, their own app, does not support what you are asking.

Apple OWNS APNS. Whadafuq? Seriously. I don't get it. THIS IS THEIR CODE.

 

[Mlrollin91]

Apple OWNS APNS. Whadafuq? Seriously. I don't get it. THIS IS THEIR CODE.

I'm done with this because you clearly are not understanding. Just because they OWN it, doesn't mean they open it up to how YOU would like it to be. Apple chooses NOT to do what you are want. End of story. It doesn't matter who owns it, all that matters is it doesn't function they way you would like it to by DESIGN. Again look at mail. Have a good day.

 

[yalag]

I'm done with this because you clearly are not understanding. Just because they OWN it, doesn't mean they open it up to how YOU would like it to be. Apple chooses NOT to do what you are want. End of story. It doesn't matter who owns it, all that matters is it doesn't function they way you would like it to by DESIGN. Again look at mail. Have a good day.

That's exactly my original question, WHY won't THEY DO THIS?? Not, why doesn't it work with TODAY'S DESIGN. That would be an idiotic question. Because if the current design did it, it WOULD HAVE WORKED ALREADY.

There's no need to talk about how it doesn't work right now. I just want to know why they HAVEN'T CHANGED IT TO WORK. When the change is trivial.

 

[Mlrollin91]

That's exactly my original question, WHY won't THEY DO THIS?? Not, why doesn't it work with TODAY'S DESIGN. That would be an idiotic question. Because if the current design did it, it WOULD HAVE WORKED ALREADY.

There's no need to talk about how it doesn't work right now. I just want to know why they HAVEN'T CHANGED IT TO WORK. When the change is trivial.

I shall refer you to my first post as I have already addressed this. Battery life. I have also given an example of how this is an actual problem because if you use a 3rd party mail app that leaves the channel open, it uses more battery life. Its really that simple. All I have been doing is trying to help you answer your question (which I did).

 

[yalag]

I shall refer you to my first post as I have already addressed this. Battery life. I have also given an example of how this is an actual problem because if you use a 3rd party mail app that leaves the channel open, it uses more battery life. Its really that simple. All I have been doing is trying to help you answer your question (which I did).

It would have 0 impact on battery life, because it would be the same APNS payload one would receives from normal push. This would simply be a new type of APNS command that is intended to update badge without user prompt.

 

[Sital]

I shall refer you to my first post as I have already addressed this. Battery life. I have also given an example of how this is an actual problem because if you use a 3rd party mail app that leaves the channel open, it uses more battery life. Its really that simple. All I have been doing is trying to help you answer your question (which I did).

Regarding battery life, I've been using a 3rd party email app for a few months now precisely because I wanted my badge count to sync, but I haven't noticed a difference in my battery life. Not to say that there isn't an effect (especially if you started using multiple 3rd party apps that leave the channel open) , it just isn't an issue for me.

 

[yalag]

Regarding battery life, I've been using a 3rd party email app for a few months now precisely because I wanted my badge count to sync, but I haven't noticed a difference in my battery life. Not to say that there isn't an effect (especially if you started using multiple 3rd party apps that leave the channel open) , it just isn't an issue for me.

Of course it doesn't have an battery life impact. The way APNS works is that there is only one persisted network connection ever for all apps (first or third party) so the fact that the app is told to update it's badge is not going to create additional connections. You can argue the battery consumed just to receive the updated count but that's such a trivial amount unless you are updating it extremely frequently in a day.

 

[cswifx]

Badge syncing is hardly a feature many people use or notice, so it's counterintuitive to include such a feature. Besides, it's the apps' developers' responsibility to manage their own notifications.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[tarsins]

That's exactly my original question, WHY won't THEY DO THIS?? Not, why doesn't it work with TODAY'S DESIGN. That would be an idiotic question. Because if the current design did it, it WOULD HAVE WORKED ALREADY.

There's no need to talk about how it doesn't work right now. I just want to know why they HAVEN'T CHANGED IT TO WORK. When the change is trivial.

Why don't you ask them then?

 

[btbam91]

Definitely a shortcoming of iOS.

 

[stooovie]

It already was a feature in early betas of iOS 5 and it did work but they pulled it. It's very annoying. I've got four Apple devices and I have to clear the same notifications on each of them. Doesn't make sense when calls can be relayed, Mac music playback volume decrease when nearby iPhone is on call and stuff like that already works.

 

[sniffies]

5 years later:

I'm with OP 100000000000000%.

There's absolutely no reason it can't work.

When you clear iCloud Mail badge on iOS, macOS automatically clears it as well.
But when you clear iCloud Mail badge on macOS, iOS simply refuses to automatically clear it as well.

Like, what the funk!!!!