Critique of Logo for Web Design Business

[THX1139]

Great, just what the internet needs. Another web "designer" who doesn't know how to design.

Like:

http://www.noahsarklimos.com/

Seriously though... I would suggest that you team up with a designer and you do all of the development if that is your thing. Don't worry, you are on the better side of the business because most medium sized businesses are going to a CMS template driven solution. If you know how to code then your services are going to be valuable in the long run. However, to start up a one man shop to develop website might not be a good idea right now. The whole internet is shifting away from that model. The only ones who are going to be willing to dump lots of money on their web presence are those who probably already have an in house design department, or they rely on large agencies to do the work. The days of making a good living from website development (especially design) are almost over unless you have the facilities to compete for the high-end market. Judging by your logo, I'm thinking not.

Get done with school and go intern at an agency and THEN decide on your future. If you still want to go for it, then try to put together a team who can play off each other strengths and weaknesses.

One last thing. If you can't afford to hire someone to design your logo, then you can't afford to start a business. Sorry, but it's the truth. Paying for salaries, cost of operations, marketing, computers, software, etc... is a lot more expensive than the one time cost of a logo development.

Good luck!

 

[dkotter]

Thank you for the 101 on what a web designer is... I don't know about the people you talk to, but on a day to day basis collaborating with lots of people who build websites – a designer implies you have design skills. It is closely associated with complete UI and front end development.

If I hired a web designer who couldn't develop a complete site, including any potential graphics/logos I wouldn't be too impressed.
You may have a differnt view, but you have to take into account that there are lots of 'web designers' out there who do that very thing – a complete package (rightly or wrongly that IS the case). You have to be clear with your naming on what you are providing because otherwise you're going to waste your time and other peoples.

I can do a complete site, with graphics and UI. To me logo design is a lot different then making a background image or a header graphic. And I can design simple logos fine, I was looking for something a little different with this one and it didn't work out. Plus you can always collaborate with an actual logo designer if I can't get it done. And again, for the average person, if you say you're a developer, they are probably not going to know what you do. But designer is easier for the average person to understand, which in naming a business you need to "dumb" it down for those that don't do those things for a living and don't know the lingo.

Great, just what the internet needs. Another web "designer" who doesn't know how to design.

Like:

http://www.noahsarklimos.com/

Seriously though... I would suggest that you team up with a designer and you do all of the development if that is your thing. Don't worry, you are on the better side of the business because most medium sized businesses are going to a CMS template driven solution. If you know how to code then your services are going to be valuable in the long run. However, to start up a one man shop to develop website might not be a good idea right now. The whole internet is shifting away from that model. The only ones who are going to be willing to dump lots of money on their web presence are those who probably already have an in house design department, or they rely on large agencies to do the work. The days of making a good living from website development (especially design) are almost over unless you have the facilities to compete for the high-end market. Judging by your logo, I'm thinking not.

Get done with school and go intern at an agency and THEN decide on your future. If you still want to go for it, then try to put together a team who can play off each other strengths and weaknesses.

One last thing. If you can't afford to hire someone to design your logo, then you can't afford to start a business. Sorry, but it's the truth. Paying for salaries, cost of operations, marketing, computers, software, etc... is a lot more expensive than the one time cost of a logo development.

Good luck!

I think I can design just fine. This is one logo, and it didn't work out, but it doesn't reflect my design skills. This isn't meant to be my primary job. I already have one of those. I plan on getting a job with a company after I graduate, but until then I might as well start getting some more clients. I've already designed sites for local companies, and have more lined up. And that's really what I'm aiming for; local businesses that need sites, not global. So my business is already started. I have a computer, software, and everything else I need.

I appreciate everyone's advice but I really do know what I'm doing. I don't mind attacks on the logo, because I knew it wasn't perfect. But to say I don't know how to be web designer, when you don't even know me, is just rude.

 

[bluetooth]

Hey, I just started doing logos myself and had a little time to kill so threw some rough ideas around a couple font types...not sure your direction but I agree with the majority, start in b&w, simple, legible font, preferably sans or sans serif for a modern, contemporary feel, clean lines et. If you look at the most widely recognized and successful brands they are all simple, clean, clear logos and/or wordmarks.

*Click the attached. For some reason the colours preview incorrectly on the thumbnail (they appear really bright, especially 2nd from bottom on the left - bright turquoise/cyan), perhaps someone knows why? Once you click the thumbnail, the colours show up closely, on my display anyways...

Cheers,

 

[dkotter]

Hey, I just started doing logos myself and had a little time to kill so threw some rough ideas around a couple font types...not sure your direction but I agree with the majority, start in b&w, simple, legible font, preferably sans or sans serif for a modern, contemporary feel, clean lines et. If you look at the most widely recognized and successful brands they are all simple, clean, clear logos and/or wordmarks.

*Click the attached. For some reason the colours preview incorrectly on the thumbnail (bottom left appears really bright), perhaps someone knows why?

Cheers,

Thanks for the help but I don't see anything attached. Maybe I'm just missing something?

 

[bluetooth]

Thanks for the help but I don't see anything attached. Maybe I'm just missing something?

I was trying to play around with the colour previews, they are showing extremely bright on the thumbnail preview, but once you click through they show up in their proper shade/tones...

 

[dkotter]

I was trying to play around with the colour previews, they are showing extremely bright on the thumbnail preview, but once you click through they show up in their proper shade/tones...

Okay I see them now. Those are actually really good. It gives me a lot of good starting points. Thanks a lot!

 

[bluetooth]

Okay I see them now. Those are actually really good. It gives me a lot of good starting points. Thanks a lot!

Cool. Glad I could help.

 

[Consultant]

A web designer designs pages, which a logo might be part of that but there's a lot of web designer who don't do logo design. You can always collaborate with a logo design company to get that done. A web developer is usually seen as more web applications, web programming, etc. I think the general public would understand designer a lot more then developer.

In that case, it should be DK "Web Developer" instead of DK Design

Otherwise your tag line should be
DK Design, We leave the design to internet forums

 

[a cat *miaow*]

DK Design, We leave the design to internet forums

hahaha, that's one sweet tag line!

 

[ezekielrage_99]

hahaha, that's one sweet tag line!

That made me lol as well

 

[ezekielrage_99]

I think the general public would understand designer a lot more then developer.

Out of experience (over 7 years in design) if you put design in a name or position yourself to design client will expect you to be able to design it all.. Logos, letterhead, web pages, etc, although not necessarily realistic design to a client means all design until you educate them.

I am not a print designer but I do often get requests for brochures, etc and when I do explain this I often the the bemused response "but you're a designer"...

 

[dkotter]

Out of experience (over 7 years in design) if you put design in a name or position yourself to design client will expect you to be able to design it all.. Logos, letterhead, web pages, etc, although not necessarily realistic design to a client means all design until you educate them.

I am not a print designer but I do often get requests for brochures, etc and when I do explain this I often the the bemused response "but you're a designer"...

I understand that but if I say developer instead, I bet most people won't have a clue what that means so they won't even bother asking me to do work.

In that case, it should be DK "Web Developer" instead of DK Design

Otherwise your tag line should be
DK Design, We leave the design to internet forums

If you read back through the original question I was asking for help on my own personal logo, not something for clients. I can do design better then the majority of web pages I see out there (which honestly isn't that hard). This logo was just something I wasn't sure about and I realize now it failed miserably.

But yeah thanks for the help.

 

[THX1139]

I understand that but if I say developer instead, I bet most people won't have a clue what that means so they won't even bother asking me to do work.

You have no faith in your clients. Web development is your specialty and that is what you should market yourself under.

I can do design better then the majority of web pages I see out there (which honestly isn't that hard).

That's a pretty bold statement. Got any links to current work?

 

[ezekielrage_99]

I understand that but if I say developer instead, I bet most people won't have a clue what that means so they won't even bother asking me to do work.

Sorry but I disagree, developers generally work close with designers, branders and the creatives. We have a few developers we refer projects to where I currently work, I design, they don't design, they don't call themselves designers but they are an intricate part for delivering/developing a project for either broadcast or web.

B2B is big, good developers are hard to find and generally work with/for creative agencies. Personally if you're a developer I wouldn't be chasing clients rather the business, they'll know what you're about and want your unique skills.

 

[dkotter]

You have no faith in your clients. Web development is your specialty and that is what you should market yourself under.



That's a pretty bold statement. Got any links to current work?

What I'm saying is there is a lot of bad work out there. If you have spent a moderate amount of time online, you should see that. But the original question was about my own personal logo, and my business name, so I'm not going to share anything else at this point. I've been ripped apart enough for now.

Sorry but I disagree, developers generally work close with designers, branders and the creatives. We have a few developers we refer projects to where I currently work, I design, they don't design, they don't call themselves designers but they are an intricate part for delivering/developing a project for either broadcast or web.

B2B is big, good developers are hard to find and generally work with/for creative agencies. Personally if you're a developer I wouldn't be chasing clients rather the business, they'll know what you're about and want your unique skills.

I understand all that but for now I'm dealing with small local companies, not big corporations. And if I just do the developing, I'll have to find a designer to work with, which since I'm dealing just locally at the moment, that would be hard to do. Working on my own probably won't be my career. I'll eventually work at an established company and I'll do whatever they want, whether that's design or development.

 

[Consultant]

If you read back through the original question I was asking for help on my own personal logo, not something for clients. I can do design better then the majority of web pages I see out there (which honestly isn't that hard). This logo was just something I wasn't sure about and I realize now it failed miserably.

But yeah thanks for the help.

That one is a freebie. It's good to see that you are handling the different opinions well. =)

The logo you made uses a certain font that's not really used by successful businesses, thus you are getting the criticism for calling your self a designer. Designers are usually known as artists, while developer / programmers are a different breed.

Design is a hard business. So unless you can actually design, calling yourself a designer will not really help with getting clients in the long run.

Anyway, if you show good examples of your development work, then your logo should not matter that much as long as it's something that's not horrible.

hahaha, that's one sweet tag line!

That made me lol as well

Glad to help. =)

 

[Spiral21x]

Sorry. I see you've already been ripped apart, but I gotta say this. Based off those logo's you've shown, I wouldn't hire you to draw me a circle. Stick with what you're good at.

Think about a name that isn't so literal (and therefore doesn't typecast you or create undue expectations). How about DK Media. The name really does not matter much anyway. Your better off with John Smith - Web Services than calling it DK Design, and then showing a logo like that.

 

[dkotter]

Sorry. I see you've already been ripped apart, but I gotta say this. Based off those logo's you've shown, I wouldn't hire you to draw me a circle. Stick with what you're good at.

Think about a name that isn't so literal (and therefore doesn't typecast you or create undue expectations). How about DK Media. The name really does not matter much anyway. Your better off with John Smith - Web Services than calling it DK Design, and then showing a logo like that.

I don't mind being criticized as long as it's constructive. Just saying "You suck" really doesn't help me at all. But yeah I think a new name might be better. I still want something simple though, and easy to remember, but something like media or web services instead of design might be better.

But I think we've established that my original logo is horrible and I won't be using it.

 

[THX1139]

Hey, I just started doing logos myself and had a little time to kill so threw some rough ideas around a couple font types...not sure your direction but I agree with the majority, start in b&w, simple, legible font, preferably sans or sans serif for a modern, contemporary feel, clean lines et. If you look at the most widely recognized and successful brands they are all simple, clean, clear logos and/or wordmarks.

*Click the attached. For some reason the colours preview incorrectly on the thumbnail (they appear really bright, especially 2nd from bottom on the left - bright turquoise/cyan), perhaps someone knows why? Once you click the thumbnail, the colours show up closely, on my display anyways...

Cheers,

A lot of work there you did for free. Trouble is, none of those logos illustrate what the OP does. They are worth what he paid for them.

 

[panoz7]

A lot of work there you did for free. Trouble is, none of those logos illustrate what the OP does. They are worth what he paid for them.

Why does everybody in the design forum have to be so ridiculously and unnecessarily harsh? I'm close to graduating from a design program so i'm used to taking and giving criticism in studio, but it's always constructive, and never mean hearted. I can't say the same for a lot of the stuff that's been posted in this thread and this forum in general.

A few years ago I came to this forum asking for some advice on my work and whether or not it would be worth applying to design school. I didn't have a design background and had some freelance web design projects that I'd done to earn some money during high school. Back then everybody was incredibly supportive. Looking back at the work I presented all I can really say is that it sucked - but people didn't tear it apart, they recognized that I was young and had no formal training and would learn. Had the thread been similar to this one I likely wouldn't have applied.

I'm assuming (maybe incorrectly) that the OP is in a similar position: young, and learning. Yeah, that first logo wasn't great, and maybe the logos bluetooth graciously took the time to work on weren't spot on either, but they were a start.

All I'm saying is that there's a difference between being brutally critical and politely adding some constructive criticism to the discussion. I just wish more people would tend towards the later than do.

I don't mind being criticized as long as it's constructive. Just saying "You suck" really doesn't help me at all. But yeah I think a new name might be better. I still want something simple though, and easy to remember, but something like media or web services instead of design might be better.

But I think we've established that my original logo is horrible and I won't be using it.

OP: You've taken the criticism in this thread, some deserved and some not, admirably well – far better than I would have. In my experience the best designers know how to take criticism and learn from it, and you seem willing to do that. Don't let everybody scare you away from this forum or design in general.

 

[dkotter]

I'm assuming (maybe incorrectly) that the OP is in a similar position: young, and learning. Yeah, that first logo wasn't great, and maybe the logos bluetooth graciously took the time to work on weren't spot on either, but they were a start.

All I'm saying is that there's a difference between being brutally critical and politely adding some constructive criticism to the discussion. I just wish more people would tend towards the later than do.

OP: You've taken the criticism in this thread, some deserved and some not, admirably well – far better than I would have. In my experience the best designers know how to take criticism and learn from it, and you seem willing to do that. Don't let everybody scare you away from this forum or design in general.

Thanks a lot for the support. I'm always willing to take constructive criticism, especially when warranted. But I am young, still in school, and I'll learn and get better. I know I'm not the best designer but I'm learning and I know I'll improve. I'm not going to leave the design world anytime soon, but I might wait awhile to post any of my projects here again.

 

[bluetooth]

A lot of work there you did for free. Trouble is, none of those logos illustrate what the OP does. They are worth what he paid for them.

Take is easy, it wasn't a lot of work, probably took me around half an hour and most importantly they were meant as a directional starting point, not a finished or polished product. The starting points being, simple design, to work with black and white or basic colour, use of a clear font and to try different approaches around various typefaces, to come up with 5 or 6 rough ideas and look for feedback from there etc.

It wasn't an attempt to do his work for free, rather an example of the general direction that is usually involved in the logo design process. He thanked me and said it was helpful, giving him a lot of good starting points which is what the overall objective was.

 

[usclaneyj]

Why does everybody in the design forum have to be so ridiculously and unnecessarily harsh?

There are a few posters on here who would rather troll and offer back-handed, apathetic, "advice" but not all of us treat people like that.

It is unfair to speak to other humans (whose only faults were not following someone else's idea of protocol) with the level of disdain that gets tossed around in here.

 

[MattSepeta]

Lol

lol@this thread. Same old song and dance.

Not trying to single people out, but if you search "logo" or "help" in the design forum, I'm willing to bet that you find the same old members in these threads pontificating the "worth" of design, and the "worthlessness" of anything done for free.

OP: See how much fun we can have?

 

[ChicoWeb]

This thread needs to go away.