Do you also agree that MacOS quality has been on a downhill lately?

[GeoStructural]

Ever since Catalina I feel like MacOS quality control is declining. I am currently on Ventura in my personal MBP16 and using Monterrey on my work laptop, the amount of glitches in both versions is incredible, there is also quite a lot of mismatching UI elements. Releases come and go and problems persist.

This last one is laughable because Mac users mocked Windows for years for having inconsistent UI or Win-95-like menus still in Windows 10, but this is exactly what Ventura is right now, you go from menus of different styles in one click, and many of the buttons and text are different in size and color, it is an eyesore to OCD me.

I find myself backing up more frequently now, I have lost confidence in MacOS and I am afraid to lose data.

MacOS was once considered a very stable and trustable system, I don’t feel this way anymore.

What do you guys/girls think?

 

[Apple_Robert]

Overall, I haven't had any real day to day user problems with MacOS in recent years. I haven't been a fan of some of the aesthetics but, I still like using MacOS.

 

[jz0309]

Monterey has been stable running on my 2017 iMac for a year, no issues for my use.
Ventura PB on my M1 MBA has also been surprisingly stable for me, no glitch thus far. Can't argue inconsistency in the UI but it is still in beta ...

it certainly seemed more SW related issues over the past 2 years, I have commented on multiple posts, but, one should not forget that we have been living in a pandemic so we have to account for that.

I use Win10 on my work laptop and I hate it. And whenever I have to do something on my wife's Win11 laptop - I hate it. For me, macOS is still far superior to Windows, but to each their own.

 

[belvdr]

You should backup often, but any UI issues wouldn't lend me to change that behavior. If you had crashing or other filesystem issues, then that changes things.

 

[GeoStructural]

You should backup often, but any UI issues wouldn't lend me to change that behavior. If you had crashing or other filesystem issues, then that changes things.

Yes, I backup often regardless. Plus I have cloud storage. My point is that I am more concerned now than I ever was about system stability in general.

Regarding the issues, yes, I have experiences crashes too. And the other day I was creating a document and it seemed like it was not saving and the folder was empty, then I restarted the laptop and found 16 empty files in the folder, weird.

Also this week I am unable to change my wallpaper. I often put my week’s schedule as wallpaper so I have it right in front of me. I am unable to change it now, I contacted Apple and haven’t heard a response yet, I know it is a minor thing, but still.

Lastly, I have observed more apps freezing and had to Force-quit them. I am about to perform a fresh restart of the machine to see if that solves the issues and kills the bugs.

 

[GeoStructural]

Another weird thing happening in Ventura is the treatment of external drives. I have one Samsung T5 and a Kingston drive, they both perform well on Monterrey, but the Kingston one is painfully slow on Ventura, either something is going on with file management or it is a bug that will hopefully be resolved once the Beta program ends.

 

[appltech]

Avoid having APFS on external drives, continuous background data sync, and macOS usage without a reboot.
+ Install latest updates for OS and do tinkering with the system time to time and shouldn't be any (major) problems

 

[Queen6]

Ventura is in Beta and people have been saying the same since way before Snow Leopard. That said I do believe Apple would serve it's Mac focused customers far better with a 24 month cycle and not follow the IOS 12 month cycle.

I generally stay one OS revision behind, purposely to avoid issue. I've only just updated my M1 Mac to Monterey as for Ventura I wont remotely consider the OS until August/September 2023 and then it has to be of benefit to me as the user.

Fair enough I'm not at the cutting edge, equally I get a new stable OS each year and don't have to deal with Gen one HW issues if present.

Q-6

 

[AnnonKneeMoosee]

The biggest problem I see with a Mac is that you can’t upgrade it or repair it. Everything is soldered in to prevent users from repairing their computers. The five year long “butterfly keyboard” fiasco is a perfect example of Apple greed gone insane. The design was a POS to begin with, and they wanted to keep it so computers would wear out sooner. Finally, finally, they gave up on that design.

Personally, I’ve been using Mojave until well into 2024. I finally upgraded to Monterey a few months ago. Since I have the last good MacBooks they made (2015 models) I plan to keep using them for years to come. My computer still runs incredibly fast, so why would I want faster? To me it’s like saying your Ferrari doesn’t go fast enough, so you want a new one. Huh?!!

One advantage I have is that I replaced all the SSD’s in my MacBooks. After much research, I discovered a brand of M.2 that uses less energy, less battery, and is faster than the original hardware. Hence, my two old 2015 MBPr MacBooks have 4TB of storage in them. My 2013 MacBook Air has 1TB. It comes in handy when I’m having Internet issues, and need to take a light portable computer to my modem to diagnose issues. But after upgrading my coax to wiring to very thick copper and insulation, I haven’t had anything go wrong. 🤞

By some strange stroke of luck, my crappy Internet company replaced all the underground copper cables in my old neighborhood with fresh new ones. Super heavy duty this time. It doesn’t seem to matter what people who share the connection are doing, my Internet still runs blazingly fast. Not that I need anything faster than 50Mbps anyway, but I always have 300Mbps or higher. At $25/mo for the next 3 years, I’m finally stable and satisfied.

Apple intentionally releases a new macOS every year, so old versions become obsolete much faster. After four years, you’re abandoned. Newsflash to Apple: I will abandon you, too. macOS no longer supports Intel processors, which was the primary reason I decided to try Mac computers back in 2010. If someone gave me a brand new Mac today, I would turn around and sell it immediately for the cash. I hate Macs now, far more than I ever did before. As far as I’m concerned, Apple can go screw themselves. Windows is also a POS, so that’s not an option either. If it becomes necessary, I’ll add a version of BSD for a modern browser to do my online financial stuff.

To buy another computer from Apple, I would have to be utterly insane. The same goes for a new Windows computer. Home computers are so darn fast, there is no point in upgrading them anymore. Ironically, when Europe banned lead in solder, that lead to solder that is stronger than ever. Yay.

 

[zevrix]

To buy another computer from Apple, I would have to be utterly insane. The same goes for a new Windows computer.

I understand your dissatisfaction sentiment.

However, it simply means at least two things:

-You're not a software developer for any major desktop or mobile platform.
-Your livelihood doesn't depend on using the current versions of professional software of any kind.

Otherwise, for better or worse, you wouldn't be able to pursue your philosophy on software and hardware upgrades.

 

[AnnonKneeMoosee]

So true.

 

[doogm]

I've been using MacOS since OSX 10.4 and honestly Sonoma and Seqouia have been the best two updates I remember since I started. I had one minor bug with Sonoma (using Stage Manager the windows would not cycle around when using the keyboard combo Cmd-` but instead stopped at the last window on the stack - fixed with Sequoia.) In fact these two updates were the first I installed the first week they were out - I usually waited until xx.1 was released.

 

[AnnonKneeMoosee]

I understand your dissatisfaction sentiment.

However, it simply means at least two things:

-You're not a software developer for any major desktop or mobile platform.
-Your livelihood doesn't depend on using the current versions of professional software of any kind.

Otherwise, for better or worse, you wouldn't be able to pursue your philosophy on software and hardware upgrades.

I hadn’t thought of that, but it’s a good point. If I wanted to make current apps, I would have no choice but to have current hardware. (Kind of obvious, really.)

The primary reason I wouldn’t want to own a newer Mac (or other new Apple device) is that Apple intentionally designs them with planned obsolescence in mind. They support the OS for only four years (sometimes less) after they discontinue a particular model. That also leaves developers with little choice but to abandon support of their products after the OS is no longer supported.

Yet Apple has gone even further than that recently. I noticed the latest MacBooks put the processor on the top of the motherboard—facing the underside of the keyboard, so it cannot be accessed easily by removing the bottom. This in turn makes it quite difficult to replace the thermal paste on one's own, but it will perhaps last until the OS is no longer supported. But if you’re someone like me, without deep pockets, it leaves us hanging in the wind.

I find this situation quite objectionable. Computer processors and storage have become so incredibly fast and efficient that there is little reason to replace hardware after only a few years, at least for most typical home users. The only viable alternative is to switch to Ubuntu Linux, or similar generic OS. I’m exploring that option myself right now, and it looks quite promising. Especially when using an emulator rather than dual boot. I can continue to use my reliable old hardware and software till the cows come home! The only thing I really need is to keep my browser updated, so it will still work with recent security updates. Ubuntu fills that need nicely. My only concern was that many financial institutions are switching to supporting only the Google Chrome browser. Yet Ubuntu has become so popular, Google actually makes a version of Chrome to run specifically with it. Using Parallels, I can run the latest Google Chrome with Ubuntu, and even old versions of Windows. For corporations especially, a generic OS like Ubuntu becomes the best option financially. I was quite surprised to discover there are literally hundreds of millions of Ubuntu users. If I were a software developer, I’d look seriously at supporting that OS, rather than sticking with only macOS or Windows, which keep becoming obsolete for no good reason.

As for Apple, time will tell what effect planned obsolescence has on their user base. Buying used Apple equipment has already become a poor option, and owners will find their equipment almost worthless when trying to sell it. All of which are good arguments to not buy Apple Mac computers in the first place.

 

[AnnonKneeMoosee]

I've been using MacOS since OSX 10.4 and honestly Sonoma and Seqouia have been the best two updates I remember since I started. I had one minor bug with Sonoma (using Stage Manager the windows would not cycle around when using the keyboard combo Cmd-` but instead stopped at the last window on the stack - fixed with Sequoia.) In fact these two updates were the first I installed the first week they were out - I usually waited until xx.1 was released.

I’m curious what you find so special about Sonoma or Sequoia. It’s just an OS! I see no significant advantages, but plenty of reasons not to. If it’s so your Mac can act more like an iPad, why not just buy an iPad and have done with it? Much cheaper than a Mac, which is designed to become obsolete ASAP. If I’m going to buy an Apple product that’s designed to become obsolete quickly, I’d rather pay less than more.

I only recently upgraded from Mojave to Monterey, and there are no serious improvements. A little tweak here and a little tweak there – big deal! To me it’s like upgrading from XP to Windows Vista or 7 or 8 or 10 or 11 or… Mostly headaches having to relearn what I already knew well, not to mention spending money just to have the latest little whiz-bang feature that I don’t really need anyway.

 

[Derek Morton]

7.6.1 was the peak... it has been downhill since.

 

[doogm]

I’m curious what you find so special about Sonoma or Sequoia. It’s just an OS!

You're right. There's not much special, but there are improvements - calendar now can show reminders, for example. I've already listed one bug fix already - I like stage manager on the Mac, but couldn't use it on Sonoma. But Sequoia worked perfectly for me, no bugs, from day-one. It was pretty much the same with Sonoma, and it probably was with Ventura and Monterey as well. That has not always been the case with MacOS/OS X in my user experience.

If it’s so your Mac can act more like an iPad

Good lord, no. An iPad is nowhere near as powerful as a Mac. I have Macs because iPads (and iPad apps) can't do what Macs and Mac apps can do. (I have an iPad and use it quite a bit - it's good for what it can do, but it's just not a powerful, general-purpose computer OS like MacOS.)

Much cheaper than a Mac, which is designed to become obsolete ASAP.

I completely disagree with that statement. My current 2022 MBA will last me for another three years easily, maybe longer. I generally upgrade my laptop every 5 years, but only because I keep my old one as a just-in-case backup device, and trying to use a Mac after ten years is just pushing it too much (though I have done it - I was using a 2009 MBP as a backup device until 2022.)