Does clamshell mode hinder performance ?

[Canadia69]

I still didnt pull the plug on the M4 Pro mbp and am still on the 2019 intel 15inch as im patiently waiting for my bonus to come in..

I did get my hands on a second hand samsung Neo g9 (49inch) and really love it although since I got it, i started using my setup in clamshell mode and the entire OS feels so much slower and laggy.

My previous setup was a 34inch monitor (3440 by 1440) with the laptop lid open. I thought that performance would be better now with the laptop lid closed since the 49inch by itself is less pixels to generate than the 34inch + 15inch macbook.

Even right after a reboot, it would still be very laggy even with just 2 safari tabs open.

Today while doing a reboot again I noticed the macbook was burning hot. This time i shut it down, let it cool off a few minutes and turned it back on and lagginess was gone.

This is making me reconsider wanting a MacBook Pro if Im going to have it in clamshell mode most of the time. Do you guys think this is just an intel thing? Or are ur M series macbook also getting the performance hindered by having them overheat in clamshell mode.

Maybe a mac mini and macbook air would make sense…even though i prefer just 1 mac that can be versatile.

Thanks

 

[maerz001]

All thouse intel mbp are running hot and slow compared even to a M1 chip.

I dont know the Resolution of your samsung display. But we use the apple studio display with a clamshell M1 and M1 pro. And this is just as fluid as on the built in MB display

 

[smirking]

I dont know the Resolution of your samsung display. But we use the apple studio display with a clamshell M1 and M1 pro. And this is just as fluid as on the built in MB display

I just upgraded to an M4 Pro from an M1 Pro. I often used my M1 Pro in clamshell mode with an LG 5K or an Apple Studio Display. I didn't notice any lag, but there was one specific thing it would stutter on. I use spaces and the animation when switching to a new space would sometimes stutter for a split second.

Other than that, I didn't experience anything I'd call lag on the M1 Pro.

I previously had a 2018 Intel MBP that was also used in clamshell mode on the LG 5K. It was about the same. It may have also had that occasional split second stutter, but I don't remember anything significant.

 

[iMacDragon]

The M's are far more suited to clamshell mode than especially the latter day Intel's, far less heat generation in normal usage, clamshell mode in daily use will be fine I'm sure.

Also don't need to switch to a different more power hungry gpu just to run in clamshell like the 15-16" intels had to.

 

[ignatius345]

If you were looking to upgrade to a passively cooled MacBook Air, then I believe clamshell mode would potentially be more of an issue because of heat buildup and throttling. The MacBook Pros all have fans so I'd assume they would disperse heat better.

 

[Canadia69]

thank u all for the feedback, this is reassuring me. Only thing to consider now is whether im getting 14 or 16inch…i know the 16inch is has better cooling but considering im mostly gonna use it at home plugged to a dock, idk if i should get 14inch to save a little

 

[luzsa2004]

If you were looking to upgrade to a passively cooled MacBook Air, then I believe clamshell mode would potentially be more of an issue because of heat buildup and throttling. The MacBook Pros all have fans so I'd assume they would disperse heat better.

Agree about going with a MBP; most recently ran a M3 MBA with two external monitors in clamshell; far from a good fit. Mostly FCP, photo editing, spreadsheeting. Using a Dell on other projects became accustomed to a min of 3 simultaneous screens. Stumbled across an outstanding deal at Best Buy to trade in for a M4 MBP that’s scheduled to arrive Tuesday.

 

[vanc]

thank u all for the feedback, this is reassuring me. Only thing to consider now is whether im getting 14 or 16inch…i know the 16inch is has better cooling but considering im mostly gonna use it at home plugged to a dock, idk if i should get 14inch to save a little

I've been using a MBP 16 with M1 Pro since early 2022, almost exclusively in clamshell mode. Only occasionally, I took it on trips.

Last week, I ordered a new MBP 14 with M4 Max. The reason I switched to 14" was that it's more portable, and slightly cheaper. It should have similar performance as the 16" one. The battery life would be a tad worse, but it doesn't matter much to me as most of the time, it would be plugged in.

 

[Canadia69]

I've been using a MBP 16 with M1 Pro since early 2022, almost exclusively in clamshell mode. Only occasionally, I took it on trips.

Last week, I ordered a new MBP 14 with M4 Max. The reason I switched to 14" was that it's more portable, and slightly cheaper. It should have similar performance as the 16" one. The battery life would be a tad worse, but it doesn't matter much to me as most of the time, it would be plugged in.

Il really on the fence. Im coming from a 15inch mbp and dont really mind the big size and weight.

Im debating between :

14inch M4 Pro (binned) 12 core cpu, 16 core gpu 1Tb, 48gb ram. For 3449$ CAD

Or

16inch M4 Pro (unbinned) 14 core cpu, 20 core gpu, 1Tb, 48gb ram. For 4049$ CAD

In the Max tech video bellow he compares these 2 same machines and chips and they have very similar performance. In his words “the smallest difference between a 14 and 16 inch model ever” except for the fact that the fans on the 14inch kick off much sooner.

I feel like the binned 12/16 core M4 Pro is probably enough for my app development needs but considering I want to have it clamshell mode most of the time I kind of wonder if it might start overheating under intensive tasks like running phone emulators, or running multiple intelliJ application simultaneously.

600$ more does not seem like a crazy bump up when I consider the extra screen size, bigger fans/chassis, better battery and more cpu and gpu core…especially if I consider keeping the machine for 4-5 years like I did my 2019 mbp.

14inch is prob enough though… idk.

 

[smirking]

Il really on the fence. Im coming from a 15inch mbp and dont really mind the big size and weight.

Im debating between :

14inch M4 Pro (binned) 12 core cpu, 16 core gpu 1Tb, 48gb ram. For 3449$ CAD

Or

16inch M4 Pro (unbinned) 14 core cpu, 20 core gpu, 1Tb, 48gb ram. For 4049$ CAD

Here's been my progression 2018 15" MBP -> 2021 16" M1 Pro -> 2024 14" M4 Pro.

I didn't think moving up to the weight of the 16" was going to bother me much, but it did. That's because I work from home and I'm always walking around with my laptop open holding it with one hand. The extra weight when multiplied by the extra dimensions feels way more significant than you'd expect just comparing numbers side by side.

I decided to go to a 14" this time around and I'm quite happy with the blend of portability and performance. The battery life took a slight hit, but Silicon battery life is so good anyway that it's not an issue for me. The 14" handles a lot like the 15" did and it easily fits in anything I want to put it in.

 

[Canadia69]

Here's been my progression 2018 15" MBP -> 2021 16" M1 Pro -> 2024 14" M4 Pro.

I didn't think moving up to the weight of the 16" was going to bother me much, but it did. That's because I work from home and I'm always walking around with my laptop open holding it with one hand. The extra weight when multiplied by the extra dimensions feels way more significant than you'd expect just comparing numbers side by side.

I decided to go to a 14" this time around and I'm quite happy with the blend of portability and performance. The battery life took a slight hit, but Silicon battery life is so good anyway that it's not an issue for me. The 14" handles a lot like the 15" did and it easily fits in anything I want to put it in.

When looking at the difference in dimensions, it seems like such a small difference but considering Ive still never seen or held a 14 or 16inch M series mac in person, i think I might go to an apple store this week to check them out and see how I feel about them both…always thought that since the 16inch has barely no bezel compared to the 15inch that theyre bassicly same dimensions but maybe the extra thickness and weight do make a difference.

Also the smaller screen size kind of makes make go 16 since i always felt like the 13inch was a one application at a time but maybe with the 14 its a little different…i will definitely test that out when I see it in stores.

Thanks for the input, i was not considering the difference in dimensions!

 

[smirking]

but maybe the extra thickness and weight do make a difference.

I owned the Unibody MBPs for years and those are way heavier. I don't remember ever feeling like those were as heavy and I think it's because I used those differently and carried them differently. Namely I either used both hands or I closed them and toted them like a book.

With the more recent laptops having a more mobile form factor, I just naturally handle them a little more like I'd handle a tablet and suddenly 4.7lbs is a very heavy tablet.

What also surprised me about the size is that the 16" just kept being just a little bit too much. It's a tiny bit heavier than I want, tiny bit wider, tiny bit thicker and it adds up. I didn't have to buy all new gear to transport it. It fit into things my 15" fit into, but barely.

The extra dimension would cause my bags to bulge and behave differently. My camera bag became harder to unlatch with one hand and it would tip over more easily.

Also the smaller screen size kind of makes make go 16 since i always felt like the 13inch was a one application at a time but maybe with the 14 its a little different…i will definitely test that out when I see it in stores.

Thanks for the input, i was not considering the difference in dimensions!

Definitely put them side by side. When looking at the devices side by side, I realized that I actually liked the smaller screen, which was the opposite of how I expected to react. The extra real estate on the 16" is nice, but for the way I work most of the time it's unused space. I would need an 18" screen before I would really feel the difference.

Another thing to be aware of is that the pixels are smaller on a 14/16" MBP than a 15" (254ppi vs 220ppi). If you can handle using scaled resolutions, you actually will have more desktop space on a 14" MBP than on a 15" MBP. When I need to read text easily, I go with default resolution. When I need to see layouts in a more expansive way, I change my resolution to get more desktop.

 

[Canadia69]

I owned the Unibody MBPs for years and those are way heavier. I don't remember ever feeling like those were as heavy and I think it's because I used those differently and carried them differently. Namely I either used both hands or I closed them and toted them like a book.

With the more recent laptops having a more mobile form factor, I just naturally handle them a little more like I'd handle a tablet and suddenly 4.7lbs is a very heavy tablet.

What also surprised me about the size is that the 16" just kept being just a little bit too much. It's a tiny bit heavier than I want, tiny bit wider, tiny bit thicker and it adds up. I didn't have to buy all new gear to transport it. It fit into things my 15" fit into, but barely.

The extra dimension would cause my bags to bulge and behave differently. My camera bag became harder to unlatch with one hand and it would tip over more easily.



Definitely put them side by side. When looking at the devices side by side, I realized that I actually liked the smaller screen, which was the opposite of how I expected to react. The extra real estate on the 16" is nice, but for the way I work most of the time it's unused space. I would need an 18" screen before I would really feel the difference.

Another thing to be aware of is that the pixels are smaller on a 14/16" MBP than a 15" (254ppi vs 220ppi). If you can handle using scaled resolutions, you actually will have more desktop space on a 14" MBP than on a 15" MBP. When I need to read text easily, I go with default resolution. When I need to see layouts in a more expansive way, I change my resolution to get more desktop.

Seems very enticing towards the 14inch. What version of the M4 Pro did you get? Binned 12cpu/16gpu or unbinned 14cpu/20gpu? What is/are the most intensive tasks you do? Does it heat up substantially ? And do the fans spin up more than they did on your 16inch M1 Pro?

Thanks!

 

[smirking]

Seems very enticing towards the 14inch. What version of the M4 Pro did you get? Binned 12cpu/16gpu or unbinned 14cpu/20gpu? What is/are the most intensive tasks you do? Does it heat up substantially ? And do the fans spin up more than they did on your 16inch M1 Pro?

I got the 24GB 14/20GPU version. My typical operating environment looks like this: 2 small sized Docker webserver VMs and 2 large ones. 2 large Web development projects loaded in PHPStorm Developer IDE (IntelliJ). 3-4 different browser types open.

The most intense thing is PHPStorm indexing one of my large projects. That happened a lot as I kept having to reload different versions of a large codebase to test alternate scenarios.

I also do a lot of RAW Photo editing in Capture One Pro.

I haven't been using it in clamshell mode much lately so I can't answer if being in clamshell is a problem for it, but it breezes through everything I throw at it. I mostly need between 1 and 5 minute bursts of high intensity and the rest of the time it's just moderate but steady intensity. I'm not using all 4 Docker containers at the same time.

If the fans are coming on, I don't notice them. There's nothing going on that makes me think to myself that this thing runs a lot hotter than my old machine.

The one thing I do notice is that when I'm doing repeated reindexings, the M4 Pro really sucks up a lot of power. I also suspect there are some bugs messing with my power management. Sometimes I get around 3 hours of battery life without doing much and other times I'm getting 8-10 just working normally.

I do think those 3 hour episodes is due to bugs though. That sometimes happens if I go several days without rebooting.

6-10 hours of battery was what I typically got on my 16" M1 Pro depending on what I was doing.

 

[Canadia69]

I got the 24GB 14/20GPU version. My typical operating environment looks like this: 2 small sized Docker webserver VMs and 2 large ones. 2 large Web development projects loaded in PHPStorm Developer IDE (IntelliJ). 3-4 different browser types open.

The most intense thing is PHPStorm indexing one of my large projects. That happened a lot as I kept having to reload different versions of a large codebase to test alternate scenarios.

I also do a lot of RAW Photo editing in Capture One Pro.

I haven't been using it in clamshell mode much lately so I can't answer if being in clamshell is a problem for it, but it breezes through everything I throw at it. I mostly need between 1 and 5 minute bursts of high intensity and the rest of the time it's just moderate but steady intensity. I'm not using all 4 Docker containers at the same time.

If the fans are coming on, I don't notice them. There's nothing going on that makes me think to myself that this thing runs a lot hotter than my old machine.

The one thing I do notice is that when I'm doing repeated reindexings, the M4 Pro really sucks up a lot of power. I also suspect there are some bugs messing with my power management. Sometimes I get around 3 hours of battery life without doing much and other times I'm getting 8-10 just working normally.

I do think those 3 hour episodes is due to bugs though. That sometimes happens if I go several days without rebooting.

6-10 hours of battery was what I typically got on my 16" M1 Pro depending on what I was doing.

Very insightful information. Thank you for that. Personally ill be using it on vpn/citrix for work so not a lot of power usage. But i also do some web development and am working on building an app.

Running docker smoothly is reassuring as its almost impossible on my intel 2019 mbp…the laptop just freezes up completely even with everything else closed.

Will go to the apple store and feel them out

 

[smirking]

Running docker smoothly is reassuring as its almost impossible on my intel 2019 mbp…the laptop just freezes up completely even with everything else closed.

I don't know how hungry my Docker containers are. I have a Docker management utility that manages my Docker setup for me and supposedly it's really good at keeping the resource footprint low. I had around 6 medium sized Docker VMs running a couple of days ago and they were all running very smoothly.

I just ran Windows Update over Parallels while also installing software into a second MacOS Sonoma install that I keep in Parallels. No fans. Smooth as butter. I even have Windows and the other MacOS on an external Thunderbolt 4 drive.

I followed that up by installing iOS into XCode and launching an iPad simulator. I did get fans kick in for 20 seconds installing iOS. My XCode build went pretty briskly. All of this was done in clamshell mode.

 

[xraydoc]

thank u all for the feedback, this is reassuring me. Only thing to consider now is whether im getting 14 or 16inch…i know the 16inch is has better cooling but considering im mostly gonna use it at home plugged to a dock, idk if i should get 14inch to save a little

I use my 14" MBP mostly plugged in at home, in clamshell mode, connected to a dock and external displays. While a 16" can potentially have better performance and cooling, I occasionally do use my MacBook Pro as god intended (as a laptop), and when I do, I prefer to have a smaller machine than a larger one.

But to be perfectly honest, I've never run into a situation where my 14" MBP is thermally throttling (not for what I do on my machine), so for me, there's no downsides.

 

[luzsa2004]

I use my 14" MBP mostly plugged in at home, in clamshell mode, connected to a dock and external displays. While a 16" can potentially have better performance and cooling, I occasionally do use my MacBook Pro as god intended (as a laptop), and when I do, I prefer to have a smaller machine than a larger one.

But to be perfectly honest, I've never run into a situation where my 14" MBP is thermally throttling (not for what I do on my machine), so for me, there's no downsides.

Hi. Curious, why have the MBP in clamshell while using the laptop? Is it necessary — if so, which one do you own — or is it a preference?

 

[Canadia69]

I don't know how hungry my Docker containers are. I have a Docker management utility that manages my Docker setup for me and supposedly it's really good at keeping the resource footprint low. I had around 6 medium sized Docker VMs running a couple of days ago and they were all running very smoothly.

I just ran Windows Update over Parallels while also installing software into a second MacOS Sonoma install that I keep in Parallels. No fans. Smooth as butter. I even have Windows and the other MacOS on an external Thunderbolt 4 drive.

I followed that up by installing iOS into XCode and launching an iPad simulator. I did get fans kick in for 20 seconds installing iOS. My XCode build went pretty briskly. All of this was done in clamshell mode.

Damn I talking about 1 docker container to run my app on...not what ur doing lol. And good to know about xcode. Thx! Still havent gone to see and compare both model though, should do that this weekend

 

[Canadia69]

I use my 14" MBP mostly plugged in at home, in clamshell mode, connected to a dock and external displays. While a 16" can potentially have better performance and cooling, I occasionally do use my MacBook Pro as god intended (as a laptop), and when I do, I prefer to have a smaller machine than a larger one.

But to be perfectly honest, I've never run into a situation where my 14" MBP is thermally throttling (not for what I do on my machine), so for me, there's no downsides.

Great to hear, especially coming from a M3 Max 14inch...ive heared alot about throttling with 14inch and Max chips but good to hear urs handles it

 

[Canadia69]

Hi. Curious, why have the MBP in clamshell while using the laptop? Is it necessary — if so, which one do you own — or is it a preference?

For me, its just because I like the cleaner look, I like having my desk pretty empty, just keyboard, mouse, trackpad and speakers with my laptop tucked away..so for me, its just preference

 

[xraydoc]

Hi. Curious, why have the MBP in clamshell while using the laptop? Is it necessary — if so, which one do you own — or is it a preference?

Not necessary, but I have three 27” external displays. I don’t need the laptop’s.

 

[xraydoc]

Great to hear, especially coming from a M3 Max 14inch...ive heared alot about throttling with 14inch and Max chips but good to hear urs handles it

I do have the ‘smaller’ M3 Max chip, but I just didn’t need the bigger one. The difference in price was better applied to external displays. For my work, an additional display increases my productivity more than a faster processor would.