MP 6,1 Does this make sense? Purchasing a 6,1?

[InuNacho]

I've seen rock bottom prices on the 6,1 locally and I think it may fit well into my mix of hardware in my art studio/archiving area.

I have a Dell workstation with a i7-8700, 32GB of ram, GTX 1070 and tons of storage. I have a large backlog of analog and DV tapes to go through and I think with my old FCPX license and hardware acceleration free on the Mac version of DaVinci Resolve, it would make some financial sense to snag and upgrade a 6,1.

Existing equipment and setup I have:

Sony DV/MiniDV Deck with Firewire port
Thunderbolt - FW800 adapter
S-VHS deck that upscales to a DVDO VP30 for 1080p. Actually looks pretty good!
BlackMagic Intensity Pro Capture card - bought maybe in 2014 so I know technology has moved on since then

Since I don't have a license for the paid version of DaVinci Resolve at the moment, I haven't started transferring any tapes nor any basic editing. I'm curious what configuration of the 6,1 would be comparable to my Dell workstation D300, 500 or 700?
Can someone remind me again if FCPX still have DV logging?

Any other tips and advice welcome!
Thanks!

 

[rm5]

No, it doesn't make one bit of sense. They're not nearly as upgradable as 5,1s and although the CPU might be better, the graphics are plain awful. Even the D700 (the max configuration) is not even close to the 1070. The D700 is more like a GTX 960/R9 380 according to TechPowerUp. Compare the 1070 with the D700. I've gotta be honest, you should get a 5,1 and throw in like a 5700 XT or something. That'll do you a lot better in terms of graphics performance compared to a 6,1. My 5,1 is still going strong even though it's 13 years old! I've got 32 GB of RAM and a Radeon Pro W5500, it works great. Can edit multiple streams of 4K at full resolution no problem. It also renders 1080p H.264 projects at around 150-160 FPS, which is very respectable.

 

[zackkmac]

No, it doesn't make one bit of sense. They're not nearly as upgradable as 5,1s and although the CPU might be better, the graphics are plain awful. Even the D700 (the max configuration) is not even close to the 1070. The D700 is more like a GTX 960/R9 380 according to TechPowerUp. Compare the 1070 with the D700. I've gotta be honest, you should get a 5,1 and throw in like a 5700 XT or something. That'll do you a lot better in terms of graphics performance compared to a 6,1. My 5,1 is still going strong even though it's 13 years old! I've got 32 GB of RAM and a Radeon Pro W5500, it works great. Can edit multiple streams of 4K at full resolution no problem. It also renders 1080p H.264 projects at around 150-160 FPS, which is very respectable.

+1 on this - the 6,1 is an engineering feat, sure, but the dual D700 does not compare. I agree that for your case, a 5,1 is the way to go. They are considerably cheaper to buy and upgrade with much more room to expand. I sold my 5,1 to go for a 6,1...but decided to cancel the order for the 6,1 and I'm thinking of purchasing another 5,1.

Just for fun, I priced up a full cart on eBay yesterday, with a 5,1 + some upgraded parts. Here's what I came up with:

Mac Pro 5,1 (2010)
12-core dual CPU setup (2xX5680 @ 3.33GHz)
128GB RAM
16.5TB storage space (4x4TB HDD and 2x256GB NVMe SSDs + PCIe adapters)
Radeon RX 590 8GB GPU

All for...I think $670ish before tax, aka roughly what you would pay for a 6,1 with D700s and far less storage/RAM.

 

[conmee]

The 6,1 will definitely be a better addition to your art studio. Do you really want a big ol’ box of slots (5,1) taking up space in your creative area, sapping your spirit of any inspiration? This isn’t about performance, this is about taste. Get the 6,1.

On a more serious note, you’re probably better off with a Mac Studio (even a Mini would probably handle your workflow with aplomb). However, if price is a determining factor and you can live without PCI slots, then 6,1 all the way baby!

 

[rm5]

Do you really want a big ol’ box of slots (5,1) taking up space in your creative area, sapping your spirit of any inspiration?

I'm perfectly fine with having the 5,1 under my desk. The 6,1 is a piece of garbage.

 

[avro707]

The 6,1 will definitely be a better addition to your art studio. Do you really want a big ol’ box of slots (5,1) taking up space in your creative area, sapping your spirit of any inspiration? This isn’t about performance, this is about taste. Get the 6,1.

Better, I've got an even bigger box of slots with shiny handles on top - a huge 7,1 so inspirational right? (rolls eyes)

Same room has 5,1, 6,1 and 7,1.


The 5,1 is a pain if you want to use later MacOS versions since you need to have Opencore, if you understand that it's not a problem but that's something you need to work out. Some of the newer video cards need to be flashed to work in the 5,1 and a few of them require the Pixlas mod.

The 6,1 is old and has limited scope to upgrade (mine is the maximum). You could be better off watching eBay and trying to find a 7,1 at a decent price, then you have a lot more scope to upgrade than the 5,1 and you can run Ventura without needing Opencore.

 

[conmee]

I'm perfectly fine with having the 5,1 under my desk. The 6,1 is a piece of garbage.

rm5,

There’s a reason it’s under your desk, I wouldn’t want to be seen with one of those things either lol. In all seriousness, I like the 5,1 and it’s true to the workstation segment unlike the 6,1. The 6,1 isn’t garbage, and if it wasn’t marketed as a workstation replacement for the 5,1 it would have been much more well received. And if Apple would have at least upgraded the graphics during its run (there were options that could have been implemented that didn’t bump up against Apple’s thermal corner confession), they would have extended the useful life of the 6,1.

I’m biased as my daily work is split between my beloved 6,1 and MacBook Pro, so I’ll aways be unapologetically pro Mac Pro 6,1.

Long live the 6,1!

 

[conmee]

Better, I've got an even bigger box of slots with shiny handles on top - a huge 7,1 so inspirational right? (rolls eyes)

Same room has 5,1, 6,1 and 7,1.

Handles are great, but does your box o’ slots have wheels?

 

[avro707]

Handles are great, but does your box o’ slots have wheels?

It sits on the desk looking beautiful and inspirational. The 6,1 might be mistaken for a rubbish bin.

Kidding aside, the 6,1 is interesting but old. If the GPUs fail then it's a problem because you can't just go out and buy a new one. You won't be very inspired if that happens.

 

[InuNacho]

The main reason why I wouldn't want another Cheese grater (I am a former high specced 2010) is the power draw vs performance. With my ole' dual X5690, the CPUs alone was around 250W. That comparable to my current Dell's CPU+GPU combo. My studio is in a building built right after the war and I'm not 100% sure exactly how it's wired up. My art studio mate and I recently tripped the breaker running both our space heaters. Mine was set to 750W and I'm not sure what her's was at.
Also size is a big thing, my current Dell is about 2/5 the size of my 5,1. I'm trying my hand with a 2010 Mini as a capture device and FCP7 but it just isn't that well suited for that.

Also there is budget, maybe $500? A cMP may be cheaper to acquire yes but getting it up to spec could potentially be more. The E5-2697 V2 can be had for around $40 and I have friends in ITAD where I can get RAM for cheap. Maybe even one of the 2013 for cheap too! I already have some blade style drives from my old jobs so the drive+adapter isn't an issue either.

The cost of a DaVinci Resolve is $295 which is what I'd spend to get hardware acceleration on my Dell. So the license is about the cost of a base 6,1.

I get the GPU is the weakspot on these.

 

[conmee]

Avro makes a good point re: replacing failed GPUs. I'll put my pragmatic hat on for a moment and say that it isn't simply performance that is a GPU weakspot, but failure rates. Now I've had good luck, and many have, because I don't have a workflow that constantly pegs the GPU at 100% just asking for a failure. But when the D300/D500/D700 fail, you're likely looking having to buy another 6,1 just for the working GPU parts. And if that's the road you find yourself on, you'll quickly end up in brand new Mini price territory. Based on your workflow, I wouldn't be too concerned, but it is a legit concern if money is tight or you don't want to end up with two 6,1's with one being an avant-garde paperweight.

 

[zackkmac]

I still stand that for your type of project, a D700 6,1 (if you must go for one) would be the one to get, but you won't find any for $500...if you do, take it and run! But that maxes out your budget for the desktop alone. Though keep in mind, you could always get any config 2013 + an eGPU, but that is added expense + power consumption.

I agree that the 5,1 is a large, power-hungry beast. The X5675 runs at 95W TDP vs the X5690 at 130W TDP, so that's something to consider. Can't help with the size of course lol but you're hard pressed to find similar performance in a Mac with a much smaller form factor at this price point.

An M1 mini could be another route to look into, as long as you have (or can find) accessories that are compatible with it for your capturing projects. They are usually around $500 for open box models. Would be even better if the M1s offered eGPU support, but maybe your content won't stress the M1 as bad as a Xeon, I have no idea. But if power consumption is a primary factor...M1 is hard to beat.

 

[MisterAndrew]

The 7,1 doesn't really consume a lot of power at idle and light duty tasks. Mine seems to average about 130W to 140W power draw.

Here's a comparison page: Mac Pro: Power consumption and thermal output (BTU/h) information

I really liked the 6,1, but I started getting frustrated with it. They're problematic and they're limited with connectivity & expansion. I wouldn't buy one now. Get something with Thunderbolt 3 or 4. A 2018 mini with an eGPU might be better than an M1 mini, but if Apple supports AMD GPUs on the M2 Ultra Mac Pro then they might enable eGPUs for the M1 mini. Hard to say.

 

[apostolosdt]

I have both, the 5,1 (2012, 12-core, R9 280X, 64GB) is faster than the 6,1 (6-core, D500, 64GB), which is expected, but the feeling is the 5,1 will have the job done more persuasively. Plus the upgrade issues. As for power consumption, measured with a dedicated wattmeter, it records about 17-20 kW/month for a 6-hour heavy daily use for 5,1 and about 35% less for 6,1 (with a LaCie of 3TB connected to compensate for the storage downgrade).

However, is fan noise a problem for you? For 6,1 is virtually soundless.

 

[MisterAndrew]

Soundless is one of the 6,1 design failures. You need to set the fan speed to ramp up with an app like iStat Menus when it’s under load or else it will literally cook itself. That’s mostly why the GPUs fail.

 

[apostolosdt]

Soundless is one of the 6,1 design failures. You need to set the fan speed to ramp up with an app like iStat Menus when it’s under load or else it will literally cook itself. That’s mostly why the GPUs fail.

That's an interesting remark; I've never heard of a lack of fan sound being a design failure, but it all looks reasonable to me. I would appreciate it if you elaborated on that a bit more.

 

[yellowbunny]

If you need to capture DV the 6,1 will obviously be completely fine (will need an adapter for FireWire). But any Mac from the last 15 years can do that job. I have 12core, d300 and runs editing at 4k absolutely fine…

 

[yellowbunny]

* Have never changed the fan speed and had no problems (touch wood)

 

[Bug-Creator]

I don't think there is any good reason to buy an Intel Mac no matter how cheap they may get. Unless your into tinkering with old HW or need to run some old abandoned SW.

So either M1.. (MacMini, Studio, iMac) which will stay useful for longer, or go Windows.

 

[avro707]

I don't think there is any good reason to buy an Intel Mac no matter how cheap they may get. Unless your into tinkering with old HW or need to run some old abandoned SW.

So either M1.. (MacMini, Studio, iMac) which will stay useful for longer, or go Windows.

The 7,1 is worth getting, I got mine brand new last year - it runs current MacOS and can be built into an absolute monster of a machine that will also do Windows without problem. That's why I didn't spend AUD$12,598 on the Studio at maximum specs but AUD$16,000 on the Mac Pro.

Two graphics cards with 64GB each, 4 GPUs, huge amount of maximum ram, 28 core CPU, massive amounts of NVME storage and running windows on the same machine.

It just runs - no quirks, nothing strange - it's a solid machine. If need be you can go over to Windows and use current PC graphics cards.

 

[Mac3Duser]

it makes sense if you can have the 12 cores / 64gb ram / D700 for something like 600/700 $
600/700 $ for the 5.1 with 12 cores / 64gb ram / and at least RX580
if more expensive it's better to buy the M1 Max

 

[Bug-Creator]

The 7,1 is worth getting, I got mine brand new last year

So you paid top Emu$ for HW that is mostly 3 years old at this point. Sure it might make sense in some obscure money-ain't-the-issue cases but apart from those it will be just a bad investment.

 

[apostolosdt]

* Have never changed the fan speed and had no problems (touch wood)

Thanks, that's relieving. Neither have I, but I use the TG Pro app for close monitoring.

 

[MisterAndrew]

I don't think there is any good reason to buy an Intel Mac no matter how cheap they may get. Unless your into tinkering with old HW or need to run some old abandoned SW.

So either M1.. (MacMini, Studio, iMac) which will stay useful for longer, or go Windows.

That's not true. There's no indication that M1 Macs will be supported for longer than current Intel Macs. The first M1 Macs are 3 years old. The current Intel Macs and M1 Macs are all likely to be discontinued this year and will have the same length support status. When macOS support ends for Intel Macs you can continue to use them with another OS like Windows or Linux. When macOS support ends for the M1 Macs there isn't much you could do with it. Hard to say if there will be a hack available like OpenCore that will allow future macOS versions on unsupported M1 Macs.

 

[Bug-Creator]

There's no indication that M1 Macs will be supported for longer than current Intel Macs.

a) the only data we have is from the prior architecture switches....
b) none of the "current" Intel Mac are an option for OT
c) the 6.1 MacPro (which is the topic) has already been dropped

New "M1" based Macs have been introduced less than a year (M1Max/Ultra is just M1 with more of everything) while everything Intel is 3 years old, so even without the whole x86/ARM these would still be dropped long before M1.

As for using any Mac past it's OSX support, noone knows what the future will hold. Linux runs on anything is less than 30 years old. Windows requires (AFAIK) BootCamp specific drivers which may be an issue with what every version is current in 5+ years.
Using OpenCore to run unsupported version of MacOS is a similar unknown.