GPS and the Nike Apple Watch

[pedalmasher]

I must be missing something. I have owned numerous GPS enabled watches that I have used for running and cycling. In each instance, the watch must find the GPS signal which sometimes takes minutes. With the Nike watch fully coupled to my iPhone, when I institute the NRC app on the watch, it is ready to run immediately. How can it be ready to run immediately unless the GPS never shuts off in the Nike watch. I must be missing something. Thanks for whatever you can enlighten regarding this.

 

[Julien]

When using with your iPhone it uses the GPS in the iPhone and not in the Watch. The iPhone knows location because of Location Services.

It will only use the Watch's GPS if you leave your iPhone behind (in car or at home).

 

[pedalmasher]

When using with your iPhone it uses the GPS in the iPhone and not in the Watch. The iPhone knows location because of Location Services.

It will only use the Watch's GPS if you leave your iPhone behind (in car or at home).

But I went outside without the phone and brought up the app and it was immediately ready for me to run which made me wonder if the GPS was active in that it took zero time to find it.

 

[twisted-pixel]

your phone will have location services turned on and can provide this to the watch. A device can find the GPS signal very quickly, but it needs to listen for a period of time (varies on signal strength) to receive current ephemeris data (this describes exactly where the satellite is located). Since your phone has location services on, it already has this data available and can pass it to your watch.

If you have another GPS device, you will notice that if you use it everyday the GPS lock is quick because the ephemeris data is has is still current. Turn it off for a few days and it has to download the data and start all over again, meaning longer acquisition times.

if you're really interested in how it all works, you can research almanac data too, this is sometimes used to predict where satellites are using the clock and previous satellite data. It's not very accurate though.

 

[pedalmasher]

your phone will have location services turned on and can provide this to the watch. A device can find the GPS signal very quickly, but it needs to listen for a period of time (varies on signal strength) to receive current ephemeris data (this describes exactly where the satellite is located). Since your phone has location services on, it already has this data available and can pass it to your watch.

If you have another GPS device, you will notice that if you use it everyday the GPS lock is quick because the ephemeris data is has is still current. Turn it off for a few days and it has to download the data and start all over again, mraning longer acquisition times.

Great, thanks, I hesitated to use it when it failed to search for a signal. I guess I better get my butt out there and test it on a run. I'll have to strap my Garmin 620 on the other wrist and see how they compare. As an aside, I am thrilled with the heart rate monitoring. Dead on every time I check it against manual checking for example riding a stationary bike. This is contrary to the 3 FitBit Surge watches and two Garmin VivoSmart HR+ that I have used which were not even close to being accurate.

 

[deeddawg]

In addition to @twisted-pixel's great info, let me note that recent Garmin devices will pre-cache the ephemeris data if they connect with your cell phone. With the cached ephemeris, the initial GPS position fix is a few seconds rather than the longer time required on the older Garmin devices.

More info: https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2016/03/why-your-garmin-gps-is-better-off-taking-epo.html

As for accuracy between the Apple Watch and Garmin - I find my FR235 and Apple Watch are fairly close, though sometimes they can be off a bit. Mostly seems related to differences in the auto-pause in my experience. YMMV.

Regardless of which watch, I find giving the watch a little bit of time to settle in gives a bit better initial fix. With device I start the activity and immediately pause it while I do a little bit of stretching or set up whatever podcast or music I'm going to listen to.

 

[Pseudo-Fed]

I don't use the Nike app but have an AW3. I start my runs on the stock workout app quickly, and I'm on the watch only--phone is at home in the bedroom. I don't wait on the countdown. I touch the screen to bypass the countdown and start running. The GPS track is very accurate including the starting point. I've also noticed that if I launch the Runkeeper AW app, I have full GPS signal immediately. I don't know how Apple does it, because it's certainly quicker than my Garmin shows GPS acquired.

 

[960design]

I must be missing something. I have owned numerous GPS enabled watches that I have used for running and cycling. In each instance, the watch must find the GPS signal which sometimes takes minutes. With the Nike watch fully coupled to my iPhone, when I institute the NRC app on the watch, it is ready to run immediately. How can it be ready to run immediately unless the GPS never shuts off in the Nike watch. I must be missing something. Thanks for whatever you can enlighten regarding this.

I have used numerous GPS enabled watches as well, but now only use the Apple Watch Series 3 with GPS. The signal finding is immediate ( okay, 3 seconds ). When you are using an Apple Watch that does not have built in GPS ( I used to have the series0, the pairing is immediate as well, because the iPhone can GPS locate nearly instantaneously.

Only the old school GPS chips / processor combos need more than 30 seconds. The last Garmin I had was the 210 with chest strap. As soon as the Apple Watch came out, I was in heaven. Now that we have GPS and cell on watch, I'm in heaven again. Running, swimming, biking has never been easier to transition through.

 

[pedalmasher]

In addition to @twisted-pixel's great info, let me note that recent Garmin devices will pre-cache the ephemeris data if they connect with your cell phone. With the cached ephemeris, the initial GPS position fix is a few seconds rather than the longer time required on the older Garmin devices.

More info: https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2016/03/why-your-garmin-gps-is-better-off-taking-epo.html

As for accuracy between the Apple Watch and Garmin - I find my FR235 and Apple Watch are fairly close, though sometimes they can be off a bit. Mostly seems related to differences in the auto-pause in my experience. YMMV.

Regardless of which watch, I find giving the watch a little bit of time to settle in gives a bit better initial fix. With device I start the activity and immediately pause it while I do a little bit of stretching or set up whatever podcast or music I'm going to listen to.

Super, informative info - thanks. I had never heard of that phenomenon.
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I have used numerous GPS enabled watches as well, but now only use the Apple Watch Series 3 with GPS. The signal finding is immediate ( okay, 3 seconds ). When you are using an Apple Watch that does not have built in GPS ( I used to have the series0, the pairing is immediate as well, because the iPhone can GPS locate nearly instantaneously.

Only the old school GPS chips / processor combos need more than 30 seconds.

Thanks, I am enthralled with this watch!! I cannot get over the fact that I can make and receive telephone calls, exercise, listen to music, track my sleep and heart activities (accurately finally), etc., etc., etc. Why did I wait this long and waste my time with endless FitBit and Garmin alleged fitness watches? Oh and yes, control my multiple Sonos speakers!

 

[960design]

Super, informative info - thanks. I had never heard of that phenomenon.
[doublepost=1510934765][/doublepost]


Thanks, I am enthralled with this watch!! I cannot get over the fact that I can make and receive telephone calls, exercise, listen to music, track my sleep and heart activities (accurately finally), etc., etc., etc. Why did I wait this long and waste my time with endless FitBit and Garmin alleged fitness watches? Oh and yes, control my multiple Sonos speakers!

Hey! You are right down the road from me. I bet you've pedaled past me many times while I'm out running. Crazy world.

 

[pedalmasher]

Hey! You are right down the road from me. I bet you've pedaled past me many times while I'm out running. Crazy world.

Probably in that I used to do 16,000 miles a year on the bike while being an avid competitor. Done a little running myself, won the USATF national 1 mile title last year and the national 1500 meter title the year before!

 

[960design]

Probably in that I used to do 16,000 miles a year on the bike while being an avid competitor. Done a little running myself, won the USATF national 1 mile title last year and the national 1500 meter title the year before!

Dayum... that's some serious mileage!

 

[pedalmasher]

Dayum... that's some serious mileage!

It worked though! I was able to break the national 5K time trial record in 2011! It was 3 1/2 to 5 1/2 hours of training every day of my life. Got off easier in the running. Was able to it with just 24-25 miles a week! I like that better!