Hotmail filters messages sent from Mail as junk, yahoo won't accept

[2A Batterie]

Some of my friends have not been receiving my emails as of late. Today I sent messages to my hotmail and yahoo accounts from Apple Mail. Hotmail filtered it as a junk message and yahoo didn't even receive it. I'm using my email address from my website and running it through Apple mail. However my yahoo and hotmail accounts can receive messages from my main email address if I send them through the login page on the net, and not from Apple Mail. Any ideas what the beef is?

 

[mkrishnan]

Do you have a custom signature in Apple Mail? Perhaps that's the issue? Do messages sent through both routes (web and Mail.app) with exactly the same body content, including signature, work only from the web login and not from Mail.app?

 

[2A Batterie]

No I do not have a custom signature in Apple Mail and yes, identical emails are only received when sent from web login and not when sent from Apple Mail. I'm stumped.

 

[jeremy.king]

Take a look at the full headers of the message you sent to your hotmail account. Avoid using words like info, anonymous, or nobody in your From name or reply-to names. Also, what is your website domain (aaronapter.net or different)? - could be triggering spam filters if it contains naughty words.

 

[2A Batterie]

Take a look at the full headers of the message you sent to your hotmail account. Avoid using words like info, anonymous, or nobody in your From name or reply-to names. Also, what is your website domain (aaronapter.net or different)? - could be triggering spam filters if it contains naughty words.

I made sure to note all of that while doing my tests. The big red flag for me was sending an email from Apple Mail and having it marked as junk when it was received at hotmail (yahoo didn't even accept it). Then I sent the same identical email from the same address to the same addresses, except this time I did it from my web login page (as oppossed to apple mail) and both Yahoo and Hotmail accepted it.

 

[jeremy.king]

I made sure to note all of that while doing my tests. The big red flag for me was sending an email from Apple Mail and having it marked as junk when it was received at hotmail (yahoo didn't even accept it). Then I sent the same identical email from the same address to the same addresses, except this time I did it from my web login page (as oppossed to apple mail) and both Yahoo and Hotmail accepted it.

Right, but you can set your reply-to and from names in Mail.app and if its funky (in terms of spam engines) it will be blocked. Im sure it has nothing to do with mail, as there are millions of us who use Mail.app to send emails out using the interweb. Its also possible your IP is being flagged since this is usually included as part of the email message.

So I would again recommend you review the complete email headers of both a message sent from your webmail and one sent from Mail.app and see if there are any differences. Since you don't get the one message in your Yahoo mail, you will have to use your hotmail account to view the full headers.

They will look something like this (this is from Yahoo! mail)

From Jeremy R. King Tue Dec 20 11:20:48 2005
X-Apparently-To:	 xxx@yahoo.com via 66.163.179.154; Tue, 20 Dec 2005 11:20:49 -0800
X-Originating-IP:	 [66.163.179.140]
Return-Path:	 <xxx@yahoo.com>
Authentication-Results:	 mta111.mail.re2.yahoo.com from=yahoo.com; domainkeys=pass (ok)
Received:	 from 66.163.179.140 (HELO web35601.mail.mud.yahoo.com) (66.163.179.140) by mta111.mail.re2.yahoo.com with SMTP; Tue, 20 Dec 2005 11:20:49 -0800
Received:	 (qmail 61973 invoked by uid 60001); 20 Dec 2005 19:20:48 -0000
DomainKey-Signature:	 a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=wUHfvcTip9jGwK/+CMOGYe/A+6DDM0o8MXBEIHEePPKZD2TKvZR/QUIi6CCy8g30cWSuHgEzRiYf2ny8pwX4+tNyLVY+ISnSQ47SZE8muRjnHtpfbxogWCKSF0nYAMVPkFNSmktldTAUNO1GvKVth5hfJAd5rnzulOP3Mi7Ua98= ;
Message-ID:	 <20051220192048.61971.qmail@web35601.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Received:	 from [63.174.7.252] by web35601.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 20 Dec 2005 11:20:48 PST
Date:	 Tue, 20 Dec 2005 11:20:48 -0800 (PST)
From:	"Jeremy R. King" <xxx@yahoo.com>  View Contact Details   Add Mobile Alert 
Yahoo! DomainKeys has confirmed that this message was sent by yahoo.com. Learn more
Subject:	 rent
To:	"ME" <xxx@yahoo.com>
MIME-Version:	 1.0
Content-Type:	 multipart/alternative; boundary="0-240714278-1135106448=:61893"
Content-Transfer-Encoding:	 8bit
Content-Length:	 637

 

[2A Batterie]

Right, but you can set your reply-to and from names in Mail.app and if its funky (in terms of spam engines) it will be blocked. Im sure it has nothing to do with mail, as there are millions of us who use Mail.app to send emails out using the interweb. Its also possible your IP is being flagged since this is usually included as part of the email message.

So I would again recommend you review the complete email headers of both a message sent from your webmail and one sent from Mail.app and see if there are any differences. Since you don't get the one message in your Yahoo mail, you will have to use your hotmail account to view the full headers.

They will look something like this (this is from Yahoo! mail)

From Jeremy R. King Tue Dec 20 11:20:48 2005
X-Apparently-To:	 xxx@yahoo.com via 66.163.179.154; Tue, 20 Dec 2005 11:20:49 -0800
X-Originating-IP:	 [66.163.179.140]
Return-Path:	 <xxx@yahoo.com>
Authentication-Results:	 mta111.mail.re2.yahoo.com from=yahoo.com; domainkeys=pass (ok)
Received:	 from 66.163.179.140 (HELO web35601.mail.mud.yahoo.com) (66.163.179.140) by mta111.mail.re2.yahoo.com with SMTP; Tue, 20 Dec 2005 11:20:49 -0800
Received:	 (qmail 61973 invoked by uid 60001); 20 Dec 2005 19:20:48 -0000
DomainKey-Signature:	 a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=wUHfvcTip9jGwK/+CMOGYe/A+6DDM0o8MXBEIHEePPKZD2TKvZR/QUIi6CCy8g30cWSuHgEzRiYf2ny8pwX4+tNyLVY+ISnSQ47SZE8muRjnHtpfbxogWCKSF0nYAMVPkFNSmktldTAUNO1GvKVth5hfJAd5rnzulOP3Mi7Ua98= ;
Message-ID:	 <20051220192048.61971.qmail@web35601.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Received:	 from [63.174.7.252] by web35601.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 20 Dec 2005 11:20:48 PST
Date:	 Tue, 20 Dec 2005 11:20:48 -0800 (PST)
From:	"Jeremy R. King" <xxx@yahoo.com>  View Contact Details   Add Mobile Alert 
Yahoo! DomainKeys has confirmed that this message was sent by yahoo.com. Learn more
Subject:	 rent
To:	"ME" <xxx@yahoo.com>
MIME-Version:	 1.0
Content-Type:	 multipart/alternative; boundary="0-240714278-1135106448=:61893"
Content-Transfer-Encoding:	 8bit
Content-Length:	 637

How do I change my reply to and from names in mail.app? I'm using mail 1.3 (I still use OSX 10.3.9). I'm assuming that I would go into the preferances panel and change "full name". If that is the case, it uses my full name, which has no spam qualities at all.

So I tried comparing the codes of identical emails sent from my my mail.app and from the web. The codes are different, but I have no idea what they mean. Can someone help me out here? Here's the codes:



This is sent from mail.app to my hotmail account, which recognized it as junk:

ME-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v623)
Received: from mail4.infinology.net ([38.118.142.231]) by bay0-mc10-f6.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Thu, 22 Dec 2005 20:22:01 -0800
Received: (qmail 13467 invoked by uid 399); 23 Dec 2005 04:12:18 -0000
Received: from adsl-68-75-25-51.dsl.wotnoh.ameritech.net (HELO ?10.0.1.3?) (68.75.25.51) by mail4.infinology.net with SMTP; 23 Dec 2005 04:12:18 -0000
X-Message-Info: 6sSXyD95QpWr3pRdmExEvNnWiAm/rYoxdFzCNxK5rK8=
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.623)
Return-Path: aaronapter.com@hotmail.com
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Dec 2005 04:22:01.0381 (UTC) FILETIME=[6BDDDD50:01C60778]

This is from the EXACT same email sent from my web login page to my hotmail account, which put the message in the inbox:


MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: from mail4.infinology.net ([38.118.142.231]) by bay0-mc11-f16.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Thu, 22 Dec 2005 20:20:20 -0800
Received: (qmail 12195 invoked by uid 399); 23 Dec 2005 04:11:38 -0000
X-Message-Info: 6sSXyD95QpVBDc/fSk0ZqRd7fUXinWjqpD6wOIeSBXQ=
Return-Path: aa@aaronapter.com
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Dec 2005 04:20:20.0627 (UTC) FILETIME=[2FD00630:01C60778]
Return-Path: aaronapter.com@hotmail.com
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Dec 2005 04:22:01.0381 (UTC) FILETIME=[6BDDDD50:01C60778]


Any help would be greatly appreciated!!

 

[jeremy.king]

How do I change my reply to and from names in mail.app? I'm using mail 1.3 (I still use OSX 10.3.9). I'm assuming that I would go into the preferances panel and change "full name". If that is the case, it uses my full name, which has no spam qualities at all.

So I tried comparing the codes of identical emails sent from my my mail.app and from the web. The codes are different, but I have no idea what they mean. Can someone help me out here? Here's the codes:



This is sent from mail.app to my hotmail account, which recognized it as junk:

ME-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v623)
Received: from mail4.infinology.net ([38.118.142.231]) by bay0-mc10-f6.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Thu, 22 Dec 2005 20:22:01 -0800
Received: (qmail 13467 invoked by uid 399); 23 Dec 2005 04:12:18 -0000
Received: from adsl-68-75-25-51.dsl.wotnoh.ameritech.net (HELO ?10.0.1.3?) (68.75.25.51) by mail4.infinology.net with SMTP; 23 Dec 2005 04:12:18 -0000
X-Message-Info: 6sSXyD95QpWr3pRdmExEvNnWiAm/rYoxdFzCNxK5rK8=
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.623)
Return-Path: aaronapter.com@hotmail.com
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Dec 2005 04:22:01.0381 (UTC) FILETIME=[6BDDDD50:01C60778]

This is from the EXACT same email sent from my web login page to my hotmail account, which put the message in the inbox:


MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: from mail4.infinology.net ([38.118.142.231]) by bay0-mc11-f16.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Thu, 22 Dec 2005 20:20:20 -0800
Received: (qmail 12195 invoked by uid 399); 23 Dec 2005 04:11:38 -0000
X-Message-Info: 6sSXyD95QpVBDc/fSk0ZqRd7fUXinWjqpD6wOIeSBXQ=
Return-Path: aa@aaronapter.com
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Dec 2005 04:20:20.0627 (UTC) FILETIME=[2FD00630:01C60778]
Return-Path: aaronapter.com@hotmail.com
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Dec 2005 04:22:01.0381 (UTC) FILETIME=[6BDDDD50:01C60778]


Any help would be greatly appreciated!!

You seem to be missing a Return-Path header - notice the one with aa@xxx.com is working while the one without isn't.

Have you set BOTH an email address and name in your account settings in mail.app? This is under Mail > Preferences > Accounts

Heres a screenshot from gmail.

 

[2A Batterie]

You seem to be missing a Return-Path header - notice the one with aa@xxx.com is working while the one without isn't.

Have you set BOTH an email address and name in your account settings in mail.app? This is under Mail > Preferences > Accounts

Heres a screenshot from gmail.

My account info in the mail prefs are set the same as yours, except for "Incoming mail Server" and "Outgoing Mail Server (smtp)", which are both set to "mail.aaronapter.com". Could this be the problem? If not, would it be something with my ISP? If that's the potential problem, where would I start looking? Geez, this is confusing but thanks a ton for your help so far!

Another thing- I get this message at the top of the email in my hotmail junk mail from my mail app- "The sender of this message could not be verified by Sender ID. Learn more about Sender ID." it then links me to http://help.msn.com/(cHJvamVjdD1ob3...er=&querytype=keyword&query=PIM_SenderID&fs=1

 

[jeremy.king]

My account info in the mail prefs are set the same as yours, except for "Incoming mail Server" and "Outgoing Mail Server (smtp)", which are both set to "mail.aaronapter.com". Could this be the problem? If not, would it be something with my ISP? If that's the potential problem, where would I start looking? Geez, this is confusing but thanks a ton for your help so far!

Another thing- I get this message at the top of the email in my hotmail junk mail from my mail app- "The sender of this message could not be verified by Sender ID. Learn more about Sender ID." it then links me to http://help.msn.com/(cHJvamVjdD1ob3...er=&querytype=keyword&query=PIM_SenderID&fs=1

the mail servers settings shouldn't matter. The Sender ID stuff definitely will. MS thinks your email is bunk since it can't validate where your email came from. I would call your ISP to discuss what you can do to avoid that problem. Alternatively, you could try setting up Mozilla Thunderbird to see if you have the same issues. This would eliminate Mail.app as a problem.

 

[2A Batterie]

I'm downloading Firebird right now, and am going to search Apple Support forums while waiting. It's funny; I've never had this problem before, as my emails always went through. This has just started happening in the past three days. I'm with SBC and I've heard horror stories about them regarding issues like these and support.

 

[2A Batterie]

This is starting to get seriously weird. Now I can't even check my email from mail.app, but it does send messages and they can be received (hotmail still sees it as junk, but it does get it). I've downloaded Thunderbird but it can't retrieve my email because it doesn't recognize when I type in the correct password. I have SBC and I just checked over at Apple discussions and found this interesting thread, which makes me think I need to start a new thread here.
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=1377394#1377394

 

[jeremy.king]

This is starting to get seriously weird. Now I can't even check my email from mail.app, but it does send messages and they can be received (hotmail still sees it as junk, but it does get it). I've downloaded Thunderbird but it can't retrieve my email because it doesn't recognize when I type in the correct password. I have SBC and I just checked over at Apple discussions and found this interesting thread, which makes me think I need to start a new thread here.
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=1377394#1377394

Looks like your ISP is having issues....Perhaps when its back up, you can give Thunderbird a try.

Later.

 

[mkrishnan]

Huh...that's really strange. Your internal SMTP server (the one with your domain name) -- does it forward to the SBC/Yahoo SMTP server? If so, is it the smtp.yahoo.com one or is it another one? Maybe someone accidentally put that server on a SPAM hitlist somewhere? That's happened a handful of times before....

Does SBC/Yahoo prevent you from using another SMTP server? (my cable company will not let me access an external SMTP server, so when I'm at home, I must send all mails through their SMTP server, regardless of address.) If not, can you try switching to another SMTP server, such as the one at Yahoo, if you're not using it now?

I used SBC/Yahoo before leaving Detroit, FWIW, and didn't have these issues then, but clearly it's a very recent thing.