Hypothetical: "Apple Deck" gaming console with Apple Silicon

[senttoschool]

Hardware-wise, Apple should be able to make a far more capable handheld console than the recently announced Steam Deck.

There has been a lot of rumors about Apple making a gaming console. There was even a rumor that Apple would make a "Switch-like console" before the Steam Deck was announced. It seems like it's not an if but when Apple will release one.

Apple is already the most profitable gaming company in the world. With Apple Arcade and the recently leaked emails from the Epic lawsuit, it's quite clear that Apple intends to be a bigger player in gaming, including AAA gaming. In addition, every Apple Silicon Mac going forward will be capable of playing AAA games at 1080p or higher through its powerful IGPU.

Suppose Apple puts its M1 SoC into its "Apple Deck", it would have:

• ~2x ST and MT performance over the Steam Deck
• 45% higher GPU performance (assuming RDNA2 Tflops and M1 Tflops are comparable)
• Significantly better battery life
• Neural Engine to perform DLSS-like upscaling
• Tens of thousands of battery-optimized games on day one.

But Apple would likely produce something like an "M1G" where the GPU is bumped up for a console. If Apple releases it in one to two years, the SoC should be based on the M2 or M3. Apple's recent SDK updates heavily hints at hardware ray-tracing support in upcoming SoCs.

One benefit for developers is that an "Apple Deck" game will automatically be playable across all Apple devices including iPhones, iPads, and Macs. This also means the number of devices capable of playing your game would be in the billions, significantly more than Xbox, Playstation, and Nintendo combined.

 

[nicho]

One benefit for developers is that an "Apple Deck" game will automatically be playable across all Apple devices including iPhones, iPads, and Macs. This also means the number of devices capable of playing your game would be in the billions, significantly more than Xbox, Playstation, and Nintendo combined.

Actually, no. Either:

a) this device has physical controls, so games that are optimised for it require an accessory before they are playable on iPhones/iPads/Macs. Without this accessory, the number of devices capable is little more than the subset of iDevice owners who have a PS5/latest Xbox (ie, happen to have a compatible controller)

b) it's a touchscreen device... which already exists. It's called an iPad.

 

[senttoschool]

Actually, no. Either:

a) this device has physical controls, so games that are optimised for it require an accessory before they are playable on iPhones/iPads/Macs. Without this accessory, the number of devices capable is little more than the subset of iDevice owners who have a PS5/latest Xbox (ie, happen to have a compatible controller)

Yes, I'm well aware of this. Apple can simply release a controller accessory for iPhones, iPads, and Macs and voila, you can play your "Apple Deck" games there too. Heck, I believe current iDevices already support external gaming controllers.

Or if developers want, they can have a set of controls for controller support and another set for touch screens. Games already do this today.

But the whole point is that a development team can make a game for "Apple Deck" and still be able to have the game work for billions of iDevices without much trouble.

 

[leman]

Apple already has gaming devices with performance comparable to that of the Steam Deck, they are called the iPhone and the iPad. Apple's problem is not the device, but the lack of interesting games. I mean, it's great if you like Apple Arcade or the games currently available on the iOS, but there is literally nothing there that would appeal to me.

 

[senttoschool]

Apple already has gaming devices with performance comparable to that of the Steam Deck, they are called the iPhone and the iPad. Apple's problem is not the device, but the lack of interesting games. I mean, it's great if you like Apple Arcade or the games currently available on the iOS, but there is literally nothing there that would appeal to me.

Why do you think that there is a lack of interesting games (to you)?

Is the lack of non-touch controls one of the reasons?

 

[leman]

Why do you think that there is a lack of interesting games (to you)?

Is the lack of non-touch controls one of the reasons?

It has nothing to do with controls. It's simply that virtually all available games are shallow, primitive, with no interesting gameplay and no interesting concepts. There are a few brilliant games that come from mobile (such as Angry Birds and Plants vs. Zombies), but everything I seen on Apple Arcade are very weak clones of popular game mechanics that have zero entertainment value for me.

Frankly, one part of the problem is that many developers are a bit dumb in this regard. There are a lot of brilliant independent games (e.g. Rimworld, Terraria, Factorio...) that would be an excellent fit for the iPad and that would likely have strong sales. But so far, only Prison Architect folks have made an iOS version. Most of it has to do with lack of foresight, bad coding practices and flawed architecture that locks you into a specific platform.

Frankly, if I were Apple, I would sponsor these smaller devs to make high-quality versions of their games for the iOS and native Apple Silicon. This is much cheaper (and simpler) than going after the mass AAA market, and it would appeal to a large group of passionate gamers out there. Unfortunately, Apple's strategy is way to focused on mindless mainstream consumerism. At least they got a strong cooperation with Larian, they are my main hope right now for the future of Mac gaming.

 

[thenewperson]

Frankly, if I were Apple, I would sponsor these smaller devs to make high-quality versions of their games for the iOS and native Apple Silicon. This is much cheaper (and simpler) than going after the mass AAA market, and it would appeal to a large group of passionate gamers out there. Unfortunately, Apple's strategy is way to focused on mindless mainstream consumerism. At least they got a strong cooperation with Larian, they are my main hope right now for the future of Mac gaming.

This has been my hope for Apple Arcade since it was announced, but unfortunately their focus does seem to be leading them astray. Another thing I hope they do (based on their recent additions of iOS classics) is revive the classic Mac indie gaming scene that the 64-bit transition + ARM transition have probably diminished.

I just wish they'd take Apple Arcade as seriously as they take TV+.

 

[UBS28]

Developers for Apple “consoles” don’t care about making games, they care about making money. If you look at what “games” are making the most money, it is all about micro-transactions (which Apple gets a 30% cut).

Why would a developer put alot of time and effort making a AAA game for Apple while he can make a quick low quality effort cash grab game filled with micro-transactions and make alot more money that way?

 

[senttoschool]

Developers for Apple “consoles” don’t care about making games, they care about making money. If you look at what “games” are making the most money, it is all about micro-transactions (which Apple gets a 30% cut).

Why would a developer put alot of time and effort making a AAA game for Apple while he can make a quick low quality effort cash grab game filled with micro-transactions and make alot more money that way?

Which developers care about making games over making money? You know developers don't work for free right?

A game has to be good (or addictive) to be successful with microtransactions.

 

[UBS28]

Which developers care about making games over making money? You know developers don't work for free right?

A game has to be good (or addictive) to be successful with microtransactions.

They are not good games. They are hidden casino’s who prey on the weak. I read in the news that some people spend over $100.000 on these Apple “games” / casinos.

So that is why there will never be AAA games for Apple. You can make much more money by creating such casino’s and it doesn’t require much effort.

Apple is fine with it ofcourse, since they get their 30% cut.

 

[EntropyQ3]

They are not good games. They are hidden casino’s who prey on the weak. I read in the news that some people spend over $100.000 on these Apple “games” / casinos.

So that is why there will never be AAA games for Apple. You can make much more money by creating such casino’s and it doesn’t require much effort.

AAA games have been walking this path as well. Microtransactions, selling loot boxes ("surprise mechanics") and so on.

That said, I agree that the main problem with iOS gaming is indeed that so many of the games are created around predatory monetisation schemes, as opposed to creating a good gaming experience and simply sell it. While it’s a strong current in the entire gaming industry, it’s particularly prevalent in mobile gaming. Apple Arcade is actually a very refreshing exception. Unfortunately, the number of titles is quite limited and contans next to nothing for fans of really high production values. It’s niche. A nice niche, mind you, but still with very limited appeal overall content wise.

 

[JMacHack]

Why would a developer put alot of time and effort making a AAA game for Apple while he can make a quick low quality effort cash grab game filled with micro-transactions and make alot more money that way?

You described AAA games twice.

 

[Falhófnir]

The catch 22 here would be it either needs to be so different to other iOS/ Mac devices you lose out on economy of scale from the wider ecosystem, in which case it risks failing to catch on unless Apple pushes hard to get developer support, or else you just have an iPhone/ iPad with less (‘more focused’) functionality…

 

[boss.king]

There's already an Apple Deck. Well, not Deck, Pad. iPad.

Slap a game controller on either that or your iPhone and you have as close to a handheld game console as Apple is likely to make for the foreseeable future.

 

[dmccloud]

They are not good games. They are hidden casino’s who prey on the weak. I read in the news that some people spend over $100.000 on these Apple “games” / casinos.

So that is why there will never be AAA games for Apple. You can make much more money by creating such casino’s and it doesn’t require much effort.

Apple is fine with it ofcourse, since they get their 30% cut.

Your argument fails because AAA games are already doing the exact same thing. Loot boxes in games such as Battlefield and CoD series, gear drops in Overwatch, Fortnite, PUBG, the Sims franchise all rely on periodic and/or recurring transactions once the game itself has been purchased. Both EA and 2K Games are notorious for this in their licensed sports titles as well, so it's not something unique to mobile apps or mobile app developers.

 

[thenewperson]

Your argument fails because AAA games are already doing the exact same thing. Loot boxes in games such as Battlefield and CoD series, gear drops in Overwatch, Fortnite, PUBG, the Sims franchise all rely on periodic and/or recurring transactions once the game itself has been purchased. Both EA and 2K Games are notorious for this in their licensed sports titles as well, so it's not something unique to mobile apps or mobile app developers.

PC gamers have conveniently and neatly tossed all F2P/IAP/lootbox nonsense onto mobile gaming to keep the 'purity' of that space relatively intact, even though MMOs and other F2P stuff on PC have been havens for these things.

 

[JMacHack]

PC gamers have conveniently and neatly tossed all F2P/IAP/lootbox nonsense onto mobile gaming to keep the 'purity' of that space relatively intact, even though MMOs and other F2P stuff on PC have been havens for these things.

People forget the modern lootbox trend started with Team Fortress 2. PCMR types have some serious mental gymnastics when it comes to any criticism toward pc gaming.

 

[leman]

PC gamers have conveniently and neatly tossed all F2P/IAP/lootbox nonsense onto mobile gaming to keep the 'purity' of that space relatively intact, even though MMOs and other F2P stuff on PC have been havens for these things.

PC gaming landscape is much more heterogenous than mobile gaming. And there are a lot of big money-makers on the PC that are every bit as bad in this regard as the worst "mobile" games.

The thing is that PC also has some good quality passion projects that just want to be good games instead of tricking the customer into paying more and more money, and games like those are notably missing from the mobile platform. Plenty have Mac ports however.

 

[rtkeeling]

Terraria is available.

 

[senttoschool]

PC gaming landscape is much more heterogenous than mobile gaming. And there are a lot of big money-makers on the PC that are every bit as bad in this regard as the worst "mobile" games.

The thing is that PC also has some good quality passion projects that just want to be good games instead of tricking the customer into paying more and more money, and games like those are notably missing from the mobile platform. Plenty have Mac ports however.

I think on-the-go and touch controls automatically steer games towards what we have today in mobile gaming.

I think the combination of all AS Macs being capable of playing AAA games and something like an Apple Deck would help bring higher quality games to Apple's ecosystem.

Apple's gaming strategy should be:

Apple Deck + AAA gaming on Macs + Official Apple Controller + Apple Arcade

 

[robco74]

If rumors are to be believed, the upcoming iPad mini should fit the bill nicely.

Arcade is designed for casual, not hardcore gamers. To bring in titles like MS does with their service, Apple would need to raise the price for Arcade to pay developers more. On that topic, I do wonder if Steam will offer a competing subscription service to go along with the Steam Deck.

As for controllers, Apple typically doesn't go into new areas unless they can bring something new to the table. Given that they already support most standard controllers, and games can now require them, I'm not really sure what they would add that hasn't already been done.

 

[diamond.g]

Hardware-wise, Apple should be able to make a far more capable handheld console than the recently announced Steam Deck.

There has been a lot of rumors about Apple making a gaming console. There was even a rumor that Apple would make a "Switch-like console" before the Steam Deck was announced. It seems like it's not an if but when Apple will release one.

Apple is already the most profitable gaming company in the world. With Apple Arcade and the recently leaked emails from the Epic lawsuit, it's quite clear that Apple intends to be a bigger player in gaming, including AAA gaming. In addition, every Apple Silicon Mac going forward will be capable of playing AAA games at 1080p or higher through its powerful IGPU.

Suppose Apple puts its M1 SoC into its "Apple Deck", it would have:

• ~2x ST and MT performance over the Steam Deck
• 45% higher GPU performance (assuming RDNA2 Tflops and M1 Tflops are comparable)
• Significantly better battery life
• Neural Engine to perform DLSS-like upscaling
• Tens of thousands of battery-optimized games on day one.

But Apple would likely produce something like an "M1G" where the GPU is bumped up for a console. If Apple releases it in one to two years, the SoC should be based on the M2 or M3. Apple's recent SDK updates heavily hints at hardware ray-tracing support in upcoming SoCs.

One benefit for developers is that an "Apple Deck" game will automatically be playable across all Apple devices including iPhones, iPads, and Macs. This also means the number of devices capable of playing your game would be in the billions, significantly more than Xbox, Playstation, and Nintendo combined.

But why? While I think an Apple version of the Steam Deck would be cool, why would someone buy it over an iPad/iPhone?

 

[ianziguri]

A SteveDeck perhaps?

 

[JMacHack]

A SteveDeck perhaps?

Perfect counterpart to the GabeCube.

 

[senttoschool]

But why? While I think an Apple version of the Steam Deck would be cool, why would someone buy it over an iPad/iPhone?

No one is buying it over an iPad and iPhone. You can own all 3.

Why? Because the iPhone and iPad are both terrible at any sort of gaming beyond the basic genres.