iPhone X camera help needed

[01jamcon]

So I've tried asking in the general iPhone forums (https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/iphone-x-poor-pictures-in-low-light.2093819/), but people there maybe aren't photography experts like you guys

After more testing, it appears the iPhone X f1.8 camera on my phone just doesn't take good pictures in low light. In its attempts to take in more light, it creates more blur and noise reduction seems too aggressive for me creating blotchy photos.

I noticed that the 'portrait mode' camera at f2.4 though darker, takes much clearer photos even in low light.
Annoyingly, I can't seem to force the 'regular' photo mode to switch to the f2.4 camera even by zooming in and it seems instead to just use digital zoom (which defies the point of having two cameras).

Does anyone think I've got a dud f1.8 camera on my phone? Or is this just normal behaviour at a wider aperture? Any suggestions welcomed.

Test photos below - cropped roughly


'Regular photo mode" - f/1.8 1/4 4 mm ISO80

'Portrait photo mode' - f/2.4 1/9 6 mm ISO160

 

[Apple fanboy]

So I've tried asking in the general iPhone forums (https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/iphone-x-poor-pictures-in-low-light.2093819/), but people there maybe aren't photography experts like you guys

After more testing, it appears the iPhone X f1.8 camera on my phone just doesn't take good pictures in low light. In its attempts to take in more light, it creates more blur and noise reduction seems too aggressive for me creating blotchy photos.

I noticed that the 'portrait mode' camera at f2.4 though darker, takes much clearer photos even in low light.
Annoyingly, I can't seem to force the 'regular' photo mode to switch to the f2.4 camera even by zooming in and it seems instead to just use digital zoom (which defies the point of having two cameras).

Does anyone think I've got a dud f1.8 camera on my phone? Or is this just normal behaviour at a wider aperture? Any suggestions welcomed.

Test photos below - cropped roughly


'Regular photo mode" - f/1.8 1/4 4 mm ISO80 View attachment 741308

'Portrait photo mode' - f/2.4 1/9 6 mm ISO160
View attachment 741309

Do you have a tripod? For comparative tests you need to shoot from a tripod so both images are as stable as each other. Otherwise blur could be camera shake.

 

[01jamcon]

Do you have a tripod? For comparative tests you need to shoot from a tripod so both images are as stable as each other. Otherwise blur could be camera shake.

Though I agree for a true comparison I should be using a tripod, however, I'm talking about an iPhone here, which most people don't usually lug around a tripod for. Also, both lenses are meant to have OIS. Finally, I've taken multiple shots of this and tried to pick out as representative an example of each camera as possible. Hope that helps.

 

[Apple fanboy]

Though I agree for a true comparison I should be using a tripod, however, I'm talking about an iPhone here, which most people don't usually lug around a tripod for. Also, both lenses are meant to have OIS. Finally, I've taken multiple shots of this and tried to pick out as representative an example of each camera as possible. Hope that helps.

Image stabilisation only helps to a point.
Agree a tripod isn't really what iPhone shooting is about, but if you want to be sure you are comparing comparable images that's the way to go.
I don't use my iPhone for photography. Just snaps. For me the quality isn't there. I don't think it will be.
Certainly when compared to what I use.

 

[01jamcon]

Image stabilisation only helps to a point.
Agree a tripod isn't really what iPhone shooting is about, but if you want to be sure you are comparing comparable images that's the way to go.
I don't use my iPhone for photography. Just snaps. For me the quality isn't there. I don't think it will be.
Certainly when compared to what I use.

Fair enough. I guess all I really want is some other iPhone owners to say, actually this is the same on other iPhones, stop pixel peeping and not expect DSLR quality from a tiny camera attached to an otherwise pretty great phone.

 

[MacRy]

You’re always going to struggle in low light with a camera phone as the sensor is so tiny. Although they can take some great shots in decent light you need to lower your expectations for low light photography with them I’m afraid.

It’s all to do with pixel size. The bigger the sensor the bigger the pixels and bigger pixels let in more light. Having a tiny sensor and cramming loads of pixels in it makes matters worse. That’s why some cameras with a lower MP count are better performers in low light than their siblings with a high MP count. The Sony A7S is a good example of this - less pixels, but larger ones.

 

[kenoh]

Sorry to repeat what has been said already but small sensor, low light is not a good combination. You have to either add stabilisation or light to get a decent image.

I doubt you have a dud, this is just the woes of a photographer I am afraid. We all live with these compromises everyday. That is why we lug those big ugly cameras around with us so we can get better low light capabilities.
[doublepost=1512907515][/doublepost]

Fair enough. I guess all I really want is some other iPhone owners to say, actually this is the same on other iPhones, stop pixel peeping and not expect DSLR quality from a tiny camera attached to an otherwise pretty great phone.

OK, here you go....

Actually this is the same on all iPhones and phones in general, stop torturing yourself by pixel peeping and try not to expect DSLR quality in low light from a tiny camera attached to an otherwise pretty great phone.

 

[maflynn]

After more testing, it appears the iPhone X f1.8 camera on my phone just doesn't take good pictures in low light. In its attempts to take in more light, it creates more blur and noise reduction seems too aggressive for me creating blotchy photos.

Low light performance is only going to improve when they increase the size of the sensor.

The old and over-used quote "The Best Camera is the One You Have With You" aptly fits because with the iPhone you'll be in situations where its not convenient or even possible to take a camera with you, yet you'll have your phone. I accept that the iPhone's camera has limitations and as long as you understand that you can enjoy the pictures taken and not worry about pixel peeping

 

[01jamcon]

Ok guys, thanks for all your responses. I mostly agree with you.

The one thing bugging me is, assuming this isn't just motion blur (which I promise I've tried to minimise) - why is the camera with the brighter wider aperture more blurry? I can see from the metadata that the iPhone is deciding to use a longer shutter length 1/4 vs 1/9 on the f2.4 lens which to me doesn't make any sense. Surely it should be able to have a faster shutter given then wider aperture to capture the same amount of light - therefore reducing chances of blurring?

 

[kenoh]

Ok guys, thanks for all your responses. I mostly agree with you.

The one thing bugging me is, assuming this isn't just motion blur (which I promise I've tried to minimise) - why is the camera with the brighter wider aperture more blurry? I can see from the metadata that the iPhone is deciding to use a longer shutter length 1/4 vs 1/9 on the f2.4 lens which to me doesn't make any sense. Surely it should be able to have a faster shutter given then wider aperture to capture the same amount of light - therefore reducing chances of blurring?

It is trying to reduce ISO in first instance to get cleaner image. Hence slowing shutter no? Higher iso, more noise.

And you agree mostly? Lol... We are photographers... This is the daily grind for us and our images...

 

[maflynn]

I can see from the metadata that the iPhone is deciding to use a longer shutter length 1/4 vs 1/9 on the f2.4 lens which to me doesn't make any sense. Surely it should be able to have a faster shutter given then wider aperture to capture the same amount of light - therefore reducing chances of blurring?

Looks like the software opted to choose for a slower shutter speed over boosting the ISO. This is why I like using my OMD, I have full control over what happens, whether I choose shutter speed, aperture, or ISO.

 

[MacRy]

Looks like the software opted to choose for a slower shutter speed over boosting the ISO. This is why I like using my OMD, I have full control over what happens, whether I choose shutter speed, aperture, or ISO.

This.

I’m not an iPhone user so I don’t know if they let you go full manual mode with the camera, but that would be the way to overcome this.

 

[robgendreau]

There are reports in the iOS 11 forum about focus issues with 11.2 and iPhone 8, 8+ and X. Make sure you haven't been bitten by that. At least one I read said the focus issues went away when using Portrait Mode.

 

[kenoh]

This.

I’m not an iPhone user so I don’t know if they let you go full manual mode with the camera, but that would be the way to overcome this.

You can with an app....

 

[Alexander.Of.Oz]

I can see from the metadata that the iPhone is deciding to use a longer shutter length 1/4 vs 1/9

This is your problem right here! Too slow a shutter speed for using a tiny sensor and glass combination. Increase your light or don't expect good images from those sort of lowlight and slow shutter speed combination scenarios.

The iPhone does not have vibration reduction or image stabilisation built into the glass, it shifts the sensor in minuscule amounts.

Even if you used a third party app, expect to see horrid increases in noise once you go beyond ISO 400 in low light conditions with any phone camera.

 

[mofunk]

You can autofocus lock on the area that has the most light. Then your photo should be better. Remember shooting with an iPhone is just like shooting a camera in Auto mode. It will give you an average shot.