macOS Java, VB.Net, C#/VC++.Net Discussion

[longofest]

It's not going to be that simple, because Xcode can't build Windows applications. Adobe will have partitioned out the project so that as much code as possible will compile nicely under two separate environments.

I agree... plus its not like you can even port portions of the code over to and from the two environments very easily, since you have to use VB.Net or C#/VC++.Net on the Windows side, and Obj-C on Mac. Granted, you can use C++ code in XCode, so theoretically if you wanted to segment some of your background processing routines/classes from your framework calls, you could have those classes be portable. But I've never attempted using C++ in an otherwise Obj-C program.

(sure you could use Java for cross-platform capabilities, but not really in this instance. Any hard-core processing must be done by a fully compiled language, or you're an idiot)

 

[Squonk]

It's not going to be that simple, because Xcode can't build Windows applications. Adobe will have partitioned out the project so that as much code as possible will compile nicely under two separate environments.

Right right right - I forgot about that.

I agree... plus its not like you can even port portions of the code over to and from the two environments very easily, since you have to use VB.Net or C#/VC++.Net on the Windows side, and Obj-C on Mac. Granted, you can use C++ code in XCode, so theoretically if you wanted to segment some of your background processing routines/classes from your framework calls, you could have those classes be portable. But I've never attempted using C++ in an otherwise Obj-C program.

(sure you could use Java for cross-platform capabilities, but not really in this instance. Any hard-core processing must be done by a fully compiled language, or you're an idiot)

That one made me laugh - the thought of an application of this size being written in Java! Ooh, but it would run oh so speedy!

 

[Rodimus Prime]

I agree... plus its not like you can even port portions of the code over to and from the two environments very easily, since you have to use VB.Net or C#/VC++.Net on the Windows side, and Obj-C on Mac. Granted, you can use C++ code in XCode, so theoretically if you wanted to segment some of your background processing routines/classes from your framework calls, you could have those classes be portable. But I've never attempted using C++ in an otherwise Obj-C program.

(sure you could use Java for cross-platform capabilities, but not really in this instance. Any hard-core processing must be done by a fully compiled language, or you're an idiot)

I am inclined to agree in some ways. I could see part of the reason for this to make it easier on them to make the new products. I could see it just being easier to write and optimize code for one CPU type than it is to write it for 2. And since they are making stuff for both windows and Macs the CPU side is going to have to factor in some. Plus it more than likely allows for more of the code to be used cross platform.

Short run the Intel switch is going to hurt. long run it means more software for OSX because it will be easier to port it over since it will only be OS differences not an OS and CPU difference.

 

[longofest]

That one made me laugh - the thought of an application of this size being written in Java! Ooh, but it would run oh so speedy!

Don't even get me started about Java and its speed ...

 

[macenforcer]

Don't even get me started about Java and its speed ...

For real. Java is the WORST language out there yet people continue to develop in it.

 

[cwoloszynski]

Right right right - I forgot about that.



That one made me laugh - the thought of an application of this size being written in Java! Ooh, but it would run oh so speedy!

I agree about interpreted Java, but you can compile Java to a native application (see GCJ as part of the GCC toolchain) and get some pretty high-performance applications. [I'm not trying to suggest everyone to do this, but I wanted to give kudos to the GCC folks who created GCJ as an option for those who prefer Java as a language, but need to avoid the performance of an interpreted VM].

For real. Java is the WORST language out there yet people continue to develop in it.

Looks like we need to take this Java discussion to a different forum. Would you prefer C#?

 

[longofest]

Moving this discussion to the Mac Programming forum. Enjoy.

 

[Catfish_Man]

For real. Java is the WORST language out there yet people continue to develop in it.

You might be surprised at the speed improvement I've seen when moving a chunk of C code to a (better written) chunk of Java code through the ObjC<->Java bridge.

C++ is, imo, a far worse language, and there are many many languages far worse than C++.

 

[smsm1]

For real. Java is the WORST language out there yet people continue to develop in it.

I think that Java is one great language to work with. Have you ever tried to work with C pointers? They are a nightmare! I know Java can be a bit memory intensive and at times slow. In contrast, I have a friend who has used Java to copy data, and it was faster than Windows File Copy! So Java isn't that slow.

 

[therevolution]

It's my belief that, 99% of the time, if your Java code is slow, then it's because you're not doing it correctly. Java's not perfect for every application, obviously, but any validity to the whole "Java is slow" excuse died years ago.

How many of you whining about Java's speed program in Java and use it everyday? I do, and I don't agree with that sentiment. Can you provide evidence to back up your claims?

 

[smsm1]

It's my belief that, 99% of the time, if your Java code is slow, then it's because you're not doing it correctly. Java's not perfect for every application, obviously, but any validity to the whole "Java is slow" excuse died years ago.

How many of you whining about Java's speed program in Java and use it everyday? I do, and I don't agree with that sentiment. Can you provide evidence to back up your claims?

Quick concise, and most importantly well said. I couldn't have said it better myself.

However, some companies still require you to use C or C variants. This is now becoming a good skill to have for undergraduates (as I found out at the Scottish Graduate Fair last week).

With increases in Java usage in new development, it should become less of an issue.

 

[lmalave]

It's my belief that, 99% of the time, if your Java code is slow, then it's because you're not doing it correctly. Java's not perfect for every application, obviously, but any validity to the whole "Java is slow" excuse died years ago.

How many of you whining about Java's speed program in Java and use it everyday? I do, and I don't agree with that sentiment. Can you provide evidence to back up your claims?

I second this sentiment. I've worked on financial applications and high-volume travel websites that were based on server-side Java. Java performance has not been an issue. Granted, I'm talking about sever-side Java here, nothing to do with drawing a GUI. On the server-side, I can tell you that Java has gained acceptance in the Corporate IT world as a mature technology and there are many, many mission-critical, multimillion dollar apps already using it.

 

[longofest]

I think that Java is one great language to work with. Have you ever tried to work with C pointers? They are a nightmare! I know Java can be a bit memory intensive and at times slow. In contrast, I have a friend who has used Java to copy data, and it was faster than Windows File Copy! So Java isn't that slow.

One of the reasons why I like C/C++ is because of the pointers

It's my belief that, 99% of the time, if your Java code is slow, then it's because you're not doing it correctly. Java's not perfect for every application, obviously, but any validity to the whole "Java is slow" excuse died years ago.

How many of you whining about Java's speed program in Java and use it everyday? I do, and I don't agree with that sentiment. Can you provide evidence to back up your claims?

Also, have you ever used Lotus Notes? It's written in Java, and is an excellent example of a slow Java program that other programs like it are able to do the same thing in a fraction of the amount of time.

 

[therevolution]

Also, have you ever used Lotus Notes? It's written in Java, and is an excellent example of a slow Java program that other programs like it are able to do the same thing in a fraction of the amount of time.

Like I said, if that's true, the problem almost certainly lies within Lotus Notes and not within Java itself.

The UI for the Java GUI app I work on is just as quick as any native Windows app (well, usually. When it's not, then it's my job to fix it ).

 

[FireArse]

Also, have you ever used Lotus Notes? It's written in Java, and is an excellent example of a slow Java program that other programs like it are able to do the same thing in a fraction of the amount of time.

I used Lotus Notes, at 3Com when I worked there a year or so back - it was pretty good. I didnt think it was slow at all. The only time it was slow was when the oil blast took out the European HQ in Hemel Hempstead.

It still worked though - just took its sweet little time!

F