Mac Mini G3 Project

[Appleuser201]

z970mp gave me a great idea for a G3 project... After discussing the high end G3 iBooks and the commen smelly keyboard issue, these iBooks are unfortunately made unusable in their current state as the smell to some is horrid.
The thing is, these are 800-900mhz high end G3s. Real performers. Why get rid of it or not get it because it smells? There are some things and games I want to try out on a high end G3. I've got the perfect idea, why bother with another iBook case or keyboard? I want to make the first ever Mac Mini... G3

I'd 3D print the case after getting precise measurements of the motherboard and all the other complements leaving air intake in the case for proper cooling as well as the original battery. I will try and make the case look close to the G4 Mac Mini with its own G3 twist (maybe in a iMac fruit color). I hope to get this project done in the next several months. Definitely something worth a try And my first custom Mac, which will be a true performer at 900mhz (might try and over clock to 1ghz as battery life won't be an issue)

I'd love to hear any ideas thoughts or suggestions!

 

[z970]

Such a concept as smell always did seem to me like a stupid reason to go and waste the hardware and all its capabilities.

You don't even need to print it, as the core idea is to simply take advantage of the 900mhz G3 without dealing with such superficiality as smell. Make a Power Mac G3 actually live up to its name and just slot one in there. Do what I did and buy a couple extension cables, route them from the iBook to the port holes, and mount the logic board to the door. Wham, Power Mac G3 Plus.

With modding, your imagination is the limit.

 

[Appleuser201]

Such a concept as smell always did seem to me like a stupid reason to go and waste the hardware and all its capabilities.

You don't even need to print it, as the core idea is to simply take advantage of the 900mhz G3 without dealing with such superficiality as smell. Make a Power Mac G3 actually live up to its name and just slot one in there. Do what I did and buy a couple extension cables, route them from the iBook to the port holes, and mount the logic board to the door. Wham, Power Mac G3 Plus.

With modding, your imagination is the limit.

I've already decided on 3D printing so I can customize it myself. A G3 cube is also another possibility! Or a specially made iMac G4 lamp design with the G3 components making it a fruit coloured iMac G3 that looks like a iMac G4.

 

[Lastic]

I applaud your effort and looking forward to the result.

 

[Project Alice]

Any G4 > 900Mhz G3
Though I understand, and am enthused by the same curiosity.

it would probably be easier to just desolder the G3 and solder it onto whatever you wanted to build it into. Like a CPU card for a PowerMac G4. That would fit into a Cube as well as a graphite G4. That seems like a more realistic goal. Though I’m certain the G4 will still be faster even at 450Mhz.

I have a G4 Pismo curtesy of dosdude1, that’s equipped with a 550Mhz G4. Originally, it was 500Mhz. Not a big difference in clockspeed however it is a massive difference in speed as a G4. I also own a 600Mhz iMac G3 that is nowhere near as fast as it, or the multitude of 450mhz and 500mhz graphite G4s I’ve got laying around.

 

[jmilan0302]

I wonder if those could be put on a dual CPU card from a G4 to make a daul 900 MHz G3... If the G4 will even boot with a G3 CPU.

 

[bunnspecial]

Not to discourage the enthusiasm for what sounds like an interesting project but...

If you want the "ultimate" G3 there is a more or less off the shelf if not particularly easy to find option. ZIF upgrade cards that fit the beige and B&W were made as fast as 1.1ghz. They're few and far between, but they're out there.

I have a 1ghz that I run in a B&W with a VooDoo 5 5500. @Surrat has a very similar system but I think he has the 1.1ghz. Unfortunately, not a lot of Mac programs can really leverage the VooDoo card. Funny enough, the fairly scarce Mac edition VooDoo 5 is actually sometimes flashed to a PC card as the Mac edition has DVI+VGA where the PC is only VGA.

All of that aside, that combination makes for a REALLY sweet G3 system in OS 9. For a somewhat more available GPU, drop in a Radeon 9200 for OS 9, or a flashed Geforce 5200 or 6200 for OS X(the latter two get you core image support).

 

[retta283]

I'm all for tinkering, but I have a question about the smelly keyboards. Can't you just replace it with a G4 keyboard, or does the smell remain?

 

[AphoticD]

Again, all for creative adventures with old Macs, however a simpler approach might be to just remove the smelly keyboard and run the iBook in clamshell mode with an external display, keyboard and mouse. Prop it up with the rear vents facing up so the fan pushes hot air straight out.

You could even go a step further and remove the display to make it slimmer, but you’d need to then make antennae for the WiFi. You’d probably also need to magnetize where the hall sensor switch is so the system can run in clamshell mode.

 

[weckart]

I'm all for tinkering, but I have a question about the smelly keyboards. Can't you just replace it with a G4 keyboard, or does the smell remain?

I think the G4 keyboards are different electrically and there are a couple of revisions of those, so not one G4 keyboard will work with all G4 notebooks.

 

[Appleuser201]

Not to discourage the enthusiasm for what sounds like an interesting project but...

If you want the "ultimate" G3 there is a more or less off the shelf if not particularly easy to find option. ZIF upgrade cards that fit the beige and B&W were made as fast as 1.1ghz. They're few and far between, but they're out there.

I have a 1ghz that I run in a B&W with a VooDoo 5 5500. @Surrat has a very similar system but I think he has the 1.1ghz. Unfortunately, not a lot of Mac programs can really leverage the VooDoo card. Funny enough, the fairly scarce Mac edition VooDoo 5 is actually sometimes flashed to a PC card as the Mac edition has DVI+VGA where the PC is only VGA.

All of that aside, that combination makes for a REALLY sweet G3 system in OS 9. For a somewhat more available GPU, drop in a Radeon 9200 for OS 9, or a flashed Geforce 5200 or 6200 for OS X(the latter two get you core image support).

What I originally wanted to do was overclock the iBook from 900mhz to 1ghz. It may not be the ''ultimate, ultimate'' G3 system out there since there is a 1.1ghz G3 card (with potential overclock to 1.2ghz or higher). Really just want to save an old smelly iBook, and give it a new chance at life while getting an insane OS9 system with a stylish custom case.
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Again, all for creative adventures with old Macs, however a simpler approach might be to just remove the smelly keyboard and run the iBook in clamshell mode with an external display, keyboard and mouse. Prop it up with the rear vents facing up so the fan pushes hot air straight out.

You could even go a step further and remove the display to make it slimmer, but you’d need to then make antennae for the WiFi. You’d probably also need to magnetize where the hall sensor switch is so the system can run in clamshell mode.

Where's the fun in that? Simple isn't always fun and hard work can turn out some great results.

 

[Amethyst1]

Such a concept as smell always did seem to me like a stupid reason to go and waste the hardware and all its capabilities.

What are you going to do if the smell is bad enough to make you feel sick?

On a similar matter, a couple of years ago I had to return an LCD monitor that had a PWM-controlled LED backlight which visibly flickered unless brightness was at maximum. At maximum brightness, my eyes hurt, at a lower brightness, the flickering caused me a terrible headache after an hour or so. A waste of an otherwise good panel maybe but I wouldn't let it interfere with my health or welll-being.

 

[Appleuser201]

What are you going to do if the smell is bad enough to make you feel sick?

On a similar matter, a couple of years ago I had to return an LCD monitor that had a PWM-controlled LED backlight which visibly flickered unless brightness was at maximum. At maximum brightness, my eyes hurt, at a lower brightness, the flickering caused me a terrible headache after an hour or so. A waste of an otherwise good panel maybe but I wouldn't let it interfere with my health or welll-being.

What he means is it's stupid to waste all the hardware and components in the G3. that's what's stupid, not that it's stupid to not use the iBook because it stinks. Which is why I've decided to give a smelly old iBook another chance at life.

 

[tevion5]

All of that aside, that combination makes for a REALLY sweet G3 system in OS 9. For a somewhat more available GPU, drop in a Radeon 9200 for OS 9, or a flashed Geforce 5200 or 6200 for OS X(the latter two get you core image support).

Can confirm the Radeon 9200 128MB runs great in my upgraded PM 8600/250 (now a 450MHz G4).

 

[Appleuser201]

Can confirm the Radeon 9200 128MB runs great in my upgraded PM 8600/250 (now a 450MHz G4).

Gaming and video will definitely appreciate that video card in OS 9 and especially OS X. I didn't think you could put such a card in such an old machine. I have to go see what video upgrades exist for the newer power Mac G3 models.

 

[bunnspecial]

Gaming and video will definitely appreciate that video card in OS 9 and especially OS X. I didn't think you could put such a card in such an old machine. I have to go see what video upgrades exist for the newer power Mac G3 models.

The Radeon 9200 will work in any PCI based Mac going all the way back to the 7200.

It's the best card for general use that you can put old world ROM computers.

The Radeon 7000 also works, and is a lot easier to find.

The Rage 128 that shipped in the B&W is probably the easiest and least expensive, and will work in all of these also. Almost all of my beige PCI Macs have one of these since it gives me a VGA port and I can run an LCD at reasonable resolutions off one.

The original Radeon and the 7500 are also available in PCI Mac editions, and are great choices.

The nearly impossible to find VooDoo 5 of course is out there also.

For the B&W ONLY(and Yikes!, which is basically a B&W with a G4) there are a handful of specific NVIDIA PCI cards you can flash that will work in these computers. They have the advantage of offering Core Image support. I have a Geforce 5200 that gets swapped between computers. The one I have has dual VGA out and 256mb VRAM. I have another Nvidia Quadro card that I THINK is roughly equivalent to a 6200 but has dual DVI(I need to get around to flashing it-I mostly bought it because it popped up on Ebay and @LightBulbFun told me I should buy it )

 

[z970]

The Radeon 9200 will work in any PCI based Mac going all the way back to the 7200.

It's the best card for general use that you can put old world ROM computers.

The Radeon 7000 also works, and is a lot easier to find.

The Rage 128 that shipped in the B&W is probably the easiest and least expensive, and will work in all of these also. Almost all of my beige PCI Macs have one of these since it gives me a VGA port and I can run an LCD at reasonable resolutions off one.

The original Radeon and the 7500 are also available in PCI Mac editions, and are great choices.

The nearly impossible to find VooDoo 5 of course is out there also.

For the B&W ONLY(and Yikes!, which is basically a B&W with a G4) there are a handful of specific NVIDIA PCI cards you can flash that will work in these computers. They have the advantage of offering Core Image support. I have a Geforce 5200 that gets swapped between computers. The one I have has dual VGA out and 256mb VRAM. I have another Nvidia Quadro card that I THINK is roughly equivalent to a 6200 but has dual DVI(I need to get around to flashing it-I mostly bought it because it popped up on Ebay and @LightBulbFun told me I should buy it )

What's the performance difference between the OG Radeon, 7000, and 9200 in a PCI Mac?

 

[bunnspecial]

What's the performance difference between the OG Radeon, 7000, and 9200 in a PCI Mac?

For what you're likely to be doing on an older PCI Mac, probably splitting hairs between them.

If you're doing 3D gaming or something else that can actually use it, have the CPU power to back it up, and install the appropriate drivers, 9200>Radeon>7000. The CPU power thing is a big one, and you probably at least need to get into G3 territory before you can see it.

Of course, of the bunch the 9200 is the only one that drive two monitors off a single card IIRC, so if you want to do that it's clearly the best choice. That's especially true if you're dealing with a 3 slot computer and already have one claimed for your USB/FW card and another claimed either to drive your hard drives or run 10/100 ethernet.

 

[Appleuser201]

For what you're likely to be doing on an older PCI Mac, probably splitting hairs between them.

If you're doing 3D gaming or something else that can actually use it, have the CPU power to back it up, and install the appropriate drivers, 9200>Radeon>7000. The CPU power thing is a big one, and you probably at least need to get into G3 territory before you can see it.

Of course, of the bunch the 9200 is the only one that drive two monitors off a single card IIRC, so if you want to do that it's clearly the best choice. That's especially true if you're dealing with a 3 slot computer and already have one claimed for your USB/FW card and another claimed either to drive your hard drives or run 10/100 ethernet.

Is there any version of Linux that could take advantage of these video cards for stuff like YouTube and HD movies? Graphics acceleration is possible in 64 bit lubuntu for the G5 I remember.. Would it work on our older macs?

 

[Slix]

Cool idea!

A while back I used my 700 MHz iBook G3 in clamshell mode with an external monitor using Screen Spanning Doctor, but yeah, it still smelled. I wonder if removing the keyboard entirely and letting it air out for a while would let you just use clamshell mode without the smell?

 

[Project Alice]

What is actually the cause of the smell anyways? I read it somewhere but I can't recall and I'm too lazy to google it right now lol.
I thought it was because of some thermal pad or something?

 

[TheShortTimer]

What is actually the cause of the smell anyways? I read it somewhere but I can't recall and I'm too lazy to google it right now lol.
I thought it was because of some thermal pad or something?

A Stinky Old iBook that Smells Like Sweat | Low End Mac

lowendmac.com

Apparently an adhesive used in the labeling and construction of the keyboard would begin to out-gas about 12-18 months after the iBook was manufactured. This gas smells remarkably like ripe, testosterone-enriched perspiration, and it only gets worse with age.

Here's the follow up article with potential solutions that include:

If you’re overly compulsive and willing to completely disassemble the board and soak the mounting plates in a solvent bath until they are both separate and clean, you might get rid of the smell entirely. You will then have to stick the plates back together with some kind of odorless adhesive and make sure you get all of the keys back in the right places.

I wonder if Apple ever had a recall and replace programme for this issue during the iBook's production run? My instincts tell me no.

 

[Project Alice]

A Stinky Old iBook that Smells Like Sweat | Low End Mac

lowendmac.com

Here's the follow up article with potential solutions that include:



I wonder if Apple ever had a recall and replace programme for this issue during the iBook's production run? My instincts tell me no.

So it's just the keyboard? Aren't all white iBook G3 keyboards compatible? If so this could be fixed by putting an older keyboard from a 500Mhz or something in it. The LEM article states that all dual USB white iBooks have it, I was under the impression it was only the ones which have the Radeon chip. I've got two 500Mhz iBooks, one of which I've had for over 10 years and haven't ever had this problem. The second one I picked up a few months ago but it seems fine too.

 

[Appleuser201]

A Stinky Old iBook that Smells Like Sweat | Low End Mac

lowendmac.com

Here's the follow up article with potential solutions that include:



I wonder if Apple ever had a recall and replace programme for this issue during the iBook's production run? My instincts tell me no.

I doubt anyone at Apple cared about this problem, Apple support was probably like “get an iBook G4”.
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Cool idea!

A while back I used my 700 MHz iBook G3 in clamshell mode with an external monitor using Screen Spanning Doctor, but yeah, it still smelled. I wonder if removing the keyboard entirely and letting it air out for a while would let you just use clamshell mode without the smell?

The 700mhz 2002 models were affected too? I thought it was only the later 800, and 900mhz 2003 models.

 

[Slix]

The 700mhz 2002 models were affected too? I thought it was only the later 800, and 900mhz 2003 models.

Yup, my 14" 700 MHz is quite bad. My mom had a 12" 500 MHz too, and that one smelled bad as well. Apparently when she was using it way back in like 2009 my dad got a new keyboard for it or they used dryer sheets to try to fix the smell, but it still smells a little off...