MP 7,1 Mac Pro 7.1 owners! What would 8.1 need to be to get you to leave your 7.1 behind?!

[maikerukun]

What's up community!

As ya'll who know me know, I run a small indie production company and the heart of it is my 2019 Mac Pro 7.1 It's a 28-Core with 2 W6800X Duos and in GPU Rendering Tests it is equivalent to roughly about 33% under 3 RTX 3090's.

Recently it's been revealed that the RTX 4090's are roughly 30% faster than the RTX 3090's...meaning 1 W6800X Duo is about equivalent to 1 RTX 4090 "and first of all, holy hell that 4090 is a powerful card considering 1 w6800x duo is literally TWO w6800x's lol"...

But that said, that places my machine at right around a PC with 2 RTX 4090's in it, obviously future proofing it in it's current state for a good 5 years, and that's NOT TAKING INTO ACCOUNT the w7800x Duo's that are also right around the corner.

SO HERE'S THE QUESTION! WHAT ARE YOUR CURRENT SPECS AND WHAT DOES THE 2023 MAC PRO 8.1 NEED TO OFFER TO GET YOU GUYS TO SELL YOUR CURRENT SETUP AND REPLACE WITH THE 8.1???

For me as things are now, I've realized there is an exact combination of things that will get me to jump on board...

1. A CPU 3D rendering performance equivalent to a 64-Core Threadripper.

2. PCIe V5 Support.

3. MPX MODULE GPU Support

4. Internal Storage Expandability

5. Support for Expandability to 1.5TB of Ram

If that new machine is running an M2X as a beating heart, and ALSO has these 5 things...I'm all in.

 

[ZombiePhysicist]

Similar for me. It needs to have

1 internal ram expansion beyond the ram that is on SOC
2 internal storage expansion including space for 2-4 2.5” or 2 3.5” drives like the current 7,1
3 multiple pcie slots (ideally pci 5, but I’d sadly settle for pcie4)— must be at least 5 slots
4 system must support common pcie pc graphics cards and other pc pcie cards
5 AS SOC should support more than the 28 cores I currently have to make the upgrade worthwhile

 

[rkruk]

1. a more compact model like a 3U config,
2. continued use of the MPX Module

 

[avro707]

Like the current 7,1 but with newer processors. Also MPX module support (as now).

Also end the cold war with NVidia so we can use those cards.

 

[Mike Richardson]

A kilo of meth?

I'm still on a 5,1 so, you know?

I personally call the 7,1 the "Income Inequality Mac Pro".

:|

I remember when the 7,1 came out. I said, well, when I can get a used one for $2k, I'll spring for it.

Then ARM Macs screwed that all up. Can't spend anything on a Mac that's going to be artificially obsoleted so quickly by Mr. Cook.

 

[Boil]

Third-party GPUs doubtful, but ASi GPU compute cards might be a thing...?

 

[DrEGPU]

Third-party GPUs doubtful, but ASi GPU compute cards might be a thing...?

If so, it sure would be nice if they included a full stack GPGPU driver, libraries, drivers, etc, so these things could be used for something other than video processing. Otherwise, I'm with ZombiePhysicist that they would need to have PCIe slots to add compute cards.

 

[majus]

Something is causing folks to sell them. On eBay, as of 11:30AM July 29 there are 105+ of them up for auction, both desktop ($3K) and rackmount ($27K+), in varying configurations. Most are in the under $10K range..

 

[prefuse07]

Something is causing folks to sell them. On eBay, as of 11:30AM July 29 there are 105+ of them up for auction, both desktop ($3K) and rackmount ($27K+), in varying configurations. Most are in the under $10K range..

While they may start around the $3k mark, they definitely sell for much higher than that.

 

[rondocap]

What's up community!

As ya'll who know me know, I run a small indie production company and the heart of it is my 2019 Mac Pro 7.1 It's a 28-Core with 2 W6800X Duos and in GPU Rendering Tests it is equivalent to roughly about 33% under 3 RTX 3090's.

Recently it's been revealed that the RTX 4090's are roughly 30% faster than the RTX 3090's...meaning 1 W6800X Duo is about equivalent to 1 RTX 4090 "and first of all, holy hell that 4090 is a powerful card considering 1 w6800x duo is literally TWO w6800x's lol"...

But that said, that places my machine at right around a PC with 2 RTX 4090's in it, obviously future proofing it in it's current state for a good 5 years, and that's NOT TAKING INTO ACCOUNT the w7800x Duo's that are also right around the corner.

SO HERE'S THE QUESTION! WHAT ARE YOUR CURRENT SPECS AND WHAT DOES THE 2023 MAC PRO 8.1 NEED TO OFFER TO GET YOU GUYS TO SELL YOUR CURRENT SETUP AND REPLACE WITH THE 8.1???

For me as things are now, I've realized there is an exact combination of things that will get me to jump on board...

1. A CPU 3D rendering performance equivalent to a 64-Core Threadripper.

2. PCIe V5 Support.

3. MPX MODULE GPU Support

4. Internal Storage Expandability

5. Support for Expandability to 1.5TB of Ram

If that new machine is running an M2X as a beating heart, and ALSO has these 5 things...I'm all in.

Just curious what you are rendering and what programs you typically use between Mac and Windows for those workflows?

 

[avro707]

While they may start around the $3k mark, they definitely sell for much higher than that.

Quite true, when I was looking at pre-owned machines, there was one at an attractive AUD$3000, a base model. By the time the bidding finished it was AUD$4900. I didn't go for it.

Instead I went for a brand new one, I can't see any new machine that will make me part with it. Everything that is rumoured so far is not a "real" Mac Pro. The 7,1 is.

 

[ddhhddhh2]

If the new M1/M2 MacPro is to have 1.5TB of memory, or unified memory, at the current state of the art, it would require 12 M1 Ultra chips, after all, with the specifications we've seen so far, one Ultra chip can reach 128GB of unified memory, so multiply that by 12 and you get 1.5TB.
Well, with 12 Ultra (whether it's M1 or M2), then at a minimum, you get 48(64) x 12 GPU, that's 576(768) core GPU, and then 20 x 12 CPU, that's 240 cores, wow, how amazing is that?

 

[prefuse07]

If the new M1/M2 MacPro is to have 1.5TB of memory, or unified memory, at the current state of the art, it would require 12 M1 Ultra chips, after all, with the specifications we've seen so far, one Ultra chip can reach 128GB of unified memory, so multiply that by 12 and you get 1.5TB.
Well, with 12 Ultra (whether it's M1 or M2), then at a minimum, you get 48(64) x 12 GPU, that's 576(768) core GPU, and then 20 x 12 CPU, that's 240 cores, wow, how amazing is that?

Not sure if you've seen this yet...

 

[mcnallym]

Something is causing folks to sell them. On eBay, as of 11:30AM July 29 there are 105+ of them up for auction, both desktop ($3K) and rackmount ($27K+), in varying configurations. Most are in the under $10K range..

Launch date was June 2019 so is now probably 3 years since these boxes acquired.

Some places have a 3 year write off period and then replace, wether it makes sense or not. Business can do tax write offs/deductions etc.

My 5,1 since replaced since was such a 3 year machine.

 

[maikerukun]

Similar for me. It needs to have

1 internal ram expansion beyond the ram that is on SOC
2 internal storage expansion including space for 2-4 2.5” or 2 3.5” drives like the current 7,1
3 multiple pcie slots (ideally pci 5, but I’d sadly settle for pcie4)— must be at least 5 slots
4 system must support common pcie pc graphics cards and other pc pcie cards
5 AS SOC should support more than the 28 cores I currently have to make the upgrade worthwhile

It's wild that our needs to upgrade are eerily similar. I hope Apple is aware of this fact, because it's feeling like there's a very VERY slim path for current 7.1 owners to transition over to the 8.1

 

[maikerukun]

1. a more compact model like a 3U config,
2. continued use of the MPX Module

MPX Module continued use is HUGE for me.

 

[maikerukun]

Like the current 7,1 but with newer processors. Also MPX module support (as now).

Also end the cold war with NVidia so we can use those cards.

LMFAO!! Yep! End the Cold War because frankly, we could use diversity in our GPU needs and options.

 

[maikerukun]

A kilo of meth?

I'm still on a 5,1 so, you know?

I personally call the 7,1 the "Income Inequality Mac Pro".

:|

I remember when the 7,1 came out. I said, well, when I can get a used one for $2k, I'll spring for it.

Then ARM Macs screwed that all up. Can't spend anything on a Mac that's going to be artificially obsoleted so quickly by Mr. Cook.

LOL. Try as Apple might, there will be no putting the 7.1 out to pasture anytime soon. I give it AT MINIMUM another 5 years and realistically another 7 to 9. The ONLY way this doesn't happen is if the needs most of us have mentioned here are met...and I'll be honest, I'm hoping that they ARE

 

[maikerukun]

If so, it sure would be nice if they included a full stack GPGPU driver, libraries, drivers, etc, so these things could be used for something other than video processing. Otherwise, I'm with ZombiePhysicist that they would need to have PCIe slots to add compute cards.

EXACTLY...the problem with going the card route is it basically nullifies any possibility of giving us what we ACTUALLY NEED out of our GPU's.

 

[maikerukun]

Something is causing folks to sell them. On eBay, as of 11:30AM July 29 there are 105+ of them up for auction, both desktop ($3K) and rackmount ($27K+), in varying configurations. Most are in the under $10K range..

Lol 105 of anything isn’t really a lot. And I would say realizing it was overkill for about 90% of people would cause it. Unless you’re doing serious heavy GPU intensive work, it’s a super overkill machine. That said, if expandability and $15k isn’t a big deal for you, it’s also super reliable and will last literally for another decade or so.

 

[maikerukun]

Just curious what you are rendering and what programs you typically use between Mac and Windows for those workflows?

Workflow for me goes for pre, Final Draft to Previs Pro, (then for production a bunch of proprietary softwares I've made for filming process) then in post, to AVID/FCPX/PREMIERE depending on the client, then branch off, for sound to Logic Pro/Pro Tools depending on client, for color, Davinci Resolve/FCPX dependent on client, for VFX, ZBrush for character modeling, Marvelous Designer for clothes design and clothing sims, Substance for Texturing (although as soon as Quixel can match them in ease of use, switching for sure), Cinema 4D for CG modeling, rigging, animation, and lighting (some of my artists use Maya, I personally stay inside of C4D, they both translate well with each other), Octane Render tends to be our final export for 100% CG sequences before sending to AE for compositing and adjustments, as of about 5 months ago, UnREAL 5 has become a part of the workflow as well...shockingly it flies in realtime on the Mac Pros...not so much on the old 2020 5k iMacs, so depending on the shot and who's working on it, that's a part of the process, Realflow for liquid Sims, X-Particles for sims, Houdini for explosion sims and liquid sims, Mocha Pro for planar tracking, 3D Equalizer/PF Track for 3D tracking, After Effects for compositing (currently transitioning our workflow to Nuke though...After Effects just crashes too damn much and tired of adobe refusing to make use of the Mac Pro’s ridiculously powerful GPUS), Logic Pro X for ADR, Voice Over, Sound Design, Foley, and Music Composition, and Resolve/FCPX for final timeline export and final deliverables.

 

[mattspace]

Lol 105 of anything isn’t really a lot. And I would say realizing it was overkill for about 90% of people would cause it. Unless you’re doing serious heavy GPU intensive work, it’s a super overkill machine. That said, if expandability and $15k isn’t a big deal for you, it’s also super reliable and will last literally for another decade or so.

People assuming the Mac Pros on the market are people upgrading to Mac Studios, and not businesses who've failed as post-industrial society collapses, having their expensive capital equipment liquidated by receivers / administrators.

 

[maikerukun]

People assuming the Mac Pros on the market are people upgrading to Mac Studios, and not businesses who've failed as post-industrial society collapses, having their expensive capital equipment liquidated by receivers / administrators.

People assuming the Mac Pros on the market are businesses who’ve failed as post-industrial society collapses, having their expensive capital equipment liquidated by receivers/administrators, and not people upgrading to Mac Studios.

 

[mattspace]

People assuming the Mac Pros on the market are businesses who’ve failed as post-industrial society collapses, having their expensive capital equipment liquidated by receivers/administrators, and not people upgrading to Mac Studios.

I think you're missing the point I was making - that seeing 105 expensive capital machines for sale on eBay, during a massive global recession, probably says less about people getting rid of Intel machines to replace them with Apple Silicon, than it does about the general economy right now.

 

[exoticSpice]

Why would most 7,1 users upgrade to a Mac Studio, in terms of upgradeability it's worse than the 6,1.

Mac Pro's always been where you can remove the shell/case and upgrade something in the case of the 6,1 and almost anything in the case of the 7,1, 5,1.

Don't let the Apple's marketing fool you. Apple enginners know that the Mac Studio is not enough/powerful enough to replace the 7,1 GPU wise. The Mac Studio is too weak in that regard.