Maps not recognizing road closures

[kybldmstr]

I just updated to iOS 11 today on my primary device. There is currently major construction going on at the exit I would typically take to work and as a result I need to take alternative routes. Yesterday my phone (iOS 10) gave me three routes, all avoiding the road closures. Today my iPhone is only giving me one route option: which is not possible because it wants me to drive through the road closure.

Whats going on?

 

[MozMan68]

The only thing you can do is mark it on the map and send to Apple. Closed roads are so uncommon near me and since I stopped commuting a few weeks ago, I haven't been able to see that issue.

 

[one more]

Apple Maps in iOS 11 beta still remains a pretty interface on top of just about useable underlying data (road layouts, POIs, etc.). Do yourself a favour and try Waze to see what I mean. You may not like its looks, but the road data itself & POIs are solid.

 

[MozMan68]

Apple Maps in iOS 11 beta still remains a pretty interface on top of just about useable underlying data (road layouts, POIs, etc.). Do yourself a favour and try Waze to see what I mean. You may not like its looks, but the road data itself & POIs are solid.

I think it depends on where you are. Outside of POI parsing in some cases, Apple Maps has been incredible.

And for POI’s, just some of the parsing for me...the actual search has been really good.

 

[one more]

I think it depends on where you are.

Possibly, but the whole point of a mapping solution is to work wherever you are. My problem with Apple Maps comes from the fact that it fails in accuracy in exactly the same areas where Waze & Google manage just fine. All of them are global companies, so why would Google-Waze manage & Apple not?

Have you seen any DHL, UPS or Uber drivers using Apple Maps? Wonder why?

 

[ZEEN0j]

Possibly, but the whole point of a mapping solution is to work wherever you are. My problem with Apple Maps comes from the fact that it fails in accuracy in exactly the same areas where Waze & Google manage just fine. All of them are global companies, so why would Google-Waze manage & Apple not?

Have you seen any DHL, UPS or Uber drivers using Apple Maps?

Google has been doing maps a lot longer than Apple. I know google is better, but I still use Apple. My two major reasons are Siri and lock screen support. So my battery lasts longer and I don't have to fiddle with my phone when in the car. Of course if Apple maps failed at navigating in my city I wouldn't use it. But it works just as well as google.

 

[MozMan68]

I guess I should have clarified...users in places like Pakistan were showing all these awful comparisons between Google and Apple.

It certainly isn’t the mapping software of choice in EVERY country, but neither is Google.

I travel every week all over the US and Canada and use Apple Maps. I will use Waze as well when in Toronto, but Maps seems to match it for the most part.

 

[one more]

Google has been doing maps a lot longer than Apple. I know google is better, but I still use Apple. My two major reasons are Siri and lock screen support. So my battery lasts longer and I don't have to fiddle with my phone when in the car. Of course if Apple maps failed at navigating in my city I wouldn't use it. But it works just as well as google.

Siri will fail you too if you do not have a good cellular connection. Battery in a car is not an issue - just plug the phone into a USB or cigarette lighter’s port and drive on.
[doublepost=1504286033][/doublepost]

I guess I should have clarified...users in places like Pakistan were showing all these awful comparisons between Google and Apple.

It certainly isn’t the mapping software of choice in EVERY country, but neither is Google.

I drive through France & Switzerland, not Pakistan, but good try.

Now, can you name a single country where Waze falls behind Apple Maps?

 

[ZEEN0j]

Siri will fail you too if you do not have a good cellular connection. Battery in a car is not an issue - just plug the phone into a USB or cigarette lighter’s port and drive on.
[doublepost=1504286033][/doublepost]

I drive through France & Switzerland, not Pakistan, but good try.

Now, can you name a single country where Waze falls behind Apple Maps?

I don't have my charger plugged in all the time. Only bring it out for long drives or if I need to charge. So being able to say to my watch to navigate and having it start on my phone is the kind of convenience I like. Never been in a position except tunnels where I don't have internet when driving.

Also, since Apple maps works there is no need for me to seek an alternative. So for the occasional drive where I need navigation Apple maps suites my needs perfectly.

 

[MozMan68]

Siri will fail you too if you do not have a good cellular connection. Battery in a car is not an issue - just plug the phone into a USB or cigarette lighter’s port and drive on.
[doublepost=1504286033][/doublepost]

I drive through France & Switzerland, not Pakistan, but good try.

Now, can you name a single country where Waze falls behind Apple Maps?

I was using the Pakistan example as how ridiculous people were being when comparing them when Maps first came out.

Switzerland and France? Yes, I would expect Apple to work well there.

And as far as Waze is concerned, I guess some people would still prefer Apple due to Waze’s routing algorithms. I know I prefer it and only utilized Waze when commuting for the police notification function or when visiting very high traffic areas. But even then (traffic use) I find that Apple has been giving very similar re-routing when compared side by side.

Living in the US has its benefits.

What about HERE Maps??

 

[one more]

What about HERE Maps??

I have just checked and HERE WeGo has the correct road layout for the area AM gets wrong for me, yet its interface looks very outdated compared to AM & Waze, plus it seems to be quite heavy on the phone, warming it up in a matter of minutes. I might try taking it for a real spin tomorrow, but can’t see any advantage of using it over Waze, as the latter has a much larger traffic data pool.

 

[MozMan68]

I have just checked and HERE WeGo has the correct road layout for the area AM gets wrong for me, yet its interface looks very outdated compared to AM & Waze, plus it seems to be quite heavy on the phone, warming it up in a matter of minutes. I might try taking it for a real spin tomorrow, but can’t see any advantage of using it over Waze, as the latter has a much larger traffic data pool.

Was just wondering since it HERE was developed in and was supposed to be good for Europe...and owned by the car companies for future development of self driving capabilities and auto navigation.

 

[kybldmstr]

Apple Maps in iOS 11 beta still remains a pretty interface on top of just about useable underlying data (road layouts, POIs, etc.). Do yourself a favour and try Waze to see what I mean. You may not like its looks, but the road data itself & POIs are solid.

It just seems weird that two different iOS versions will give different results in the same app.

 

[one more]

It just seems weird that two different iOS versions will give different results in the same app.

Sure, but a similar thing happened when they switched Maps between iOS 9 & iOS 10. I was using Maps all the time in iOS 9, but when they changed their advanced guidance system (keep left, keep right, etc.) it made it more difficult for me to drive along. This is when I switched to Waze, reluctantly, as I really liked the Maps. So I keep on checking it every now and again to see how it compares to Waze, only to find out that it is a very visually pleasing, yet still inaccurate navigation tool. I was really looking forward to seeing the advertised speed limits & lane guidance in iOS 11, but they have not been enabled here yet, so I cannot even test their accuracy. Will check it again when iOS 11 is officially out for everybody.

 

[MozMan68]

Sure, but a similar thing happened when they switched Maps between iOS 9 & iOS 10. I was using Maps all the time in iOS 9, but when they changed their advanced guidance system (keep left, keep right, etc.) it made it more difficult for me to drive along. This is when I switched to Waze, reluctantly, as I really liked the Maps. So I keep on checking it every now and again to see how it compares to Waze, only to find out that it is a very visually pleasing, yet still inaccurate navigation tool. I was really looking forward to seeing the advertised speed limits & lane guidance in iOS 11, but they have not been enabled here yet, so I cannot even test their accuracy. Will check it again when iOS 11 is officially out for everybody.

I could take or leave the speed limit sign...I go as fast as want anyway.

The lane guidance is really good.

And like I said before, where I travel, it works incredibly well.

 

[campyguy]

Whats going on?

Longtime civil construction engineer here, on the design/management side. Traffic reporting is a bit more involved that most think. TomTom supplies traffic data to Apple in most instances - in NA TomTom gets traffic reports from agencies that report to a source that TomTom relies on, in most instances DOTs, counties, and cities - the DOTs, counties, and cities get their data and reports from their own inspectors and traffic engineering departments. Reports are aggregated by the traffic layer "entity", and eventually dialed into an app/interface that its user consume.

One of the issues I regularly encounter - a contractor or agency doesn't report the full scope of work being performed, or that traffic change is reported to one traffic company (Tele Atlas, of TomTom, but not another HERE/NAVTEQ); most of the DOTs I work with now have integrated Waze at some level. I always check DOT sources plus TomTom's Route Planner and DOT web cams before hitting the road - no one source is bound to be fully accurate. For traffic data and some navigation I tend to prefer the INRIX Traffic app - traffic is what they do, and their traffic data is refreshed every 60 seconds as opposed to the 5-minute refresh time most apps have (TomTom, Apple Maps, Waze/GMaps). Another traffic-only (no nav) app is hosted by Sigalert (I also use an epichome app for Sigalart's web portal). If an incident/change is not reported to each entity you won't see it reflected in every app - a lot of local projects fall through the cracks that way.

Further complicating this matter with routing, the routing in these apps and in dash units is performed by companies that physically drive roadways - I'm not alluding to the Apple/Bing/Google cars - and if these companies aren't notified of changes and incidents, routing modifications just don't happen…

Be part of the solution and make changes here: https://mapcreator.here.com or https://mydrive.tomtom.com/
[doublepost=1504302569][/doublepost]

Was just wondering since it HERE was developed in and was supposed to be good for Europe...

NAVTEQ originated in and is still based in Chicago, roughly 30 years ago now. Tele Atlas originated in Europe, now part of TomTom, and my choice for navigating while in Europe.

 

[stulaw11]

I think people misunderstand how mapping works.

First, Google owns/built it's own maps (it used to source the data too many years ago). Apple pulls mapping data from other sources like Tomtom (main source) but others too and then adds its own layers over. It does have some mapping vehicles but nowhere near the scale of data Google has collected; Apple only started doing so in 2015.

Road closures are only as good as the reports by users; they come and go so often. Even with Google, a road being closed for a day or even a week is unlikely to be picked up by one of its vehicles. It is user reports; and generally more than 1

So if users arent bothering to report the chance to Apple (and it obviously takes some number of reports to be deemed reliable) then the change isnt made.

You cant blame Apple or Google (or their apps) for that though. Either there are a ton more Google Maps and Waze users, or their users are just more likely to report an error. While driving is very hard to think about reporting an error when you come across it right then.

 

[genomez]

I was out to lunch today running iOS11 (in CarPlay) and noticed that an interstate on ramp was blocked by Police AND it showed blocked on Apple Maps.

1.5 hours later the on ramp wasn’t blocked and it didn’t show blocked in Apple Maps any longer. I was very surprised at the accuracy of it. I should add that I haven’t used Apple CarPlay (and also Apple Maps) in a while, but the last couple days I’ve been using CarPlay and have been happy with it so far.

 

[EM2013]

Apple Maps in iOS 11 beta still remains a pretty interface on top of just about useable underlying data (road layouts, POIs, etc.). Do yourself a favour and try Waze to see what I mean. You may not like its looks, but the road data itself & POIs are solid.

I've had the same problem with road closures using Waze and google maps.

 

[RSmith2023]

I have honestly tried to use Apple Maps over google several times (to take advantage of integration with iOS since they won’t allow you to make another as default - smartly so) but it is sub par on routing to google and Waze.

Case in point, the most direct route to my son’s soccer practice on mondays takes me thru some 2-lane back roads to get there. Google maps recognizes these roads and the route just fine. Apple maps insists on trying to take me north to the closest town square to use major roads and then back down to where I need to go almost doubling the distance and time driven. It will even try to re-route me off of the back roads (which are clearly identified on the map and satellite views) to get to its chosen route. (Apple telling us what it thinks is best... who would’ve heard of that? )

Yes.. I have tried reporting the issue numerous times. (I first ran across this issue in iOS 10.) I’m not sure what criteria it uses for calculating routes but there are plenty of places where it simply believes there is only one “good” route and it will stick with it no matter what.

 

[one more]

Waze up, TomTom below.

NAVTEQ originated in and is still based in Chicago, roughly 30 years ago now. Tele Atlas originated in Europe, now part of TomTom, and my choice for navigating while in Europe.

I would be careful relying on TomTom in Europe then, as it is the one that shows the wrong road layout along with AM for the area in question, whereas Waze, Google, HERE and maps.me all show it correctly. And yes, I reported this to both Apple & TomTom well over six months ago.
[doublepost=1504333097][/doublepost]

From the top: Waze - Apple - Google - TomTom - HERE

PS: maps.me has it right too, I just can’t insert more than five images.

So if users arent bothering to report the change to Apple (and it obviously takes some number of reports to be deemed reliable) then the change isnt made.

You cant blame Apple or Google (or their apps) for that though. Either there are a ton more Google Maps and Waze users, or their users are just more likely to report an error. While driving is very hard to think about reporting an error when you come across it right then.

My point is that I reported it several times to both Apple & TomTom over six months ago and the road layout is still wrong. I remember a similar situation with a guy in Poland (also from Macrumors forums), who was saying he submitted a lot of corrections to Apple, but they were not implemented. Do you think this lack of attention from Apple’s part is going to encourage more people to report stuff? Unlikely. So I do blame Apple for the lack of care.
[doublepost=1504334038][/doublepost]To sum it all up, I think that Apple made some fundamental mistakes when they decided to rely on their AI data vs user feedback to reflect real road conditions. Remember the iOS 10 Maps presentation where they were talking about not needing user reports as AI would just see that there was no traffic there and Maps would redirect you accordingly? Sure the same algorithm should sense I am making almost a full circle on the same road twice a week over the last five years when I enter the roundabout instead of making a left turn? Not happening.

Add a not existing response to a user’s multiple feedback (my case) and we are stuck with the wrong road situation. Their main buddy TomTom, meantime, is seriously struggling in the presence of more accurate & free solutions (Waze, Google, HERE & maps.me).

 

[campyguy]

And yes, I reported this to both Apple & TomTom well over six months ago.

No worries, I only question my employees regarding mapping/surveying issues. FWIW, I pretty much always carry a Thomas Guide wherever I go. Also, I was alluding specifically to traffic-related issues and not roadway-layout issues in my OP.

Roadway data is a whole different procedure, and a real change can take up to two-to-three years to go from being built out to actually showing up in a map app/portal. A developer hires my firm, a development is planned and approved, the development "sits" until all structures are approved (sanitary, water, storm, concrete structures, roadway asphalt base lift), the governing agency ultimately approves the development, the final asphalt lift is installed, then the plans are submitted to the agency and the surveyor. Sometime later, those plans head to a GIS department, which digitizes those plans (more likely) or imports/massages a CAD base file or DXF file (less likely) - and the city/county engineer finally stamps the plans and the city/county planner "blesses" the street names and anything else in the long checklist to approve the next step - opening the development to the public.

Then, one day - maybe - just like you decide you want to buy a set of knives or a car, a company like Google or HERE or Tele Atlas or Bing picks up the phone and asks "do you have any mapping updates for your jurisdiction?" There is nothing "automatic" by Google or HERE or Tele Atlas or Bing for incorporation of new/updated data. Honestly, I am only now seeing updates in aerials and roadways from the 2010/2011 data dumps. And, yes, I get the frustration - one of my projects straddled a roadway that was breached by the Corps of Engineers almost 5 years ago and against the wishes of the county and the Corps didn't report it (they pretty much never give a sh** about anyone besides themselves in the field. I reported the breach while in the field and only GMaps reflects the routing change - I even sent Apple photos of proof, and they don't give a crap either. My Thomas Guide shows the closure…

Apple "leases" it roadway mapping data from so many entities that I'm aware of it's hard to pin down what entity is actually responsible. I pretty much don't waste my time with submitting roadway changes - keep in mind that you're not a licensed surveyor and surveyors always get top billing in this food chain, and they're generally the approving source of roadway layouts in my industry. There's no means I'm aware of to streamline this procedure. Surveyors are cautious beasts. Cheers.

 

[Donfor39]

I’m surprised to mention weekend local roadworks/closures are showing via Apple maps.

I’ve been preferring google maps past few years in Scotland.

On scan of todays Apple maps this is a major improvement!

Only if I can get Siri to work in car -awaiting iOS 11 final release next few. Weeks.

Attempted to upload a screenshot showing roadworks.

What’s the security message not allowing upload to macrumours!

 

[one more]

Apple "leases" it roadway mapping data from so many entities that I'm aware of it's hard to pin down what entity is actually responsible. I pretty much don't waste my time with submitting roadway changes - keep in mind that you're not a licensed surveyor and surveyors always get top billing in this food chain, and they're generally the approving source of roadway layouts in my industry. There's no means I'm aware of to streamline this procedure. Surveyors are cautious beasts. Cheers.

I appreciate the complexity of the procedure you describe, but the fact is that Waze, Google, HERE & maps.me somehow can get it right, with Waze displaying it correctly within several weeks, whereas Apple Maps and TomTom lag behind for over six months.

 

[stulaw11]

I pretty much don't waste my time with submitting roadway changes

But that's the issue, without reports no one at the data sources know there is an issue. I suspect for authenticity reasons it takes some number of users to trigger a raised eyebrow. If people don't report it, it will be whenever some official source (whoever they use) verifies and marks the change.

I appreciate the complexity of the procedure you describe, but the fact is that Waze, Google, HERE & maps.me somehow can get it right, with Waze displaying it correctly within several weeks, whereas Apple Maps and TomTom lag behind for over six months.

Again, see the above. It all depends on how many users in that area are using that app, and how many take the time to report the error as it takes some baseline of reports for anyone to look into it. Google owns Waze now so those are doubled up in terms of user reports and likely makes changes a lot faster than any other map app alone just based on volume of users and data coming in.

Most people are just going to drive by and not tap on their phone while driving, just the nature of it.