Migrating from Apple ecosystem to... Discussion

[dwnldr]

Dear Friends !

Maybe this thread sounds crazy on "macforum", but i would like to discuss a bit about this idea... and maybe im not the only one.

Im Apple products user cca 10years. The costs/prices of this machines comparing to "incomes-loans" in my country are really high = they are expensive for "us". It costs me mentioned time to build a whole ecosystem with Macmini's, AppleTV's, TimeCapsule, iPhone's, Watch, iMac, MacBook etc... I have at the moment 10+ "i" devices in our home. But what i miss, is satisfaction with them. When i fell in love with this devices, i had the smallest, sexyest desktop computer, G4 MacMini with the most powerfull OS X. Then i bought my first iPhone 3G, the best ever phone which i had in my hands. I never regret any c€nt, that i spend for gadgets that time.

This year, i upgraded my iMac 27" Late2013 to new model, without any noticeable step forward. With newest (fastest - best...) OS and APFS filesystem wakes my Quad-Core computer on in cca 10second. DISASTER ! The change from iPhone 8Plus to XR was literally a huge mistake ! Swapping my old G4 Mini with Leopard (which was iTunes HomeSharing Server for AppleTV's and devices) to i5 Mini with Mojave was the next step beside regarding to "bug or something", where AppleTV cannot "mark as watched" the watched TV Shows. The need to rip multimedia to "Apple formats" -> importing them to iTunes on 24/7 running HomeSharing Mini for playing something on TV isn't also a lottery win in 2018 and my 2years old Apple Watch is not capable to run the newest watchOS with upgraded features... Just a very very short and small list.

Yes, the cooperation between "i" devices is fantastic. The AirPlay options, the Call-Message features between platforms, iCloud, AppleMusic etc... Everything works together without configuration, immediately. But the stability and the satisfaction is not present.

I tell you the truth, i'm also scared about change. The only option is Android and Windows combo (with SykDrive conto) and the whole "everything" from different manufacturers. MaybeSamsung, Dell/lenovo, Linksys/Netgear, nVidia Shield or other multimedia machine with Kodi/Plex/LibreELEC. But it sounds scary...

Have you maybe sometimes think about this, or made a change ?

Greetings !

 

[mrex]

I have a system that has ios, android, windows, linux, macos - used daily - so i see no problem here. Using cross platform services is the key and, btw, they work much better than any apple-only thing.

 

[YaBe]

Went form Apple only to a Xiaomi Notebook pro and Xiaomi Mi Mix2, after some initial adjustment (had the same when swiched from win to mac in 2000) I now feel pretty much at home, spend less and achieve the same.

They are not that different anymore, takes some time getting used to the "differences" but really, if you have a google account itmakes transitioning everything quite easy.

Plus Windows 10 is not as bad as some make it look like, it runs quite nicely even on older machines, and Android.... well running Xiaomi MIUI is almost identical to iOS (good thing or a bad thing I let you decide).

Once you stop caring who copied who and start using the sw to your needs it all works good .

P.S.
Apple music works great on Android / Win also

 

[Absrnd]

what i miss, is satisfaction

You are just in the " the grass is greener over there " phase
and is something a lot of users here complain about, thet see all this seemingly great hardware from other manufacturers, and think, I want that, but it is not as great as it seems, and switching could have a lot of consequences, if you have to mingle Mac and other hardware.
and really read up on the other forums of this "nice" devices, most have the same or more problems, to have it do what they want

just try to find why some devices are not working the way you want, like the 10sec boot-up of your iMac, that is not normal, and could be a problem of running certain software or network problems.

And why is the XR a * disaster ?

Itunes, has always been a bit of a beast to work with, but running PLEX could solve a lot of problems, and make it more easy to add media, I did that.

 

[dwnldr]

Thank you very much everyone !

Absrnd - in first case, you are absolutely right ! I wrote that also, i'm afraid of changing. Maybe i'm lazy to start everything from beginning or its just the habit, but yet is the first time in past 15years, that i'm hesistating to change. So there is a reason. I'm daily active user of computers (25years), a "part of me" is IT worker so i don't cathegorize myself as amateur, i like everything about electronics - gadget - smart things etc... and i try to retain the steps with industry. BUT... When i buy my first mentioned Apple products, that was an era of Windows XP, Symbian Nokia's, cheap AMD's and the opposite side = OS X, iOS... As i say, i never regret any spend cent and i had the best systems on the planet. And this feeling lasts till "today". Because now MY devices has also problems do what they should do, they aren't anymore "unattented" machines. I never need trying to find why something doesn't work on Apple products. The 10sec wake up is problem of mojave and APFS on FusionDrive (everytime major update comes from any xOS, i make clean install), iTunes is bigger "beast" everyday, the phones are not worth to change but the politics of Apple forces you to do that.A lot of things together. The rivals are also not sleeping, Windows 10 or today's Android (in phones, smart TV's, multimedia centers...) are really nice and good working systems. I thought i never say that (trust me, i was the biggest hater of them!) but today it's reality...

 

[sracer]

I have a system that has ios, android, windows, linux, macos - used daily - so i see no problem here. Using cross platform services is the key and, btw, they work much better than any apple-only thing.

Same here. @mrex is spot on that cross-platform software and services are the important factor. And it is also important to not just ditch current hardware en masse and buy all new. Use the time with your current hardware to explore new software and service options and as the time comes to replace a particular component, examine the hardware landscape and see which device will serve your new needs better.

Having been in Appleland for a little over 10 years, I've been making a gradual departure as Apple increasingly produces products and services that do not meet my needs. When it was time to replace my Macbook Air and 12.9 iPad Pro, it was replaced with a Pixelbook. My iPhone SE was replaced with an LG Stylo (for now). My 2018 iPad+Pencil is an indispensable digital notebook/sketchbook/project workbook. My 21" iMac continues to do the heavy-lifting of desktop work. Roku/Chromecast/FireTV combo have replaced my Apple TV and cable TV service.

The OP might want to check out this "What is your Mixed Ecosystem Setup" thread.

 

[YaBe]

Same here. @mrex is spot on that cross-platform software and services are the important factor. And it is also important to not just ditch current hardware en masse and buy all new. Use the time with your current hardware to explore new software and service options and as the time comes to replace a particular component, examine the hardware landscape and see which device will serve your new needs better.

That is what I did, the iPhone needed a replacement and went Xiaomi, liked the price / quality ratio and when the time came for the MBA to be replaces I knew what I was looking at.

It is not that Apple makes bad stuff, but they priced themselves out of my pocket AND i do not think that lately they deserve the pricing they have, let alone the new pricing scheme.

They still make great HW, just not worth to me the asking price when competitors have now catched up, you still need to readjust, but it is not as big of a difference as it was in the past.

 

[Absrnd]

Thank you very much everyone !

Absrnd - in first case, you are absolutely right ! I wrote that also, i'm afraid of changing. Maybe i'm lazy to start everything from beginning or its just the habit, but yet is the first time in past 15years, that i'm hesistating to change. So there is a reason. I'm daily active user of computers (25years), a "part of me" is IT worker so i don't cathegorize myself as amateur, i like everything about electronics - gadget - smart things etc... and i try to retain the steps with industry. BUT... When i buy my first mentioned Apple products, that was an era of Windows XP, Symbian Nokia's, cheap AMD's and the opposite side = OS X, iOS... As i say, i never regret any spend cent and i had the best systems on the planet. And this feeling lasts till "today". Because now MY devices has also problems do what they should do, they aren't anymore "unattented" machines. I never need trying to find why something doesn't work on Apple products. The 10sec wake up is problem of mojave and APFS on FusionDrive (everytime major update comes from any xOS, i make clean install), iTunes is bigger "beast" everyday, the phones are not worth to change but the politics of Apple forces you to do that.A lot of things together. The rivals are also not sleeping, Windows 10 or today's Android (in phones, smart TV's, multimedia centers...) are really nice and good working systems. I thought i never say that (trust me, i was the biggest hater of them!) but today it's reality...

Yes there are a lot of other systems that have great looking hardware, and they have really caught up with Apple, and usability integration,
but remember it is not all about nice looking and working hard and software.
If I look at the longevity of the my Apple hardware, I am very satisfied, I did 5 years with my ol iMac, and only recently upgraded, and all the iPad and iPhones can work up to several years, this is something other manufacturers can still learn a bit.

I see no real difference between Apple and other manufacturers, and yes Apple can have some limitations built in, but that is most of the time to make it work, the way it does.
and the problems with all the other hard and software is just as bad/good as Apple, the problems are only different.

Like I said, if you spend any time on other forums about other devices, and software, they all have the same, and sometimes even more problems.
I was really liking the new MS surface Studio, and thought that something like that would tempt me to step over, but after reading about the underwhelming un-upgradable hardware (just like iMac) and the major privacy concerns with Win10, I decided not to.

I would not consider stepping over to other hardware, just because of security/privacy concerns, and how everything works together, that even my old mother can work with it.

But if you want to taste the "other side" , install Win10 in bootcamp, and start with that

 

[YaBe]

I would not consider stepping over to other hardware, just because of security/privacy concerns, and how everything works together, that even my old mother can work with it.

Considering Facebook claims it sold data to Apple (Netflix and others..), I really fail to see the security/privacy Apple offers compared to others.... it is all marketing .

As in ...if they cared they would have never gotten them in the first place.

 

[sracer]

I would not consider stepping over to other hardware, just because of security/privacy concerns, and how everything works together, that even my old mother can work with it.

On the topic of security and privacy as a reason for sticking with Apple....

It depends upon what you mean by "security and privacy". There are different levels of S&P and different things that are considered part of S&P. There's a lot of misinformation regarding the topic, some originating from Apple, which isn't surprising because it is a marketing point for them in selling the image that iOS devices are more secure.

The fact that one is using a smartphone throws S&P (security and privacy) out the window. Your cell service provider is tracking your every movement.

The web browser you use is only one element in the S&P chain. Even IF Safari isn't tracking you, the websites that you visit with that browser most certainly are.

People think that if they don't sign up for Facebook and have never signed up for Facebook that Facebook doesn't have any data on them. They are mistaken. Facebook's heuristic algorithms assemble profiles on everyone and anyone they can. Even if you have never been on Facebook, if people you know are on Facebook, then they piece together information about you from them... and they'll take what little info they can synthesize internal to Facebook and cross-reference that with external databases. People would be surprised to learn just how much personal information Facebook as on them even if they have never signed up or in to Facebook.

As for staying with iOS for the purposes of S&P... everyone must make their own decisions. I've done my research and analysis, and using basic common sense with regard to safe practices, I've concluded that there is no benefit to me in using iOS over Android (from and S&P perspective). Others may draw a different conclusion for themselves.

I've owned Android phones since the very first (HTC Dream) and a few iPhones along the way. I have seen no difference in security between the two platforms. I've done a very large volume of financial transactions online over the years, not only personal, but business-related as well. I've never had a problem with ID theft, fraud or anything on my end.

However, during that time I've been notified by some online stores, like Target, that THEIR databases were breached. And a few credit card fraudulent charges because someone at some sketchy gas station on our trip from AZ to CA snagged our card number... but never online fraud.

Something to consider... Apple and their fans would have you believe that Android is the wide highway for miscreants to steal all of your data and your money. If that was anywhere near being true, you'd hear stories on the national news every night about these breaches.

 

[SDColorado]

I would not consider stepping over to other hardware, just because of security/privacy concerns, and how everything works together, that even my old mother can work with it.

Another S&P concern is with sealed products. Whenever you send them in for service you are surrendering custody of the data stored on them. I understand that most cell phones and tablets are this way, but Apple also does with this all their laptops. Send it in for a keyboard issue, you are surrendering custody of your data. The design doesn't allow for something similar to Lenovo's Keep Your Drive (KYD) program where you retain custody of the drive and data.

 

[Absrnd]

Considering Facebook claims it sold data to Apple (Netflix and others..), I really fail to see the security/privacy Apple offers compared to others.... it is all marketing .

As in ...if they cared they would have never gotten them in the first place.

On the topic of security and privacy as a reason for sticking with Apple....

It depends upon what you mean by "security and privacy". There are different levels of S&P and different things that are considered part of S&P. There's a lot of misinformation regarding the topic, some originating from Apple, which isn't surprising because it is a marketing point for them in selling the image that iOS devices are more secure.

The fact that one is using a smartphone throws S&P (security and privacy) out the window. Your cell service provider is tracking your every movement.

The web browser you use is only one element in the S&P chain. Even IF Safari isn't tracking you, the websites that you visit with that browser most certainly are.

People think that if they don't sign up for Facebook and have never signed up for Facebook that Facebook doesn't have any data on them. They are mistaken. Facebook's heuristic algorithms assemble profiles on everyone and anyone they can. Even if you have never been on Facebook, if people you know are on Facebook, then they piece together information about you from them... and they'll take what little info they can synthesize internal to Facebook and cross-reference that with external databases. People would be surprised to learn just how much personal information Facebook as on them even if they have never signed up or in to Facebook.

As for staying with iOS for the purposes of S&P... everyone must make their own decisions. I've done my research and analysis, and using basic common sense with regard to safe practices, I've concluded that there is no benefit to me in using iOS over Android (from and S&P perspective). Others may draw a different conclusion for themselves.

I've owned Android phones since the very first (HTC Dream) and a few iPhones along the way. I have seen no difference in security between the two platforms. I've done a very large volume of financial transactions online over the years, not only personal, but business-related as well. I've never had a problem with ID theft, fraud or anything on my end.

However, during that time I've been notified by some online stores, like Target, that THEIR databases were breached. And a few credit card fraudulent charges because someone at some sketchy gas station on our trip from AZ to CA snagged our card number... but never online fraud.

Something to consider... Apple and their fans would have you believe that Android is the wide highway for miscreants to steal all of your data and your money. If that was anywhere near being true, you'd hear stories on the national news every night about these breaches.

Another S&P concern is with sealed products. Whenever you send them in for service you are surrendering custody of the data stored on them. I understand that most cell phones and tablets are this way, but Apple also does with this all their laptops. Send it in for a keyboard issue, you are surrendering custody of your data. The design doesn't allow for something similar to Lenovo's Keep Your Drive (KYD) program where you retain custody of the drive and data.

I guess the words, Safety and security, really is like cheese for the mouse

Everybody knows Android and MS sell you personal date, and if you use any social meda apps, you give them even more to sell,
and like Apple said, you are not the product (and don't give that "they say that b ut do they really" argument, you can say that with everything)

But this is not a thread about selling personal information

 

[dwnldr]

The (call it...) security is really a huge PRO for Apple products. I know, that lot of limitations are the price for "closed" platform. I have accepted this limitations years ago, because everything was worked as should and almost every limitation has it's "factory add-on" or 3rd party solution. And the limitations outside US are even lot bigger. But the main problem is not with these (however itunes, the media formats, filesystem incompatibility are really disaster), but with fact, that i NEED to find out "why is something not working as should". This was an unknown for me, as an long time Apple user who payed nice money in middle Europe for their products. The "long lasting" word is also only half truth (or just in my case), because every new OS since 10.10 brings for me a necessary, long time missed function. Really don´t know which way to go : if i should spend (a lot! of) time searching why isn´t the whole ecosystem running as should, or if is selling-buying something else the way... yeah, and throwing away the Xr

 

[dk001]

The (call it...) security is really a huge PRO for Apple products. I know, that lot of limitations are the price for "closed" platform. I have accepted this limitations years ago, because everything was worked as should and almost every limitation has it's "factory add-on" or 3rd party solution. And the limitations outside US are even lot bigger. But the main problem is not with these (however itunes, the media formats, filesystem incompatibility are really disaster), but with fact, that i NEED to find out "why is something not working as should". This was an unknown for me, as an long time Apple user who payed nice money in middle Europe for their products. The "long lasting" word is also only half truth (or just in my case), because every new OS since 10.10 brings for me a necessary, long time missed function. Really don´t know which way to go : if i should spend (a lot! of) time searching why isn´t the whole ecosystem running as should, or if is selling-buying something else the way... yeah, and throwing away the Xr

Ran into issues starting with my 7+ a year back and started to move to a mixed system.
It works. There is plenty out there that allows you to slowly move into what you want.

I went from 2 iPhones, 2 iPads, MB, Thinkpad to 1 iPhone, 1 Android (Razer), MB, Yoga, Thinkpad. One iPhone and Thinkpad are for work.
Where I am aiming to end up: Android phone, iPhone, Hybrid laptop x2. Android and hybrid - Personal, iPhone and hybrid - Work.

So far all is working well. Very well. It is all about using proper interfaces.

Plan your cloud accounts accordingly. Use your peripherals as long as you can.

MHO YOMV.

 

[SDColorado]

I guess the words, Safety and security, really is like cheese for the mouse

Everybody knows Apple, Android and MS sell you personal date, and if you use any social meda apps, you give them even more to sell,
and like Apple said, you are not the product (and don't give that "they say that b ut do they really" argument, you can say that with everything)

But this is not a thread about selling personal information

FIFY. But the selling of personal info aside, the KYD program is more secure, especially if you have HIPPA and other privacy concerns about data stored on your drives.

 

[AndyMacAndMic]

I guess the words, Safety and security, really is like cheese for the mouse

Everybody knows Android and MS sell you personal date, and if you use any social meda apps, you give them even more to sell,
and like Apple said, you are not the product (and don't give that "they say that b ut do they really" argument, you can say that with everything)

But this is not a thread about selling personal information

I know it's off topic, but I can't resist:

Everybody knows Android and MS sell you personal date

[OFF TOPIC]
Android does not sell any data because Android is software (a variant on Linux which is an operating system). Google develops Android and Google sells your personal data. If you use an iPhone, iPad or Mac and you use Google as your search engine your data is just as easily sold as if you use Android. Also Google paid Apple a ton of money to be used as the default search engine on Apple devices (do the math). Apple also uses/used Bing as search engine (Siri), which is from (drumroll…..) Microsoft!

Apart from search engines (but not entirely):
Every time you buy things online, every time you login to something, every time you look something up in your browser, every time you provide some data on a site , you give away personal data to third parties. It does not make any difference if that is from an Apple device or any other device.

Also if you give apps permission to use your camera, microphone or to track where you are etc. etc. You give away your privacy to third parties and it doesn't matter if you do that on your iPhone, an Android device or a Windows computer.

Therefore your point about having more security/privacy with Apple is not valid at all, but a nice sales pitch from Apple to make there customers feel secure and protected.

The very moment you connect to the internet and interact with it, your privacy is out of the window.
[/OFF TOPIC]

Sorry I could not resist ('like cheese for the mouse' as you said ).
On topic again.

 

[mrex]

Everybody knows Android and MS sell you personal date... But this is not a thread about selling personal information

neither a thread for wearing tinfoil hats

 

[zen]

To the OP, I say, do it!

I shifted from an iPhone and Mac Mini to a Samsung S9+ and a custom-built desktop PC. The PC cost about half of a comparable Mac (not that there was a direct comparison really), it was super fun to customise, and its performance blows me away. Windows 10 is absolutely fine - far snappier than macOS Mojave, actually.

The Samsung S9+ is the best phone I have owned, hands down.

Now I just need to get rid of my iPad and MBP.

For services, etc, I went from Apple Music to Spotify Premium, Photos to Google Photos (which is way better), and iCloud mail to Gmail. Transitioning from one set of cloud-based services to another was no problem at all.

Go for it! A world of actually really good computing awaits.

 

[dwnldr]

Thank you very much everybody !

So... i tryed to consider the next step regarding to this conversation :

First, as @Asrnd sad, the other systems has also (more or less as me now...) bugs, so there isn't guarantee that i can build a Plug&Play "IT" home, gadgets, etc... But as lot of you sad, the other side is grown up till "today", and with little research, it can be maybe better as my system yet + i will not be forced to update/upgrade everything for huge costs to use the new features in the future.

The result for yet (i hope you agree with my "Adult" decision) : Since i spend 15years (and a lot of money) to build my/home/family "computing" from Apple, i have everything now, i didn't make the change, YET ! Regarding to my market research in our country, this products hold they prices very well also as used = the time doesn't play against me. However i hasn't during years expected any troubles with Apple and i never need to solve any problems with them, the fastest option now will be finding the solutions , as sell - search - buy - configure everything new (...and learn). As i told, for NOW. If the problems/bugs do not succeed in a short time, i will not be afraid anymore of IMMEDIATE change.

Agree... ?

Thank you !

 

[krause734]

Apple hardware is inferior and more expensive (at least for a basic standalone desktop box). I still like the iPhone better however. MacOS is aesthetic but overrated and less functional than Windows or Linux.

 

[sracer]

Apple hardware is inferior and more expensive (at least for a basic standalone desktop box). I still like the iPhone better however. MacOS is aesthetic but overrated and less functional than Windows or Linux.

If one's only view of macOS is via the app store and GUI then I can see how someone could come to that (erroneous) conclusion.

 

[retta283]

I haven't purchased an Apple device that was current since 2013, and I don't think I ever will again. I still use some of their older products, but I don't consider myself in the Apple "ecosystem" I really don't consider myself as part of any tech "ecosystem"