MP 1,1-5,1 MP 4,1->5,1, No image on screen, fans spin up at start up

[gadgetfreak98]

Hi all. I put this computer aside when I got my new Mac Mini, but I'm trying once again to resurrect this, but feel completely lost.

This is a 2009>2010 EFI Mac Pro. When I start it up, there is no chime. The power light shines normally, but eventually the fans spin up to full speed and stay there. There is no image on the screen.

I have put back in the original GT120 card. I also have tried various combinations of RAM (no LED errors on the board).

I do not have a proper startup drive in there right now, since I had yanked everything out and repurposed it for the Mac Mini. But i can easily do so, but it seems like the problem is not about the software.

I had updated the CPUs last year and all was working well. Until it wasn't. These are delidded CPUs as I didn't want to deal with the height issue. It's a dual CPU unit.

Any recommendations? It doesn't seem like a PSU issue since the fans are running.

Thanks!

 

[gadgetfreak98]

By the way, I have done the first 8 steps of the build up troubleshooting from the service manual successfully. It's on 9, when I try to use one processor and one heat sink that things don't work. I have put back in my original 2.26 for this purpose. Have tried both of them, in fact. No success...

 

[tsialex]

Install your original Xeons to eliminate any CPU tray problems, start from a known working point.

Shutdown, power-on, press DIAG button on the backplane. If the EFI done led is off while pressing the DIAG button, you have a corrupted SPI flash.

 

[gadgetfreak98]

I did that when the sled was in with no processor. This was Step 7 of that build up. And it was illuminated. I had the following.

• PSU PWROK (green), 5V STBY (amber), EFI DONE (green), GPU OK (green)

Are you saying to look for this when the processor is in?

Interestingly, if the heatsink is too loose, the fans go full bore. If it is tightened down, they are at normal level.

 

[tsialex]

CPU tray needs to be working and installed at all times, you can't diagnose your Mac Pro without the tray working.

 

[gadgetfreak98]

Understood. The tray was in. But WITHOUT a processor installed. That's per the service manual process. With the tray in (but no processor or RAM), I got:

• PSU PWROK (green), 5V STBY (amber), EFI DONE (green), GPU OK (green)

 

[tsialex]

Understood. The tray was in. But WITHOUT a processor installed. That's per the service manual process. With the tray in (but no processor or RAM), I got:

• PSU PWROK (green), 5V STBY (amber), EFI DONE (green), GPU OK (green)

The SPI flash is read by the processors, not having one to read and check it for correct checksums makes your test moot.

 

[gadgetfreak98]

Ok, putting one back in and will see...
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EFI DONE did NOT come on with one CPU in. What is a corrupted SPI flash and how does one fix that?

 

[tsialex]

Ok, putting one back in and will see...
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EFI DONE did NOT come on with one CPU in. What is a corrupted SPI flash and how does one fix that?

SPI flash is a flash memory that stores the BootROM, when the contents become corrupted you have to do one of the below:

1 - Replace the backplane, fastest option for non hardware people, only needs a screwdriver.
2 - Desolder, reprogram the SPI flash with a flash programmer, solder back - not for people that can’t solder SMD.
3 - Buy a external SPI flash replacement like a Mac Pro MATT card and use it. This is not as simple as may sound. MATT card has several problems that I wrote extensively, use the search. iCloud/FaceTime/iMessage won’t work with the default code.

 

[gadgetfreak98]

Thanks. I saw your thread on this topic elsewhere in the forums. Seems like maybe I'm just hitting the end of the line here... I would love to salvage this for use in a second location, but all of these solutions are bordering on illogical. Getting hard to spend another $ on it! And clearly, for me, option 1 is the way to go. Soldering is not my forte. Thanks for the advice though!

 

[Macschrauber]

So maybe find a tech guy. Soldering the flash chip and program it externally is no big deal for someone who does this frequently.

Programming it with the generic firmware file extracted from the os installer could bring it at least back to life.

Needs further programming with specs. This can be done inside the working Mac after soldering it back.

 

[tsialex]

Thanks. I saw your thread on this topic elsewhere in the forums. Seems like maybe I'm just hitting the end of the line here... I would love to salvage this for use in a second location, but all of these solutions are bordering on illogical. Getting hard to spend another $ on it! And clearly, for me, option 1 is the way to go. Soldering is not my forte. Thanks for the advice though!

I bought a backplane on eBay for $49 recently. It’s cheaper than a MATT card and you can replace in less than two hours, but it’s better to use this opportunity to clean everything inside, so it’s more like an afternoon job. Just remember that you need a 2009 backplane even if you already flashed the MP5,1 firmware. 2009 CPU trays need 2009 backplanes, SMC version needs to be the same.

 

[Snow Tiger]

I like your diagnostic lights . Dual Processor 2009-12 cMP + A decade of Use = dried thermal paste on the Northbridge controller chip . It's the hottest chip in the System and when it goes offline the system won't boot . And there are no diagnostic indicators for it's failure as Apple probably thought people wouldn't be using these Macs this long . It's that small heatsink in between the processors . Rebuild the Northbridge Heatsink. It's an unusual repair and not an easy one , either . But if you can install a pair of processors , you can handle this , too . You have nothing to lose and the solution is cheap ! I'll walk you through it .

 

[gadgetfreak98]

Ok, so I finally got around to sourcing another backplane and just put it in. I specifically bought one for a Mac Pro 4,1 and like the original, it is stamped with Apple copyright 2009.

I have both processors in. With three memory sticks in I still get the same -- no chime and the fans roaring.

I do get the following lights:

PSU
5V
EFI DONE
GPU OK

There are no drives nor is there a video card in at this point. Just the two processors and the 3 RAM sticks. Got the fan blowing just the same with 6 sticks in.

Any thoughts? I had removed and replaced the Northridge heatsink several months back, putting new thermal paste on. Looking at it again now, it looks ok. I had replaced one of the spring loaded mount and the other was ok. They both look mounted correctly.

One other detail. I had updated to the OSX Wifi BT and 802.11ac card. It was working fine when the computer was starting up. I went ahead and put in on the new backplane. Unfortunately, due to a nearly stripped screw, I could not remove the old BT card. But I unplugged both it's connectors so I assume it is just sitting there idle, mounted to the board by a screw but nothing else. If you know the OSXWifi card, you know there is a BT daughter card mounted to the Wifi adapter. So the original seems to be a redundant vestige.

I had flashed my machine to 5,1. Anything I need to do now with the new backplane in?

I was so hoping this might bring it back to life!

 

[tsialex]

Ok, so I finally got around to sourcing another backplane and just put it in. I specifically bought one for a Mac Pro 4,1 and like the original, it is stamped with Apple copyright 2009.

I have both processors in. With three memory sticks in I still get the same -- no chime and the fans roaring.

I do get the following lights:

PSU
5V
EFI DONE
GPU OK

There are no drives nor is there a video card in at this point. Just the two processors and the 3 RAM sticks. Got the fan blowing just the same with 6 sticks in.

Any thoughts? I had removed and replaced the Northridge heatsink several months back, putting new thermal paste on. Looking at it again now, it looks ok. I had replaced one of the spring loaded mount and the other was ok. They both look mounted correctly.

One other detail. I had updated to the OSX Wifi BT and 802.11ac card. It was working fine when the computer was starting up. I went ahead and put in on the new backplane. Unfortunately, due to a nearly stripped screw, I could not remove the old BT card. But I unplugged both it's connectors so I assume it is just sitting there idle, mounted to the board by a screw but nothing else. If you know the OSXWifi card, you know there is a BT daughter card mounted to the Wifi adapter. So the original seems to be a redundant vestige.

I had flashed my machine to 5,1. Anything I need to do now with the new backplane in?

I was so hoping this might bring it back to life!

Even mid-2012 boards have 2009 copyright. The MLB label can be used to know for sure if it’s a 2009, 2010 or 2012 backplane, but don’t post it here or you can have your Mac Pro cloned/iCloud hacked later on.

If the backplane still have the MP4,1 original firmware, you need a Nehalem Xeon to boot, Westmere Xeons only work with MP5,1 firmware. A tray with Westmere processors won’t work with a 2009 backplane with MP4,1 firmware.

 

[gadgetfreak98]

Were the originals Westmeres? Or the originals were Nehalems? e.g., if I have the new 3.33 chips in, they will not start, correct? I need to go back to originals?

 

[tsialex]

Were the originals Westmeres? Or the originals were Nehalems? e.g., if I have the new 3.33 chips in, they will not start, correct? I need to go back to originals?

A Mac Pro 2009 backplane still with MP4,1 firmware will only support Nehalem Xeons.

All hexa core Xeons are Westmeres. If you have any W36xx, X56xx, or the less common L56xx Xeons, you need to install the original Nehalem Xeons to boot a backplane that have MP4,1 firmware.

Nehalem Xeons are E55xx, L55xx, W35xx and X55xx. Use this table:

Mac Pro CPU Compatibility List

Bokkow and I have created a Mac Pro CPU compatibility list. The intent is to cover all relevant and compatible CPU upgrades for all Mac Pros. These are asked about over and over and over again, so I thought it would be nice to have it all in one place. Constructive criticism, corrections to...

forums.macrumors.com

 

[gadgetfreak98]

Well, amazingly, with one of the original CPUs in, I heard the chime! Now the fans are still spinning like crazy. Would that be expected with just the single CPU in and the RAM and nothing else?

By the way, the EFI DONE and GPU lights are no longer on. I see the SYS PG on though.

 

[tsialex]

Well, amazingly, with one of the original CPUs in, I heard the chime! Now the fans are still spinning like crazy. Would that be expected with just the single CPU in and the RAM and nothing else?

Yes. Install both CPUs to have SMC working correctly.

 

[gadgetfreak98]

So I've done that. The fans are still going wild unfortunately. I have hooked up to a monitor but get the circle with a slash through it. I think that means whatever is mounted on that drive is not appropriate for this hardware. I found the original Mas OS X install DVD from when I bought the machine, but the DVD ROM doesn't sound right. So I will need to figure out how to get OS X installed again... is that just a matter of creating a thumb drive? I need to find the right software of course...

Inching closer

 

[tsialex]

So I've done that. The fans are still going wild unfortunately. I have hooked up to a monitor but get the circle with a slash through it. I think that means whatever is mounted on that drive is not appropriate for this hardware. I found the original Mas OS X install DVD from when I bought the machine, but the DVD ROM doesn't sound right. So I will need to figure out how to get OS X installed again... is that just a matter of creating a thumb drive? I need to find the right software of course...

Inching closer

MP4,1 supports from 10.5.6 to 10.11.6:

 

[tsialex]

Btw, don’t forget to go back the clock, certificates used to sign macOS releases prior to Catalina expired October 24.

Any macOS installer that used the previous certificates will error out with dates post October 24 2019.

Re-issued El Capitan installer that Apple now offers for download can’t be used for USB installs, only from macOS to an empty disk.

 

[gadgetfreak98]

Thanks. I'm still trying to figure out how to download a copy of El Capitan that I can put on a thumb drive. My Catalina Mac Mini refuses to let me create the installer in my applications file that I need to create the bootable drive. So I'm stuck...
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Sorry, missed the second part of your post. I'm trying to figure out how to get the installer on to my Mac Mini, as I noted. I understand the thumb drive isn't possible. So how do I get on an empty disk via my Mac Mini, such that I can then put it into the Mac Pro?

 

[tsialex]

Thanks. I'm still trying to figure out how to download a copy of El Capitan that I can put on a thumb drive. My Catalina Mac Mini refuses to let me create the installer in my applications file that I need to create the bootable drive. So I'm stuck...

Like I said above, read my previous post again, you can’t.

If you have bought older OSX releases (10.7 to 10.9) and have it on your Past Purchases List, use anything from there, with the clock backtracked to earlier than October 24.

With Yosemite you can't upgrade to MP5,1 firmware, incompatible SIP.
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Sorry, missed the second part of your post. I'm trying to figure out how to get the installer on to my Mac Mini, as I noted. I understand the thumb drive isn't possible. So how do I get on an empty disk via my Mac Mini, such that I can then put it into the Mac Pro?

If your have 10.7/8/9/11 on your Past Purchases List is just a matter of downloading and to make a createinstallmedia USB installer/or use DiskMakerX to do it.

If not, you are in trouble and will have to get the installers from other means.

 

[gadgetfreak98]

So after many, many hours and lots of very good advice, I'm nearly back to where I want to be.

First, thank you, thank you, thank you tsialex. Your expertise and patience is invaluable. I have successfully:

• Replaced the backplane, which was the primary faulty culprit
• I am up to 10.13.6 (thankfully still had my original system disk from 2009 and had I think the Snow Leopard upgrade). I needed to buy a cheap replacement DVD-ROM, since the original seemed faulty. That got me far enough to get to the app store. Then I could start to download past purchases.
• My 3.33 Westmere processors are back in (had some tightening issues, but that seems worked out now)
• I have my 802.11AC and BT 4.0 cards working again (although it's a little wonky with Apple Watch unlocking)
• My USB-C card is back in and functional
• I am on bootrom 144.0.0.0 as I intend to migrate back to a NVMe based startup disk using the kryoM.2 PCIe card I already have

I'm likely to upgrade from my GT120. I had a Radeon RX580 (which is how I was able to upgrade the bootrom), but that now belongs to the eGPU for my Mac Mini. Once I have a new card, I'll go back to Mojave probably.

But this computer is now once again fully functioning. I had pretty much left it for dead. So thank you again for all the help. I'm sure I'll have more challenges to come after these many, many hours of sorting through it. But in the meantime, it's great!