Oddity with Sonnet Allegro Pro USB 3.0 PCIe card

[skizzo]

I recently had a strange event with the Sonnet Allegro Pro USB 3.0 PCIe card. This card is installed in PCIe slot #3. I have all four ports being used by various things. They are installed as so, if you are looking at the card from the rear of the machine port #1 would be the left most port and #4 being the right most port

1) PreSonus Studio 192 audio interface
2) Glyph Studio 3TB HDD
3) DDrum Trigger I/O (Trigger/MIDI interface)
4) iLok license key 3rd Gen (dongle device for plugin licenses)

Out of nowhere I noticed the Studio 192 interface would not be recognized so I tried the usual things of restart the Mac Pro and cycling power on the audio interface. I then simply thought something was funky with the Allegro Pro card and plugged the Studio 192 into a native USB 2.0 port and it was instantly recognized. As this point I realized the other devices plugged in the Allegro Pro where functioning (and they never we NOT functioning, I just didn't think about it right away).

So at this point it made be to believe there was something wrong with a single port/controller on the Allegro Pro. So I removed the iLok from port #4 and plugged the Studio 192 into port #4 and it was instantly recognized. Ok so this is making sense until I plugged the iLok into port #1 (where the Studio 192 was NOT being recognized) and the iLok is working and recognized in port #1.

This is why I am scratching my head. I tried using even different pieces of gear I have and for some reason the Studio 192 just doesn't work in port #1 anymore but does in the other ports. So what could be causing the issue with that port but not the others for a single piece of equipment? The Studio 192 has it's own power source so it does not get it's power through USB, so I think that rules out that. Any insight is appreciated on why this has occurred out of nowhere, because it has been working for 4 months until this odd quirk popped up. Everything functions still but I am looking to understand why and how this could occur

I'm on a cMP early 2009 w/5,1 firmware. OS is 10.13.6

 

[bookemdano]

Try shutting down and removing the power cord from your cMP. Leave it unplugged for 30 seconds (I like to push in and hold the power button while it's unplugged to hasten draining all residual power but you don't have to do that). Then plug the power cord back in, boot up and try the Studio 192 in port #1 again.

You may want to try relocating some of that stuff that doesn't benefit/require USB 3 over to one of the USB 2 ports. Not sure it would have prevented this issue but in might help keep a high load off the card.

 

[crjackson2134]

The Sonnet Allegro Pro USB 3.0 PCIe card has 4 independent controllers. One for each port. I've done a lot of research and testing of this card and you can even find the review I wrote on MR.

Try what @bookemdano said and see how that works out for now.

My personal guess, is that you have a weak controller chip on port #1 and it will always be weak, or even eventually fail before the others. I've had this happen before on other cards of similar design, and even had an early card that was never released to the public present nearly identical behavior. However, simply resetting everything, and even re-seating the card in the PCIe slot may help solve your current problem.

If it were me, I'd pull the card and inspect the board/chips for signs of overheating, or other issues. Clean the edge connectors, reinstall and retest. If none of these present a solution, replace the card. I have 2 cards of each brand I use just in case. I've actually seen cards drop a single port due to software corruption of the virtual USB port driver after an update, but this was on another OS. I have also seen macOS updates cause USB3 cards to appear faulty and it was fixed by an update.

Testing is in order to nail this down solidly. You really need a second card for emergencies and testing.

I like the equivalent HighPoint card as a fool-proof backup. I've never had a hardware failure on any of the cards I've tested of theirs.

 

[skizzo]

First, thanks for the responses!

I actually have literally every USB 2.0 (and as you can see 3.0) port occupied on my cMP besides 1 USB 2.0 port in the front. I like to leave that open for using thumb drives and other mobile type connections. So yes I do agree that something such as an iLok definitely does not require or benefit from USB 3.0 over 2.0 but I have laid out everything to function best with my particular workflow. For example I have a 1st gen iLok also and that doesn't work on USB 3.0 so I have to put that in a 2.0 port, which I do on the keyboard's USB port. I believe the other 2.0 ports are occupied by the wired keyboard, monitor adapter, cable for an xbox360 controller, and another audio interface.

At first I planned on having multiple HDDs going on this Allegro Pro card along with the 3.0 interfaces so I did not want any bottle necks. The point of this upgrade for me was to make sure I was not going to introduce any additional latency for recording audio due to a bottle neck of a single USB controller for multiple devices simultaneously. I understand this card may be overkill for my needs. With that said I can look into a cheaper 3.0 card that could be used for troubleshooting. I also just checked the warranty on the Allegro Pro and it is covered for 5 years, so if I do have an issue with a controller failing (which was my hunch also) I should be in the clear on getting it replaced or fixed under warranty free of charge.

So I have a couple things to try right off the bat.
1) I'll try the power down / unplugging task as described by @bookemdano
2) If issue still present I will move swap my #3 and #4 slot cards (GT120 from #4 to #3 which I have been meaning to do for a while now. I think the GPU gets a little hotter in that top most slot). So this covers the cleaning and reseating as described by @crjackson2134
3) if issue still present I will look into a Highpoint brand 3.0 card for troubleshooting if it is a hardware failing problem on the Allegro Pro or something with the actual cMP or OS combination. As in if the issue is still present then it's not the Allegro Pro that is having the problem

Does a single controller card make sense for the troubleshooting part? As I write this I am wondering if that is going to be too much like comparing apples to oranges? Should I still get a 4 controller card to troubleshoot with for better comparison to see if one of the four controllers has an issue with the Studio 192?

 

[crjackson2134]

Honestly, I would get THIS CARD and RMA the Allegro Pro for a warranty replacement.

 

[Squuiid]

USB 2.0/3.0 can be very finicky. I've had my cMP boot to a black screen if I plug my mic into one USB port in a hub and work fine if I plug it into another. Ports are fine, and they work with other USB devices just fine.
It's just a weird bug. I work in IT and see this sort of thing pretty often, it's just the way USB goes sometimes.
I wouldn't bother RMA'ing the card. I personally don't think there is anything wrong with it.
Just use the ports that work and forget about it.

Oh, and definitely remove the GT120 if it's sharing PCIe slots 3 and 4 with the Allegro Pro.

 

[Earl Urley]

Honestly, I would get THIS CARD and RMA the Allegro Pro for a warranty replacement.

Seconding this recommendation, I have this same exact card. Wound up upgrading to Sierra/High Sierra because El Capitan's USB framework is ****ed from the get go, once I did that, it eliminated all the niggling little things like devices taking five million years to get recognized/enumerated/mount, sudden dropouts (only with super cheap **** USB drives) and slow transfers.

 

[bookemdano]

One suggestion, get a simple unpowered USB 2.0 hub ($5-$10 or maybe even free at Goodwill or something) to plug your DRM dongles into hanging off one of your rear USB 2.0 ports. I would save your USB 3.0 ports for things that need the throughput.

 

[skizzo]

thanks for all the feedback and comments!

USB 2.0/3.0 can be very finicky. I've had my cMP boot to a black screen if I plug my mic into one USB port in a hub and work fine if I plug it into another. Ports are fine, and they work with other USB devices just fine.
It's just a weird bug. I work in IT and see this sort of thing pretty often, it's just the way USB goes sometimes.
I wouldn't bother RMA'ing the card. I personally don't think there is anything wrong with it.
Just use the ports that work and forget about it.

Oh, and definitely remove the GT120 if it's sharing PCIe slots 3 and 4 with the Allegro Pro.

If the cMP boots to a black screen with something plugged into USB, does that mean just no boot screen so black until the OS loads or does it stay black the whole time with the mic plugged in?

I've seen behavior with something plugged into USB ports would make the displays not work properly. Consulting with other IT folks at work on this they suggested different BIOS to be used would fix it. No idea what that really entails though. This happened to me when I plug a USB 2.0 1GB flash drive into a rear port prior to booting on a work computer. They never fixed the issue, just gave me the line that an appropriate workaround is to plug in the flash drive after booting

Seconding this recommendation, I have this same exact card. Wound up upgrading to Sierra/High Sierra because El Capitan's USB framework is ****ed from the get go, once I did that, it eliminated all the niggling little things like devices taking five million years to get recognized/enumerated/mount, sudden dropouts (only with super cheap **** USB drives) and slow transfers.

hmm, I notice that my newest USB 3.0 HDD takes much longer than my decade old FW800 HDD to be recognized. It's not a huge issue, just a noticeable difference. I thought it was strange due to you would imagine a newer unit on a faster protocol would load up faster. I've only used USB 3.0 on High Sierra and a little bit on Sierra.

 

[bsbeamer]

I notice that my newest USB 3.0 HDD takes much longer than my decade old FW800 HDD to be recognized. It's not a huge issue, just a noticeable difference. I thought it was strange due to you would imagine a newer unit on a faster protocol would load up faster. I've only used USB 3.0 on High Sierra and a little bit on Sierra.

What drive and what external case? Are you positive it is a 7200rpm+ HDD? Is it under 4TB? Is it formatted correctly?

SOME cases claim USB 3.0, but they are NOT fully compatible with 1 or 2TB+ drives. Unfortunately, this is not disclosed. You may need to update the case (with controller) to better support. Some of the newest offerings from Orico work well with large drives and Macs under USB 3.0 connection.

 

[skizzo]

the Allegro Pro uses the eXtensible host controller
The USB 3.0 HDD is a Glyph Studio 3TB HDD, so under 4TB. It is definitely 7200RPM and formatted properly as HFS+.
For my audio drives I have used for desktop and portable reasons I have always used this company Glyph which is very geared towards the professional audio market and is also local to my area in central New York. So I have a little bias of hometown pride if you will there lol. So I am not using any external case. These are standalone external HDD's that come in their own enclosure and are capable of being installed in rack units, which I do rack them now that I am not really going back and forth between recording studio's anymore.

USB 3.0 Glyph Studio 3TB HDD is recognized slower than a FW800 Glyph GT050Q 500GB HDD.
Just to clarify, I mean recognized not necessarily transfers. The USB 3.0 protocol is noticeably faster in actual read/write speeds but for some reason the FW800 HDD takes only 10 seconds to be recognized after powering it on. The USB 3.0 HDD takes longer, say 30 seconds. And that is what I thought was a little backwards.

I just realized as I typed this the Studio HDD has FW800 ports so I could plug those in and see if it's the difference between the FW800 and USB 3.0 protocol making different recognized times or if it is the actual HDD's that takes longer to power on and get recognized.

 

[bsbeamer]

If the drives load and transfer speeds are not impacted, do not worry about it. The system will generally recognize everything "built-in" first, which is where FW800 and USB2.0 fall. Drivers need to load for most PCIe devices before they are recognized and work correctly. Very few have pre-boot drivers.

If it's an issue after the system has fully booted and THEN you are connecting the driver, go ahead and test between USB3 and FW800, but once the drive loads the speed difference should be in favor of USB3... but it's not going to be a tremendous difference. You're likely barely actually reaching speed limits with an HDD for audio files. Most drives would max at 100-110MB/s over USB 3.0. Many older audio systems prefer FW800 over anything USB for storage and transfer, so you may want to look into that as well.