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Questioning Apple's Quality

bembol

bembol

macrumors 65816
Original poster
Jul 29, 2006
1,077
66
The last few weeks have been a PITA, 2 of the 3 iMac's we own are going down!?!?! :mad:


My sister's 20" iMac, had it for just over 3 years is dying. I was told by Apple that the Case Logic Board needs to be replace which will cost $900+. It doesn't make sense when you can just buy a new one.

Now my brother's 17", had it for lover 2 years is acting up and I think it's just the HDD? I have an appointment with Genius Bar later this afternoon.


I'm aware things fail but when you pay $300, $500 more for Apple, as my sister said she just expects it to outlast her Dell PC/Windows she bought 7 years ago!

They are questioning if they should get another iMac. What's sad is my sister was thinking about buying the new 13" MacBook Pro before all this.


Just had to get this rant out because I convinced them to switch and spend the money to upgrade/buy one. :eek:
 
Apple Care if you plan on keeping your computers for that period of time is always a good choice. Logic Boards are expensive and random, but definitely a killer to many computers.
 
thegoldenmackid said:
Apple Care if you plan on keeping your computers for that period of time is always a good choice.
Click to expand...

I think that is the key lesson to learn. While it might seem like a lot to pay upfront for something that you might never use, one little problem can more often then not pay for itself a few times over.
 
hm in my opinion every system will fail at one point sooner or later and it does not make a difference if it did cost 500 or 5000
so i would not say only on the grounds that your 2 computers broke down that apple produces bad quality , my imac g3 600 for example from 2001 is still running perfectly like new ,so does my emac from 2005
what most people dont do is maintaining their computers
if they have fans for instance they collect a fair bit amount of dust which will lead to overheating , so the processor and even the logicboard can die from dust so can the psu , so cleaning it on a regualr basis can certainly lead to a longer life

i dont get this habit of buying a computer and expect it to last forever without maintenance
if you buy a car you bring it in for a service too on a regular basis ? or
do you drive it until it breaks down and make the manufacturer responsible for bad quality??
 
I don't belive in Extended Warranties, buying Apple Care IMO shows you do not trust the Product/Company.

The only time I bought one was for my first car, '99 Pontiac Grand AM/V6. I liked it but since my family was against it I bought the extended warranty. Which didn't make a difference because it turned out to be a Lemon! This why I would never buy GM/Domestic.

My current and last coupe (Nissan and Acura) I didn't buy it.


Anyways, even if they bought it the coverage is over.
 
the extended warranties make sense if you are not that wealthy that you can
buy a new computer as soon as the old one plays up and most problem come within the first 3 years nowadays , but my guess thats industry standart to convince you to buy a new one
if you think about it my granny still uses her washing machine from the 60`s so is the fridge and her colour telly is from the 70`s not to mention her radio which i suppose is from the early 50`s , but they all work flawless back then there was build quality better in general , but then manufacturers realised if they build quality products that last forever they are out of bussines soon ;)

no they did not build a breaking point within 10 years in , its simple older products will break too but back in the 60`s 70`s the spareparts had been made cheap to exchange , and repair in a shop was common so in terms of a computer, it would have meant if your computer is broken down the shop would have realised that its resistor plabla on the motherboard that isnt working and would have exchanged it for 10 quid , instead of giving you the advise to buy a new board for 500
but thats common nowadays dont repair just exchange parts
 
bembol said:
I don't belive in Extended Warranties, buying Apple Care IMO shows you do not trust the Product/Company.

The only time I bought one was for my first car, '99 Pontiac Grand AM/V6. I liked it but since my family was against it I bought the extended warranty. Which didn't make a difference because it turned out to be a Lemon! This why I would never buy GM/Domestic.

My current and last coupe (Nissan and Acura) I didn't buy it.


Anyways, even if they bought it the coverage is over.
Click to expand...

Every single computer manufacturer has systems that fail, your trust in a product doesn't magically change the fact that electronics break.
 
Umbongo said:
Every single computer manufacturer has systems that fail, your trust in a product doesn't magically change the fact that electronics break.
Click to expand...

yes but in the UK the SOG act protects expensive purchases like iMac's and stops companies like Apple avoiding their responsibilty.

Legally they have to make sure their products last a reasonable length of time bearing in mind their price and useage, up to 6 years.

they may force you to go to small claims court but providing you haven't abused the machine then if it's less than 3 years old then you will nearly always win. I know this from experience.
 
I'm really sorry to hear about what happened to your sister.
And the truth is, there is nothing anyone can really do about any of this.
Actually.. the sad thing is, compared to many PC companies out there, Apple are top of the line when it comes to quality (I'm talking about companies such as Gateway, which is without a doubt THE WORST COMPUTER COMPANY IN THE WORLD.)
Apple may not be the best at making all their computers, but then again.. neither is any other company. HP and Dell have that same problem.
It's nothing anyone can predict, so it's not like you can blame the company itself.
They do test their stuff before it's shipped out and sold, but as times goes by, the hardware itself will break in any brand name computer.
3 years is actually a very long time for once computer to be up to date and working flawless. And yeah, I know, it is a lot of money. But that's why you need AppleCare, because one little thing could go wrong at any moment, and then you're pretty much screwed with having to buy another computer.
 
mtnDewFTW said:
I'm really sorry to hear about what happened to your sister.
And the truth is, there is nothing anyone can really do about any of this.
Actually.. the sad thing is, compared to many PC companies out there, Apple are top of the line when it comes to quality (I'm talking about companies such as Gateway, which is without a doubt THE WORST COMPUTER COMPANY IN THE WORLD.)
Apple may not be the best at making all their computers, but then again.. neither is any other company. HP and Dell have that same problem.
It's nothing anyone can predict, so it's not like you can blame the company itself.
They do test their stuff before it's shipped out and sold, but as times goes by, the hardware itself will break in any brand name computer.
3 years is actually a very long time for once computer to be up to date and working flawless. And yeah, I know, it is a lot of money. But that's why you need AppleCare, because one little thing could go wrong at any moment, and then you're pretty much screwed with having to buy another computer.
Click to expand...



3 points


1/ Dell, Gateway etc.. don't charge the 'moon' for their products.

2/ Dell, Gateway etc... don't misleadingly advertise their products as just working at the expense of any of their competitors.

3/ Apple care (in the UK) is just an unneeded stupid tax.
 
archipellago said:
1/ Dell, Gateway etc.. don't charge the 'moon' for their products.

2/ Dell, Gateway etc... don't misleadingly advertise their products as just working at the expense of any of their competitors.

3/ Apple care (in the UK) is just an unneeded stupid tax.
Click to expand...


1) Take a look at the Adamo (or whatever its called). Plus, they can't because theres so many other competitors who sell Windows machines so they've got to be competitive in their pricing.

2) Well, they can't because everyone knows Vista was poor. It would be a bad call from their part

3) Some what partially agreed. If you go down the HE route, its quite reasonable - £47 for 3 years.
 
I sure wish I had bought it. My 2007 imac has started turning it self off once a day now. It is completely random and not an overheating issue. Owell lesson learned I will be buying it for my 27" for sure.
 
The Samurai said:
1) Take a look at the Adamo (or whatever its called). Plus, they can't because theres so many other competitors who sell Windows machines so they've got to be competitive in their pricing.

2) Well, they can't because everyone knows Vista was poor. It would be a bad call from their part

3) Some what partially agreed. If you go down the HE route, its quite reasonable - £47 for 3 years.
Click to expand...

1. So Apple can Rip you off cause they have no competition? hmmm

2. How is SL looking then?? Kinda reminds me of vista with all its issues. SL does not just work period. I got farked off with is and had to replace it with leopard. Current apple Ads are BS cause if anything windows 7 just works out of the box. The current build of vista is way more stable then SL.

3. Given most customers cannot get HE discounts you points is not valid here.
 
richprice79 said:
I sure wish I had bought it. My 2007 imac has started turning it self off once a day now. It is completely random and not an overheating issue. Owell lesson learned I will be buying it for my 27" for sure.
Click to expand...

To be honest for the money you spent on a 2007 imac it should still be running strong. I get applecare for all my products, I am not happy about it, but by buying it I am accepting the fact that Apple products just plain die and Applecare is just necessary. What makes the issue worse is that they charge stupid amounts for replacement parts so applecare is the cheaper option. I sell off all my macs about 2.5 years (applecare = 3 years) after owning them cause I do not trust them to keep going and repairing them is not an options.

They are build using the cheapest components in the sexiest chassis. They will die, get applecare and sell them off before it expires. Also never buy first gen apple products, wait a few months for the bugs to be ironed out.
 
MH01 said:
To be honest for the money you spent on a 2007 imac it should still be running strong. I get applecare for all my products, I am not happy about it, but by buying it I am accepting the fact that Apple products just plain die and Applecare is just necessary. What makes the issue worse is that they charge stupid amounts for replacement parts so applecare is the cheaper option. I sell off all my macs about 2.5 years (applecare = 3 years) after owning them cause I do not trust them to keep going and repairing them is not an options.

They are build using the cheapest components in the sexiest chassis. They will die, get applecare and sell them off before it expires. Also never buy first gen apple products, wait a few months for the bugs to be ironed out.
Click to expand...

I have Power Mac 7100 and 8500 from the mid 90's that still work perfectly. Also a Power Mac G3, Power Mac G5 and iBook G4 which are 5-9 years old and still work perfectly. None of those computers have ever needed any repair whatsoever. I'm not buying your argument, but admittedly, I've never owned an iMac (nor would I buy an all in one design (excepting laptops) for reliability and value reasons).
 
archipellago said:
yes but in the UK the SOG act protects expensive purchases like iMac's and stops companies like Apple avoiding their responsibilty.

Legally they have to make sure their products last a reasonable length of time bearing in mind their price and useage, up to 6 years.

they may force you to go to small claims court but providing you haven't abused the machine then if it's less than 3 years old then you will nearly always win. I know this from experience.
Click to expand...

Yes, but the threadstarter isn't in the UK.
 
fa8362 said:
I have Power Mac 7100 and 8500 from the mid 90's that still work perfectly. Also a Power Mac G3, Power Mac G5 and iBook G4 which are 5-9 years old and still work perfectly. None of those computers have ever needed any repair whatsoever. I'm not buying your argument, but admittedly, I've never owned an iMac (nor would I buy an all in one design (excepting laptops) for reliability and value reasons).
Click to expand...

Actually i was referring to the newer stuff made in China. I have an old powerbook g4 that is working great, so far this year I have had to replace my 24" LED logicboard and had three repairs on a MBP. Apples current obsession with thinness is resulting in reliability issues, well that is my point of view anyway.
 
i've been around computers since the 1990's. i've seen some last for years, others die in a few months. few years ago we ordered a few hundred Dell laptops and our helpdesk said that half of them were dead in a matter or weeks, but it was probably the people we gave them to. most of the laptops we buy are cheapo ones for $500 so if they break we just scavenge the parts and buy another one for the user.

my company bought me a $1500 HP laptop 2 years ago that came with a 3 year warranty. LCD broke and HP wanted us to pay for it because we didn't buy the extra warranty. now the keyboard is flaky. my manager has the exact same laptop and his LCD is having the same issues mine did last year, but he doesn't want to ask the company to spend $500 to fix it.

Few years ago i bought a Dell Inspiron with a coupon i found on the internet. It was around $750 off $2000 or so. Cost me $1500 total from the base price of $700. i added a lot of upgrades including the 3 year warranty since my wife was going to use it for work. 2 years into the laptop the battery starts going and i call Dell. They said the battery is excluded from the warranty and is only warrantied for 1 year. The warranty cost me $250 or so.

hard drives are notorious and even HP warranties their server class hard drives only for 1 year. For logic boards there was a big thing a few years ago in the build it yourself community. Some company had a bunch of motherboards die fast and people complained. Turns out they used the cheapest capacitor or something and it died. the part costs something like 5 cents or less. the good one was an extra $.05 or something. Next thing you know the same motherboard companies are shipping "premium" motherboards with the good capacitors and other components for $20 - $50 more than the regular one.

For Apple products you have to buy them at the right time to be price competitive with a PC. iMac's are a good buy now, but MBP's are a rip off at current prices compared to a Dell.

When i buy my next computer it will be either a cheapo PC, or if my wife and I want to spend $1000 or more for a desktop or $1500 for a laptop then it's going to be an Apple at those prices. At the higher price range i'd trust Apple more than Dell or HP
 
MH01 said:
1. So Apple can Rip you off cause they have no competition? hmmm

2. How is SL looking then?? Kinda reminds me of vista with all its issues. SL does not just work period. I got farked off with is and had to replace it with leopard. Current apple Ads are BS cause if anything windows 7 just works out of the box. The current build of vista is way more stable then SL.

3. Given most customers cannot get HE discounts you points is not valid here.
Click to expand...

1) Sadly, thats how business works. As theres the only one manufacturer, consumers don't have choice than to opt for Apple.

2) SL is actually perfect for me, thanks for asking though. As Apple said a year ago, SL is going to have small tweaks and nothing major. At no point did they ever make SL to be a substantial change. On the contrary, Vista was a disaster because it was marketed in a way that Vista 'was the next big thing'.

3) Fair point, and I agree.
 
Free +1yr. Extended Warranty

In general, extended warranties don't make "economic" sense, i.e., the manufacturer makes a big profit on them because they cost more to buy than the avg cost of a repair, defined as the total costs of repairs divided by the total number of customers purchasing the extended warranty.

Therefore, the chances are that you will save money in the long run by not buying them.

However, all it takes is one 366th-day failure to make you decide that you're totally risk averse w.r.t. losses and that the extra money is "worth it." This is a psychologic phenomenon that I totally understand. :)

In any case, there is a good alternative to AppleCare that I haven't seen mentioned. If you purchase your computer with an American Express card (and a number of other cards as well, including some debit cards--but it's specific to the terms of your credit card agreement), for example, Amex will add on another year of warranty for free. It's not an extra year of Apple service, but if it breaks during that second year Amex, e.g., will replace it. :cool:

(Of course, it is not really free in an economic sense, either, but because you can't change the facts of commerce today--where people paying for things with credit cards pay the same price as those paying with cash--very easily, you might as well embrace it: i.e., if Apple charged a different price for cash or debit, then this might not be a good idea.)

There are some limitations that are worth reading*, but this is an option worth considering as an alternative to AppleCare.

*that apply to the number of items per year that would be covered, to cite one example.
 
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