MP 1,1-5,1 Questions before I upgrade my GPU and install Catalina...

[BadGoldEagle]

Hi all,

This is my first post here. I am not a complete novice though. I'd say I'm adequately verse in both old and modern mac stuff. I have an account on the 68kmla for the vintage machines and I just created one here because I might want to get a little more involved in intel stuff.

My daily driver is a cMP 5,1 running both 10.13.6 and Windows 10 1903. It's rocking an Nvidia 1080Ti GPU. The nvidia is kinda getting on my nerves, sometimes preventing Windows to boot properly (which is odd, I thought Windows was smart enough to work with cards designed for it. Apparently it's a driver issue.), and it's also preventing me from upgrading to Mojave or Catalina…

I’d like to replace the 1080Ti with an AMD 5700 or 5700XT. But before I buy it, I have a few questions.
NB: My current BootROM version is MP51.0089.B00 and the SMC Version is 1.39f5.

1/ Is the latest BootROM (144.0.0.0.0) still compatible with High Sierra? Also, is it still compatible with the GT120? (I know it won't work if I boot from a volume that has 10.14+ on it but will I still get the boot manager?)
I'm asking this because in case something goes wrong, I'd like to revert back to HS and the GT120... It should work but I want to be sure before I commit.

2/ DOSDUDE patcher related questions:
2.1/ Can I upgrade from High Sierra to Catalina directly or should I install Mojave first? If I have to install Mojave this is going to be a pain in the butt as the 5700 doesn't work with Mojave nor does the 1080Ti...
2.2/ Does the current patcher install 10.15.1 or 10.15? 10.15.1 is required for the 5700 as it's the only one that has the AMD Navi drivers built in… Apparently the latest version 1.2.1 added support for Catalina version 10.15.1. But does that mean it is simply compatible with it or does it install it?

I know that's a lot of specific questions. Thumbs up if you got this far.
Thanks!
BGE

 

[tsialex]

1/ Is the latest BootROM (144.0.0.0.0) still compatible with High Sierra?

Yes, even with 10.6.8.

Also, is it still compatible with the GT120? (I know it won't work if I boot from a volume that has 10.14+ on it but will I still get the boot manager?)

Yes, pre-boot configuration support still works.

I'm asking this because in case something goes wrong, I'd like to revert back to HS and the GT120... It should work but I want to be sure before I commit.

Yes, no problem.

Read here:
MP5,1: What you have to do to upgrade to Mojave (BootROM upgrade instructions thread)

 

[bsbeamer]

My daily driver is a cMP 5,1

the SMC Version is 1.39f5

Your machine is (likely) an MP4,1>MP5,1 or other hack to ID as MP5,1. Double check your processor(s) and confirm you will not be impacted by the audio bug.

Strange Audio Issue on MP 4,1>5,1 Mojave 10.14.4

Ok, so this is my first post here since Ive been working with these machines for quite some time and Im fairly knowledgeable with these kinds of things, but this time Ive hit a brick wall so any help would be great. Recently got a Dual Quad 2.26 MP 4.1 with the intentions of maxing it on the...

forums.macrumors.com

 

[BadGoldEagle]

@tsialex Thanks for the very prompt reply!
I checked the thread and I saw this:

If your Mac Pro have a BootROM earlier than MP51.0089.B00, to upgrade to 144.0.0.0.0 you will have to do:

1. Download the full Mac App Store installer for 10.13.6, open it and then do as the installer says to upgrade to MP51.0089.B00, this needs a Mac EFI GPU. After the firmware upgrade reboot, you can close the installer app.
2. Download the full Mac App Store installer for Mojave, the most recent one (10.14.6), open it and then do as the installer says to upgrade to 144.0.0.0.0. After the firmware upgrade reboot, you can close the installer app. This firmware upgrade requires a METAL supported GPU.

It might not work after all... Have you personally tested the compatibility with the boot manager? This is kind of a big deal for me as I have to use it every time Windows updates itself (which is a lot!).
Edit: The other unknown is wether the 5700 will display a proper boot screen or not... I might not need the GT120 if this is the case.

@bsbeamer Good catch. This is exactly what happened to me. The original owner changed the string to display mid 2010 instead of early 2009. I realized that as soon as I reinstalled macOS... but at least he upgraded the CPUs to X5680s. That I'm sure. So I shouldn't be impacted by the audio bugs, right?

 

[tsialex]

@tsialex Thanks for the very prompt reply!
I checked the thread and I saw this:


It might not work after all... Have you personally tested the compatibility with the boot manager? This is kind of a big deal for me as I have to use it every time Windows updates itself (which is a lot!).


@bsbeamer Good catch. This is exactly what happened to me. The original owner changed the string to display mid 2010 instead of early 2009. I realized that as soon as I reinstalled macOS... but at least he upgraded the CPUs to X5680s. That I'm sure. So I shouldn't be impacted by the audio bugs, right?

A PC GPU won't have pre-boot configuration support, obviously. A RX 5700 will boot blind, without boot screens/boot picker/AHT & ASD support/etc.

 

[BadGoldEagle]

I remember hearing a rumor that this was about to change or something. Guess not. So I definitely need that GT120 boot support!

Edit I didn't even see the post I quoted was your own. Sorry! So I should be all right with 144.0.0.0.0 and my GT120?

 

[tsialex]

I remember hearing a rumor that this was about to change or something. Guess not. So I definitely need that GT120 boot support!

After High Sierra, you can't mix NVIDIA and AMD GPUs anymore. No go.

 

[bsbeamer]

Correct, the 5600 series CPUs are not impacted by the audio bug in Mojave.

I’d like to replace the 1080Ti with an AMD 5700 or 5700XT

To be frank, the 5700 GPUs are not what I'd recommend for MP5,1 at this time. Unless you're already up and running, it can be a bit of an experiment. The drivers are only improving in Catalina, not Mojave. You should have a METAL card for MOJAVE available, like Apple's own recommended Sapphire Pulse RX 580 which can be easily powered internally via dual mini 6-pin to standard 8-pin cable. Anyone who moves to Catalina should have a bootable copy of Mojave at the ready.

 

[tsialex]

I remember hearing a rumor that this was about to change or something. Guess not. So I definitely need that GT120 boot support!

Edit I didn't even see the post I quoted was your own. Sorry! So I should be all right with 144.0.0.0.0 and my GT120?

GT120 can't upgrade to 144.0.0.0.0 and won't have acceleration with Mojave, but works fine with 10.13.6 and 144.0.0.0.0.

 

[BadGoldEagle]

Sorry to insist again, but since you seem to be a real expert, let me ask you one last time (I promise that'll be it this time) if the following step by step should work: (I know there's always a window for error and that things that should work sometime don't but again, perhaps I'm overlooking something...)

1/ If I don't upgrade to Mojave, I can still install the latest firmware using the Mojave 10.14.6 installer on High Sierra with the 1080Ti (Web Drivers) and the system will continue to work as if nothing happened (boot manager with GT120 + High Sierra with either GT120/1080Ti? Or only with 1080Ti?).
2/ Create a Catalina installer with the dosdude1 tool on High Sierra (GT120/1080Ti).
3/ Once that's done, I can get a 5700/5700XT and install it in the Mac Pro (no 1080Ti or GT120)
4/ Boot from the hacked installer and install on separate partition (just to be sure)
5/ Boot Catalina with both GT120 and 5700 installed.

To recap, after all of the above has been done:
- I should still be able to get the boot manager for emergency purposes but only on the GT120 as the Mac starts up.
- I should still be able to boot from my High sierra partition with the GT120 and use macOS normally.
- Only the 5700 will work with Catalina (and Windows of course)

Does this make sense?
Thanks immensely!

 

[tsialex]

Sorry to insist again, but since you seem to be a real expert, let me ask you one last time (I promise that'll be it this time) if the following step by step should work: (I know there's always a window for error and that things that should work sometime don't but again, perhaps I'm overlooking something...)

1/ If I don't upgrade to Mojave, I can still install the latest firmware using the Mojave 10.14.6 installer on High Sierra with the 1080Ti (Web Drivers) and the system will continue to work as if nothing happened (boot manager with GT120 + High Sierra with either GT120/1080Ti? Or only with 1080Ti?).
2/ Create a Catalina installer with the dosdude1 tool on High Sierra (GT120/1080Ti).
3/ Once that's done, I can get a 5700/5700XT and install it in the Mac Pro (no 1080Ti or GT120)
4/ Boot from the hacked installer and install on separate partition (just to be sure)
5/ Boot Catalina with both GT120 and 5700 installed.

To recap, after all of the above has been done:
- I should still be able to get the boot manager for emergency purposes but only on the GT120 as the Mac starts up.
- I should still be able to boot from my High sierra partition with the GT120 and use macOS normally.
- Only the 5700 will work with Catalina (and Windows of course)

Does this make sense?
Thanks immensely!

1) pre-boot configuration support has nothing to do with the BootROM release, it's the GPU that have it or not. 144.0.0.0.0 works with GT 120 for pre-boot configuration support.
2,3,4) I don't use dosdude1 patcher, can't answer about it.
5) I already told you earlier that the last macOS release to support AMD and NVIDIA GPUs at the same time is High Sierra and won't work even if it's an OEM Apple HD 5770, since it's not supported anymore after 10.13.6.

If you really really need pre-boot configuration support, you can buy a MVC RX 580 now or wait for the future VEGA/Navi announced support by MVC.

 

[bsbeamer]

Seems like you've already determined the route you want to take and are not willing/wanting to listen to the advice given. On top of that, Catalina should ONLY be considered for testing purposes on MP5,1's at the moment and should not be considered a daily OS for this machine.

The steps outlined in this forum are mostly for non-hacked installs of Catalina. Ask in those specific threads for better advice.

Good luck and report your results if you want to help anyone in the future.

 

[BadGoldEagle]

Thanks for clarifying 1) once for all. There's a lot of conflicting info about this. Now I know.

About 5) and @bsbeamer , I apologize. I didn't see your posts as I was writing mine at the same time, and the website didn't refresh for some reason. I definitely don't want to go against what you say. It's more of a idea in my head at this point. You have both more experience than me when it comes to this.

About the RX580, I did not know that the MVC version had boot manager support. I don't know how well it performs (vs 1080Ti) and if it's 100% stable power-wise. I had to under volt my 1080Ti under Windows otherwise it'd hard shut down after 10 mins of use...

But I agree, it might be the safest option. Or alternatively it might be even safer to just wait (as HS is still fully supported, until next year I guess) for the 7,1...

 

[tsialex]

Thanks for clarifying 1) once for all. There's a lot of conflicting info about this. Now I know.

About 5) and @bsbeamer , I apologize. I didn't see your posts as I was writing mine at the same time, and the website didn't refresh for some reason. I definitely don't want to go against what you say. It's more of a idea in my head at this point. You have both more experience than me when it comes to this.

About the RX580, I did not know that the MVC version had boot manager support. I don't know how well it performs (vs 1080Ti) and if it's 100% stable power-wise. I had to under volt my 1080Ti under Windows otherwise it'd hard shut down after 10 mins of use...
But I agree, it might be the safest option.

MVC RX 580 seems to work fine, no problems power-wise, lot's of people here bought one or sent one to be flashed. It's weaker comparing with 1080Ti, it's more ore less between GTX 970 and GTX 980 scores for OpenCL but it's much much faster at METAL and most people that need pre-boot configuration support are happy with a MVC RX 580. I have a non-flashed Sapphire Pulse RX 580 and works perfectly.

BTW, RX 580/VEGA/VII GPUs can have HEVC hardware decoding/encoding enabled, no NVIDIA card supports hardware HEVC decoding/encoding with macOS.

 

[Macsonic]

Hi all,

1/ Is the latest BootROM (144.0.0.0.0) still compatible with High Sierra? Also, is it still compatible with the GT120? (I know it won't work if I boot from a volume that has 10.14+ on it but will I still get the boot manager?)
I'm asking this because in case something goes wrong, I'd like to revert back to HS and the GT120... It should work but I want to be sure before I commit.

Thanks!
BGE

I can confirm that the BootROM 144.0.0.0.0 works OK with High Sierra, Sierra or Mavericks . I have Mojave installed and can also run High Sierra, Sierra or Mavericks just fine. It's best when upgrading to a new OSX, make a clone of your main boot drive so if there are problems, it's easier to go back to the former OS. For Catalina, I would wait it out for 3-6 months before upgrading.

 

[meneervermeer]

I'm also very interested in a proper upgrade path for my Mac Pro. I have a flashed 4,1 to 5,1, single CPU model.

1) What I would like to know, is it possible to upgrade to Catalina with the GT 120? I run a GTX 1070 and would like to swap that for a rx 5700 since it's starting to get MacOS support.
2) I've flashed the BootRom with a (I believe dosdude1) patcher to enable nvme drives, only to later learn about the 144.0.0.0.0 bootrom. Is it safe to flash/update the bootrom of this modded bootrom?