Reformatting for NTFS

[Stridder44]

So I made a 50GB Windows partition in Boot Camp. Of course the default format is FAT-32, and I want NTFS. So I boot up off the Windows XP CD to install, and in order to reformat the partition it says I have to delete it (just simply installing on the partition won't bring up any reformatting options). So to reiterate, it looks like this:

Partition 1 <200MB> (Unknown)
Partition 2 <170GB> (Mac OS X)
Unknown <128MB> (Unknown)
Partition 3 <50GB> (where Win XP will be installed)

If I delete Partition 3, it also removes that 128MB partition as well (which Boot Camp must have made because it was never there before). My question is, is the 128MB "space" necessary.

 

[steveza]

You don't have to delete it - you can choose NTFS format when you install Windows or if you have already installed Windows run this command:

convert c: /fs:ntfs

 

[Stridder44]

You don't have to delete it - you can choose NTFS format when you install Windows or if you have already installed Windows run this command:

convert c: /fs:ntfs

...and in order to reformat the partition it says I have to delete it (just simply installing on the partition won't bring up any reformatting options)...

It won't let me do that for some reason. It just goes about installing Windows. But does the 128 MB space even matter? Because if I delete "partition 3" it takes the 128 MB space with it, but at least then I can reformat it to NTFS.

 

[steveza]

Well that 128MB partition only seems to appear when you have other partition formats (NTFS and FAT32) so I guess that it's not really required. What can you get on 128MB anyway ?

 

[Stridder44]

Well that 128MB partition only seems to appear when you have other partition formats (NTFS and FAT32) so I guess that it's not really required. What can you get on 128MB anyway ?

True, but I wasn't sure if it had something to do with Boot Camp or whatnot.

 

[stainlessliquid]

Those unkown partitions look like partitions created when using GUID (efi) instead of MBR (bios) when partitioning the drive, GUID creates ~200mb hidden partitions everytime you create another partition, its where it keeps the boot info instead of on the actual data partition like MBR. The XP disc probably wants to create an MBR partition.

I wouldnt mix and match GUID and MBR stuff on the same drive, I dont know what would happen but it probably doesnt work.

 

[Stridder44]

Huh. One other question, when completely reformatting the HDD, what is the best type (i.e., GUID, etc.) and what do they all mean?

 

[Stridder44]

128 MB partition and NTFS

I can't format the Boot Camp partition because of that stupid 128 MB "space" that Boot Camp creates. I _have_ to delete the Windows partition if I want to reformat it to NTFS, and when I do delete it it takes the 128 MB "space" with it. Otherwise I get "hal.dll missing or corrupt" or "Disk error" errors (Yes, I've followed the Boot Camp instructions).

Help!

Just to reiterate, it looks like this:

Partition 1 <200 MB> (EFI)
Partition 2 <170 GB> (Mac OS X)
Unknown <128 MB> (MBR?)
Partition 3 <50 GB> (Where Windows XP SP2 will be installed)

 

[Melee]

I've no idea what they do, but they're not necessary. I've just removed all mine using Parted and both OSX and XP are happy.

If the Windows partition is formatted as FAT32, then the installer should ask if you want to re-format the partition first before installing (mine did, anyway!) and you have the opportunity to 'leave the file system alone' or reformat as NTFS...

 

[theLimit]

What type of Windows install disc are you using? XP Pro, Home, Media Center, one of the many Vistas? Is it Retail, OEM, or other?

My OEM XP Pro disc is pretty scratched up and my MBP wouldn't read it, so I used someone else's backup disc to install XP Pro and used my license number. My OEM disc has always given me format options as soon as I chose a partition to install to. Either FAT32 or NTFS with quick or full format, Convert the file system, or Leave the file system intact. The backup disc that I used didn't give me those options, it just quick formatted the partition as NTFS. Maybe different discs have different installers on them.

Just to add, my Windows disc makes an additional small partition when installing on a PC as well, so I don't think it's strictly a Boot Camp thing.

 

[Krevnik]

Partition 1 <200 MB> (EFI)
Partition 2 <170 GB> (Mac OS X)
Unknown <128 MB> (MBR?)
Partition 3 <50 GB> (Where Windows XP SP2 will be installed)

The 128MB is free space created by the repartitioning tool in Boot Camp. I believe it is just buffer space and used to hold a little bit of data for the dynamic repartitioning so it knows how to remove the windows partition from the drive if you need to.

You don't HAVE to remove the partition, you can convert it from FAT32 to NTFS during the install, and it should work just fine. Converting before you install is fast enough, and usually you can just erase the partition without removing it. I don't think I have ever had to completely remove the partition with XP SP2.

 

[Eraserhead]

My Vista disk worked just fine, and let me choose the correct partition...

 

[Stridder44]

The 128MB is free space created by the repartitioning tool in Boot Camp. I believe it is just buffer space and used to hold a little bit of data for the dynamic repartitioning so it knows how to remove the windows partition from the drive if you need to.

You don't HAVE to remove the partition, you can convert it from FAT32 to NTFS during the install, and it should work just fine. Converting before you install is fast enough, and usually you can just erase the partition without removing it. I don't think I have ever had to completely remove the partition with XP SP2.

That's what I thought too, but I've tried this and when I select "install" of the partition Boot Camp makes (which sets it to FAT32 by default), instead of giving me any kind of option to convert it to NTFS beforehand it just goes straight into copying files. And no, the disc is completely clean. Like I said, it's annoying because I've already ran both XP and Vista on this machine and hadn't had problems in the past, but I've also reinstalled Windows several times...so maybe doing that could have messed something up with the EFI?

I've read that deleting the 200MB EFI partition might fix this but I'm not sure about that...

 

[Stridder44]

I've no idea what they do, but they're not necessary. I've just removed all mine using Parted and both OSX and XP are happy.

If the Windows partition is formatted as FAT32, then the installer should ask if you want to re-format the partition first before installing (mine did, anyway!) and you have the opportunity to 'leave the file system alone' or reformat as NTFS...

Thats the problem! For some reason it won't let me choose.

 

[Stridder44]

It appears other people are having this problem too!

http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=6940328

 

[MSmith1915]

Start Over

Why don't you use boot camp to delete the partition, return the hard drive to it's original state and then start over. The more meticulous you are in ensuring everything is working properly from the beginning, the better the install will go. i.e. use disk utility to verify disk (repair if necessary) and verify/repair disk permissions. Can't remember now, but during the install either in boot camp or windows you will be able to format to NTFS which I think is more stable. This is my first MAC, about 3 weeks ago, installed Windows XP home edition about 2 weeks ago and it's running flawlessly.

My 2cents
Mike

 

[stainlessliquid]

Its not bootcamp thats creating it, its how GUID disc schemes work. It needs an extra partition thats usually around 200mbs where it keeps information pertaining to the partitions so they can be recognized, it creates one of those 200mb spaces for every partition you create. GUID only works with EFI, which is what macs have. You cannot delete those little GUID partitions or else your computer wont be able to find the big one you want to use for data. MBR is the old way used in BIOS, it keeps the partition and boot info on the actual data partition rather than create extra 200mb ones.

You can always install XP on fat32 then just convert it to ntfs from inside windows, it doesnt damage anything and I dont think it makes it any slower or worse than a freshly formatted ntfs partition.

 

[Stridder44]

Its not bootcamp thats creating it, its how GUID disc schemes work. It needs an extra partition thats usually around 200mbs where it keeps information pertaining to the partitions so they can be recognized, it creates one of those 200mb spaces for every partition you create. GUID only works with EFI, which is what macs have. You cannot delete those little GUID partitions or else your computer wont be able to find the big one you want to use for data. MBR is the old way used in BIOS, it keeps the partition and boot info on the actual data partition rather than create extra 200mb ones.

You can always install XP on fat32 then just convert it to ntfs from inside windows, it doesnt damage anything and I dont think it makes it any slower or worse than a freshly formatted ntfs partition.

Ah, thank you for clearing that up. But honestly, MBR sounds better than GUID. Keeping the partition data seems smarter making a sepreate mini-partition for each normal partition.

But back to the problem, I can't install on FAT32 either, like I had said, because if I do I get "disk error. press any key to restart" (which never works). I'm _never_ prompted to format to NTFS. I don't understand why Boot Camp can't just offer NTFS in the first place. FAT32!? Come on. Dinosaurs and cavemen used that. It's 2008!

Ugh, dear Jesus please don't tell me I have to reformat the whole @#!%ing hard drive and reinstall OS X. I just got OS X set up exactly the way I want it.