MP 1,1-5,1 Reprogram Mac Pro 5,1 Processor Tray SMC firmware

[Lxixboss]

I have a 2009 Mac Pro 4,1 whose firmware I have upgraded to 5,1. I ordered what was supposed to be a compatible processor tray from an ebay vendor. I guess the vendor did not know that there was a difference between 4,1 and 5,1 processor boards and sent me a 5,1 processor board by mistake. I am working at getting him to replace it with the right board but I fear that this may not resolve itself to my satisfaction as he will probably not want to reimburse the shipping and import charges which I incurred getting this board from the US to Canada (although his listing clearly states that the board is compatible with the 2009 Mac Pro). At any rate, I am not posting this message to find out how to navigate ebay disputes.
What I want to know is whether or not it is possible to reprogram the SMC chip on the processor board. Currently the system is running SMC firmware version 1.39f5 while the processor board is running 1.39f11. This results in the all-too-wellknown "fans running like a 747 at takeoff". Note that there apparently is program like Macs Fan Control that can bring these fans under control since the firmware does not even see the fans.
I have ordered a "Keeyees SOP8 SOIC8 Test Clip and CH341A USB Reprogrammer Flash" from Amazon to allow me to flash the Nvidia Geforce 765M in my trusty 2011 Imac with an Apple ROM to give me bootscreens (well documented elsewhere on this site and others). I was wondering if this same device could be used to download SMC firmware 1.39f5 either directly from the Mac Pro 4,1 backplane board or from a Mac Pro 4,1 processor board and then use that software to replace the SMC 139f11 software from this incorrect processor board.
Advice and opinions would be most welcome but please try not to stray too far from the original question. Of particular interest would be input from those who have actually tried this. I would also be interested in hearing from those who have experience using this type of programmer and/or who have experience flashing EEPROM chips. Please note that I have little to no knowledge of electronics. I am, however, good at solving problems and can follow instructions.
Thanks in advance from the Great White North

 

[Macsonic]

As far as I recall and if I’m not mistaken, the SMC firmware of a 2010 CPU tray cannot be changed to a 2009 1.39f5. I’ve asked a Mac technician years ago and he said it’s not possible. I have not read anyone who successfully changed the SMC firmware of CPU board trays.

 

[tsialex]

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but your idea is flawed from the start.

The Renesas H8S/2100 micro-controller that do the SMC job is a secure one, the firmware can be re-written but can't be read/dumped from a mid-2010/mid-2012 board in any way and the source firmware was never leaked. Only Apple repair centres could do it back in the day when refurbishing backplanes/CPU trays. Now that it's obsolete, not even them.

If one day the SMC firmware code ever leaks, then early-2009 backplanes and CPU-trays could finally be updated to 1.39f11. Until then, the only way to upgrade an early-2009 backplane/CPU tray is to physically replace the SMC from one extracted from a mid-2010/mid-2012 defective board. Since it's a 144-pin TQFP chip, it's a job that only trained technicians with lot's of repair equipment can do.

Replace your backplane for a mid-2010 model and sell your old one to recoup some of the losses.

 

[Lxixboss]

It looks like the advice to sell this 2010 board and buy a 2009 might be the best idea. However, I have at least two « bad » 2009 CPU trays (no chime, no GPU diagnostic LED, no boot) and I have already ordered the EEPROM programmer. I will therefore see if I can, fiirst of all, extract the SMC firmware from a 5.1 processor board and save it and then see if I can program one of the chips on one of the bad boards. No doubt, hijinks will ensue.
First of all, I will have to find the chip that holds the SMC firmware. Any pointers?

 

[tsialex]

It looks like the advice to sell this 2010 board and buy a 2009 might be the best idea. However, I have at least two « bad » 2009 CPU trays (no chime, no GPU diagnostic LED, no boot) and I have already ordered the EEPROM programmer. I will therefore see if I can, fiirst of all, extract the SMC firmware from a 5.1 processor board and save it and then see if I can program one of the chips on one of the bad boards. No doubt, hijinks will ensue.
First of all, I will have to find the chip that holds the SMC firmware. Any pointers?

Please read again my post, then look at the data sheet that you can download from the link I posted.

The SMC firmware is stored inside the SMC, it's a SOC that has it's own internal ROM/RAM on die and it's firmware code is not possible to be dumped, it's a secure micro controller.

Again, it's not possible to read the SMC firmware, you can re-write it, but not dump it.

 

[Lxixboss]

Yes, I have read your text and, in light of your expertise and reputation, you are most assuredly right. That will not, however, prevent me from trying. As I said, hijinks will most likely ensue... (If I was an American, I would most likely be from Misouri. ;-)

 

[tsialex]

Yes, I have read your text and, in light of your expertise and reputation, you are most assuredly right. That will not, however, prevent me from trying. As I said, hijinks will most likely ensue... (If I was an American, I would most likely be from Misouri. ;-)

Sure, you can see for yourself, but it's easy to just read the datasheet and see that it's was designed from the ground to block what you intend to do. It's a secure micro controller.

Do you have a Renesas H8S/2100 development kit to recreate the SMC firmware code? Btw, it's a 144-pin chip with very tiny leads that you have to interface to your programmer…

 

[tsialex]

Btw, seems you are sure that the SMC firmware is stored on a SPI flash like the BootROM or the GPU firmware that you talked on the first post.

It's not.

The SMC firmware is stored on a flash memory on the die of the H8S micro-controller. The H8S family of micro-controllers are totally self contained, no ROM/RAM outside it. Just open the data sheet and take a look, you will see that what I'm writing here is true.

 

[Lxixboss]

Actually, mo, I do not have one if those (nor would i know what to do with one if I had it). So, are you telling me that the doodad I purchased to flash my GT765M will not even mate up with the aforementioned SMC chip?

 

[tsialex]

Actually, mo, I do not have one if those (nor would i know what to do with one if I had it). So, are you telling me that the doodad I purchased to flash my GT765M will not even mate up with the aforementioned SMC chip?

Seems you are not understanding what I'm writing at all.

The Mac Pro SMC is a micro-controller, from early-2009 to mid-2012 Apple used Renesas F2117TE20H H8S/2117V and it's a 144-pin chip in a package called TQFP. This micro-controller family don't have any outside of the package RAM or ROM, only inside the die itself. It's a totally self contained SOC with it's own operational system and runs independently from the rest of the board. The SMC micro controller has to run even when you shutdown your Mac, it's the micro-controller that manages all the power and thermals of the Mac Pro and it's completely independent of macOS. Renesas made it totally self contained and secure, impossible to be dumped.

Your ch341a programmer can only program simple SPI flash memories, not micro-controllers. Even if you buy a Renesas F2117TE20H H8S/2117V development kit to interface with the SMC via a 144-pin socket you have to use a blank chip, program it then replace the old one on the board. Last time I saw an used development kit being sold on eBay the seller was asking US$ 1200, anyway, you can only write to it, not read it. No one ever did it successfully this way, AFAIK, since you have to recreate the firmware code that runs inside the SMC.

 

[Lxixboss]

You’re right in that a lot of what you are saying is gibberish to me. What I do understand, however, is two things. The first is that you obviously know what you are talking about. The second is that I will not be able to do what I thought I might be able to. That’s OK. I knew it was a longshot from the get go.
I have to tell you what a great asset you and the other gurus on this site and others are to hobbyists like myself. Thanks to all if you, I have learned to flash video cards, upgrade various Mac Pros and do all sorts of things on my Macs that Mother Apple never intended me to. Thanks to people like you who choose to share your knowledge and expertise with the rest of us.