Ripping legality question

[thebignewt]

Pardon me if this is "off topic" to the TV forum. I understant that DVDs are copy protected, and that you have to combine Handbrake with that other software in order to rip/convert them. My question is why are DVDs treated differently than audio CDs? The only reason I could think of is that DVDs are mostly rented from stores and Netflix and CDs are mostly bought (and not rented). Is that why I can't easily rip even the DVDs that we've bought over the years (a ton)? I could rip some old ones. Why couldn't the rental companies make their copys different than the ones you buy? I'm sure it is legal to digitally convert a DVD that you own so it can be viewed on your iPad. Thanks for the info.

 

[Airforcekid]

This whole area is so confusing it's best to use your own moral judgement some won't burn their own purchased DVDs and will rebuy on iTunes because that's 100% right others buy giga connections and upload to various P2P networks. I land where if I can find it to download not via p2p but to stream or Netflix hulu etc I will watch it or if I own the DVD I will rip it.

 

[hayduke]

The original CD formats didn't have any copy protection. The software (iTunes etc.) enable CD ripping because you could make a legal argument that the software was useful for ripping non-Commerical CDs.

With DVDs, they have always been copy protected and their widespread distribution arose after the onslaught of MP3s, Napster, etc.

Regardless, the Digital Millennium Copyright Act prohibits the copying of CDs and DVDs. There are different arguments about what constitutes "fair play" and/or "fair use," but I don't think any of them have firm legal ground.

You might *think* it is reasonable to rip a copy of a CD/DVD for your iPad, but the industry bosses beg to differ. Not that that stops anyone...

 

[thebignewt]

I'm not talking about selling anything of course. I think that the music industry lost a Supreme Court case that ruled it legal to make cassette tape copies of your records. They tried to make a few copy protected CDs and the public went nuts so they stopped. Then iTunes quit limiting how many devices you could put purchased music on. The whole music issue is pretty much over with (other than flagrant P2P). But video is different. Sure, there are payper download video sites that go for cheap and are of questionable legality, just like music sites. I just wondered if any industry cases of DVD ripping for personal use existed.

 

[dynaflash]

Do not expect valid legal advice from anyone here (including myself). As anyone responsible should tell you ... you should consult professional legal advice in the country in which you reside. Anything else is just someone's opinion, that you probably have never met and don't know on an internet forum ... which would never hold up in court. Ultimately you would be held responsible for anything illegal you may do, and I am fairly certain " ... but , but your honor ... I got advice on a forum on the internet from <insert nick here> ..." will not hold up. Basically when it comes to ripping or altering any form of copyrighted material its up to the end user to decide whether its right/wrong or legal/illegal.

Harsh but true.

 

[dynaflash]

The only reason I could think of is that DVDs are mostly rented from stores and Netflix and CDs are mostly bought (and not rented). Is that why I can't easily rip even the DVDs that we've bought over the years (a ton)? I could rip some old ones.

No, as described above its a technical reason ... dvdcss. Handbrake for the mac dynamically links to VLCs libdvdcss library (note vlc does not have to even be running) to "read" a protected dvd. So, in a nutshell if you have VLC media player on your system and also HandBrake ... Handbrake can "read" a css encrypted dvd.

As I said above whether or not you should choose this option is completely up to you and not advised by the HandBrake project in any way shape or form. It is simply there as an "option".

HandBrake as it's offered can not defeat *any* encryption.

 

[pMad]

You might *think* it is reasonable to rip a copy of a CD/DVD for your iPad, but the industry bosses beg to differ. Not that that stops anyone...

Morally, I don't think anyone should have a problem ripping a disc they legally purchased.

Legally, I don't think it is clear if this is a violation or not.

According to the DMCA ( Digital Millennium Copyright Act ), it’s illegal for you to rip a DVD that has CSS ( Content Scramble System ) on it.

However, it is legal for an individual in the United States to make a copy of media he/she owns for his/her own personal use.

I personally think Fair Use would trump as long as you are not distributing it.

Realistically, how is anyone ever going to find out?

 

[fishcove]

In general the DMCA protects the DVD but not the cd.

Irrespective of any "fair use" claims, it is illegal to circumvent the copy protection on commercial dvds, except in a very few specific situations.

Music cds are generally drm-free, so this does not apply.

 

[TallManNY]

In general the DMCA protects the DVD but not the cd.

Irrespective of any "fair use" claims, it is illegal to circumvent the copy protection on commercial dvds, except in a very few specific situations.

Music cds are generally drm-free, so this does not apply.

Has anyone really been prosecuted for ripping a DVD and then playing the ripped version in their own iPod? I think the "fair use" concept would trump the DMCA law, perhaps even resulting in a finding that aspects of DMCA are unconstitutional.

 

[vrDrew]

The main distinction between DVDs and CDs is that DVDs have copy protection enabled, and CDs don't.

The Digital Millenium Copyright Act made it illegal to "circumvent" copy-protection schemes. Meaning any tool, device, software, or act that enabled the breaking of Digital Rights Management restrictions was theoretically illegal.

Its has ALWAYS been illegal to distribute to third parties copies of copyrighted material. It was just as illegal to make photocopies Catcher In the Rye and sell them on the street in 1953 as it would be to sell bootlegged DVDs of Pirates of the Caribbean in 2004.

The difference, under DCMA, is that it isn't illegal to make a photocopy of Catcher in the Rye or a CD backup of Goats Head Soup for your own use. However a literal interpretation of the DCMA law would indicate that using DVD ripping tools that enabled the circumvention of the DRM contained on the DVD disc means that even people ripping copies for their own use were theoretically in violation of the law.

From a practical standpoint, however, its unlikely a consumer simply ripping a DVD to watch on his own iPad or Apple TV would run any risk of prosecution. What the DCMA does, however, is give content providers and the government a statuatory framework to go after the makers of "tools and software" that would enable people to do it.