Rumors about Mac Desktop Apps on iTunes?

[CodeJingle]

iTunes is traditionally an app store for iPod/iPhone. Has anyone heard rumors about possibly expanding iTunes to include an app store for Macs, or is this done already and I am just blind? I may post an expanded thread discussing this under the Mac section of the forums. Thanks very much for responses !

(PS There wasn't an 'app store' section under Macs in the forum, so this seemed like the best place to post this thread, let me know if I was mistaken)

 

[stridemat]

What's wrong with downloading them directly from the internet???

 

[CodeJingle]

What's wrong with downloading them directly from the internet???

A Mac app developer would have to pay for advertising and have to host their own site for that. Being able to host apps in iTunes is sort-of like free advertising and free hosting wrapped up in one. It is what makes being an iPod Touch or iPhone app developer so great.

Try and think of my question from the perspective of the app developer and publisher not just as a customer.

There is also the required process of collecting payment for the app if it is not free, which is built into a distribution system like iTunes. I think this is an untapped potential goldmine for Apple, and as an app developer I would really appreciate have the streamlined process of iPod Touch and iPhone app distribution at my disposal for Macs.

 

[stridemat]

Im not trying to be an ass about this but I can't see the point of an app store with websites such as http://www.macupdate.com/ which lists hundreds of downloadable software for a mac.

Having a closed development environment would kill the market. Open source software would have to comply with strict Apple rules.

It works for the iphone/ touch because that is a closed environment.

 

[CodeJingle]

Having a closed development environment would kill the market. Open source software would have to comply with strict Apple rules.

It works for the iphone/ touch because that is a closed environment.

SteamPoweredGames.com is a huge hit as a desktop software distribution system on PC (though mostly games), so that kind of kills your claims. I still value your feedback though. I personally think it would work great for iTunes to sell Mac desktop apps. So the general consensus of others is in the negative then?

Oh and stridemat I highly agree with your post signature

 

[stridemat]

Thanks, my sig is very correct at this moment in time.

Also for every success you say for a mac store I could think of one which has failed and does decrease development.

Other people agree with what you say and what I say see here and here so the jury is still out.

 

[CodeJingle]

Other people agree with what you say and what I say ... so the jury is still out.

I DO agree that having an app store for OS X should in no way impede any of the other ways to distribute and execute Mac apps compared to how things are currently. And I DO agree that if Apple opened an online OS X app store that they might go too far and then eventually Apple would force the app store to be the ONLY way to distribute Mac apps (and I don't want that).

I think the comment from one of those other threads "One single trusted source for customers" is as bad of a thing as it is good.

If Apple or another company (if Apple allowed) did it like SteamPoweredGames.com , then I think that would be great and it wouldn't take over and wouldn't impede any other type of distribution, it would just be a solid CHOICE for distribution (key word CHOICE).

So maybe if someone would give feedback on having a solid and widely used online Mac app distribution system assuming that for one moment Apple (or whatever company was running it) wasn't a huge monopolous secretive power-hungry corporation ?

(But that is like asking 'Give feedback on what the Republicans would do assuming they weren't acting like Republicans?')

Maybe if SteamPoweredGames simply expanded into the Mac realm that would be pretty much what I had in mind. Though I was planning on distributing other apps than just games.

I guess Kagi is a decent distribution system that is also for Mac apps (they also have a store here http://shop.kagi.com/ ) - I mean I've bought software apps through Kagi on my Mac for years (mostly emulators), though it doesn't have much of an online presence. If anyone else knows of any good online distribution systems for Mac apps let me know, I will probably post a thread in the programming section of the forum asking developers what systems they use for distribution of paid Mac apps.

Truthfully I just want a cheap way to sell Mac apps, without the hassles of self-distribution and worrying about handling payments and payment systems myself. I have done this before, it is a big headache. Again the greatness of iPod and iPhone app development is how this is all done for you, however much that is undone by awful crippling and monopolization. I'd like to find a balance between the two. I don't mind giving away some apps, but not all of them. I have a wife and two kids, I have to make a living somehow, despite how much I'd like every app ever made to be free.

 

[CodeJingle]

Special thanks to stridemat who is the only one so far to have responded to this thread

I posted a thread in the 'Mac Programming' section asking how developers and small companies host and sell their Mac apps, I encourage anyone with relevant info to post to the thread https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/818483/ ). The thread is aimed specifically for actual developers (lone and small companies) making a living selling Mac OS X apps.

 

[rorschach]

You might take a look at Bodega, which has (according to its site) 700+ apps.

http://appbodega.com/

 

[str1f3]

I think it's a good idea for a Mac App Store as long as you'd still be able to install apps outside of the App Store. It would make iTunes even more bloated of an app though. Apple already has a downloads page and all it would be doing is just tying in iTunes to the purchase. While I'm sure the devs may not be initially happy with Apple's 30% cut, I believe that they will make more money in the long run. I'm sure there many kids out there w/o a credit card that would like to use their gift cards towards Mac apps.

It would also be a lot easier to not have to worry about losing your license key since the app is tied to your iTunes account.

 

[nashmills]

An app store for the Apple TV would be nice.

 

[stridemat]

My decision to stop iPhone development has had everything to do with Apple's policies. I respect their right to manage their platform however they want, however I am philosophically opposed to the existence of their review process. I am very concerned that they are setting a horrible precedent for other software platforms, and soon gatekeepers will start infesting the lives of every software developer.

The web is still unrestricted and free, and so I am returning to my roots as a web developer. In the long term, I would like to be able to say that I helped to make the web the best mobile platform available, rather than being part of the transition to a world where every developer must go through a middleman to get their software in the hands of users.

Another case for not having an app store for mac. The developer of the facebook app does not like the review process.

 

[HowEver]

There's a place for this, in part:

http://www.apple.com/downloads/macosx/


.

 

[CodeJingle]

There's a place for this, in part:

http://www.apple.com/downloads/macosx/


.

Well it looks good, I think it would have better exposure to have this download list available through iTunes too. Anyone know how to get on this list ( http://www.apple.com/downloads/macosx/
)?

 

[CodeJingle]

Another case for not having an app store for mac. The developer of the facebook app does not like the review process.

Apple has historically been like this from the very beginning. Developers getting into the Mac and iPod/iPhone development arena should EXPECT to some degree to deal with a crazy, control-obsessed company. Definitely something for Apple dev newbies to keep in mind - APPLE IS A CONTROL FREAK! Trying to deny this is like trying to deny a part of Apple's heritage. I don't mind though, I've absorbed this and let it go many years ago. Although like stridemat I would like to limit Apple's craziness as much as possible however much I expect it of them.

Anyway if there is any way to get the best of both worlds (a streamlined online distribution and payment system for Mac OS X apps without the monopoly/control) then that would be ideal - I would rather hope for the best than be completely against it from the get-go.

If you really think about it, a few years ago this was the state of the music industry - people were begging for legitimate online distribution and the musicians and corporate giants were expecting the worst and would rather kill themselves then let that happen (Metallica was REALLY against this). I guess the only difference here is that people are expecting the worst because they have seen and experienced the worst, and don't like it. Funny, Apple took over that too

 

[CodeJingle]

Thanks again. It looks like the thread is dying so I will say goodbye for now, unless it kicks back up.

One point I will mention that I just found out today: Most closed platforms, like for console manufacturers Nintendo, Sony, and Microsoft - they all have an initial submission process for app ideas and app prototypes (that part I knew), which it seems is Apple's biggest flaw in their iTouch/iPhone distribution system. Apple expects the initial app submission to be the final version of the app (the part I didn't know), which is the point where a developer gets the final 'yes' or 'no' from Apple to sell in the iTunes store. So that is bad. Though the distribution system would be much more complicated if they did it correctly (going from 1 round of approvals to 2 effectively doubles the complexity), and the cost to be an iPhone/iTouch app developer would probably rise substantially from $100/y if they added that step to the process. So yeah, THAT REALLY DOES SUCK!

Oh, well this is a little off topic, but I heard someone say Apple is trying to take over online distribution of movies and video in general the same way it has already for music. Which is one way to explain why the sale of the new 1080p iMac coincided with the major upgrade of Apple TV and Apple's pitch of iTunes Subscriptions to TV Networks - and still no Blu-Ray as it would be a competitor to iTunes (though Blu-Ray drive has a much smaller profit-to-revenue margin than DVD drive I'm sure). So if correct it would still mean Apple is trying to 'take over'. So having a Mac OS X app store on iTunes has as much bad potential as it does good (arguably).

Later

 

[savanahrose]

thanks

Stridemat thanks for that link. I never really knew that existed. if i did I forgot about it. I will check it out later.
thanks again.

 

[strike1555]

Stupidest idea I have ever seen.

What's it going to sell? Moron tests? Fart apps? Nearly every app is a novelty item for a phone.

There is an app store. It's called the internet. Seriously. Why can't you just google what you need on the internet like the rest of us?
There's absolutely no point or need for such a thing. Media is the only exception and that's been done. Unless you count games on a Mac (LOL).

*facepalm*

I don't know where people think up such ridiculous ideas.

 

[MacToddB]

Apps on Mac

I would like to see an App Store for Mac... not to sell MacOS apps on the App Store, but rather to run iPhone apps on a Mac.

Basically, let non-developers run an iPhone Simulator and use the App Store to purchase/install apps to run in the simulator.

Of course you'd lose accelerometer, GPS, Compass and other functionality but it'd be nice to be able to run third party apps (i.e. besides my own) on a Mac. Especially for trying out free apps before you sync them to your i-device. And might help the halo effect by selling more Macs.

And if a tablet was really a Mac OS tablet, not iPhone OS, it could run apps (perhaps scaled up in resolution?) or multiple apps as widgets, and perhaps provide GPS, accelerometer, compass info, etc.

 

[str1f3]

Stupidest idea I have ever seen.

What's it going to sell? Moron tests? Fart apps? Nearly every app is a novelty item for a phone.

There is an app store. It's called the internet. Seriously. Why can't you just google what you need on the internet like the rest of us?
There's absolutely no point or need for such a thing. Media is the only exception and that's been done. Unless you count games on a Mac (LOL).

*facepalm*

I don't know where people think up such ridiculous ideas.

If you think the App Store or Mac apps are full of joke apps then you are proving your own stupidity. This topic had an article written about it at virtually every Mac site. As for the advantages of getting the app through iTunes instead of on the net:

1. No passwords. The app is tied to your account.
2. Security & trust. There is no one I trust more with my credit info.
3. Direct competition. A Mac app store could potentially drive down prices yet sell more copies which would be best for devs and customers. Also apps would still get more attention since the Mac is more about quality than quantity of apps.
4. Gift cards could also help drive sales during the holiday season and year long with the younger crowd that don't have access to a credit card.
5. It is easier to keep your software up to date because there is one centralized location to notify you of application updates.
6. Possibly better removal of software when deleted through iTunes. Some devs leave junk all over the place (I'm looking at you Adobe) and I'm sure that Apple would make it easier to completely remove an app from your computer which keep it running at its fastest.

There are a couple of downsides to this but I think there is a major upside. The major concern is App Store policies. Apple can't have the same policies with the Mac as they would with the iPhone and I'm pretty sure that apps like Transmission wouldn't be allowed.

 

[CodeJingle]

There is an app store. It's called the internet. Seriously. Why can't you just google what you need on the internet like the rest of us?
There's absolutely no point or need for such a thing. Media is the only exception and that's been done. Unless you count games on a Mac (LOL).

You obviously don't make a living trying to sell apps. At least that is what it sounds like. How do you make a living and provide for your family strike1555? Or maybe you are simply getting your kicks with a little light flaming. If you've ever made even just one app before and tried to make money off of it you would realize the hell of a hundred different ways to try and advertise it, sell it, and get paid for it. Simply hosting your own app on your own site and waiting for people to Google it? That isn't going to cut it. The owner of a friend's software company had your mindset, and guess what? The company tanked (Alter Ego Games Studio - their game 'Revolved' didn't make any money, despite winning the SlamDance 'Indie Game of the Year' competition http://www.slamdance.com/games/2005.html and being a finalist in the Independent Games Festival 2005 Competition http://www.igf.com/php-bin/entries2005.php?entry_id=70 - because the company's president thought just like you did)

And 'Hordes of Orcs' is a pretty good Mac game, I got it for free in the latest MacHeist NanoBundle. I played the game for like 12 hours straight. Best free game I ever played (*legally* free).

 

[CodeJingle]

As for the advantages of getting the app through iTunes instead of on the net...There are a couple of downsides to this but I think there is a major upside. The major concern is App Store policies. Apple can't have the same policies with the Mac as they would with the iPhone...

Yup str1f3 your lengthy reply pretty much sums up my opinions.

 

[strike1555]

If you think the App Store or Mac apps are full of joke apps then you are proving your own stupidity. This topic had an article written about it at virtually every Mac site. As for the advantages of getting the app through iTunes instead of on the net:

1. No passwords. The app is tied to your account.
2. Security & trust. There is no one I trust more with my credit info.
3. Direct competition. A Mac app store could potentially drive down prices yet sell more copies which would be best for devs and customers. Also apps would still get more attention since the Mac is more about quality than quantity of apps.
4. Gift cards could also help drive sales during the holiday season and year long with the younger crowd that don't have access to a credit card.
5. It is easier to keep your software up to date because there is one centralized location to notify you of application updates.
6. Possibly better removal of software when deleted through iTunes. Some devs leave junk all over the place (I'm looking at you Adobe) and I'm sure that Apple would make it easier to completely remove an app from your computer which keep it running at its fastest.

There are a couple of downsides to this but I think there is a major upside. The major concern is App Store policies. Apple can't have the same policies with the Mac as they would with the iPhone and I'm pretty sure that apps like Transmission wouldn't be allowed.

Apparently, you can't read. Absolutely none of your points make a compelling reason to change current way things are done. It sounds like you are just plain lazy and want everything managed for you.

Your post = epic fail.

 

[str1f3]

Apparently, you can't read. Absolutely none of your points make a compelling reason to change current way things are done. It sounds like you are just plain lazy and want everything managed for you.

Your post = epic fail.

I wonder how old you are. You act like an imbecile. I read your simplistic post and you couldn't give valid reasons but just insult.

LOL, I want everything managed for me? Welcome to the whole point of tech, jerkoff, to make life easier.

 

[CodeJingle]

Yes str1f3 and I think strike1555 was too scared of looking bad to answer the question I directed directly to him. strike your way of thinking has failed miserably for devs and software companies, ones whose founders I know personally (again read my previous recent posts). Other people in this thread have given real reasons why it is potentially bad to have Mac OS X apps on iTunes, your reasons however are just ignorant and look more like you are getting a thrill from light flaming than trying to convey real information (though flaming was as much of a reason why forums were created as they were for exchanging useful information).

Hosting an app on a single webpage and waiting for the world to come to you only works if you have money to pay for real advertising. It otherwise takes merciless blood and sweat to promote an app, in some respects as much or more than the work to make the app. I and several others I know have done it before, so try and take my word for it. For a similar example, book writers usually have to tour the country to promote sales. A truly killer app would sell itself, but even a great developer might only make one of those once in their lifetime.