I understand the 16" MBP has PWM, which I am sensitive to, but have been getting by ok. What are the benefits to the Pro screen vs. the Air? Will it be a noticeable downgrade if I switch from a 16" MBP to 15" MBA?
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SCREEN COMPARISON - 16" MBP vs. 15" MBA
- Thread starter mstgkillr
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The biggest areas of difference between the MBP and 15" MBA screens are as follows:
With the Pro displays, you get a screen capable of over 3x the brightness, plus ProMotion (which can extend battery life due to not having to refresh the display as often). The higher pixel density will mean smoother looking images, although that's not readily apparent for most users. The mini LED backlighting means more even brightness across the display, and the increased GPU core counts of the MBP (16-38 cores compared to just 10 for the 15" Air) will come in handy when running applications or even processes which rely on the GPU more than the CPU.
| Specifications | 2023 15-inch MacBook Air | 2023 MacBook Pro |
|---|---|---|
| Max Resolution | 2880 x 1864 | 3024 x 1964 (14"), 3465 x 2234 (16") |
| Pixel Density | 224 ppi | 254 ppi |
| Brightness | 500 nits | XDR: 1000 nits sustained, 1600 nits peak SDR: 500 nits max |
| Backlighting | LED | Mini LED |
| Max Resolution | 2,880 x 1,864 | 3024 x 1964 (14"), 3456 x 2234 (16") |
| Display Technology | Wide Color P3, True Tone | Wide Color P3, True Tone, ProMotion |
With the Pro displays, you get a screen capable of over 3x the brightness, plus ProMotion (which can extend battery life due to not having to refresh the display as often). The higher pixel density will mean smoother looking images, although that's not readily apparent for most users. The mini LED backlighting means more even brightness across the display, and the increased GPU core counts of the MBP (16-38 cores compared to just 10 for the 15" Air) will come in handy when running applications or even processes which rely on the GPU more than the CPU.
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If I have the choice to get either a 16gm 15" Air or a 14 Pro (only $100) difference, what would you guys do? Tough call. I do feel the screen clarfity and ease of reading maybe easier on the 14 pro? I dont do video editing or any of that. I like reading a lot, and occasionally edit photos.
Unless you think you'll need HDMI or a built-in SD card slot regularly, go with the Air IMO.
yeah I dont need those, was thinking more the better screen, brighter more detail on the pro (if that's the case?)
I would get the pro for that $100 difference.
I just went through the comparison and went with the Pro. You have to REALLY want the larger screen. Everything about the Pro is better other than screen size and weight.
I did the opposite. After living with the 14" for 1.5 years, I'm letting it go for the 15" Air. Switching over, there's not much difference in performance for most tasks. I only ever see a difference when I'm pushing both while rendering 3D. Otherwise the 15" is just as fast as 14".
Screen real estate is a massive difference. Screen brightness is not so much. Not without employing hacks to force the 14" display into thinking it's perpetually displaying HDR but that actually breaks HDR compatibility too, so there's no happy medium.
The 15" runs cooler, requires much less of a charger to charge when it's being pushed to the max, and is silent.
The 14" with my tasks runs hotter, requires a beefier charger (anything less than 45W and it starts to drain the battery), and is still very finicky with non-Apple displays.
But it's up to you. You're asking this in the Pro section so most people will go with the Pro because it is indeed "more" in numbers. I personally don't feel that it is "more" as people are thinking. The 15" with M2 is actually still very fast and is in fact as fast or faster than the M1 Pro chip I'm replacing it with in most tasks except for GPU.
I don't see the "need" for myself to put up with a smaller screen, much smaller text (due to screen PPI being higher) or blurrier texts (if you go below native res to match text size vs the 15", texts become noticeably more blurry), and a chonkier, heavier, noisier device. But others who are valuing the combined "package" and don't mind having to work around some of the limitations (namely SDR being locked to 500 nits) will probably appreciate the 14" more.
not much performance difference when come to burst demand, sustained demand is another story. m2 pro or even m1 pro easily beat out m2 base in every other category besides single core burst demand.
i run vivid app just fine, it doesn't suffocate HDR compatibility, and in the likely chance that it does, a simple toggle off does the trick.
what are you metrics for that, the simple fact that the mba doesnt have a fan is a contradiction that the 15inch runs cooler. in my time testing out mba 15, with photoshop mba hits 100c within minutes of exporting raw 40mb+ photos. meanwhile my 14inch has a slight audible hum with an estimated 20-30db, which is practically near silent.
please define finicky, i have plugged my 14inch with many displays offered from different brands, from apple XDR pro to asus 1440p. never once had it acted up.
irrelevant, he could've asked this on reddit and would get similar answer. the 15inch is marginally faster in single core burst task performance, anything else the m2/m1 pro variant would easily trump the base m2 founded in the mba.
I don't know which MacBook Air you tested but here you go.
I think it's very clear which one is hotter at this point, no? Inside and outside. I also made absolutely sure the MacBook Air is ran down until it thermally throttles, too.
During this test, the MacBook Pro reported 2.5 hours remaining on battery. The Air reported... 7 hours remaining. It's also very clear which one will last until the very end.
As for external displays, if you don't know, you basically don't know. The resolution issue has since been resolved but support for this display is still not very seamless. It doesn't kick into the right DisplayPort mode. Apple's own displays like the XDR are fine.
And again, M1 Pro doesn't trump the M2 15" Air here at all. Air lasts 2.5x longer on battery for sustained workload because the chip is throttled to low power, and the overall temperature of the device is 10C less than 14" M1 Pro. Maybe M2 Pro tweaked the fan curve? But the M1 Pro was maxed out here so unless Apple improved the cooling substantially, I do not think the 14" is as magical as you are making it out to be. And I have proof.
P.S.: 16" is better though. It behaves more like the 15" Air and settles at around 90C for all chips eventually. Still battery life is very poor.
mba 15 256gb 16gb ram variant.
the mba has 2 more E core and MBP has 4 more P core, obviously when under burst performance the mba will have the edge since you are comparing m1 vs m2, and m2 has more e cores to begin with.
apple silicon thermal throttles above 100c, in your picture the max temp is only 89c. something doesn't add up here.
ok, but how long did it took the mba and how long did it take the mbp to complete the rendering. that is a much more important factor on a general basis.
i know AS has issues with non traditional resolution such as the ultrawide. but i'll withhold my comment since i don't have enough hands on experience, however, i will say this, if this can be configured in 3rd party software, then its a matter of chance for apple to release any future update. btw, you don't need to be condescending.
yes, i did forget about the battery. on the battery front the m1 is lacking compare to the m2 purely because of the more e cores. but outside of these two and perhaps weight? the 14inch trumps overall.
and for the record, i never claim the 14inch is magical, you state one side of the narrative, and i simply state the other. please don't put words in my mouth.
lol your proof so far doesn't line up with credible reviews done by others nor general user experience. from the screen comparison you did to the sound comparison.
I'm not being condescending. You are simply asking about things that I suspect you don't know about, hence that comment.
I never claimed the M2 runs everything faster than M1 Pro. Definitely not Cinebench. But I can tell you the M1 Pro is about 2x faster here. It's 2x faster for 3x the power draw. For some, that may be worth it because their task may need to be finished 1-2 hours earlier. For me, it's not because I don't regularly run tasks like what Cinebench does. To each their own.
So now you're trying to refute actual numerical results posted that contradict your own narrative? Quite a discussion we're having.
i'm not trying to, i'm refuting your results because the thermal throttle limit on the m2 is 100c, me and countless others seen it, yet on your cinebench run, max temp is 92c and you claimed you have ran down to thermal throttle? make it make sense.
edit: literally 3rd video on youtube from search.
You have the answer in my screenshot. It's 100C but only for the first few minutes and then it'll eventually settle down to 90C when the chip is throttled to 10W. You don't see that in Max Tech's video because they didn't let it run for that long. Their chip is still at 15W consistently during that video.
what app are you using for monitoring,
i did 8 pass, and i have a m1 max, it reached 100c for about 3 seconds during 1st pass before the fans kicked in and stablized between 91-97c, and this is definitely not the most optimal way of testing since i have 40 tabs open on chrome with a suite of my workflow apps in the background. so yeah, the results temp would be lower.
Quiet the conversations
I still think the NEW 15” is the future direction. Of apple laptops, the 14” looks so outdated. Sure for programming, etc you guys need it. The firm factor is simply amazing !! I don’t miss my 16” at all!
I still think the NEW 15” is the future direction. Of apple laptops, the 14” looks so outdated. Sure for programming, etc you guys need it. The firm factor is simply amazing !! I don’t miss my 16” at all!
not sure how you arrive at that conclusion consider the 15inch is literally just a bigger version of the 13inch, and the 13inch is just a thinner and smaller design of the 14inch. design philosophy wise they are all the same.Quiet the conversations
This is funny to hear after so many people complained for years about the thin Pro enclosures! Cooling, ports, battery, better keyboard (than the old butterfly) all require the extra thickness. For many, the thickness is a worthwhile tradeoff for those.
Quiet the conversations
How is the 14" the outdated one and not the 13" (which honestly has no place in the current lineup post-15" Air)?
The 13" still uses the Intel-era design, complete with the touchbar and only USB-C for connectivity. In fact, it's the only laptop in the lineup that doesn't use MagSafe now. It's definitely NOT a smaller version of the 14" design.
But it’s time to not settle for trade offs
meant 13 air sorry. I just don’t like the marshmallow designs. It’s annoying
People complained because the chips used in those enclosures required higher cooling capacity. But now that Apple has chips that do not require such high cooling, they made the enclosures and cooling even thicker and more overkill than what was already in the older devices.
And I suspect many people are just buying the Pro devices in hopes that their workflows will be faster, but there are "pro" workflows where the bigger devices with more cooling and even more RAM don't really provide any tangible benefits at all. Here's one:
^ I thought I was crazy since I'm seeing the same thing, but that video verifies it: this is what I've been seeing with my coding workflow. The M2 Air 15" is just as fast if not even faster than M1 Pro 14" when it comes to Docker in my experience.
The same thing goes for non-multithreaded non-sustained Java apps.
The same thing goes for Python as well...
Sure, some pros may see real benefits here, but I think the whole ARM transition is still in its infancy, so many "pro" workflows still need to be updated and adjusted. For now, I think the Air fits my needs, but for the others, I'd say perhaps they may want to very closely evaluate again exactly just how much power and performance they really need.
If you don't mind the extra weight, get the 16" MacBook Pro. ProMotion, 2x native retina scaling and HDR support are just amazing and it's a shame the MacBook Air doesn't have them..