Seeking better sound + integration with the Apple TV 4K device and HomePod Mini

[94114]

I’m trying to find a good, economical sound solution for watching tv in my living room (15’ x 15’ with three walls. The other end is open to the dining room/kitchen.) I have a Samsung TV and I use an Apple TV 4K device and remote to control the tv. For audio I’m using a HomePod Mini, but I just can’t distinguish words in the deeper end of the spectrum.

Any suggestions on what I can add to my Apple family to get better sound? Perhaps add a second Mini?

Been looking at soundbars for around $300, but I’m clueless. Of course, I don’t want to have to use some sort of hub or have to use a different remote.

Suggestions?

 

[AL2TEACH]

Any suggestions

You can get another mini because 1 will not do and use the same remote.
You can get a soundbar and some like Vizio will also have speakers and might have to use a different remote but that's might.
With both of these you will get stereo or/and surround sound(with speakers). You will not get Dolby Atmos but assuming that's okay with you. Eh, just took a peek and some models and companies do say they support Dolby Atmos(5.1) in your price range.

 

[Kenny99]

Suggest a soundbar. Look at Amazon. Take care of the packing as you might want to return the item. I have a Vizo and it does the Dolby Atmos and the volume works with the Apple Remote when connected with the HDMI (ARC).

 

[94114]

Thanks, @Kenny99. That helps. So when I'm looking for a soundbar, I would need one that is Airplay and Atmos capable, right? A cable from the HDMI ARC outlet of the TV would plug into the soundbar, and then I'll be able to operate with the 4K remote and Siri (& leaving the soundbar remote in a drawer) once I set it up?

Weird how no Vizio products are on Apple's list of compatible products. I guess I'm missing something.

 

[onenorth]

The soundbar does not need AirPlay since you can AirPlay through the Apple TV.

I have an old Vizio sound bar. My Tivo (cable box) is connected to the soundbar, which is connected to the ARC port of the Samsung TV. My Apple TV is connected to a second HDMI port of the Samsung. I use the Samsung remote to select the input (either the Tivo or the Apple TV) and the audio automatically switches. I also have the Samsung TV set up to control the Apple TV with the Samsung remote, so I can use either the Samsung remote or the Apple remote for the Apple TV (I still need the Tivo remote for controlling the Tivo).

So I really only need two remotes, although I have four: Tivo, Apple, Samsung and Vizio (for the soundbar, but I only use it to switch to Bluetooth if I want to stream audio without the Apple TV).

 

[bluespark]

I’m trying to find a good, economical sound solution for watching tv in my living room (15’ x 15’ with three walls. The other end is open to the dining room/kitchen.) I have a Samsung TV and I use an Apple TV 4K device and remote to control the tv. For audio I’m using a HomePod Mini, but I just can’t distinguish words in the deeper end of the spectrum.

Any suggestions on what I can add to my Apple family to get better sound? Perhaps add a second Mini?

Been looking at soundbars for around $300, but I’m clueless. Of course, I don’t want to have to use some sort of hub or have to use a different remote.

Suggestions?

For better sound than a typical soundbar would provide, consider a pair of AudioEngine powered speakers. You can connect them by wire to the Apple TV and they sound excellent for the price.

 

[han42solo]

Hey 94114: I had a very similar issue where I had a single HomePod mini and was having trouble hearing voices on movies. My living room has similar dimensions, as well. I considered a 2nd mini, but ended up buying a refurb HomePod gen 2 from the Apple Refurb site. $250 is a little easier to swallow than $300, and the quality is the same. And I gotta tell ya…the single Gen 2 sounds incredible. I rarely need to turn it up beyond 50% volume. Full disclosure: I’m pretty “pro-Apple” so I like to keep it in the family, but the integration between my Apple TV 4K and the Gen 2 is superb, and I can turn my TV on and off with my Apple TV remote…which is surprisingly life-changing. My vote is refurb HomePod gen 2…both black and white are available right now! (I do not work for Apple)

 

[nospleen]

Hey 94114: I had a very similar issue where I had a single HomePod mini and was having trouble hearing voices on movies. My living room has similar dimensions, as well. I considered a 2nd mini, but ended up buying a refurb HomePod gen 2 from the Apple Refurb site. $250 is a little easier to swallow than $300, and the quality is the same. And I gotta tell ya…the single Gen 2 sounds incredible. I rarely need to turn it up beyond 50% volume. Full disclosure: I’m pretty “pro-Apple” so I like to keep it in the family, but the integration between my Apple TV 4K and the Gen 2 is superb, and I can turn my TV on and off with my Apple TV remote…which is surprisingly life-changing. My vote is refurb HomePod gen 2…both black and white are available right now! (I do not work for Apple)

There’s an “enhanced dialogue” setting for the audio that helps with voice clarity. I turn that on for both my mini and regular HomePods throughout our house.

 

[HobeSoundDarryl]

Up the budget and get a top-rated soundbar for that room. Your goal is QUALITY of sound and quality costs money. When low budget clashes with a quality goal, one of those is going to give... usually the latter.

About any soundbar is going to improve dialogue vs. a HP mini (or full size)... which was never intended to be a TV speaker alternative (they just happen to be able to be used like if someone wants to do so). At its core, a soundbar is a center channel speaker positioned right above or right below the TV. It should automatically sound better for center channel sound- which is often dialogue- just because it is basically that type of speaker and it is almost always positioned right where such a source of that particular kind of sound should be. Soundbars also merge in left & right channels and some will have up-firing speakers for faux ATMOS too... but with your focus on better dialogue, that is a core benefit of them.

Read reviews and step up to the higher end of soundbars. EVERYTHING will sound better with better quality.

A top-rated one that offers MANY benefits and is readily compatible with Apple offerings in HP-like ways is the Sonos Arc... 139% higher than your $300 target in their refurb store right now. If you don't want Alexa or Google voice control, Arc SL Shadow is the same speaker without voice assistants for 126% more than your working budget.

Sonos Arc sounds fantastic, has airplay 2, works with Apple Music (as well as over a hundred other services too) and you can use Siri to control it via the Siri in your AppleTV or iDevice or Mac. Arc can be the foundational speaker to which you can add others to build out a full surround sound setup over time... such as by adding 2 rear speakers and maybe their subwoofer too. Additions link together easily as a system and "just work." It all feels very Apple-like... including the pricing premium.

Yes, this would involve having to convince yourself to spend up to 139% more than a working budget, but you'll likely spend towards 250% of that budget for the next iPhone that you might keep for only 3 or 4 years and then spend towards 270% for the iPhone after that. Buy yourself a great speaker now and you will probably still be enjoying it 10-15 years from now... over which time you'll pay much more for each of maybe 3-4 iPhones. Unlike phones, speakers have long-useful-life legs. So budget accordingly.

If that is just too much for a soundbar when you have perhaps got mentally married to $300 for one, a high rated alternative that is basically a whole system for about the same money is Polk Audio Magnify MAX AX. I just helped someone set one of these up in a room about the size of yours and it is a great value for a whole soundbar-based system... especially considering that you get the surround sound speakers and a good subwoofer too. In short: this is a good & simple whole surround sound system in ONE box. This option is also a little over double your budget but you would be leaping from one little HP mini not pleasing your ears for this purpose to an entire surround sound setup in ONE purchase. Your ears would definitely notice that in a BIG way.

Either of these options will be able to be basically controlled with the Apple Remote... and/or with their dedicated apps on your iDevice(s).

Yes, both of these suggestions run a bit over double the budget... but budget may be driving your unhappiness with the quality of sound you are getting from trying to make that HP mini do this job. Save up a portion of ONE iPhone purchase and buy yourself a great soundbar or whole surround system that you'll likely enjoy for 10-15 years. If you were to head-to-head test either of these against ANY $300 soundbar, your ears will almost certainly notice a big difference. If you think in terms of life of device, that's 10-15 years of enjoying superior sound vs. so-so sound... all over a few hundred dollars more.

 

[Kenny99]

With your budget $300 I would look at this on Amazon. As I said be careful of the packaging if you choose to return it.

VIZIO M-Series 5.1 Premium Sound Bar with Dolby Atmos, DTS:X, Bluetooth, Wireless Subwoofer and Alexa Compatibility, M51ax-J6, 2022 Model​

 

[AL2TEACH]

I guess I'm missing something.

Vizio's prices are consumer friendly

 

[hippyeverafter]

For better sound than a typical soundbar would provide, consider a pair of AudioEngine powered speakers. You can connect them by wire to the Apple TV and they sound excellent for the price.

Totally agree. I must of spent the equivalent of the UK GDP over the years on loads of sound bars all of which failed to live up to their hype, especially claims regarding making dialogue clearer whilst watching films. Also tried HomePod both OG and Mini but both failed to come up to scratch!. Have a look at Klipsch in particular. I have a pair of R - 41PM set up in the bedroom and would imagine they will sound great connected to my TV although have never tried.

 

[HobeSoundDarryl]

OPs key issue here is dialogue clarity. Since he clearly states he wants a soundbar, I chose not to go to the very best possible option... which is not 2 stereo speakers regardless of what he would pay. If dialogue is goal and separate speakers would be considered, I'd passionately argue for at least a 3 speaker setup made up of high quality speakers such as some of those named left & right WITH a center channel speaker where a Soundbar typically goes. The center speaker would own the dialogue. A great quality center speaker will fully resolve OPs issues with clear dialogue.

If OP would open up to this, the classic- and still very best- path would be to buy a great Receiver and start with 3 speakers up front. Then, anytime OP likes add at least 2 surround speakers... and maybe a SUB. OP explicitly mentions ATMOS (which cannot be had with any soundbar alone or with any 2 speakers at any price) so OP would need to get some overhead speakers in place and connect them to an ATMOS capable receiver too. That would deliver TRUE ATMOS vs. the faux ATMOS spun on these single and dual speaker offerings.

True ATMOS is physical speakers spread around the listening area (classic surround sound setups) PLUS some speakers overhead too. If one visits a professional theater built for TRUE ATMOS and takes a good look around before the lights go down, you will see speakers down front, center, beside, behind and overhead. You will find no professional ATMOS theater with 1 soundbar or up to 2 HPs or any 2 stereo speakers down front alone.

Every speaker offering that is not surround + overhead speakers that prints ATMOS in the marketing and on the box are offering FAUX ATMOS... basically bending the ATMOS concept in a big way to find some legal standing to claim as little as one speaker is delivering ATMOS.

However, OP clearly states a desire for soundbar over this kind of setup, so I think his problem is actually BUDGET: too low for high quality. If he steps up to higher quality soundbars for that size of room, he'll like get exactly what he wants (though not true ATMOS). Very good soundbars can sound very good. Cheap ones do not compete on sound.

And if he wants very best sound and the only real path to TRUE ATMOS, he needs to bail on the soundbar concept and embrace a much bigger budget (maybe at least 1.5-3 or so iPhones) for a great Receiver and high quality "dumb" speakers. A bonus to this option is dumb speakers- lacking the hard marriage to tech smarts- will expand that 10-15 years of life offered in my prior post into about 20-30 years of life (because they won't be arbitrarily vintaged by a parent Corp and/or fail to work when other hardware & software evolves away from what works with the final version of those smarts). He'll simply need to update the Receiver perhaps as little as once- maybe twice- during all that time.

I encourage anyone wanting great home theater sound to go this way (Receiver + dumb-but-high-quality speakers). The fall back is high quality soundbars ike those I referenced in the prior post... that still offer a way to layer in surround sound and subwoofer. The fallback to that is a single soundbar, sacrificing surround sound, SUB, etc options. Stuff like HPs and stereo speakers are best used for MUSIC, which is the original and main intent of HPs. Stereo only setups for video purposes was left behind in about 1991 with the rollout of the first Dolby Digital tech.

 

[bluespark]

OPs key issue here is dialogue clarity. Since he clearly states he wants a soundbar, I chose not to go to the very best possible option... which is not 2 stereo speakers regardless of what he would pay. If dialogue is goal and separate speakers would be considered, I'd passionately argue for at least a 3 speaker setup made up of high quality speakers such as some of those named left & right WITH a center channel speaker where a Soundbar typically goes. The center speaker would own the dialogue. A great quality center speaker will fully resolve OPs issues with clear dialogue.

If OP would open up to this, the classic- and still very best- path would be to buy a great Receiver and start with 3 speakers up front. Then, anytime OP likes add at least 2 surround speakers... and maybe a SUB. OP explicitly mentions ATMOS (which cannot be had with any soundbar alone or with any 2 speakers at any price) so OP would need to get some overhead speakers in place and connect them to an ATMOS capable receiver too. That would deliver TRUE ATMOS vs. the faux ATMOS spun on these single and dual speaker offerings.

True ATMOS is physical speakers spread around the listening area (classic surround sound setups) PLUS some speakers overhead too. If one visits a professional theater built for TRUE ATMOS and takes a good look around before the lights go down, you will see speakers down front, center, beside, behind and overhead. You will find no professional ATMOS theater with 1 soundbar or up to 2 HPs or any 2 stereo speakers down front alone.

Every speaker offering that is not surround + overhead speakers that prints ATMOS in the marketing and on the box are offering FAUX ATMOS... basically bending the ATMOS concept in a big way to find some legal standing to claim as little as one speaker is delivering ATMOS.

However, OP clearly states a desire for soundbar over this kind of setup, so I think his problem is actually BUDGET: too low for high quality. If he steps up to higher quality soundbars for that size of room, he'll like get exactly what he wants (though not true ATMOS). Very good soundbars can sound very good. Cheap ones do not compete on sound.

And if he wants very best sound and the only real path to TRUE ATMOS, he needs to bail on the soundbar concept and embrace a much bigger budget (maybe at least 1.5-3 or so iPhones) for a great Receiver and high quality "dumb" speakers. A bonus to this option is dumb speakers- lacking the hard marriage to tech smarts- will expand that 10-15 years of life offered in my prior post into about 20-30 years of life (because they won't be arbitrarily vintaged by a parent Corp and/or fail to work when other hardware & software evolves away from what works with the final version of those smarts). He'll simply need to update the Receiver perhaps as little as once- maybe twice- during all that time.

I encourage anyone wanting great home theater sound to go this way (Receiver + dumb-but-high-quality speakers). The fall back is high quality soundbars ike those I referenced in the prior post... that still offer a way to layer in surround sound and subwoofer. The fallback to that is a single soundbar, sacrificing surround sound, SUB, etc options. Stuff like HPs and stereo speakers are best used for MUSIC, which is the original and main intent of HPs. Stereo only setups for video purposes was left behind in about 1991 with the rollout of the first Dolby Digital tech.

Dialogue definition is outstanding with two high-quality powered speakers. I've done many setups this way, and the dialogue is clearer than with a typical soundbar. Also, and although this is not intuitive, the dialogue sounds like it is coming from the center if you do this right.

A three-speaker solution or an Atmos solution (both which require a receiver) can work, but they are not necessarily better. If money is the object, stereo sound is hard to beat.

 

[HobeSoundDarryl]

Perhaps. I've been in Home & Studio Audio/Video since about 1992, professionally for a few years. One fundamental rule is actual > faux. Leaning on 2 speakers to create a faux center speaker should generally NOT be better than having a good center speaker being an actual center.

Leaning on 2 stereo speakers means both are playing what would come from the center to create the illusion of centralized sound- dialogue in this case. An actual 3 speaker setup is going to route that "same" sound from twin speakers in a stereo setup TO that center speaker so it will originate there. What one is supposed to hear from the left will still play in the left, what one is supposed to hear from the right will stay play from the right and what one is supposed to hear from the center will come from an actual center, typically positioned right below or right above the TV screen.

That shared, I can fully agree on the "not necessarily better" which can be easily achieved by having a great pair of quality stereo speakers and then cheaping out on the center. And that can be vice-versa'd too... such as buying a top quality soundbar and pitting it against bargain basement stereo speakers. One could also argue a side by considering source: if the source is stereo, stereo speakers are going to play the source as good as it can be played. If the source if 5.1 or 7.1 or ATMOS, stereo is going to be attempting to play parts not intended to come from only 2 speakers.

IMO and with some generalities, the key tips to great home theater sound goes like this:

1. No faux- get great quality speakers spread around the prime seating area. Don't lean on any technical trickery to create dedicated channels in the audio mix. Actual speakers "there" > Faux.
2. Don't cheap out. This is the rare bit of tech that can be purchased as little as ONE time and last up to one's entire life without losing quality. So budget accordingly and pay up for best quality. One does not "win" this contest by chasing cheapest prices. They are basically just shooting themselves in the audio foot when price dominates the thinking.
3. Consider the full, intended use and buy what directly and fully supports that. For example, if one is only ever going to listen to stereo sources like music, focus on buying 2 terrific stereo speakers. If one is wanting home theater for video, up to MANY speakers are required to create true ATMOS... or 7.1 or 5.1.
4. While somewhat generalizing:
   • a good Receiver + great dumb speakers is THE way to the very best home theater setup.
   • Soundbar based options are notches below that, but if one wants a soundbar, focus on the options that work with the core "rest" of a home theater setup like surround speakers and subwoofer... and see #2, as not all soundbar systems are equal.
   • A quality pair of surround sound headphones is potentially comparable at this level... but generally a solo experience... and if headphones, wired > bluetooth.
   • The lone soundbar is notches below that and I'll lump it with 2 speaker stereo setups here. HOWEVER, one could start with a 2-speaker setup- if they are "dumb" speakers- and then add in "the rest" of a surround sound setup over time... so that is a big advantage of 2 stereo speakers over lone soundbar.
   • Mono speaker is notches below that and the speakers built into the TV is towards the very bottom.

Are there exceptions to the #4 stack? Of course! One could buy a fantastic quality pair of stereo speakers and enjoy stereo sound source that sounds way better than bargain soundbar surround sound setup. And all kinds of other variables can come into play such as the room size & shape, the floor and wall material, the prime seating location, etc.

HOWEVER, OP says they want a soundbar and this is drifting way off that target. OPs primary issue is clarity of dialogue, so the key problem is a quality of speaker issue. Put the two together and OPs problem is likely budget: $300 is too little when high-rated soundbars cost double to triple that budget. To get what OP wants, he should likely UP his budget and buy a premium quality bar. I offered 2 good choices in that prior post and there are other great ones up in that price tier too. Down at $300 though, he's probably NOT going to get what he seeks. He may get something that sounds better than the HP he has now, but he probably won't get that dialogue as clear as he wishes it could be. There are PLENTY of soundbars at $300 but his core problem is actually quality of sound.

 

[bluespark]

Perhaps, I've been in Home & Studio Audio/Video since about 1992, professionally for a few years. One fundamental rule is actual > faux. Leaning on 2 speakers to create a faux center speaker should generally NOT be better than having a good center speaker being an actual center.

Leaning on 2 stereo speakers means both are playing what would come from the center to create the illusion of centralized sound- dialogue in this case. An actual 3 speaker setup is going to route that "same" sound from twin speakers in a stereo setup TO that center speaker so it will originate there. What one is supposed to hear from the left will still play in the left, what one is supposed to hear from the right will stay play from the right and what one is supposed to hear from the center will come from an actual center, typically positioned right below or right above the TV screen.

That shared, I can fully agree on the "not necessarily better" which can be easily achieved by having a great pair of quality stereo speakers and then cheaping out on the center. And that can be vice-versa'd too... such as buying a top quality soundbar and pitting it against bargain basement stereo speakers. One could also argue a side by considering source: if the source is stereo, stereo speakers are going to play the source as good as it can be played. If the source if 5.1 or 7.1 or ATMOS, stereo is going to be attempting to play parts not intended to come from only 2 speakers.

IMO and with some generalities, the key tips to great home theater sound goes like this:

1. No faux- get great quality speakers spread around the prime seating area. Don't lean on any technical trickery to create dedicated channels in the audio mix. Actual speakers "there" > Faux.
2. Don't cheap out. This is the rare bit of tech that can be purchased as little as ONE time and last up to one's entire life without losing quality. So budget accordingly and pay up for best quality. One does not "win" this contest by chasing cheapest prices. They are basically just shooting themselves in the audio foot when price dominates the thinking.
3. Consider the full, intended use and buy what directly and fully supports that. For example, if one is only ever going to listen to stereo sources like music, focus on buying 2 terrific stereo speakers. If one is wanting home theater for video, up to MANY speakers are required to create true ATMOS... or 7.1 or 5.1.
4. While somewhat generalizing:
   • a good Receiver + and great dumb speakers is THE way to the very best home theater setup.
   • Soundbar based options are notches below that, but if one wants a soundbar, focus on the options that work with the core "rest" of a home theater setup like surround speakers and subwoofer... and see #2, as not all soundbar systems are equal.
   • A quality pair of surround sound headphones is potentially comparable at this level... but generally a solo experience... and if headphones, wired > bluetooth.
   • The lone soundbar is notches below that and I'll lump it with 2 speaker stereo setups here. HOWEVER, one could start with a 2-speaker setup- if they are "dumb" speakers- and then add in "the rest" of a surround sound setup over time... so that is a big advantage of 2 stereo speakers over lone soundbar.
   • Mono speaker is notches below that and the speakers built into the TV is towards the very bottom.

Are there exceptions to the #4 stack? Of course! One could buy a fantastic quality pair of stereo speakers and enjoy stereo sound source that sounds way better than bargain soundbar surround sound setup. And all kinds of other variables can come into play such as the room size & shape, the floor and wall material, the prime seating location, etc.

HOWEVER, OP says they want a soundbar and this is drifting way off that target. OPs primary issue is clarity of dialogue, so the key problem is a quality of speaker issue. Put the two together and OPs problem is likely budget: $300 is too little when high-rated soundbars cost double to triple that budget. To get what OP wants, he should likely UP his budget and buy a premium quality bar. I offered 2 good choices in that prior post and there are other great ones up in that price tier too. Down at $300 though, he's probably NOT going to get what he seeks. He may get something that sounds better than the HP he has now, but he probably won't get that dialogue as clear as he wishes it could be. There are PLENTY of soundbars at $300 but his core problem is actually quality of sound.

Your additional nuance is well-taken and I really don't disagree with any of that.

 

[Kenny99]

HobeSoundDarryl: The only thing that I would mention to your advice (as good as it is) is OLD ears. Hearing degrades over the years due to many things. (to many to list here) and the room size and furnishings also come into play. Get the best that you can afford with an eye to the future.

 

[HobeSoundDarryl]

I fully agree, but whether old or young years, quality is quality. We don't know OPs age or ear degradation but- whatever it is- quality of sound will be better than lower quality of sound. Less sensitive ears will probably have a harder time hearing lower quality of speaker output than younger ears perhaps more sensitive and thus better able to adjust to cheaper quality.

Besides, old ears typically have guests come over and watch TV with them. And the guests will sometimes have younger or better ears. Give the overall audience a little consideration too.

And if OP buys quality and still struggles, perhaps OP should look into hearing aids and similar to fix the ears instead of hoping to get the fix in a speaker(s). Else, do what fading ears sometimes do: CRANK up the volume.

If OP is old with fading ears, it sounds like a very good reason to take some of the stuff they like to watch to a speaker retailer and listen to a selection of speakers in person. That's a great way to also consider cheaper options vs. more expensive options and see if their ears can hear a difference.

 

[Kenny99]

HobeSoundDarryl: Thanks again for the suggestions, I never thought to look for an "Audio Store" as I thought of them more a Car Audio and High End ($) Home systems. I did a search on Audio store near me and did fine a few. I never had much luck with listening to systems and speakers at Best Buy, Walmart, Target, type stores due to the environment and sales people who think that Louder is better. Will keep your information in mind when it's time to upgrade my system. Yep I'm in the OLD ears (hearing aids due to ringing in my ears) and the $300 to $500 range. The problem with stores like Crutchfield, Bose, Sonos, etc. is if you don't know what you want your at a disadvantage. Buy - Try - Return - repeat, repeat, etc.