Other Should we tone down the camera comparisons a bit?

[jntdroid]

I'm as guilty as the next person at getting caught up in analyzing these cameras to death, so I'm definitely the pot calling the kettle black here. But I had two scenarios over the weekend that helped bring me back into a more balanced perspective.

I had my 16e with me over the weekend. I've also had a 17P, 17, and Air over the past few weeks (again, pot/kettle), so my wife had no idea I only had the 16e with me this time around.

First, I sent some photos (taken with both with the rear and selfie camera, in mid lighting) of my family to other family and a couple of friends. You know what they said?

"I can't even tell what's going on. Are y'all even in those photos?" And, "Hey, I can kind of make out your face, but your ear is a little out of focus. What phone could you possibly be using that would do that?"

Obviously sarcasm, but actually it was, "Y'all look great!", "Glad to see y'all looking good!", "Your kids have gotten so big!"...

You know why? Because even the 16e did a good job of capturing the moment and the point of the photo.

Second, a group photo in poor lighting - wife offered up my phone b/c she thought I had one of the new ones with me. Nobody else knew the difference. The photo was - by this forum's standards anyway - just ok. Definitely not great, but not bad either. But everybody thought it was taken on one of the new ones, and saw it and said things like, "oh yeah I can see the difference, that's really nice."

You know why? Because again, it captured the moment and did a good job of that. Nobody cared if some small details were a little out of focus, all they cared about was that they could see every smiling face and get an idea of the environment in that moment.

So instead of all of the heated rhetoric around, "You're paying more for a lesser camera" and "you're paying for camera features you don't need", why can't it just be "you're paying for what you want, that's awesome, I hope you enjoy it as much as I'm enjoying what I paid for." It's a little absurd to actually argue over this stuff to the point of conflict... 🤷‍♂️

 

[danpass]

I stayed with the Air over the 17 Pro and kept my 16 Pro as a "camera" because it has ultra wide angle.

Did I miss the ultra enough to reach in my other pocket and grab the 16P this past weekend?

Yes, sometimes, but it wasn't earth shattering to stick with the Air. I knew it wouldn't be. I also knew there would be times I would run out of foot zoom distance. (ie, have to cross the street and THEN take the architecture shot lol)

The post processing on the Air photos is phenomenal. We need those programmers to work on iOS lol.

-

 

[JPack]

Most of the comparisons debated don't seem to be about minor details. It's about the inability to take a shot without ultrawide. If you're indoors, you probably can't stand back further because there's wall or furniture behind you. Same thing with outdoor landscape or cityscapes. Most people can't walk 500 ft. back to take the shot.

 

[jntdroid]

Most of the comparisons debated don't seem to be about minor details. It's about the inability to take a shot without ultrawide. If you're indoors, you probably can't stand back further because there's wall or furniture behind you. Same thing with outdoor landscape or cityscapes. Most people can't walk 500 ft. back to take the shot.

Yeah maybe so, I feel like I've seen a little of everything being debated. But regardless, the conflict that's come up in some of these threads is silly, especially over something that's inconsequential to 99.9% of the population (and no, I'm not new to the internet!).

 

[eyoungren]

Most of the pictures I take are either product shots (stuff on store shelves) that I send to my wife so she can tell me what item to get, or for things I post here.

I have yet to have my wife complain that the box of Hostess donuts pic that I sent her has bad lighting. And I have yet to have anyone here critique the quality of my pics either. The subject matter may be a different story though, lots of critiquing on that over the years.

Ultimately, the quality of the camera is pretty low on my reasons to get a new iPhone.

 

[lkalliance]

Yeah maybe so, I feel like I've seen a little of everything being debated. But regardless, the conflict that's come up in some of these threads is silly, especially over something that's inconsequential to 99.9% of the population (and no, I'm not new to the internet!).

I suppose the people having these debates feel they are part of the .1%. Or aspire to be.

 

[lkalliance]

Most of the pictures I take are either product shots (stuff on store shelves) that I send to my wife so she can tell me what item to get, or for things I post here.

I have yet to have my wife complain that the box of Hostess donuts pic that I sent her has bad lighting. And I have yet to have anyone here critique the quality of my pics either. The subject matter may be a different story though, lots of critiquing on that over the years.

Ultimately, the quality of the camera is pretty low on my reasons to get a new iPhone.

Yesterday I was lying down and looked over and there was my dog zonked out in the sun. I picked up my new 17 pro and shot the attached photos.

No phone I’ve ever had could have gotten this quality (just upgraded from 13 mini, this is my first pro) without my getting up and moving closer and probably waking her up and losing the shot. It gave me some pleasure. It was nice to share them with my wife without wishing they were better shots.

Even if they disappear from my mind within a day, it was something pleasant that happened and that’s nice. This kind of thing happens to me often enough that having this great camera for me is a huge positive even if I never do anything “professional” with it.

 

[eyoungren]

Yesterday I was lying down and looked over and there was my dog zonked out in the sun. I picked up my new 17 pro and shot the attached photos.

No phone I’ve ever had could have gotten this quality (just upgraded from 13 mini, this is my first pro) without my getting up and moving closer and probably waking her up and losing the shot. It gave me some pleasure. It was nice to share them with my wife without wishing they were better shots.

Even if they disappear from my mind within a day, it was something pleasant that happened and that’s nice. This kind of thing happens to me often enough that having this great camera for me is a huge positive even if I never do anything “professional” with it.

We have a number of shots like that, but our last cat died I think over two years ago. We don't have any more pets after him and I don't expect anymore. 20 years of being the only person in the house bending over the litterbox every other day and I'm done with all of that.

Of course we have all the important family shots (first day of school, graduation, etc), but in large part we don't have a lifestyle where we are taking many pictures.

Cameras and taking pictures aren't a big deal to us.

 

[lkalliance]

We have a number of shots like that, but our last cat died I think over two years ago. We don't have any more pets after him and I don't expect anymore. 20 years of being the only person in the house bending over the litterbox every other day and I'm done with all of that.

Of course we have all the important family shots (first day of school, graduation, etc), but in large part we don't have a lifestyle where we are taking many pictures.

Cameras and taking pictures aren't a big deal to us.

Do you have some other form of creative outlet? This conversation makes me wonder how many of us have something in their homes, some piece of equipment that they use to do something personally fulfilling that you wouldn’t find in just any random home.

I would be pleased to know that it’s common.

 

[eyoungren]

Do you have some other form of creative outlet? This conversation makes me wonder how many of us have something in their homes, some piece of equipment that they use to do something personally fulfilling that you wouldn’t find in just any random home.

I would be pleased to know that it’s common.

I would simply direct you to click on the link in my signature that says '10 Displays'.

Computers have primarily been my life since 1980 when I was 10. A modem came into the house in 1985 and I have never disconnected since.

In 1983, Advanced Dungeons & Dragons came along…I've never abandoned my intense interest in traditional RPGs. In 1988, along came David Eddings and his series of novels and in 1990 Robert Jordan and his books.

I'm a graphic designer, so creative outlets for me tend to revolve around how I can use computers, InDesign/QuarkXPress, Photoshop and Illustrator to create content for gaming (RPGs) and my own interests.

If you look at the link I mentioned above you'll see that my wallpaper spans six of my monitors. That was a 3-5 year process finding artwork and getting it just so - just for one Mac. Today, I'm still tweaking it from time to time. Everything in my wallpaper represents something, but just to me. It's all one very large Photoshop file with lots of layers.

I have other Macs and PCs. The wallpaper on those computers (and on my devices (phones/tablets/etc) are all designed by me based on their purpose.

Those and things related to them are my outlets.

 

[Love-hate 🍏 relationship]

If you cannot sustain the idea that a device you bought might not be good (which is pretty subjective, but i'm assuming we're comparing products of a similar price range), you can't ask people to refrain from expressing their sentiments. you might not care about the details but many people do .

fine details, textures, color rendering, might be inconsequential to you if your only intent is to capture the moment, but that's not the sole focus of everyone here

 

[fatTribble]

I used to take photographs on my Kodak 110 Pocket Camera and my Kodak Handle.
That’s when you had to buy film.

My iPhone beats both of those so I’m happy.

If I’ve learned anything from the forum it’s that I’m not nearly as OCD, uptight and obsessive about things as I thought.

 

[jntdroid]

If you cannot sustain the idea that a device you bought might not be good (which is pretty subjective, but i'm assuming we're comparing products of a similar price range), you can't ask people to refrain from expressing their sentiments. you might not care about the details but many people do .

fine details, textures, color rendering, might be inconsequential to you if your only intent is to capture the moment, but that's not the sole focus of everyone here

I’m not comparing anything, and have no problem with respectful discussion. I’ll repeat the last line in my original post. That’s all I’m saying:

“It's a little absurd to actually argue over this stuff to the point of conflict...”

 

[Love-hate 🍏 relationship]

I’m not comparing anything, and have no problem with respectful discussion. I’ll repeat the last line in my original post. That’s all I’m saying:

“It's a little absurd to actually argue over this stuff to the point of conflict...”

Oh . Wasn't aware there was conflict

 

[G5isAlive]

I'm as guilty as the next person at getting caught up in analyzing these cameras to death, so I'm definitely the pot calling the kettle black here. But I had two scenarios over the weekend that helped bring me back into a more balanced perspective.

I had my 16e with me over the weekend. I've also had a 17P, 17, and Air over the past few weeks (again, pot/kettle), so my wife had no idea I only had the 16e with me this time around.

First, I sent some photos (taken with both with the rear and selfie camera, in mid lighting) of my family to other family and a couple of friends. You know what they said?

"I can't even tell what's going on. Are y'all even in those photos?" And, "Hey, I can kind of make out your face, but your ear is a little out of focus. What phone could you possibly be using that would do that?"

Obviously sarcasm, but actually it was, "Y'all look great!", "Glad to see y'all looking good!", "Your kids have gotten so big!"...

You know why? Because even the 16e did a good job of capturing the moment and the point of the photo.

Second, a group photo in poor lighting - wife offered up my phone b/c she thought I had one of the new ones with me. Nobody else knew the difference. The photo was - by this forum's standards anyway - just ok. Definitely not great, but not bad either. But everybody thought it was taken on one of the new ones, and saw it and said things like, "oh yeah I can see the difference, that's really nice."

You know why? Because again, it captured the moment and did a good job of that. Nobody cared if some small details were a little out of focus, all they cared about was that they could see every smiling face and get an idea of the environment in that moment.

So instead of all of the heated rhetoric around, "You're paying more for a lesser camera" and "you're paying for camera features you don't need", why can't it just be "you're paying for what you want, that's awesome, I hope you enjoy it as much as I'm enjoying what I paid for." It's a little absurd to actually argue over this stuff to the point of conflict... 🤷‍♂️

my perspective is of a time where everyone didn't think they were a photographer, where to be one, you had to buy a single purpose device known as a camera, and continuosly support it by buying film and having it developed. delayed gratification and expense. This is of course before the time of vanity known as 'selfies.'

Back then we would argue the merits of Canon, Nikon and Minolta (since sold to Sony), but at the end of the day we would fall back to the common belief it wasn't just the devices that made the photographer, but the artistic vision.

now everyone is a photographer and the vision is forgotten to argue about specifications. there are a lot of bad photographs taken out there with the best specifications.

you are right. photographers capture the moment. everyone else talks about specifications. as if they understood the limits. its hard not to just roll they eyes at the lunacy.

 

[Sami13496]

I agree with you so much! And what’s funny is that the iPhone 16e camera is probably already on the same level as flagship cameras from a few years ago. For some reason, people act like you can’t take proper photos with the iPhone 16e, even though a few-year-old Pro model was perfectly capable.

This whole camera debate has just turned into pure audiophile-level nitpicking. Basically any iPhone from the past few years onward is absolutely perfect for point-and-shoot memory capturing, which is the use case for 99% of iPhone users anyway.

Then there’s the 1% who shoot photos of the night sky and analyze every pixel like MKBHD, which in my opinion is not normal from the perspective of everyday use.

 

[fompsweeva]

my choice of phone is purely to impress people on internet forums

 

[winxmac]

Among iPhone SE 2020, iPhone SE 2022, iPhone XR, iPhone 16e, iPhone Air, I would pick iPhone 16e as the best single camera iPhone, to me at least.

For the base model, either iPhone 16 or iPhone 17 would be fine.

 

[CloudChief]

I'm as guilty as the next person at getting caught up in analyzing these cameras to death, so I'm definitely the pot calling the kettle black here. But I had two scenarios over the weekend that helped bring me back into a more balanced perspective.

I had my 16e with me over the weekend. I've also had a 17P, 17, and Air over the past few weeks (again, pot/kettle), so my wife had no idea I only had the 16e with me this time around.

First, I sent some photos (taken with both with the rear and selfie camera, in mid lighting) of my family to other family and a couple of friends. You know what they said?

"I can't even tell what's going on. Are y'all even in those photos?" And, "Hey, I can kind of make out your face, but your ear is a little out of focus. What phone could you possibly be using that would do that?"

Obviously sarcasm, but actually it was, "Y'all look great!", "Glad to see y'all looking good!", "Your kids have gotten so big!"...

You know why? Because even the 16e did a good job of capturing the moment and the point of the photo.

Second, a group photo in poor lighting - wife offered up my phone b/c she thought I had one of the new ones with me. Nobody else knew the difference. The photo was - by this forum's standards anyway - just ok. Definitely not great, but not bad either. But everybody thought it was taken on one of the new ones, and saw it and said things like, "oh yeah I can see the difference, that's really nice."

You know why? Because again, it captured the moment and did a good job of that. Nobody cared if some small details were a little out of focus, all they cared about was that they could see every smiling face and get an idea of the environment in that moment.

So instead of all of the heated rhetoric around, "You're paying more for a lesser camera" and "you're paying for camera features you don't need", why can't it just be "you're paying for what you want, that's awesome, I hope you enjoy it as much as I'm enjoying what I paid for." It's a little absurd to actually argue over this stuff to the point of conflict... 🤷‍♂️

Personally, I think this is just a result of Apple’s marketing of the Pro line. And, the fact that the camera is one of the most important parts of a phone nowadays. No one wants to spend a grand and have an inferior camera.

The 16e has a smaller sensor than the 17 series. Of course, most people won’t see a difference, and the target 16e audience probably don’t care. But if you understand the benefits of larger sensors, you probably won’t be buying a 16e. Apple’s processing does a lot of heavy lifting. The raw files out of my 17 Pro look rough compared to proraw. No wonder a raw option isn’t available in the stock camera app.

 

[Tripps9000]

Wow finally a good thread I have the iPhone 16e myself and the camera works just fine for me but I also don’t take hardly any pics anyway lol so I’m happy with my choice of iPhone! But what really surprised me is seeing new cameras that work just like the old instant cameras of the 80’s and 90’s I mean wow I was surprised to see them back which means I’m just getting old👨🏼‍🦳

 

[Unami]

So instead of all of the heated rhetoric around, "You're paying more for a lesser camera" and "you're paying for camera features you don't need", why can't it just be "you're paying for what you want, that's awesome, I hope you enjoy it as much as I'm enjoying what I paid for." It's a little absurd to actually argue over this stuff to the point of conflict... 🤷‍♂️

Sure, we should. After all, it's about puny phone cameras which are just different shades of "not that great"

 

[smirking]

I suppose the people having these debates feel they are part of the .1%. Or aspire to be.

They're definitely part of the same .1% I'd want to see on the first rocket to Mars.

 

[James6s]

Every iPhone you buy from Apple at this moment is capable of taking some amazing shots.

The real difference is in the versatility with the number of cameras on each device, from the 16e to the 17 Pro models which offer the best of everything for those that need it for maximum creativity.

Point and shoot with the main lenses aren’t going to wield vastly different results, you can nit pick and pixel peep and find differences sure.

One thing I do like is the new photographic styles, you really can tune them to produce some amazing results which are more than just filters. Along with Apple’s post processing software imaging pipeline which is great and plays more of a role than hardware these days.

Your camera settings will also effect the final shot, HEIF, ProRaw, 24mp, 48mp etc etc.

It’s very hard to take a bad shot nowadays.

These were taken and edited on an iPhone 8 whilst waiting for my iPhone Air to arrive, now imagine how far we have come since 2017 with mobile photography!

 

[Astuces iOS]

I'm as guilty as the next person at getting caught up in analyzing these cameras to death, so I'm definitely the pot calling the kettle black here. But I had two scenarios over the weekend that helped bring me back into a more balanced perspective.

I had my 16e with me over the weekend. I've also had a 17P, 17, and Air over the past few weeks (again, pot/kettle), so my wife had no idea I only had the 16e with me this time around.

First, I sent some photos (taken with both with the rear and selfie camera, in mid lighting) of my family to other family and a couple of friends. You know what they said?

"I can't even tell what's going on. Are y'all even in those photos?" And, "Hey, I can kind of make out your face, but your ear is a little out of focus. What phone could you possibly be using that would do that?"

Obviously sarcasm, but actually it was, "Y'all look great!", "Glad to see y'all looking good!", "Your kids have gotten so big!"...

You know why? Because even the 16e did a good job of capturing the moment and the point of the photo.

Second, a group photo in poor lighting - wife offered up my phone b/c she thought I had one of the new ones with me. Nobody else knew the difference. The photo was - by this forum's standards anyway - just ok. Definitely not great, but not bad either. But everybody thought it was taken on one of the new ones, and saw it and said things like, "oh yeah I can see the difference, that's really nice."

You know why? Because again, it captured the moment and did a good job of that. Nobody cared if some small details were a little out of focus, all they cared about was that they could see every smiling face and get an idea of the environment in that moment.

So instead of all of the heated rhetoric around, "You're paying more for a lesser camera" and "you're paying for camera features you don't need", why can't it just be "you're paying for what you want, that's awesome, I hope you enjoy it as much as I'm enjoying what I paid for." It's a little absurd to actually argue over this stuff to the point of conflict... 🤷‍♂️

You are right, there is too many features in those iPhone cameras that make look the pro iPhone too god, but in reality the main differences are the lenses... Pictures took in x1 on the iPhone 16e might look very similar on the iPhone 17 Pro Max !

The big differences are the ultra wide and the telephoto... Tho since the iPhone has a small sensor, the telephoto camera is not enough to make impressive shots when you zoom a lot (like after x4, it's just crop) For the ultra wide, well it's not perfect, for example when you do macro... it's just taking x0.5 and crop to x1

So the conclusion is that if you don't care a lot about the camera, 16e can do the job (maybe not buy now because 17 is way better in other things so wait 17e) and even the iPhone air works fine, no need of the pro...

If you want a good telephoto or macro, then get a dedicated camera... the zoom will be better, the quality of the image too and more !

 

[Parowdy]

Most of the comparisons debated don't seem to be about minor details. It's about the inability to take a shot without ultrawide. If you're indoors, you probably can't stand back further because there's wall or furniture behind you. Same thing with outdoor landscape or cityscapes. Most people can't walk 500 ft. back to take the shot.

When I got an iPhone 11 Pro in 2019 I decided I wouldn’t accept anything after without a telephoto camera.
Now with my 15 Pro, and an actually useful ultra wide camera, I decided my next iPhone needs both. Because sometimes you need the maximum zoom possible, even at relatively close distances, and sometimes you need a shot of an entire room, or a closeup or almost macro for something else.
New iPhones have very useful cameras and I can’t do without any any more.
So yeah, I totally agree with you.
The only camera comparison interesting to me is if the 17‘s 3x zoom with its fusion camera system is comparable to the 15 Pro‘s zoom.