Some perspective about AAPL vs MSFT

[ArrowSmith]

I know it's fashionable around these here parts to declare "MSFT is dead and buried". But let's look at the facts:

Market cap

MSFT - $272 billion
AAPL - $190 billion

Net income(last declared fiscal year)

MSFT - $14.6 billion
AAPL - $4.83 billion

Net income/employee

MSFT - $155K
AAPL - $138K

So you can't even say that AAPL makes more money per employee - they don't. The only thing that can be accurately said is AAPL is kicking everyone's behinds in the smartphone market. Anything more then that is wild hyperbole.

 

[MacDawg]

You know what, I never give any of that a second thought

I just use my MBP, my 23" ACD, my iPod and my iPhone and enjoy them
Everything else is irrelevant to me

Woof, Woof - Dawg

 

[flopticalcube]

I know it's fashionable around these here parts to declare "MSFT is dead and buried".

Is it?

 

[ArrowSmith]

You know what, I never give any of that a second thought

I just use my MBP, my 23" ACD, my iPod and my iPhone and enjoy them
Everything else is irrelevant to me

Woof, Woof - Dawg

There are millions of people who get buy w/o using a single Apple product just fine.

Is it?

Well just look at any LTD post. It's even worse over on "Cult of Mac" site. That place really gives me the creeps.

 

[MacDawg]

There are millions of people who get buy w/o using a single Apple product just fine.

And good for them
They don't bother me in the least
And I leave them alone

Woof, Woof - Dawg

 

[flopticalcube]

Well just look at any LTD post.

Perhaps, but one member does not speak for the whole site.

It's even worse over on "Cult of Mac" site. That place really gives me the creeps.

That is not here.

 

[*LTD*]

It's flattering to have my name pop up in threads I didn't even take part in.

MS is by no means "dead and buried." They're simply in a long, slow decline in the consumer market, like an old man easing into a bathtub. They rule the enterprise, however (as I discussed in the other thread you started), and that isn't going to change anytime soon.

 

[bossxii]

Keep me posted of those figures in 5 years. If Balmer is still in charge I think their numbers will look very different.

 

[ArrowSmith]

Keep me posted of those figures in 5 years. If Balmer is still in charge I think their numbers will look very different.

Ballmer never pulled the trigger on acquiring Yahoo - that shows good judgment. He's an underrated CEO.

 

[gibbz]

Well just look at any LTD post. It's even worse over on "Cult of Mac" site. That place really gives me the creeps.

The sites are titled MacRumors and Cult of Mac. They are slanted by definition.

Ballmer never pulled the trigger on acquiring Yahoo - that shows good judgment. He's an underrated CEO.

Ask the Windows Mobile crowd if he is underrated (or anyone who has to watch a Ballmer keynote for that matter)

 

[Eraserhead]

So you can't even say that AAPL makes more money per employee - they don't.

Apple has a large number of retail employees, Microsoft doesn't so its not surprising that they make more per employee.

The only thing that can be accurately said is AAPL is kicking everyone's behinds in the smartphone market.

And that Apple's stock price has increased much more over the past 5 years.

That said both Microsoft and Apple have outdone the NASDAQ and Dow over the past 5 years.

 

[Queso]

Ballmer never pulled the trigger on acquiring Yahoo - that shows good judgment. He's an underrated CEO.

I'm sorry, but that's just about the only example of good judgement you can possibly quote. Ever since Ballmer took over Microsoft have coasted on the dominant position previously built by Gates. If Sony's PS3 team hadn't gifted XBox its success Ballmer wouldn't have a single credit to his name for 10 years in the top job. That's hardly the sign of a good CEO.

 

[flopticalcube]

Ballmer never pulled the trigger on acquiring Yahoo - that shows good judgment. He's an underrated CEO.

Even flipping a coin you're bound to come up heads sometimes.

 

[Eraserhead]

I'm sorry, but that's just about the only example of good judgement you can possibly quote.

ASP.NET/Windows Server have done pretty well* and isn't that Ballmer's responsibility or is it Gates too?

* = except SharePoint.

 

[Queso]

ASP.NET/Windows Server have done pretty well* and isn't that Ballmer's responsibility or is it Gates too?

* = except SharePoint.

All that came from work started in the late 90s, so Gates again I'm afraid

 

[ArrowSmith]

#1 - Ballmer made the .NET platform a smashing success
#2 - Windows Servers continue to innovate and dominate the enterprise
#3 - XBox Live is a smashing success
#4 - Surface & Natal technologies is proof that Research is innovating under Ballmer's watch
#5 - Didn't acquire Yahoo
#6 - Windows XP & 7 are a smashing success
#7 - Office suite has continued to dominate the market
#8 - Azure

 

[flopticalcube]

and yet the share price has gone nowhere in a decade. Investors may not be so sanguine at the prospects of MSFT.

 

[Queso]

#1 - Ballmer made the .NET platform a smashing success
#2 - Windows Servers continue to innovate and dominate the enterprise
#3 - XBox Live is a smashing success
#4 - Surface & Natal technologies is proof that Research is innovating under Ballmer's watch
#5 - Didn't acquire Yahoo
#6 - Windows XP & 7 are a smashing success
#7 - Office suite has continued to dominate the market
#8 - Azure

3) and 5) Already acknowledged
1), 2) & 7) All pre-date Ballmer era.
4) and 8) All based on other companies' work.
6) Your list is a little incomplete there, is it not? Please remind me which Windows OS is missing...

Today's Microsoft is a me-too organisation rather than a leader, and that will not change under Ballmer. He's not from the right mindset. The real tech progress is now coming from other players, with Google being the glue that pulls them all together. Microsoft aren't in trouble yet, but with growing awareness of alternatives coupled with MS's increasing loss of control of formats they are vulnerable in a way they haven't been for two decades. Personally I wouldn't buy their shares now. Anyone that does is a fool IMO.

 

[mysterytramp]

The only thing that can be accurately said is AAPL is kicking everyone's behinds in the smartphone market. Anything more then that is wild hyperbole.

We can say this, too:

While Zune held on to four percent of the market share for portable digital-music players, iPod maintained a whopping 71 percent.

I'm sure there are others ...

But the point is, why? Has anyone really said Microsoft is dead and buried? Even on this board? If Cult of Mac gives you the creeps, why do you read it? If MacRumors challenges your worldview, why are you here?

mt

 

[bartelby]

1), 2) & 7) All pre-date Ballmer era.
4) and 8) All based on other companies' work.

But he hasn't managed to ruin them. Surely that's the sign of a great CEO.

 

[Queso]

But he hasn't managed to ruin them. Surely that's the sign of a great CEO.

LOL. Have you actually tried to use Office 2007?

 

[bartelby]

LOL. Have you actually tried to use Office 2007?

In work I have the honour of being the only person in my division with Office 2007.

I actually had to keep pushing to get it!

 

[gibbz]

Then there is the recent Word patent snafu.

Tue Dec 22, 1:44 pm ET
WASHINGTON – A federal appeals court on Tuesday upheld a $290 million judgment against Microsoft Corp. and issued an injunction that will prevent the sale of its popular Word software.

The court injunction is set to go into effect Jan. 11. Microsoft has said such a bar would prohibit the sale of all currently available versions of Microsoft Word and Microsoft Office.

Microsoft had appealed a Texas jury verdict in favor of i4i Inc., a Toronto company. The jury found recent versions of Microsoft Word infringed on a software patent.

Microsoft has said that it and the public will both suffer if Word goes off the market while the company devises a workaround. The court said the decision does not affect copies of the programs sold before the injunction goes into effect, so Microsoft can still provide technical support to the old versions even if they infringe on the patent. .

 

[Consultant]

Um, the article in this story explains it in more details.
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/843845/

 

[Eraserhead]

and yet the share price has gone nowhere in a decade. Investors may not be so sanguine at the prospects of MSFT.

That's something I used to believe too, but it isn't quite fair:

That said both Microsoft and Apple have outdone the NASDAQ and Dow over the past 5 years.

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If MacRumors challenges your worldview, why are you here?

I for one like getting my worldview challenged.

LOL. Have you actually tried to use Office 2007?

I like Office 2007 . I like the ribbon.