HomeKit Still no “turn of after x time”

[Der Keyser]

Incredibly Apple keeps insisting that a “turn off after x minutes” timer is not allowed/needed in home automation.
Perhaps the single most usable feature is denied because Apple can’t be bothered - just unbelievable.

If i light is turned on manually (by a switch) you cannot create an automation to turn it off.
You can then script a IF-WAIT, but that only runs max 10min on AppleTV hub, and is then just “forgotten/killed”.

So you still need a “dummy“ switch to flip, so actions on that can start an automation to turn on/off the actual light.

Chessus apple - I could do this in the 80‘ies with home plc’s

 

[StumpyBloke]

Works for me fine. I just say, for example, “hey Siri turn off living room lights in 2 minutes” and it does so.

 

[chabig]

Works for me fine. I just say, for example, “hey Siri turn off living room lights in 2 minutes” and it does so.

This works for me too.

 

[TonyC28]

I think I see what you mean. You want to turn on a light and have it automatically turn off after a desired amount of time, right? I can't find a way to do it that doesn't involve a motion sensor, or like you said using "wait" but that is limited. Unless there is a way to create a shortcut that gets the light status (on) and the current time, then add to that time and using the result use that time to turn off the light. I can't figure out how to do that part but maybe there's a way.

 

[Der Keyser]

Works for me fine. I just say, for example, “hey Siri turn off living room lights in 2 minutes” and it does so.

You are missing the point - I’m not interested in having to do something to turn of the light. I just want it to turn off after 15 minutes automatically. But that‘s apparantly just too advanced for Apple to allow. Since shortcuts birth there have been thousands and thousands of requests for this basic feature.

 

[Der Keyser]

I think I see what you mean. You want to turn on a light and have it automatically turn off after a desired amount of time, right? I can't find a way to do it that doesn't involve a motion sensor, or like you said using "wait" but that is limited. Unless there is a way to create a shortcut that gets the light status (on) and the current time, then add to that time and using the result use that time to turn off the light. I can't figure out how to do that part but maybe there's a way.

I have tried a million ways, and you can‘t. Apple seems to have a complete meltdown on scheduling “events” in home automation. You are completely stripped of options to make intelligence regarding timed off events. You can only use their own built-in ”turn-off after” feature, but that requires you have a free switch to assign to a scene. otherwise it can’t de done. Sometimes Apple REALLY live in a parallel universe….

 

[caligurl]

I have 2 wemo's that work that way.... one is a plug and the other a light switch. However they are both up to automatically turn off after one minute in the wemo app. I do use siri to turn both of them on.... then they just turn off 1 min later.

 

[caligurl]

And i LOVE the new hey siri turn off in X minutes feature! Use it for the bathroom fan all the time! I used to forget it was on.... now I can just have siri do it after a shower! WOOT!!

 

[cynics]

Incredibly Apple keeps insisting that a “turn off after x minutes” timer is not allowed/needed in home automation.
Perhaps the single most usable feature is denied because Apple can’t be bothered - just unbelievable.

If i light is turned on manually (by a switch) you cannot create an automation to turn it off.
You can then script a IF-WAIT, but that only runs max 10min on AppleTV hub, and is then just “forgotten/killed”.

So you still need a “dummy“ switch to flip, so actions on that can start an automation to turn on/off the actual light.

Chessus apple - I could do this in the 80‘ies with home plc’s

You are missing the point - I’m not interested in having to do something to turn of the light. I just want it to turn off after 15 minutes automatically. But that‘s apparantly just too advanced for Apple to allow. Since shortcuts birth there have been thousands and thousands of requests for this basic feature.

I have tried a million ways, and you can‘t. Apple seems to have a complete meltdown on scheduling “events” in home automation. You are completely stripped of options to make intelligence regarding timed off events. You can only use their own built-in ”turn-off after” feature, but that requires you have a free switch to assign to a scene. otherwise it can’t de done. Sometimes Apple REALLY live in a parallel universe….

I read this a few times and I apologize if I'm missing something because it sounds like you just need a function thats been available for years, I might be wrong though. From what I'm reading it sounds like you just want an accessory to turn off 15 minutes after its turned on? If so that is a very simple shortcut that can be done a few ways.

Made this up real quick though using ShortCuts app...



WHEN 'Office Ceiling Light Turns on' > DO Shortcut > 'Wait 900 seconds (15 min)' > Set Ceiling Light - off

Now when the Office Ceiling Light is turned on it will turn itself off in 15 minutes. That is about as simple as ShortCuts get.

Shortcuts can be used for a lot of If this than that type of stuff. Like settings alarms that I turn off so I dont need to remember to turn them on. Locking the door with notifications if its ever left unlocked after I leave. Automating a process I used for work when I'm selecting photos and airdropping them to my Mac.

 

[Der Keyser]

I read this a few times and I apologize if I'm missing something because it sounds like you just need a function thats been available for years, I might be wrong though. From what I'm reading it sounds like you just want an accessory to turn off 15 minutes after its turned on? If so that is a very simple shortcut that can be done a few ways.

Made this up real quick though using ShortCuts app...

View attachment 1904942View attachment 1904943

WHEN 'Office Ceiling Light Turns on' > DO Shortcut > 'Wait 900 seconds (15 min)' > Set Ceiling Light - off

Now when the Office Ceiling Light is turned on it will turn itself off in 15 minutes. That is about as simple as ShortCuts get.

Shortcuts can be used for a lot of If this than that type of stuff. Like settings alarms that I turn off so I dont need to remember to turn them on. Locking the door with notifications if its ever left unlocked after I leave. Automating a process I used for work when I'm selecting photos and airdropping them to my Mac.

Yes, I agree it should be that simple (and it is in the GUI).
But have you tried that shortcut? It doesn’t work :-(

The trick is that no shortcut task is allowed to run more than a maximum of 10 minutes. After that it’s just killed by the OS, and everything after the ”wait” is never executed. The 10 minutes is the limit on Apple TV as a hub. I you use an iPad it’s shorter (depending on battery state), but it’s between 3 - 10 minutes.

Apple doesn’t mention this, nor is it documented anywhere….. Typical Apple - they know better :-(

 

[cynics]

Yes, I agree it should be that simple (and it is in the GUI).
But have you tried that shortcut? It doesn’t work :-(

The trick is that no shortcut task is allowed to run more than a maximum of 10 minutes. After that it’s just killed by the OS, and everything after the ”wait” is never executed. The 10 minutes is the limit on Apple TV as a hub. I you use an iPad it’s shorter (depending on battery state), but it’s between 3 - 10 minutes.

Apple doesn’t mention this, nor is it documented anywhere….. Typical Apple - they know better :-(

Interesting, I didn't know that. I tested it a couple times but for brevity sake I used 30 seconds. Good thing I never forgot to lock my door! ?

 

[software-implementor]

Incredibly Apple keeps insisting that a “turn off after x minutes” timer is not allowed/needed in home automation.
Perhaps the single most usable feature is denied because Apple can’t be bothered - just unbelievable.

If i light is turned on manually (by a switch) you cannot create an automation to turn it off.
You can then script a IF-WAIT, but that only runs max 10min on AppleTV hub, and is then just “forgotten/killed”.

So you still need a “dummy“ switch to flip, so actions on that can start an automation to turn on/off the actual light.

Chessus apple - I could do this in the 80‘ies with home plc’s

Keep us posted if Apple has solved this problem, thanks!

 

[StumpyBloke]

Keep us posted if Apple has solved this problem, thanks!

Have you read this thread? It’s part-way there…kind of.

 

[software-implementor]

Have you read this thread? It’s part-way there…kind of.

I was thinking with Automation, not Siri. Trying to turn off a HomeKit switch after, let's say, one hour.

 

[StumpyBloke]

Oh yes. It’s very Apple-esque half-arsed at the moment in that regard in my experience.

 

[Der Keyser]

Unfortunately IOS16 does nothing to solve this issue. Homekit “timed off” automations still require a dummyswitch to use in an automation if you manually turn on the accessory. Incredible this is still an issue…. My current workaround with creating dummyswitches in OpenHAB to use with automations for off timers seems absolutely redicoulous…

 

[TonyC28]

Unfortunately IOS16 does nothing to solve this issue. Homekit “timed off” automations still require a dummyswitch to use in an automation if you manually turn on the accessory. Incredible this is still an issue…. My current workaround with creating dummyswitches in OpenHAB to use with automations for off timers seems absolutely redicoulous…

The five or so interns Apple has working on their hobby called HomeKit probably don’t know how to do it.

 

[haralds]

I read this a few times and I apologize if I'm missing something because it sounds like you just need a function thats been available for years, I might be wrong though. From what I'm reading it sounds like you just want an accessory to turn off 15 minutes after its turned on? If so that is a very simple shortcut that can be done a few ways.

Made this up real quick though using ShortCuts app...

View attachment 1904942View attachment 1904943

WHEN 'Office Ceiling Light Turns on' > DO Shortcut > 'Wait 900 seconds (15 min)' > Set Ceiling Light - off

Now when the Office Ceiling Light is turned on it will turn itself off in 15 minutes. That is about as simple as ShortCuts get.

Shortcuts can be used for a lot of If this than that type of stuff. Like settings alarms that I turn off so I dont need to remember to turn them on. Locking the door with notifications if its ever left unlocked after I leave. Automating a process I used for work when I'm selecting photos and airdropping them to my Mac.

Could you step us through this? I do not see on what UX tree an item turned on can be found. Is it Personal Automation, but I do not see a path to a switch changing. Home Automation looks like a dead-end.