The state of HEIC in 2023

[ian87w]

HEIC, great format, saves a ton of space. 12MP photo on my iPone is only 600 something kb.
But that's it.

Nobody is taking advantage of the tiny file size, not even Apple. Proof?
iCloud Photos shared album will still resize your photo into measly 3MP in JPEG, which has larger filesize than the original higher-res HEIC. Super dumb. You would think with iPhones as old as the 6s being capable viewing heic, Apple would just take advantage of it. Nope. You have amazing camera on your iPhone? Tough luck, your family can only see 3MP and 720p of your photos and videos, in old formats that takes more space. Genius Apple!

How about Google? I tried uploading to Google Photos as a shared album. Google stored it as is, heic full 12MP. Okay, good start. But when you save it or download it on your Android phone, Google "kindly" auto-coverts it to JPEG that is more than twice as large in file size. WTF? No options anywhere in Google Photos to prevent this.

Gee these silicon valley companies cannot even figure this out after all these years?

 

[Slartibart]

There is probably some reasoning for using JPG in a Shared Album. 🤓

Otherwise you can easily share a HEIC file in e.g. iCloud photos by providing the iCloud-link - the recipient can then easily download the original HEIC.

Same for Google Photos on Android - it does not convert any image format automatically when e.g. you open an album within on Android, which you created with it and uploaded HEICs on iOS. Same for e.g. Windows. If I select multiple HEICs in Google Photos and choose “Download” they will be downloaded as HEICs. That’s different to using “Save As…”.

 

[ian87w]

Same for Google Photos on Android - it does not convert any image format automatically when e.g. you open an album within on Android, which you created with it and uploaded HEICs on iOS. Same for e.g. Windows. If I select multiple HEICs in Google Photos and choose “Download” they will be downloaded as HEICs. That’s different to using “Save As…”.

This is what I did. I created a shared album from the iPhone, uploaded the heic photo. I then shared it to a separate Google account. I used that Google account on my Android and open the shared album in Google Photos. Google indicated that the photo is indeed heic. But if I downloaded or saved it, it becomes JPG. I accessed Google Photos form the browser on my laptop, same thing. When I downloaded it, it becomes JPG, despite Google Photo website indicated that it's HEIC.

Is there a setting somewhere that I missed?

There is probably some reasoning for using JPG in a Shared Album. 🤓

5 years ago, sure, but today? Every iPhone with iOS11 and higher, and every Android with Android 9 and higher, support viewing HEIC. It's just ridiculous when Apple introduced this advance and modern format, yet they don't even take advantage of it.

 

[Ray2]

Storage is cheap. It’s solved a problem that does not exist.

 

[Slartibart]

This is what I did. I created a shared album from the iPhone, uploaded the heic photo. I then shared it to a separate Google account. I used that Google account on my Android and open the shared album in Google Photos. Google indicated that the photo is indeed heic. But if I downloaded or saved it, it becomes JPG. I accessed Google Photos form the browser on my laptop, same thing. When I downloaded it, it becomes JPG, despite Google Photo website indicated that it's HEIC.

Is there a setting somewhere that I missed?

You created a shared album. My impression is that for any app on any platform the common denominator is to use JPEG in a shared album.

5 years ago, sure, but today? Every iPhone with iOS11 and higher, and every Android with Android 9 and higher, support viewing HEIC. It's just ridiculous when Apple introduced this advance and modern format, yet they don't even take advantage of it.

They let you take advantage of it, don’t they? Just for shared albums a hassle-free approach is given preference. IMHO most people don’t care as long as they do not have problems using there photos to watch, share in any form, layout, print, whatever else.

But - as mentioned before - you simply can provide the iCloud-link via the Share-menu and grant access to original, “full resolution” HEIC files:

Easy enough, obviously YMMV.

 

[ian87w]

You created a shared album. My impression is that for any app on any platform the common denominator is to use JPEG in a shared album.

What album do you speak of then? Oh you mean just a regular album for yourself?

The thing is, Google Photo itself has the heic file in the cloud. The details indicated it as heic as well. But I simply cannot find a way to download it from the shared album, as any attempt to do so will have Google auto-convert the file to JPG, with more than double the file size to boot. Really dumb. It's like they have the file on their own server, the app can view it, the app knows it's heic, the phone can view it, but heaven forbids the user to download it.

 

[ian87w]

Storage is cheap. It’s solved a problem that does not exist.

Not the point.

Apple brags about the camera on the iPhones, but if user want to share their photos/videos with their own family using Apple's own cloud service, users have to be satisfied with 3MP pictures and 720p videos, using an older format that actually takes up more than double of storage size.

 

[cSalmon]

Storage is cheap. It’s solved a problem that does not exist.

Storage is most definitely not cheap - how the heck can you even think that - because it's easier to type a snarky response than deal with a real archive. And please don't try and weasel out an excuse "compare to yesterday" - our files are both exponentially larger as well as the numbers of images in an archive have significantly increased.

Furthermore one of the main benefits that HEIC was supposed to bring was a better compressed file IOWs an ability to finally "share" 16bit files over the internet.

The simple fact is jpg is painful still the defacto web format because the silicon valley companies refuse to work together each trying to weasel their way into controlling more of the cheese like the rats they have become.

 

[cSalmon]

... My impression is that for any app on any platform the common denominator is to use JPEG...


Easy enough, obviously YMMV.

Yeh and those miles between easy enough and the common denominator is huge, convoluted and guaranteed to keep us using tech from 1992

 

[ian87w]

Yeh and those miles between easy enough and the common denominator is huge, convoluted and guaranteed to keep us using tech from 1992

And this is Apple, the same company that removed the headphone jack. Any iPhone running iOS11 and newer can view heic, and the 6s can record 4k videos, yet shared album on iCloud Photos, even if user paid for more storage, is limited to embarrassing 3MP JPGs and 720p videos.

 

[winxmac]

iPhone 6s does not have an option whether to use high efficiency or most compatible... I only find it on iPhone 7 Plus... I don't have 6s Plus or regular 7 to compare... I have iPhone 6s and iPhone 7 Plus both on iOS 15.6 RC and this is what I have seen when I compared the camera settings for both...

So I think, only iPhone 7 and newer save photos/videos in HEIC/HEIF but anything older saves in JPEG/MOV

I am not sure if HEIC/HEIF is only limited to Live Photo but so far, when I enable the setting on Onedrive app related to Live Photo [I forgot the exact setting or description of it] it keeps the format as is... I log in to Onedrive on a desktop/laptop [browser] and I can see that the file extension is HEIC...

 

[ian87w]

iPhone 6s does not have an option whether to use high efficiency or most compatible... I only find it on iPhone 7 Plus... I don't have 6s Plus or regular 7 to compare... I have iPhone 6s and iPhone 7 Plus both on iOS 15.6 RC and this is what I have seen when I compared the camera settings for both...

So I think, only iPhone 7 and newer save photos/videos in HEIC/HEIF but anything older saves in JPEG/MOV

I am not sure if HEIC/HEIF is only limited to Live Photo but so far, when I enable the setting on Onedrive app related to Live Photo [I forgot the exact setting or description of it] it keeps the format as is... I log in to Onedrive on a desktop/laptop [browser] and I can see that the file extension is HEIC...

iPhone 6s cannot capture photos in heic, but it can VIEW heic photos.

 

[5a4jiuzr5]

Storage is most definitely not cheap - how the heck can you even think that - because it's easier to type a snarky response than deal with a real archive. And please don't try and weasel out an excuse "compare to yesterday" - our files are both exponentially larger as well as the numbers of images in an archive have significantly increased.

Furthermore one of the main benefits that HEIC was supposed to bring was a better compressed file IOWs an ability to finally "share" 16bit files over the internet.

The simple fact is jpg is painful still the defacto web format because the silicon valley companies refuse to work together each trying to weasel their way into controlling more of the cheese like the rats they have become.

Storage is absolutely cheap, in the context of today. It's not like we have 1992 and a disc of a few mb is prohibitively expensive. Yes, image size has gotten bigger, but not to a point where storing more is impossible. Phones with 512Gb capability have been around for some 5 years now. With increased file size came the option to stogre dozens of GB in the cloud. The comparison only makes sense, even though you try to brush it off. Storage IS cheap and easily available and so: storing proper original files in the first place > forced compression via file format.

I have to turn all this HEIC nonsense off and switch to "most compatible format" on all my apple devices and it's been an annoyance ever since. This is trying to "solve" a problem that people could eventually run into had they bought underdimensioned storage in the first place.

A 256 or 512GB device has no business compressing a few mb, let alone at the expense of compatibility and transfer issues with the odd format that would be required.

I guess maybe if you had a 16 or 32Gb device AND a lot of large image files AND no iCloud then it could make sense to offer compression as a stopgap solution. But none of that would justify to have this enabled on competent devices.

As I said, nothing beyond even 128GB can have a noticeable benefit from this. That is unless you have wild amounts of photos but then you'd obviously need a robust storage solution far beyond OEM image compression, using that at this level would be just as ridiculous as using it on a tiny amount of files. Which leaves us with medium users that ask: what is the point of HEIC in 2023?

 

[ian87w]

Storage is absolutely cheap, in the context of today. It's not like we have 1992 and a disc of a few mb is prohibitively expensive. Yes, image size has gotten bigger, but not to a point where storing more is impossible. Phones with 512Gb capability have been around for some 5 years now. With increased file size came the option to stogre dozens of GB in the cloud. The comparison only makes sense, even though you try to brush it off. Storage IS cheap and easily available and so: storing proper original files in the first place > forced compression via file format.

I have to turn all this HEIC nonsense off and switch to "most compatible format" on all my apple devices and it's been an annoyance ever since. This is trying to "solve" a problem that people could eventually run into had they bought underdimensioned storage in the first place.

A 256 or 512GB device has no business compressing a few mb, let alone at the expense of compatibility and transfer issues with the odd format that would be required.

I guess maybe if you had a 16 or 32Gb device AND a lot of large image files AND no iCloud then it could make sense to offer compression as a stopgap solution. But none of that would justify to have this enabled on competent devices.

As I said, nothing beyond even 128GB can have a noticeable benefit from this. That is unless you have wild amounts of photos but then you'd obviously need a robust storage solution far beyond OEM image compression, using that at this level would be just as ridiculous as using it on a tiny amount of files. Which leaves us with medium users that ask: what is the point of HEIC in 2023?

A modern 12MP photo can be quite large, from 2 to 6MB in JPG. Take 1000 photos, and you are at 6GB already. HEIC is very useful, cutting that size by half or even less.

Thing is, Apple brought HEIC, boasting all about its advantages. They also boast about their iPhone cameras and 4K videos. But their own iCloud Photos sharing service are not even taking advantage of the format, resorting to low res photos and 720p videos. Embarrassing.

 

[nvmls]

HEIC, great format, saves a ton of space. 12MP photo on my iPone is only 600 something kb.
But that's it.

Nobody is taking advantage of the tiny file size, not even Apple. Proof?
iCloud Photos shared album will still resize your photo into measly 3MP in JPEG, which has larger filesize than the original higher-res HEIC. Super dumb. You would think with iPhones as old as the 6s being capable viewing heic, Apple would just take advantage of it. Nope. You have amazing camera on your iPhone? Tough luck, your family can only see 3MP and 720p of your photos and videos, in old formats that takes more space. Genius Apple!

How about Google? I tried uploading to Google Photos as a shared album. Google stored it as is, heic full 12MP. Okay, good start. But when you save it or download it on your Android phone, Google "kindly" auto-coverts it to JPEG that is more than twice as large in file size. WTF? No options anywhere in Google Photos to prevent this.

Gee these silicon valley companies cannot even figure this out after all these years?

The whole cloud photos strategy is a very poor cash grab attempt on both mobile platforms. Having said that, Android has very superior bulk photo management capabilities than Apple. I use both, Apple locks your physical storage to push you to the cloud, their bulk manipulation is among the lowest UX standards in the industry. Live photos is another worthless gif-ish alternative.

Another example of profit over user productivity, which Tim excels at.

"They really have no feelings in their hearts usually, about wanting to really help their customers" - guess who said it?

 

[Danfango]

Not a fan of HEIC. It works nicely on Apple stuff but on any other platform or sharing it turns into a compatibility nightmare. Not only that, the camera output on iPhones is just not that good really due to all the image processing so any of the quality gains are pretty much lost.

Everyone complains about the size of the JPEGs only because storage is so damn overpriced. I've got a proper Samsung 1TB NVMe disk here I paid less than £100 for which outperforms anything Apple ship in any of their machines but the pricing difference from 128GB to 1TB is £550 if you want inferior storage in an iPhone.

I'll take my 6-8 meg jpegs and some cheaper storage please.

 

[5a4jiuzr5]

A modern 12MP photo can be quite large, from 2 to 6MB in JPG. Take 1000 photos, and you are at 6GB already.

Oh no. That means I can only take some 10,000 photos of the largest filesize until an entry level 128GB iPhone is anywhere close to being full...

...come on.

Not to mention that the phones that DO take these high file-size photos tend to be pro models with better cameras that capture all that data in the first place. These also tend to have larger storage, and market tendencies of that exact sort are a very good reason for a product design, as we have seen in many cases.

I still see zero justification for a >256GB device or any "pro" device to ever handle .HEIC by default. Yes, offer image compression. Have it available, nothing wrong with it.

I'm talking about it taking these files (as image format) in the first place by default and the resulting claim that this is a practically obsolete feature.

Where is the measurable benefit for the end user that evidently outweights the aforementioned issues with compatibility and sharing?

 

[ian87w]

Not a fan of HEIC. It works nicely on Apple stuff but on any other platform or sharing it turns into a compatibility nightmare. Not only that, the camera output on iPhones is just not that good really due to all the image processing so any of the quality gains are pretty much lost.

Everyone complains about the size of the JPEGs only because storage is so damn overpriced. I've got a proper Samsung 1TB NVMe disk here I paid less than £100 for which outperforms anything Apple ship in any of their machines but the pricing difference from 128GB to 1TB is £550 if you want inferior storage in an iPhone.

I'll take my 6-8 meg jpegs and some cheaper storage please.

It does NOT even work nicely on Apple's own ecosystem. iCloud Photo shared album is still sharing pathetic 3MP photos in JPG and 720p videos. That's my biggest issue here.

 

[ian87w]

Oh no. That means I can only take some 10,000 photos of the largest filesize until an entry level 128GB iPhone is anywhere close to being full...

...come on.

Not to mention that the phones that DO take these high file-size photos tend to be pro models with better cameras that capture all that data in the first place. These also tend to have larger storage, and market tendencies of that exact sort are a very good reason for a product design, as we have seen in many cases.

I still see zero justification for a >256GB device or any "pro" device to ever handle .HEIC by default. Yes, offer image compression. Have it available, nothing wrong with it.

I'm talking about it taking these files (as image format) in the first place by default and the resulting claim that this is a practically obsolete feature.

Where is the measurable benefit for the end user that evidently outweights the aforementioned issues with compatibility and sharing?

That fancy Pro cameras won't matter considering Apple's own iCloud Photo shared album resize them to pathetic 3MP JPGs that are still larger in file size than the original HEIC. That's how dumb Apple is at this point. Your 4k videos? 720p only when uploaded to iCloud Photo shares album. So yeah, not only you are not taking advantage of the modern format, Apple is still stuck in the 2007 with 3MP photos.

 

[cSalmon]

Which leaves us with medium users that ask: what is the point of HEIC in 2023?

expanding color bit depth

you do realize photography and sharing photos can happen outside of the realm of smart phones right? HEIC is pointless if it's only seen as an iPhone format

 

[antiprotest]

Storage is cheap. It’s solved a problem that does not exist.

Storage is cheap for Apple, not for Apple's customers.

 

[erikkfi]

Yeh and those miles between easy enough and the common denominator is huge, convoluted and guaranteed to keep us using tech from 1992

Heeeyyyyy, I happen to like some technology from 1992...

 

[breather]

Storage is cheap. It’s solved a problem that does not exist.

Really? It cost a lot to buy an iPhone with more storage, same with Mac.
I am aware of External HDDs, yet I stand by my previous sentence.

 

[v0lume4]

I use both, Apple locks your physical storage to push you to the cloud, their bulk manipulation is among the lowest UX standards in the industry.

I know my post isn't an answer to the OP's question, I'm just chiming in about what you said. I agree.

Apple's web interface for iCloud is laughably bad. I was wondering if I was the only one that had issues with it. Turns out the answer is no. I recently wanted to download my entire library. Easy right? Wrong. It said I could only select and download photos in batches of up to 1,000. I'd have to carefully keep my place where I'd end each batch and begin to select the next batch of 1,000.

It's my belief that Apple can not do services, and that third party solutions should be used. It's almost like Apple put out the minimum viable product to make extra cash from unknowing users (the popup saying "Your iCloud storage is running low.").

 

[ian87w]

Apple locks your physical storage to push you to the cloud, their bulk manipulation is among the lowest UX standards in the industry. Live photos is another worthless gif-ish alternative.

Another example of profit over user productivity, which Tim excels at.

"They really have no feelings in their hearts usually, about wanting to really help their customers" - guess who said it?

Yeah, and their cloud solution for sharing photos with friends and families are stuck with 3MP photos and 720p videos.

My guess is many Apple executives don’t have families? “Yeah, look at my iPhone with 48MP camera and 4K60 videos. But only I shall enjoy it.”