iCloud The UK Conundrum: Divesting From iCloud

[iLuddite]

With the UK government moving to eviscerate end-to-end iCloud encryption (Advanced Data Protection), what would steps could one take to protect oneself from prying eyes? I’m going to assume it might be smart to turn off iCloud Photos—I’ve already taken the first step and saved full-size photo versions on my devices so that I can fully disable and delete the iCloud portion at any time.

I’m also wondering if stopping the willing submission of optional analytics data might be a good idea as well.

I appreciate your interest and/or participation.

 

[BigBlur]

With the UK government moving to eviscerate end-to-end iCloud encryption (Advanced Data Protection), what would steps could one take to protect oneself from prying eyes? I’m going to assume it might be smart to turn off iCloud Photos—I’ve already taken the first step and saved full-size photo versions on my devices so that I can fully disable and delete the iCloud portion at any time.

Yep, but it's not just iCloud Photos. You would have to stop using iCloud completely (no more iCloud Drive, no more syncing of Notes, Contacts, Messages, Reminders, Calendar, Safari, etc.). Keep everything local to the device, and do local backups to a computer if you don't want anyone prying on your data stored in the cloud.

 

[doogm]

I really believe that iCloud backups are the key piece of value for police and intelligence services - they can replicate everything in the phone that doesn't sync by restoring a backup. Having the discipline to do an encrypted backup regularly to a computer is certainly not as convenient as automatic cloud backup, but that's your only other choice.

 

[NoBoMac]

no more syncing of Notes, Contacts, Messages, Reminders, Calendar, Safari, etc.

And Focuses, passwords/wifi info, Shortcuts, Health data, Podcasts/Music, Books, News. Weather, Stocks? List gets pretty big re what gets saved/synced between the iWidgets.

Add: and Mail, believe recent recipient list is shared via iCloud when using Mail. Map pins/info.

 

[JSRinUK]

With the UK government moving to eviscerate end-to-end iCloud encryption (Advanced Data Protection), what would steps could one take to protect oneself from prying eyes? I’m going to assume it might be smart to turn off iCloud Photos—I’ve already taken the first step and saved full-size photo versions on my devices so that I can fully disable and delete the iCloud portion at any time.

I’m also wondering if stopping the willing submission of optional analytics data might be a good idea as well.

I appreciate your interest and/or participation.

I’m of the same mind. I kind of always knew that “cloud” meant that there’s always a chance that someone somewhere would have access to your “stuff” (it’s not like I have anything worth anyone’s interest anyway), but my faith was always pretty high that “my stuff” was pretty secure - especially when using services from Apple, Proton, etc. Now that there seems to be an active desire by certain governments to snoop on its citizens in this way, I feel it’s time to pull back my reliance on such things. I’ll be working on moving my files locally as I always did in the past; and putting more consideration into things that go out via the internet.

 

[doogm]

passwords/wifi info, ... , Health data,...

iCloud Keychain (passwords and WiFi passphrases) and Health data (as well as iMessage messages and FaceTime calls) are end-to-end encrypted even if you have advanced data protection turned off.

What will be interesting going forward is what Apple will do if the UK says that turning off ADP is enough - because they were reportedly demanding more. Apple may be forced to turn off iCloud syncing in the UK if this is not enough. (It may be.)

 

[JamesMay82]

I’ve been wondering this recently and just found this video which answers most of our questions!

But now I have these questions

1. Mail can we not just immediately move each mail to be stored locally on our macs? That way it comes off the server.

2. Notes we can store locally but how would I back these up snd how would I restore them or move the local file to a new Mac?

3. The best thing about iCloud is how it all syncs.. how would I keep lap tops and desktop synced.. there use to be old software back in the day that did.. does this still exist?

 

[JamesMay82]

I've now removed all my photos from the cloud and stopped using iCloud Drive. ha it weirdly feels freeing.

I've kept everything else in the cloud... mainly for the notes app.

does switching safari off just stop history and bookmarks from syncing ?

 

[JamesMay82]

now I’m very frustrated! Apple makes it very difficult to live life off the cloud!

When I synced photos to my phone it also re synced my music and it’s completely messed up my albums… soundtracks which were under 1 album are now listed individually for each track which just looks a complete mess.

The only way to fix is to remove all music and then re sync it as it seems to work in the initial sync only!

I’m not sure what to do now to be honest.. either I go back iCloud or just keep photos off my phone.. or just wipe it all and hope the initial sync works again

 

[cjsuk]

I've done this already:

1. Disable iCloud photos
2. Disable iCloud drive
3. Delete all device backups and turn off device backups to iCloud
4. Turn off any iCloud services on all devices that you don't want to sync (health, messages)
5. Stop paying for all that storage I no longer need.
6. Write all my notes in a notebook and chuck it in my bag.
7. Move any passwords I don't need to share with my phone into MacPass (keepass equivalent database)

Stuff I can't get out:

• Mail - looking at options here already. Probably going to just pay Hetzner to do it.
• Calendar - they know what I am doing and where I am going all the time. ADP doesn't help with that. I am considering going back to paper for this because it's more flexible anyway. Muji sell weekly planners which would cover my requirements.
• Reminders - sync between phone/mac is needed. I have been writing stuff on paper.
• Contacts - need that synced between phone/mac. Could just write the important ones down. That worked for hundreds of years fine.

The scary thing is despite doing all these changes my life isn't really impacted that much. Starting to wonder if I really needed this technology at all in the first place and wondering why I spent so much on it. Most Apple stuff is a restrictive and heavily over-constrained note book.

With respect to photos sync, I've actually taken to using my mirrorless camera a lot instead of the iPhone and quite frankly it's so much better I just don't bother taking photos now without it.

 

[JamesMay82]

I've done this already:

1. Disable iCloud photos
2. Disable iCloud drive
3. Delete all device backups and turn off device backups to iCloud
4. Turn off any iCloud services on all devices that you don't want to sync (health, messages)
5. Stop paying for all that storage I no longer need.
6. Write all my notes in a notebook and chuck it in my bag.
7. Move any passwords I don't need to share with my phone into MacPass (keepass equivalent database)

Stuff I can't get out:

• Mail - looking at options here already. Probably going to just pay Hetzner to do it.
• Calendar - they know what I am doing and where I am going all the time. ADP doesn't help with that. I am considering going back to paper for this because it's more flexible anyway. Muji sell weekly planners which would cover my requirements.
• Reminders - sync between phone/mac is needed. I have been writing stuff on paper.
• Contacts - need that synced between phone/mac. Could just write the important ones down. That worked for hundreds of years fine.

The scary thing is despite doing all these changes my life isn't really impacted that much. Starting to wonder if I really needed this technology at all in the first place and wondering why I spent so much on it. Most Apple stuff is a restrictive and heavily over-constrained note book.

With respect to photos sync, I've actually taken to using my mirrorless camera a lot instead of the iPhone and quite frankly it's so much better I just don't bother taking photos now without it.

I’ve done all those steps and for me it’s mainly my photos and files that I don’t like being in the cloud from a security POV.

I’ve tried syncing photos to my phone again and it’s just not syncing them all for some reasons. I think like you I might just keep them off my phone and treat my iPhone like a camera to import to computer each time.. I don’t take many meaning full pictures regularly..

For mail - can we not just move all mail locally to Mac so it keeps it off the server?

 

[cjsuk]

I’ve done all those steps and for me it’s mainly my photos and files that I don’t like being in the cloud from a security POV.

I’ve tried syncing photos to my phone again and it’s just not syncing them all for some reasons. I think like you I might just keep them off my phone and treat my iPhone like a camera to import to computer each time.. I don’t take many meaning full pictures regularly..

For mail - can we not just move all mail locally to Mac so it keeps it off the server?

Photos app is a pain. I have had lots of trouble with it over the years.

As for mail yes you can. You can create local folders. But the people who own the mail server can copy it if they want and deletes aren’t always deletes.

 

[JamesMay82]

Photos app is a pain. I have had lots of trouble with it over the years.

As for mail yes you can. You can create local folders. But the people who own the mail server can copy it if they want and deletes aren’t always deletes.

I was just reading up on NAS as a solution to iCloud. Lots of good reviews but then quite a few comments saying how they wouldn’t risk their data on a NAS as hey can be vulnerable to attacks.

What are your thoughts ?

 

[cjsuk]

I was just reading up on NAS as a solution to iCloud. Lots of good reviews but then quite a few comments saying how they wouldn’t risk their data on a NAS as hey can be vulnerable to attacks.

What are your thoughts ?

It depends on the NAS vendor. The consumer ones are mostly garbage and are cloud and network connected and pull updates and are semi permanently tethered to the vendor. I used FreeNAS for a bit on an actual computer with two hard disks in the box. Worked fine.

But ask yourself how much data you have and will a simple direct attached disk work well enough. So for example if you take an OWC enclosure and stuff a decent quality (read Samsung Pro / WD SN850) 4TB NVMe inside it, that actually has lower aggregate probability of failure than an equivalent RAID1 NAS box with mechanical "NAS" drives in it. And you have enough money left over to buy another cheaper enclosure to back it up onto.

First thing though is clean up your data! Less data is easier to manage.

 

[JamesMay82]

It depends on the NAS vendor. The consumer ones are mostly garbage and are cloud and network connected and pull updates and are semi permanently tethered to the vendor. I used FreeNAS for a bit on an actual computer with two hard disks in the box. Worked fine.

But ask yourself how much data you have and will a simple direct attached disk work well enough. So for example if you take an OWC enclosure and stuff a decent quality (read Samsung Pro / WD SN850) 4TB NVMe inside it, that actually has lower aggregate probability of failure than an equivalent RAID1 NAS box with mechanical "NAS" drives in it. And you have enough money left over to buy another cheaper enclosure to back it up onto.

First thing though is clean up your data! Less data is easier to manage.

Yes at present all i have is direct attached and i was just thinking of another way to have files accessible when I’m not at home.

I’ve used my Mac Studio in file sharing mode at home which is good but is there a way to access this when I’m out the house with the built apple software?

 

[cjsuk]

Yes at present all i have is direct attached and i was just thinking of another way to have files accessible when I’m not at home.

I’ve used my Mac Studio in file sharing mode at home which is good but is there a way to access this when I’m out the house with the built apple software?

There are ways to do it but they aren’t particularly fun unless you know the unix stuff underneath it.