TimeMachine, CCC or other? What is best to use if my workstation dies?

[swealpha]

Hello!

Happily I have never had any internal disk or computer crashes, but if it happens, what is most easy and best solution for recovery? (I use MacOS High sierra).

Time Machine:
Will it be easy to setup the computer again?
I mean will it be 1:1 or just "here is your files, try to remember serial numbers etc"

Carbon Copy Cloner:
Is this something that works in the background like TM or do it want me to personally do things all the time?


Maybe I should buy a even older macbook to simulate a crash to try things out, hmmm.

 

[Ifti]

Why not both??

I use Time Machine for regular backups (manual), and a CCC clone every month, or before every OSX update. Ive never had to use them thankfully - only my TM backup when I use MA to transfer to a new system - but otherwise, the more backups the better!

If you do use both, just be sure to keep them on separate physical drives

 

[BrianBaughn]

I have TM set up and run it occasionally but use CCC automated daily to clone my Users folder and my Logic Pro sessions that are on an external drive. I also have CCC tasks set up to clone three other external drives and I run those every once in a while.

I was exclusively using CCC and bootable clones in previous years and didn't bother with TM.

 

[Ben J.]

I haven't used TM in a few years, but I think it's OK. I think it suits people who don't want to bother too much with it, and the way it works is very nice and easy - for recovering deleted stuff f.ex, you "zoom" thru "time" in a window and can see how folders content looked in the past, then recover things. If your drive dies and you need to rebuild it from backup, you install the OS and then use Migration Assistant to recover the rest from TM volume.

CCC is more for people who want more control and perfect clones.

 

[HobeSoundDarryl]

Two+ backups by either method with one stored offsite. Rotate the offsite one with the onsite backup regularly and your risk of file loss will be relatively small.

I use TM at home and ALSO with the offsite (rotation) disks. So I basically have 3 TM backups (one live, one updated just before I go swap it with another stored in a safe deposit box and the one in the safe deposit box. I rotate at least monthly.

I also have a laptop and use a great program called Chronosync to keep my unique files synced between desktop and laptop. Since I synch the unique files I create/edit between the two, I think if it as another backup too.

 

[Fishrrman]

Either CarbonCopyCloner or SuperDuper.

I've never used time machine, ever.
And... never will.

 

[MarkC426]

I use TM for daily backups, and SuperDuper for complete clones.

Carbon Copy Cloner:
Is this something that works in the background like TM or do it want me to personally do things all the time?

I use SD, but I think CCC works the same.
There is a free/trial version, but the paid versions let you do incremental updates to your clone (i.e. just what's changed). You can set up a backup schedule if desired.

 

[Ben J.]

Carbon Copy Cloner:
Is this something that works in the background like TM or do it want me to personally do things all the time?

When it's set up, you can forget it, it's the setting up that demands a bit more work because it has lots more functions. It can be streamlined in a totally different way from TM. I expect it's much the same with SuperDuper.

Restoring a failed drive will be much the same across all three. Not difficult.

 

[Boyd01]

You need more than one backup method. I have continuous time machine backups to a network drive, regular clones to an external SSD with Carbon Copy and continuous cloud backups to BackBlaze. My media server gets automatic Carbon Copy backups late every night, but I use Carbon Copy manually on my primary Mac.

For a full restore, I would definitely use Carbon Copy and not Time Machine. Time Machine is great when you accidentally delete or change a file and need to get it back, but it's too slow for a complete restore and I have some concerns about integrity.

 

[Ben J.]

You need more than one backup method.

No, you don't. Just because you do, doesn't mean one has to.

Now, having more than one backup is always recommended. The day you really need to restore important stuff, you can bet that there is something wrong with the one backup you have.
So, at minimum you should have one backup close at hand and one backup offsite in case of fire or something.
You can use the same "backup method" for all. Choose what suits you; Time Machine has it's limitations, but is easy, and it's certainly not wrong to choose.

 

[theorist9]

I have two local backups (CCC and TM) and one remote CCC backup that I swap out periodically. Like others here, I don't trust TM for a full restore; but I do like having it as a supplement to CCC, because nothing beats it for restoring an older version of a file. Indeed, it's this functionality that increases TM's complexity relative to CCC, and thus makes it (IME) less reliable for a full restore. To put it another way, I've sometimes found TM to be finicky, but never CCC.

While CCC works with all OS's, CCC is particularly nice with High Sierra, since with that OS it creates a bootable clone. And if you don't want to bother with TM at all, you can restore individual old files with CCC using the Snapshots; but TM is more convenient for that use.

 

[theorist9]

One other suggestion: If you don't have a backup drive yet, given how inexpensive SSD's have become, you might want to consider getting one of those.

Just be sure they work with your OS (e.g. the Samsung T5 requires Catalina and above to work reliably on CCC, so the current T7 might have similar or higher restrictions). Also, the cables they're packaged with tend to suck, and can cause the drive to spontaneously unmount. The safest bet is to get a certified cable from, e.g., CableMatters, though I've also had good luck with LDLrui.

As a rule of thumb, you want the CCC backup drive to be twice the size of the data you plan to backup (more if you want to keep a long history).

If you do get an HDD, Bombich (the maker of CCC) recommends against getting one with SMR (Shingled Magnetic Recording), because those are really slow with CCC.

Choosing a backup drive | Bombich Software

bombich.com

 

[swealpha]

One other suggestion: If you don't have a backup drive yet, given how inexpensive SSD's have become, you might want to consider getting one of those.

Just be sure they work with your OS (e.g. the Samsung T5 requires Catalina and above to work reliably on CCC, so the current T7 might have similar or higher restrictions). Also, the cables they're packaged with tend to suck, and can cause the drive to spontaneously unmount. The safest bet is to get a certified cable from, e.g., CableMatters, though I've also had good luck with LDLrui.

As a rule of thumb, you want the CCC backup drive to be twice the size of the data you plan to backup (more if you want to keep a long history).

If you do get an HDD, Bombich (the maker of CCC) recommends against getting one with SMR (Shingled Magnetic Recording), because those are really slow with CCC.

Choosing a backup drive | Bombich Software

bombich.com

Thank you, but what i have read is that SSD is not so smart to use for longterm storage. Bette to have mechanic disks.

I orderd a Toshiba canvio advanced 1TB.

 

[Ifti]

I use TM in a manual fashion, backing up as and when I need to, and then use it to restore any files/folders that I may have deleted and need to retrieve. I do not use the 'TM view' - I just browse into the TM files and retrieve the file/folders I need. I find this nice and easy, and works well in my workflow.
I also use my TM backup when I need to use Migration Assistant upon moving to a new system.

I only ever use CCC if I need a full drive restore, or if my TM backups should fail me.

Both are on separate external SSD drives, connected manually as and when needed via USB-C.

 

[Ifti]

Thank you, but what i have read is that SSD is not so smart to use for longterm storage.

Why is this??
SSD drives have a limited read/write cycle lifetime, but the read/writes will be less considering it's a backup/archive drive. Even then, the read/write cycle lifetime is huge and you will most likely move to other drives by the time your SSD comes to end of life.
I have been using some of my external SSDs for video editing for several years now - so quite intensive read/write cycles. No issues at all.

Mechanical drives are much cheaper in comparison, hence why they are used for archiving or backing up. I prefer to use external SSDs simply because it makes not only backups, but more importantly, restores much quicker. If my system fails I want to restore and be up and running asap.

 

[bigfatipod]

Both my wife and I had experiences in the past year years (I forget which OS levels) where each of our Time Machine backups were corrupted and didn’t come across this until it was time to do restores.
We’ve also always used CCC for many years and never had an issue. We have restored/migrated to new machines using the ccc clones and things have gone very smooth.

 

[theorist9]

I have two local backups (CCC and TM) and one remote CCC backup that I swap out periodically. Like others here, I don't trust TM for a full restore; but I do like having it as a supplement to CCC, because nothing beats it for restoring an older version of a file. Indeed, it's this functionality that increases TM's complexity relative to CCC, and thus makes it (IME) less reliable for a full restore. To put it another way, I've sometimes found TM to be finicky, but never CCC.

Just to reconfirm what I wrote above: Last weekend I couldn't boot into my Mac and, since it wasn't fixable with First Aid, I ultimately had to do a complete disk wipe and restore. After reinstalling the OS I thought I'd try restoring my data from TM instead of CCC, since I was curious how well it would work.

I tried doing the TM restore using Migration Assistant (Apple's recommended method), and simply wasn't able to. I tried using Migration Assistant within both a normal boot and recovery mode (CMD-R), and neither worked. I kept getting errors, and AppleCare couldn't come up with a workaround.

Thus I had to restore from CCC, and it worked flawlessly. I used Migration Assistant rather than CCC's own Restore function, since that's what Bombich recommends. I've got a lot of applications with complicated installs (like Office), and Migration Assistant seems to do a really good job of making sure everything is configured properly.

At the same time, I recently accidentally trashed a file, and used TM to restore it. For individual file restoration, TM is the best. For full drive restoration, I'd strongly recommend against relying on it.

 

[throAU]

Whatever you do, do not trust a single form of backup. Think of the possible ways you could lose everything and mitigate each one. Typically it boils down to

• device crash
• device theft
• accidental deletion
• device/premises destruction (e.g., house fire, broken laptop, etc.)

For me, its iCloud sync + some form of backup (CCC, Time Machine, whatever).

If my Mac dies I log into another one (or my phone, iPad, etc.) and I'm back up and running.

If my cloud storage is wiped out, I have multiple Time Machine backups - one at work and one at home (substitute CCC or back blaze or whatever for Time Machine as per personal preference).

Especially important stuff is also stored on my home NAS.

I've literally accidentally MDM wiped out my iPad before due to work MDM policy being 4 bad pins instead of 10 as default (and I figured I had a few more tries to remember instead of checking my password manager for a new pin I set at 4am) and was back up and running with iCloud on the device within 15-20 minutes.

• If iCloud (plus all the cached copies on my synced devices) dies (or account is wiped out, delete synced to all devices), I'm good
• If my house burns down, I'm good
• If work burns down, I'm good.

 

[HDFan]

wo+ backups by either method with one stored offsite.

I don't trust TM for a full restore; but I do like having it as a supplement to CCC,

With a 3-2-1 backup strategy only use one TM backup. They can get corrupted.

 

[bigfatipod]

Whatever you do, do not trust a single form of backup. Think of the possible ways you could lose everything and mitigate each one. Typically it boils down to

• device crash
• device theft
• accidental deletion
• device/premises destruction (e.g., house fire, broken laptop, etc.)

For me, its iCloud sync + some form of backup (CCC, Time Machine, whatever).

If my Mac dies I log into another one (or my phone, iPad, etc.) and I'm back up and running.

If my cloud storage is wiped out, I have multiple Time Machine backups - one at work and one at home (substitute CCC or back blaze or whatever for Time Machine as per personal preference).

Especially important stuff is also stored on my home NAS.

I've literally accidentally MDM wiped out my iPad before due to work MDM policy being 4 bad pins instead of 10 as default (and I figured I had a few more tries to remember instead of checking my password manager for a new pin I set at 4am) and was back up and running with iCloud on the device within 15-20 minutes.

• If iCloud (plus all the cached copies on my synced devices) dies (or account is wiped out, delete synced to all devices), I'm good
• If my house burns down, I'm good
• If work burns down, I'm good.

I have a NAS (synology) but never got into using it (a different than a common Mac OS user is used to…).
With that said, do you basically have it set up to routinely copy individual critical files from your Mac to the NAS? Can you even set it to do a large single file like a Photo library or will that not work?

 

[HDFan]

1. In CCC you can set a backup schedule.

2. You can set a task filter to select a single file.

Excluding files and folders from a backup task

bombich2.rssing.com

 

[throAU]

I have a NAS (synology) but never got into using it (a different than a common Mac OS user is used to…).
With that said, do you basically have it set up to routinely copy individual critical files from your Mac to the NAS? Can you even set it to do a large single file like a Photo library or will that not work?

I manually put copies of super important stuff on my NAS (this is typically stuff that doesn't change very often), however another alternative would be setting up something like NextCloud or iCloud on it and syncing things that way.

 

[Yebubbleman]

Hello!

Happily I have never had any internal disk or computer crashes, but if it happens, what is most easy and best solution for recovery? (I use MacOS High sierra).

Time Machine:
Will it be easy to setup the computer again?
I mean will it be 1:1 or just "here is your files, try to remember serial numbers etc"

It's pretty easy. You boot the computer to Recovery; select restore from Time Machine back-up; some time later, you're back exactly where you were. And no, you ought to not need to have to re-serialize serialized software, but your mileage may vary. You can also use your Time Machine back-up as a Migration Assistant source. But, for instances (such as any MacBook Pro from 2016 and later or any T2/Apple Silicon based Mac) where the logic board requires replacement and therefore you lose your internal drive, you plug in the Time Machine Drive, boot to recovery, select restore from Time Machine and you're back to exactly where you left off. Easy peasy.

Carbon Copy Cloner:
Is this something that works in the background like TM or do it want me to personally do things all the time?

I haven't used Carbon Copy Cloner in nearly a decade. I know that, due to fundamental changes around the time of the advent of APFS, it's totally different in how it works. I also generally don't see a need for it. But, then again, most of my data lives in Dropbox and I have my process to rebuild the OS environment on my computers down to a science.

Maybe I should buy a even older macbook to simulate a crash to try things out, hmmm.

They'll all safeguard your data. It's the process of restoration that is likely to be different for each. I'm way outdated on Carbon Copy Cloner and SuperDuper! But I know how Time Machine works and I've never really felt the need to use anything else. I do second the notion of everyone telling you to make more than one backup and to store them in different locations.

 

[genexx]

well......i use both 😎😎

• TM Backup
• CCC Clone
• CCC Folder Sync

 

[abromber]

I use both TM and CCC plus CrashPlan for cloud backup. I agree: TM to recover individual files or migrate to new computer. Also to restore to an earlier state (snapshots.) CCC for restoring directories or entire drives (i.e. drive failure.) Faster and very reliable. Cloud backup as a failsafe because local backups do fail. I have found TM to be easy and convenient but slow and a bit undependable, so I would not rely solely on it, but plenty of people do.

All of these backups run in the background and don't require any attention unless something goes wrong.

abromber