TimeMachine vs Bootable Backup

[Styvow]

Hi everyone,

I'm a professional photographer and taking the opportunity during this pandemic to reorganise and ramp up my back-up system. I used to work with a ton of external drives and do a lot of manual backups. But I switched to a Synology NAS, use it as an archive that is automatically backed up to the cloud and also looking into using it to store a TimeMachine back-up on.

Now, what I understand (and I'm an IT layman) is that the TimeMachine is a good, easy way to backup your Mac (in my case a MacBook Pro) but in case my MBP dies on me or is stolen or whatever... I can't use that TM-backup to work from on a different device. Therefore I need a bootable backup of my MBP. I have Carbon Copy Cloner so could use this to make a bootable backup.

How I'm setting up my NAS is that it automatically backs up all my work to the cloud but also on an external hard drive that I periodically pop in the NAS using USB Copy. So I don't need to manually schedule a backup. Just pop in the hard drive and it's get done automatically, the way I like it.
So I'm a bit reluctant to the additional complexity of having a bootable backup manually made every week next to my TM backup on the NAS. I would need to connect an external drive into my computer and start a backup.

So my questions are:
1. Can I use a bootable backup when it's stored on my NAS or do I need an external hard drive?
2. What is the additional value of a bootable backup? If I don't see the need to be able to immediately start working on another device from a bootable backup. I could just get a new device, load the latest TM backup on the that internal drive and start working?

Thanks for any advice!

 

[Longkeg]

1. Can I use a bootable backup when it's stored on my NAS or do I need an external hard drive

Though booting from an NAS is technically possible it probably fits in the “If you have to ask you have no business attempting it” category. You would need a properly formatted external drive to boot from.

2. What is the additional value of a bootable backup? If I don't see the need to be able to immediately start working on another device from a bootable backup. I could just get a new device, load the latest TM backup on the that internal drive and start working?

Sounds like you’ve answered your own question. However TM is famous for exporting problems during system migration or restoration. Those corrupted system files that crashed your original Mac may be transferred over to the new machine. A bootable backup serves as a snapshot of a time before the bad thing happened to your Mac.

 

[BrianBaughn]

You should probably read all the support FAQs and known issues at the Bombich website regarding CCC and the version of macOS you are using or are planning to use…particularly if that includes Catalina and/or APFS file system.

 

[iluvmacs99]

Hi everyone,

I'm a professional photographer and taking the opportunity during this pandemic to reorganise and ramp up my back-up system. I used to work with a ton of external drives and do a lot of manual backups. But I switched to a Synology NAS, use it as an archive that is automatically backed up to the cloud and also looking into using it to store a TimeMachine back-up on.

Now, what I understand (and I'm an IT layman) is that the TimeMachine is a good, easy way to backup your Mac (in my case a MacBook Pro) but in case my MBP dies on me or is stolen or whatever... I can't use that TM-backup to work from on a different device. Therefore I need a bootable backup of my MBP. I have Carbon Copy Cloner so could use this to make a bootable backup.

How I'm setting up my NAS is that it automatically backs up all my work to the cloud but also on an external hard drive that I periodically pop in the NAS using USB Copy. So I don't need to manually schedule a backup. Just pop in the hard drive and it's get done automatically, the way I like it.
So I'm a bit reluctant to the additional complexity of having a bootable backup manually made every week next to my TM backup on the NAS. I would need to connect an external drive into my computer and start a backup.

So my questions are:
1. Can I use a bootable backup when it's stored on my NAS or do I need an external hard drive?
2. What is the additional value of a bootable backup? If I don't see the need to be able to immediately start working on another device from a bootable backup. I could just get a new device, load the latest TM backup on the that internal drive and start working?

Thanks for any advice!

Answer:
1, No, you can't use a bootable backup stored in your NAS, but you can store disk images of your backup in your Nas and you can use that to create a separate boot disk from an external drive which you can boot off immediately from a brand new device. The exception would be Macs equipped with a T2 security chip which can add an extra step.

2, The additional value of a bootable backup is that it allows you to immediately work on another device in the event that your Macbook died, stolen or destroyed by an act of god. While Timemachine achieves a similar role, you still need to spend time to restore the data to the new device. Whereas with a bootable backup, that time was spent creating that backup. You would need an external drive to allow you to boot from your Mac, but the T2 chip again adds an extra complexity whereby not all USB 3 devices would allow you to boot externally and there is no guarantee that it will. However, Thunderbolt 3 devices would. Whereas with the Time Machine, no such requirement is required as long as the NAS can be recognized off the network and allows you to restore your data.

In the past, making a bootable backup is ideal for Macbook Pros that still allowed opening and upgrading the 2.5" easily, so in the event of a hard drive failure, the backup would go in its place. Unfortunately, this is no longer the case with the newer Macbook Pros, especially with the soldered SSD and the T2 chip which basically forbid any hard drive replacement and upgrade. And it's not even easy to clone back the backup due to the T2 chip preventing overwriting of internal OS without creating certain issues. whereas these issues will be mitigated with a Time Machine backup.
Hope this helps.

 

[Fishrrman]

"What is the additional value of a bootable backup?"

It's BOOTABLE (that is not a trick answer).
It will boot up and run just like the source drive from which it was cloned.
For all practical purposes, indistinguishable. After all, it's a "clone", right?

The other advantage is that it's mountable directly in the finder, like any other drive.
All the files on it are in "plain old finder format" -- nothing special needed to access them -- just copy one file, a group of files/folders, or RE-clone the ENTIRE DRIVE back to the internal if need be.

 

[Styvow]

Thanks for the great advice everyone!

So I decided to just stick with the TimeMachine backups to my NAS. In my case, I think that does the trick, I just need a backup of my files. That's all.

So yesterday, I set up TimeMachine to backup up to a separate shared folder on my NAS. It did the initial backup without a problem. This morning when I fired up my MacBook Pro and started working, I got the message that the backup couldn't be completed.

"One of the disks being backed up may have been ejected or disconnected from the computer"

But everything is live, the NAS and shared folder is connected.. so I don't know what went wrong? Any advice on what to look into or try and make it work?

Maybe I should just use Carbon Copy Cloner to make a regular backup of my computer on the NAS?

 

[HDFan]

So I decided to just stick with the TimeMachine backups to my NAS.

"One of the disks being backed up may have been ejected or disconnected from the computer"

I intermittently try doing TM backups to my NAS systems. Tend to be really slow (even with Thunderbolt/10 GBe) and the SMB connections keep getting dropped for some reason. Occasionally the backups get corrupted and have to start over from scratch.

Maybe I should just use Carbon Copy Cloner

Good idea. TM has its uses, but CCC is much less susceptible to corruption, even local physical media.

And I confess I have no idea as to a TM restore from a NAS. If I browse my TM backup disks (option - TM icon in menu bar) the NAS TM backup shares don't show. So I have no idea how to actually do a restore ...

 

[hobowankenobi]

Since you have a Synology, you might consider using their Drive server/client for data backups. You can set if for continuous backup, with lots of versioning options. A bit more setup, but more flexible and faster than TM. If you do, just focus on your data (not system folders, as that can get complicated, and there are limitations because of permissions issues).

Plan to consider:

1. Use Drive for continuous data: Your photos and client contact info (billing, etc) are irreplaceable.

Bonus: You can easily access the backups via any computer that can connect to your Synology, and if you use Quick Connect, your backups can run from anywhere on the internet. No drives to mount or unmount...it just works.

2. Make an occasional bootable clone to a USB drive via CCC: Protect from any system or software issues. Important to do before big software updates, or OS updates, so you can roll back easily needed.

3. Clone your NAS data (as you are now) via USB Copy: Good to have a second backup...in case the NAS burst into flames.

Oh, and yes, you can technically make a clone of your entire drive to a NAS. The trick is, you save it as a disk image. Not natively bootable, but it could be used to restore from the image to a Mac....as was mentioned above.

Imagine your MBP died unexpectedly. If you replaced it, you could restore the boot image to the replacement MBP and have all your software, settings, configurations, etc. restored to be exactly the same as your last clone.

The flip side is...it can be a bit of tech work to setup. With the low cost of HDs these days, it probably makes sense to buy a USB 3 external or two, and clone locally. Easier, and bootable. You could also make an image of a cloned drive and store the image on your NAS too.

Yes, Macs with T2 have an extra level of security, but you can boot to external drives if you configure it as needed.

 

[Styvow]

@hobowankenobi and @HDFan - A huge thank you for taking the time and think about how to make my system as redundant as possible. This all makes sense and seem to be very good suggestions.

Let me give you a bit of background. I cleaned up my external backups and MacBook and at the moment, my data is spread out like this:

* on my MacBook, I only have the admin of my business (around 30GB) and my Master Lightroom catalogues containing ALL my images (professional and personal images, around 100GB). This admin and LR catalogues are the core of my business so very important to safeguard and back these up frequently.

* On my NAS, the data currently totals up to around 10TB and consists of:
- the RAW files that are collected in the Master LR catalogues and their JPG exports (archive)
- Tutorials and content of my own workshops I organise

* I have a 2TB external SSD where I store my Work In Progress (WIP) and which I clone to my NAS every night using USB Copy.

1. Use Drive for continuous data: Your photos and client contact info (billing, etc) are irreplaceable.

Very good idea... I didn't know it was possible to do this with Synology Drive.. still so much for me to learn about my new NAS system

2. Make an occasional bootable clone to a USB drive via CCC: Protect from any system or software issues. Important to do before big software updates, or OS updates, so you can roll back easily needed.

How frequent would you recommend to do this? Maybe a weekly or even monthly update should be good, right?

3. Clone your NAS data (as you are now) via USB Copy: Good to have a second backup...in case the NAS burst into flames.

I'm planning to do this indeed for my photo archives. I would swap an external hard drive from a different location every two weeks. Would you suggest to simply do this for my full NAS then and not only my photo archives? This could be a hassle since the data on the NAS is only going to grow and grow so I would need multiple external drives.


Now the only thing I'm thinking of is this: Suppose my whole house would go up in flames. I have an external copy of my NAS on a different location (a full copy or at least the RAW files of my photos). This would mean a maximum of two weeks data loss if I clone my NAS data every two weeks. This is no problem for my photo archives since nothing really changes in two weeks but my bootable clone and my WIP would be gone. And especially that last one is a problem. I have to make sure I have a back up of the work I do for my clients so two weeks data loss is a no-go. So to solve that problem, I'm thinking of syncing that WIP folder on my NAS which I update every night, to the cloud. I would have to do the same for my admin and Master catalogues so I should link the Synology Drive backup to a cloud service.

The only thing I don't have covered then is the loss of that bootable clone.. I could leave that clone in my car outside.. or can you upload a clone to the cloud as well? I was thinking of iDrive as a cloud service since I can connect a NAS to it as well as use it to backup my iPhone.

I hope all of this makes sense. I'm a bit dizzy reading it myself