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Lemon Olive

Suspended
Original poster
Nov 30, 2020
1,208
1,324
Ok not exactly vaporware, but what most would consider it to be.

Apple should start announcing products way in advance instead of leaving customers confused about their roadmap, and even putting products up for pre-order long before they are even finished.

Especially right now during the transition to Apple Silicon. Mac customers are left in a very awkward state, having to choose between consumer grade devices that have been updated, and out of date Intel models that nobody wants. Apple should have announced the entire first run of Apple Silicon models in advance and allowed customers to pre-order them. When it comes to the roadmap, customers are not shown enough respect. Especially for Pro users, who depend on these machines for their business, and need to periodically make plans around what Apple is doing. We shouldn't be left guessing and making decisions based on a rumor mill. Apple should provide a product road map for specific products and tentative launch dates for iterations.

I would greatly prefer to pre-order a product that will tentatively launch in 6, 12, or 18 months then have no word on the existence of said product until 10 days before it ships.

That is all. ?
 
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Gnattu

macrumors 65816
Sep 18, 2020
1,107
1,672
It will be a problem to promise something not in near future because nobody can guarantee the delivery of the exact product.
 

za9ra22

macrumors 65816
Sep 25, 2003
1,441
1,931
You could apply the same principle to any company in any industry, and all that would happen is that the market for everything would be woefully confused, and entirely inoperable, because nobody would buy anything because there would always be a better product known to be in the pipeline.

It would also provide competitors with all the information they need to undercut new products before they even exist, meaning that were you to pre-order something such as an M2 iMac 32-inch, because Apple had announced it would be available in November, they may find the market has shifted out from underneath the product by competitors, and decide it is uneconomic to actually develop the product after all.

It would not help the consumer one bit, where a better understanding in the market of seeking the best product for one's individual needs from those available when the need materializes would be far more sound, and helpful.
 

TiggrToo

macrumors 601
Aug 24, 2017
4,205
8,838
Ok not exactly vaporware, but what most would consider it to be.

Apple should start announcing products way in advance instead of leaving customers confused about their roadmap, and even putting products up for pre-order long before they are even finished.

Especially right now during the transition to Apple Silicon. Mac customers are left in a very awkward state, having to choose between consumer grade devices that have been updated, and out of date Intel models that nobody wants. Apple should have announced the entire first run of Apple Silicon models in advance and allowed customers to pre-order them. When it comes to the roadmap, customers are not shown enough respect. Especially for Pro users, who depend on these machines for their business, and need to periodically make plans around what Apple is doing. We shouldn't be left guessing and making decisions based on a rumor mill. Apple should provide a product road map for specific products and tentative launch dates for iterations.

I would greatly prefer to pre-order a product that will tentatively launch in 6, 12, or 18 months then have no word on the existence of said product until 10 days before it ships.

That is all. ?

That would be utterly terrible and provide zero value to anyone.
 

lars666

macrumors 65816
Jul 13, 2008
1,202
1,327
That’s called a paper launch. It would be silly for Apple to do that unless they wanted to freeze their Mac revenue for 12 months. It leads to the Osborne effect.
Didn't know about the Osborne effect (that there's a historic real-life example which gave this obvious customer behavior a name). Googled it and learned something today, thanks.
 

jerryk

macrumors 604
Nov 3, 2011
7,421
4,208
SF Bay Area
One of Apple's qualities as a company is having the product available to customers in a few days or a month after the announcement. That builds buzz and shows that Apple is NOT a vaporware company.
 

Lemon Olive

Suspended
Original poster
Nov 30, 2020
1,208
1,324
You could apply the same principle to any company in any industry, and all that would happen is that the market for everything would be woefully confused, and entirely inoperable, because nobody would buy anything because there would always be a better product known to be in the pipeline.

It would also provide competitors with all the information they need to undercut new products before they even exist, meaning that were you to pre-order something such as an M2 iMac 32-inch, because Apple had announced it would be available in November, they may find the market has shifted out from underneath the product by competitors, and decide it is uneconomic to actually develop the product after all.

It would not help the consumer one bit, where a better understanding in the market of seeking the best product for one's individual needs from those available when the need materializes would be far more sound, and helpful.
All of your points are valid and I'm entirely aware of them. Frankly though, it doesn't help anyone, especially Pro customers, to be left entirely in the dark for months or years at a time. Look at what happened with the Mac Pro in the past. Apple went so silent for so long that they ended up needing to do damage control interviews to stop the press from destroying them over it.

The idea that "no one would buy anything" is a bit silly. Pro customers, especially businesses and orgs, are not going to not buy something because Apple has provided a roadmap. Plenty of companies provide roadmaps to their customers. It would be better for Apple to treat Pro customers a little more seriously.
 

JPack

macrumors G5
Mar 27, 2017
13,549
26,171
All of your points are valid and I'm entirely aware of them. Frankly though, it doesn't help anyone, especially Pro customers, to be left entirely in the dark for months or years at a time. Look at what happened with the Mac Pro in the past. Apple went so silent for so long that they ended up needing to do damage control interviews to stop the press from destroying them over it.

The idea that "no one would buy anything" is a bit silly. Pro customers, especially businesses and orgs, are not going to not buy something because Apple has provided a roadmap. Plenty of companies provide roadmaps to their customers. It would be better for Apple to treat Pro customers a little more seriously.

Nobody has been left in the dark. Apple made it clear their goal was to complete the transition in 2 years.

Pro users in well managed organizations tend to have set replacement cycles. Budgets are set before the fiscal year begins. They buy products tested and qualified by their IT department. A roadmap showing a blurry product doesn't help. Apple wouldn't want to commit specs or price so early either. Plenty of large organizations are still buying Intel-based MacBooks. That's why there is a 2-week lead time for custom Intel configs coming direct from Quanta.

Consumers are more willing to take risk with new products. They are the first to stop buying if they see an Osborne situation happening. That's one of the reasons why the transition began with the 13" and 24" models first.
 

za9ra22

macrumors 65816
Sep 25, 2003
1,441
1,931
....Frankly though, it doesn't help anyone...

It helps everyone.

Let me suggest a way to discover for yourself how your plan would not work. It's simple, start your own technology business, and go to the bank for a loan to get it going. Explain the plan, as you outlined it in the first post here, and see if they'll lend you the money.

In an industry with the dynamics and product turnover of IT design/manufacturing/support, I rather doubt it.

But then that's just me, and I'm not a banker.
 
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jdb8167

macrumors 601
Nov 17, 2008
4,859
4,599
Even better, how many of us used them? I inherited my dad's after he upgraded to a portable Compaq.
College roommate had one. We talked about it when I first found out about it in an advertisement in Byte magazine. It was remarkably inexpensive at the time. About $1800. Similar computers at the time could run $2500 or more.
 
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thenewperson

macrumors 6502a
Mar 27, 2011
992
912
More than what happened to Osbourne (considering Apple today can last for over a decade without selling anything), Apple probably doesn't pre-announce things because of the 'surprise and delight' play and also not letting your competition undercut you. It's why they try to prevent rumours too.
 

bluecoast

macrumors 68020
Nov 7, 2017
2,256
2,673
No thank you. I’d prefer products and features to be announced when Apple are ready to ship them or 99.9% confident of shipping them in the case of software.

I think anyone who considers themselves a ‘pro’ and who reads this (and it’s competitors) & Mark Gurman at Bloomberg, can work out what’s coming down the line re new Mac models:

16 inch MPB in the fall w/ new chassis design.
Updated ‘prosumer’ MBA in the fall w/ new chassis design.
No doubt the 27 inch MBP successor is waiting in the wings too but might come late due to chip shortages.
 

JMacHack

Suspended
Mar 16, 2017
1,965
2,424
“All warfare is based on deception.”
I’ve also found Sun Tsu quotes applicable to businesses. This would reveal what Apple is working on, giving competition a leg up. Personally, I wouldn’t do it.
 

Ray2

macrumors 65816
Jul 8, 2014
1,170
489
I agree putting a roadmap in front of the typical Apple customer base would lead to chaos. Perhaps you believe there’s rational thinking behind consumer computer purchases. I don’t.

However, I do believe Apple might execute a lot better in the development and sale of new tech. As in look at their own roadmaps. I’m the unfortunate owner of a 2018 mini. That’s the one where daily Bridge_OS related kernel panics took over a year to get addressed in the OS that shipped with the machine (Mojave). BT was placed too close to the USB3 A ports and was useless (addressed by going back to wire, with used, as Apple discontinued most wired accessories). Poorly grounded T-Bolt jacks that caused spontaneous “disk not ejected properly” messages. Fortunately the message was wrong and nothing is ever ejected. I’m on motherboard #3 so far. No improvement.

I don’t mind new tech with initial teething issues. I assume the company will continue to develop it. But new tech knowing it’s going to be abandoned in a year or 2 is wrong. It’s wrong for customers who suffer from constant issues that will never get addressed and wrong for Apple as my mini has been to service 4 times and has cost them far more than what they collected from me.

So today I finally got sick and tired of it all and looked at the trade for an M1 MBP. First, what is the M1 MBP other than a squared off Air with a trendy name and a higher price? Yes, Apple knows many of us buy status rather than functionality. Then I look at the software tools I need. Only a few run native. I get the impression some don’t run at all. Apps I already paid for don’t run native. I'm given the amazing opportunity to sign up for subscription only apps that do run native. As in Apple and their app suppliers screwing all of us with overpriced crap that runs just as well, or poorly, as the apps we already paid for.

I’ll publish my roadmap. Media servers go to either an NAS, a Raspberry or an Nvidia. Personal computing can go to a new iPad Pro.

Apple can thank Steve Jobs for the iPhone. Even this motley crew hasn’t been able to kill that golden egg. And, the OP has a good point.
 
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