Upgrade mid-2010 Mac Pro or wait for 2018 MP??

[bzollinger]

Hello,

I've got a mid-2010 Mac Pro that has been running great since I bought it. But lately I've started to run into storage issues and was wondering what peoples thoughts were.

The current setup is:
3.2Ghz Quad core
16GB Ram
Startup disk is 128GB SSD w/64GB free
ATI Radeon HD 5770 1024MB
Superdrive (which I still use)
Storage drives: 3TB w/360GB free, 2TB w/412GB free, 2TB w/1TB free
Timemachine drive: 3TB that is full

My thoughts are to just revamp the storage setup possibly with three 8TB or 10TB drives in RAID5, and a new larger startup SSD drive.

500GB SSD around $200-250
3qty- 10TB drives $929
PCIe RAID controller $80

So for around $1200 I should be able to upgrade my current system to last another 5-7 years as long as nothing else breaks.

Or I limp along until next year and get a new MP and have to add storage for around $3000 for the computer and another $1000 for external RAID storage.

What are you guys' thoughts? And thanks in advance!!

 

[h9826790]

Why wait? All the SSD and HDD you mentioned is not cMP specific hardware. You can use it on almost any current generation computer (or NAS etc). Your real cost of this upgrade project is just the $80 RAID card.

If you go for the Mac Pro 7,1 later, you still need these storages, and all of them are re-usable (may need to go external, who knows if the 6,1 has any internal storage expansion ability or not).

 

[AxiomaticRubric]

So for around $1200 I should be able to upgrade my current system to last another 5-7 years as long as nothing else breaks.

There is no solid information on exactly when the new Mac Pro is arriving. We also don't know how it will be set up to handle external hard drives (speculation is that it will connect to external hard drive enclosures via TB3).

On the other hand, the next version of macOS may not be compatible with your 2010 Mac Pro.

I'd say go ahead and upgrade the magnetic drives, maybe hold off on the SSD and save that money for an external drive enclosure compatible with the new Mac Pro. I highly doubt that Apple will re-adopt the tower design.

Worst case, you will be stuck with High Sierra on your current Mac Pro until you can afford the latest & greatest, but you would have all the capacity you need.

 

[kohlson]

Take the storage out of the equation - needed whether you update or upgrade.

It would help to know what you do with all this, but possible upgrades to your current cMP, as needed:
USB3 - $50-60 and a PCIe slot (use with external drives)
32GB memory - $100
Graphics: $200-500 for more current card
Westmere 6-core - $75-100
8TB drives: $200-ish (and consolidate SATA bays)

And while I am a big fan of SSDs, not sure why you need to replace the one you have.

 

[06tb06]

It would help to know what you do with all this, but possible upgrades to your current cMP, as needed:
USB3 - $50-60 and a PCIe slot (use with external drives)
32GB memory - $100
Graphics: $200-500 for more current card
Westmere 6-core - $75-100
8TB drives: $200-ish (and consolidate SATA bays)

Agreed. At this point in time there are no rumors or leaked info as to what the updated MPs will look like or how they will function. Nowadays you can buy older hardware at drastically reduced prices. For example, an eight-core Sandy Bridge Xeon processor at launch was ~$2300+, currently you can find those models on eBay at a mere $80. Same goes for memory. Graphics are a different story though. The HD 7950 Mac Edition costs, last I checked, around ~$400.

 

[bzollinger]

There is no solid information on exactly when the new Mac Pro is arriving. We also don't know how it will be set up to handle external hard drives (speculation is that it will connect to external hard drive enclosures via TB3).

On the other hand, the next version of macOS may not be compatible with your 2010 Mac Pro.

I'd say go ahead and upgrade the magnetic drives, maybe hold off on the SSD and save that money for an external drive enclosure compatible with the new Mac Pro. I highly doubt that Apple will re-adopt the tower design.

Worst case, you will be stuck with High Sierra on your current Mac Pro until you can afford the latest & greatest, but you would have all the capacity you need.

Thanks for pointing this out. This is a great point. As of right now I'm still on Yosemite so if Apple does abandon this version of the MP for the next OS it won't be too bad for me.
[doublepost=1512678954][/doublepost]

Take the storage out of the equation - needed whether you update or upgrade.

It would help to know what you do with all this, but possible upgrades to your current cMP, as needed:
USB3 - $50-60 and a PCIe slot (use with external drives)
32GB memory - $100
Graphics: $200-500 for more current card
Westmere 6-core - $75-100
8TB drives: $200-ish (and consolidate SATA bays)

And while I am a big fan of SSDs, not sure why you need to replace the one you have.

Yes good point. So I am good with the performance of all the other components. Maybe I could use some more RAM at times.

To save space I've currently got my user folder and all it's contents on one of the non-ssd drives. I'd consider buying a bigger ssd and putting everything back to a typical install so that everything speeds up a little.

I do some photography using Lightroom and some Photoshop stuff. I don't do anything with video really. I also do a little bit of handbrake encoding but am fine with the current speeds.

 

[h9826790]

Agreed. At this point in time there are no rumors or leaked info as to what the updated MPs will look like or how they will function. Nowadays you can buy older hardware at drastically reduced prices. For example, an eight-core Sandy Bridge Xeon processor at launch was ~$2300+, currently you can find those models on eBay at a mere $80. Same goes for memory. Graphics are a different story though. The HD 7950 Mac Edition costs, last I checked, around ~$400.

A PC 7950 can be flashed easily to work better than the 7950 Mac Edition card, and that’s just ~$80.

 

[bzollinger]

So it's fairly apparent that I really just need to redo my storage and/or maybe my RAM.

I'd rather keep everything internal. Some redundancy is also important to me. Apart from the startup drive I've got three bays available.

The RAID card on other world computing is a 4 port eSATA card but the ports are all on the outside which makes for a little bit of a funky setup to have internal drives with wires plugged in externally...

What do you guys suggest?

 

[h9826790]

So it's fairly apparent that I really just need to redo my storage and/or maybe my RAM.

I'd rather keep everything internal. Some redundancy is also important to me. Apart from the startup drive I've got three bays available.

The RAID card on other world computing is a 4 port eSATA card but the ports are all on the outside which makes for a little bit of a funky setup to have internal drives with wires plugged in externally... What do you guys suggest?

I personally won’t recommend you go for that RAID card. It make the setup more complicated with no apparent benefit.

If you want to RAID the HDD, use disk utility to apply Apple software RAID usually good enough.

 

[fendersrule]

I have a MSI 7950 that i'm selling. As long as I get $80 in my pocket after shipping, it's available. Box 'n all.

 

[bzollinger]

I personally won’t recommend you go for that RAID card. It make the setup more complicated with no apparent benefit.

If you want to RAID the HDD, use disk utility to apply Apple software RAID usually good enough.

This is good advice, I'd like to know how others feel about it too. If Apple's software RAID works reliably then that's great!
[doublepost=1512683522][/doublepost]So you're thinking I pick up three 10TB drives, slap 'em in and use the disk utility and be done with it? Sounds pretty simple and easy. Going with this setup would give me 20TB of space with one drive failure tolerance. Or save a couple hundred bucks and use three 8TB drives netting me 16GB.

 

[kohlson]

I see your point on the SSD size. I just figured since what you have works...

But you can get a decent 500GB SSD for under $150. It won't make things faster, but may make things easier.

Note that my friend has a 2010 with 5770, and he fell in love with my Dell P2715Q 4K monitor. Bought one, plugged it in with the supplied DP cable, and complained that 4K was too small. I pointed out to him that this wasn't even supposed to work. He runs it at 1440p.

I think the main thing you're seeing here is there are lots of options for this versatile system. You have plenty of headroom.

 

[OS6-OSX]

This is good advice, I'd like to know how others feel about it too. If Apple's software RAID works reliably then that's great!
.

I used Apple's SW RAID 0 (4 drives) for years and got 746 W/681 R. Later adding an ATTO R644 and 4 additional external drives. Using DVRAID whcih is ATTO's RAID 0 where you can lose 1 drive) vs regular RAID 0. So if you go RAID 0 don't forget to have a backup plan!

 

[orph]

http://www.storagereview.com/ is worth a look, some of the bigger drives are slower than the smaller ones, also do think about external backup as well as internal, thats a lot of data in one place, my external backup's help me sleep at night.
if you do go raid think about using raid drives or enterprise drives, WD red/black/gold etc.

unless adobe has relay updated things in CC a 6 core CPU upgrade wont give a real speedup apart from batch exports (im on CS6 bridge/LR so maybe they have sorted things in CC?) you will get a slight boost from a X5690 3.46ghz 4c but it's not a game changer for those apps a newer GPU may give some help but agen not shore it will for the apps listed so id sit on what you have and put that towards a new macpro but a USB 3 pci card is cheep and nice to grab (mine was about £20)

you also have the option of something like
-SSD startup disc on PCI card
-start with 2 big drives, 1 you work from and one that you do nightly backups on to (no raid)
-have 2 empty slots that if needed you can fill at a later date
-SSD in lower optical drive slot (your old one) as scratch disc (or have that as OS drive and scratch on PCI SSD drive)

as the drives wont be raided you can just pull them at any time and stick them in an external case or new macpro, not shore if you can just pull raid drives from one computer to anther with no problems?

also why not 4 drives to RAID instead of 3?

 

[OS6-OSX]

also why not 4 drives to RAID instead of 3?

Above shows him using "Time machine". Sounds like it's in one of the 4 slots. Even though he uses the "Super
drive" it probably is better off used externally. That way he could place the "Time machine" drive in the optical bay and use 4 drives for RAID 0. More speed and lager RAID.

 

[orph]

why not just stick the Time machine drive on an external disc, say a USB3 powered drive so no extra cables needed via usb2 port or a usb3 pci card? makes things more simple.
there only live backups so you dont need to take up an internal slot for them there for when things full apart not daily use so id stick them on an external, but thats me.

 

[pl1984]

This is good advice, I'd like to know how others feel about it too. If Apple's software RAID works reliably then that's great!
[doublepost=1512683522][/doublepost]So you're thinking I pick up three 10TB drives, slap 'em in and use the disk utility and be done with it? Sounds pretty simple and easy. Going with this setup would give me 20TB of space with one drive failure tolerance. Or save a couple hundred bucks and use three 8TB drives netting me 16GB.

Before purchasing a high capacity drive be sure to do your research regarding possible mounting issues. The higher capacity drives have changes to the standard (defined as locations used prior to, I think, 6TB drives) mounting locations and therefore may not work with the standard Mac Pro drive sleds.

 

[bzollinger]

http://www.storagereview.com/ is worth a look, some of the bigger drives are slower than the smaller ones, also do think about external backup as well as internal, thats a lot of data in one place, my external backup's help me sleep at night.
if you do go raid think about using raid drives or enterprise drives, WD red/black/gold etc.

unless adobe has relay updated things in CC a 6 core CPU upgrade wont give a real speedup apart from batch exports (im on CS6 bridge/LR so maybe they have sorted things in CC?) you will get a slight boost from a X5690 3.46ghz 4c but it's not a game changer for those apps a newer GPU may give some help but agen not shore it will for the apps listed so id sit on what you have and put that towards a new macpro but a USB 3 pci card is cheep and nice to grab (mine was about £20)

you also have the option of something like
-SSD startup disc on PCI card
-start with 2 big drives, 1 you work from and one that you do nightly backups on to (no raid)
-have 2 empty slots that if needed you can fill at a later date
-SSD in lower optical drive slot (your old one) as scratch disc (or have that as OS drive and scratch on PCI SSD drive)

as the drives wont be raided you can just pull them at any time and stick them in an external case or new macpro, not shore if you can just pull raid drives from one computer to anther with no problems?

also why not 4 drives to RAID instead of 3?

I totally agree with the negligible speed gains from CPU and video card upgrades. I'll have to look at storage review.com again. A few years ago it was the high capacity drives that preformed well due to their density. Also having a large capacity drive will help me from filling them up. It was my understanding that once a drive becomes half-full you start to incur a performance hit.
[doublepost=1512760536][/doublepost]

Before purchasing a high capacity drive be sure to do your research regarding possible mounting issues. The higher capacity drives have changes to the standard (defined as locations used prior to, I think, 6TB drives) mounting locations and therefore may not work with the standard Mac Pro drive sleds.

Oh, good advise. So they have a different mounting spec? I'll have to search to see if any other MP users have used 8TB or 10TB.

 

[ActionableMango]

Oh, good advise. So they have a different mounting spec?

Starting at 6TB, some drives lost the middle mounting holes that the Apple drive sled uses. Other drives still have those holes. So either make sure you buy a drive with the middle holes or get the following sled that will mount to either.

https://eshop.macsales.com/item/OWC/MPRODBKTLG6/

 

[bzollinger]

I used Apple's SW RAID 0 (4 drives) for years and got 746 W/681 R. Later adding an ATTO R644 and 4 additional external drives. Using DVRAID whcih is ATTO's RAID 0 where you can lose 1 drive) vs regular RAID 0. So if you go RAID 0 don't forget to have a backup plan!

I've never heard of DVRAID. So it's RAID which isn't fault tolerant, because the data is striped across both drives, but you can lose one? If I go RAID it'll be for fault tolerance, not speed. Hence three drives in a RAID 5 setup. But thanks for the info. I'll look into DVRAID!
[doublepost=1512761823][/doublepost]Side note, I picked up an external 8TB western digital drive on sale at Bestbuy yesterday for $140 for a Time Machine backup.
[doublepost=1512761894][/doublepost]

Starting at 6TB, some drives lost the middle mounting holes that the Apple drive sled uses. Other drives still have those holes. So either make sure you buy a drive with the middle holes or get the following sled that will mount to either.

https://eshop.macsales.com/item/OWC/MPRODBKTLG6/

This is very helpful, thank you sir!!

 

[pl1984]

Oh, good advise. So they have a different mounting spec? I'll have to search to see if any other MP users have used 8TB or 10TB.

This may be helpful to you:

6TB HDDs Causing Problems for System Vendors - But Not the Way You Think

 

[bzollinger]

This may be helpful to you:

6TB HDDs Causing Problems for System Vendors - But Not the Way You Think

That is interesting, thank you for sharing. Taking this into account the sleds that ActionableMango mentioned should solve this problem, correct?

 

[pl1984]

That is interesting, thank you for sharing. Taking this into account the sleds that ActionableMango mentioned should solve this problem, correct?

It looks as if they will.