USB-C/Thunderbolt 3/4 to HDMI 2.1 4k@120hz Gamma Flickering

[Zorast]

OLD STUFF


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4k@120hz RGB4:4:4 10bit HDR now possible !!

https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...ith-apple-silicon-m1-m2-now-possible.2381664/

 

[leifp]

Step 1: no, Macs only support HDMI 2.0 (no idea which subset)

Step 2: why are you not using the HDMI included on your laptop?

 

[Zorast]

Step 1: no, Macs only support HDMI 2.0 (no idea which subset)

Step 2: why are you not using the HDMI included on your laptop?

I use the HDMI Port, but it support only 2.0 ! 4K 60hz

 

[leifp]

Is there a reason you require more? VRR/120Hz is generally only of use in gaming. Is that what you use the C2 for? (The C2 is considered a major downgrade vs the C1 for gaming due to how it handles black frame insertion)

 

[Zorast]

The HDMI 2.1 Controller which is uses in the C2 does have also the BUG on 2.0 4k@60hz.
I write why before, because there is the flickering issue on frequencies under 120hz. The Panels are calibrated to 120hz.

The C2 is the only OLED in 42 Inch there is no other pick u can.

 

[leifp]

Not quite true. I have this one: https://rog.asus.com/us/monitors/above-34-inches/rog-swift-oled-pg42uq-model/

But it’s a monitor and not a TV, if that matters…

 

[Zorast]

Really Nice did not seen them !! It has DP so Connection works perfect ! But I Pay only 720€ for mine 42 OLED and the ASUS Cost 1700€

Did see that it have an Anti-Glare which I do not ike because the Blacks and Contrast a l lot less good as the LGs. :/

 

[Zorast]

Did see there's another oled in 42 Inch:

Sony XR-A90K

A90K | BRAVIA XR | MASTER Series | OLED | 4K Ultra HD | High Dynamic Range (HDR) | Smart TV (Google TV) | 107 cm (42")

Unser kompakter OLED-Fernseher, perfekt für Gaming

www.sony.de

 

[leifp]

Yes, I looked into using TVs however for myself I preferred to get the monitor. I can control the light levels in my room very well, so I’m not really impacted by the greying. It is my gaming PC and PS5 display… no movies or other uses.

 

[kasakka]

The HDMI 2.1 Controller which is uses in the C2 does have also the BUG on 2.0 4k@60hz.
I write why before, because there is the flickering issue on frequencies under 120hz. The Panels are calibrated to 120hz.

The C2 is the only OLED in 42 Inch there is no other pick u can.

I have literally used the LG CX 48" as a desktop display for two years at 4K 60 Hz on a Mac. There was no flickering issues. Don't know if the newer ones have this somehow worse but the problem was always just when VRR was enabled an in very specific situations.

The problem is specific to LG OLED panels too and if it's a 42 or 48" model, at the time of writing every other manufacturer will also use LG OLED panels for those sizes. So they are likely to have the exact same problem.

Even when gaming on the CX using a PS5 where most games run at 60 Hz, I have not experienced this flicker issue a single time. I think I have seen it in a game loading screen when using it on my desktop PC at 120 Hz but again, it's a rare problem.

But when it comes to Mac, just don't buy a LG OLED TV to use with it. There is still absolutely no way to run it at above 4K 60 Hz and even that requires EDID hacks if you don't want it to default to 10-bit 4:2:0 which is the absolute worst option for desktop use because it makes any red/blue text look like garbage.

Until Apple fixes support for HDMI 2.1 there is nothing you can do. No adapter or cable will help you.

 

[maflynn]

s there a reason you require more? VRR/120Hz is generally only of use in gaming.

No it isn't. Apple itself uses faster then 60hz in many of their products. The OP doesn't have to justify the desire for > 60hz other then its a nice to have, and provides a better computing experience.

I can't speak about Apple's ability or inability regarding this topic, but marginalizing the Ops, desire to have something that many if not most mainstream new laptops support is unfortunate

 

[Zorast]

I have literally used the LG CX 48" as a desktop display for two years at 4K 60 Hz on a Mac. There was no flickering issues. Don't know if the newer ones have this somehow worse but the problem was always just when VRR was enabled an in very specific situations.

The problem is specific to LG OLED panels too and if it's a 42 or 48" model, at the time of writing every other manufacturer will also use LG OLED panels for those sizes. So they are likely to have the exact same problem.

Even when gaming on the CX using a PS5 where most games run at 60 Hz, I have not experienced this flicker issue a single time. I think I have seen it in a game loading screen when using it on my desktop PC at 120 Hz but again, it's a rare problem.

But when it comes to Mac, just don't buy a LG OLED TV to use with it. There is still absolutely no way to run it at above 4K 60 Hz and even that requires EDID hacks if you don't want it to default to 10-bit 4:2:0 which is the absolute worst option for desktop use because it makes any red/blue text look like garbage.

Until Apple fixes support for HDMI 2.1 there is nothing you can do. No adapter or cable will help you.

The Black Color Flickering under 120hz is a problem which all have when HDMI 2.1 is used. Its a Bug with HDMI 2.1.
When u have a TV/Monitor that only support 60 hz then u will not have this issue. But when u have a 120hz Panel and run it with under 120 hz or VRR under 120hz u will get this issue. This is what I have ben informed now after reading days about this issue. Also LCD have this issue but u will not notice it there like on an oled. This is why we need the Game-Optimizer on LGs

He mentioned it can not be fixed by Software:

He say this also:

 

[leifp]

No it isn't. Apple itself uses faster then 60hz in many of their products. The OP doesn't have to justify the desire for > 60hz other then its a nice to have, and provides a better computing experience.

I can't speak about Apple's ability or inability regarding this topic, but marginalizing the Ops, desire to have something that many if not most mainstream new laptops support is unfortunate

That was a genuine question to figure out what their use case was.

 

[maflynn]

And VRR is very much a gaming-only use case

I cant answer regarding that, I have no experience

none of Apple’s flat panel desktop displays have exceeded 60Hz.

The MBPs, iPhones and some (all?) iPads do. As for the industry, more and more monitors are using 120hz or faster.

Its been reported that faster then 60hz offers better user experience.

 

[Zorast]

Get my Adapters. Can confirm, USB-C > DP 1.4 > HDMI 2.1 (active) incl. DSC does not work also. SH... MacOS

 

[kasakka]

The Black Color Flickering under 120hz is a problem which all have when HDMI 2.1 is used. Its a Bug with HDMI 2.1.
When u have a TV/Monitor that only support 60 hz then u will not have this issue. But when u have a 120hz Panel and run it with under 120 hz or VRR under 120hz u will get this issue. This is what I have ben informed now after reading days about this issue. Also LCD have this issue but u will not notice it there like on an oled. This is why we need the Game-Optimizer on LGs

View attachment 2122180


He mentioned it can not be fixed by Software:

He say this also:

It is not a bug with HDMI 2.1 but with the specific LG OLED panel design. To solve it they need to do something differently with their panel or its controller, thus no software fix is possible.

Again, this really does not show up unless quite specific conditions are met. My understanding is that LG even added a black level brightness slider option to the OSD to combat especially this.

 

[Zorast]

I ordered this till Apple MacOS Support natively 4k@120hz:

Docking Station Triple Display Multiport USB Hub, 12-in-1 USB C Docking Station mit 8K HDMI, Dual DP, 2*USB 3.1 10Gbps, USB 2.0, 100W PD, Ethernet, SD/TF Kartenleser für Lenovo/Dell/HP

Dieser All-in-One-Multifunktions-USB-C-Hub von LIONWEI bietet bequemen Zugriff auf mehrere Geräte auf Ihrem USB-C-Laptop/MacBook. Der Hub ist mit Triple-Display-Videoausgängen (1 x HDMI und 2 x Di...

www.amazon.de

Only pay EUR 59,49 for this. Unfortunately it can also be supported then. If not I can buy another More expensive Dock with USB 4 VIA VL 830 Chip or Thunderbolt 4 Dock. I think it will took time apple support 4k more than 60hz over HDMI

 

[Zorast]

It is not a bug with HDMI 2.1 but with the specific LG OLED panel design. To solve it they need to do something differently with their panel or its controller, thus no software fix is possible.

Again, this really does not show up unless quite specific conditions are met. My understanding is that LG even added a black level brightness slider option to the OSD to combat especially this.

Did u know if the Samsung NEO QLED also have this HDMI 2.1 Flickering under Panel frequencies ?

 

[Zorast]

After using this USB 4 Dock i got a lot less Flickering, dont know why... unfortunately I did not see it anymore... probably the reason is because it has an HDMI 2.1 Port and it works know better with the LG OLED ?

USB4 Docking Station Dual Display 4K&8K, QUUGE USB C Dock 14 in 1, HDMI+DP, 3×USB 3.2, 3×USB 2.0, 100W PD Upstream, mit USB4 Kabel, Kompatibel mit USB-C, Thunderbolt 4/3, USB4, MacBook Air Pro

USB4 Docking Station Dual Display 4K&8K, QUUGE USB C Dock 14 in 1, HDMI+DP, 3×USB 3.2, 3×USB 2.0, 100W PD Upstream, mit USB4 Kabel, Kompatibel mit USB-C, Thunderbolt 4/3, USB4, MacBook Air Pro

www.amazon.de

 

[leifp]

Yes, USB4 is basically Thunderbolt 4 and thus supports all the bandwidth required for 4K120 (40GBps of USB4 vs 48GBps of HDMI 2.1) although whether it handles VRR and HDR without using DSC (and whether you care) I cannot answer.

 

[magbarn]

So I guess the answer to this is buy a new M2 Pro Mac mini/MBP? I'm having the same issues when I went from 4K60 to 4K120 C2 OLED

 

[Zorast]

The Flickering issue can be solved when u use PC Mode on HDMI Port !! U can set this on LG Inputs Menü. Also it's better to use Game Mode with Fast Respond, this also improve the near black details.

 

[Zorast]

Did someone test an TB 4 > HDMI 2.1 Adapter on an M2 Pro/Max ?

 

[waydabber]

Hi guys, check this out to get 4K@120Hz on the M1 over HDMI.

#760

The method is to download the display's EDID via BetterDisplay, alter the EDID's video interface to DisplayPort (if set to nothing or set to HDMI originally - you might need to upgrade the EDID format to v1.4 for that) and then apply the EDID override (which is now possible on Apple Silicon with the latest BetterDisplay app version).

 

[Zorast]

4k@120hz RGB4:4:4 10bit HDR now possible !!

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/usb-c-thunderbolt-3-4-to-hdmi-2-1-4k-120hz-rgb4-4-4-10b-hdr-with-apple-silicon-m1-m2-now-possible.2381664/