What do I have to know about the Mac mini 2011/12 before buying?

[Cox Orange]

I found something funny. I could actually use my two 1,8" 256GB SSDs in one Slot http://geizhals.de/inline-76620a-2-5-laufwerksadapter-a1213065.html or http://geizhals.de/delock-sata-22-pin-auf-msata-mit-raid-2-5-konverter-62545-a1120168.html

Well not heat wise perhaps.

Meanwhile I read that Samsung EVO 840 drives suffer from read speed degradation for old files.

I had copied a folder with 40GB to my SSD and then duplicated it and activity monitor showed me that I have a read/write speed of about 150MB/s. I wonder, if activity monitor is acurate there, but it is interesting though. Also before doing that I had filled up the SSD 3-4 times and erased the 400GB of files.
I don't have TRIM enabled, which I found out, due to me updating to 10.10.2 and later I read that Apple has a kext signing to prevent malware overtaking the System and that will cause the Mac to hang after boot, when 3rd party SSD + TRIM is enabled and the OS is updated to Yosemite.
Anyhow, I noticed that after installing Adobe reader and a Lightroom demp and 10.10.2 and other updates the Mac now needs 1:30min to boot everytime, while it had been faster before the updates. Strange.

I wonder, if I'd be better off with buying a new Crucial m550 or even use a HDD, because I am moving (changing, deleting, writing) big files a lot.

 

[Cox Orange]

Some stores and shops still have new sealed 2012 Minis and also prices have dropped a bit for the 2013 iMacs, which are the current models in the apple-store.
So, now I am reconsidering getting one of these "sealed" options.

My question is how more years of usability will an Iris Pro (or even GT 750m) give me?
(re changes in video standards/encoding/decoding.)

While the clock speed differences of the iMac vs Mac Mini is neglectable, the 4 cores is maybe not, but I wonder how much everyday applications will develop further into utilizing 4 cores.

Also, what is an i7 good for, when the GPU is maybe holding it back? (Or am I thinking wrong?)


Options:

Mini
Core i5-3210M 2x2,5GHz, 4GB RAM, 500GB HDD, HD4000 (MD387D/A) [Late 2012] ..... = 540,- (+40 for extra RAM+HDD and its 630,-)
Core i5-4278U 2x2,6GHz, 8GB RAM, 1TB HDD, Iris 5100 (MGEN2D/A) [2014] ............... = 633,-
Core i7-4578U 2x3,0GHz, 8GB RAM, 1TB HDD, Iris 5100 [Late 2014] ........................... = 939,-
Core i7-3615QM 4x2,3GHz, 4GB RAM, 1TB HDD (MD389D/A) [Late 2012] = new, sealed 905,-eur
Core i7-3615QM 4x2,3GHz, 4GB RAM, 2x 1TB HDD (MD389D/A) [Late 2012] ................ = 1000,- (+20 for RAM –60 für 2nd 1TB)

+ 150-200 Monitor (or even 250???)
+ 70-90 for keyboard and mouse

21.5" iMac, i5 Quad [late 2013, is recent model!]
2,7GHz, 8GB, 1TB, Iris 5200 .......................................................= 1124,-
2,7ghz, 8GB RAM, 1TB HDD Fusion Drive (ie. +128GB SSD), Iris 5200 = 1357,-
2,7GHz, 16GB, 1TB, Iris 5200 ..................................................... = 1320,-
2,9GHz, 8GB, 1TB, GT 750M ....................................................... = 1215,-
2,9GHz, 16gb GT 750M .............................................................. = 1561,- (edu, apple on campus-Price 1496,48)

 

[dyt1983]

edit: To remove personally identifying info not relevant to the conversation.

 

[kramer733]

thinking about buying a mac mini.

Hi so after reading this thread and me being the not so technical person I am, should I get a 2012 mac mini and upgrade it with 16 gbs of ram and ssd or do I get a new 2014 mac mini? Which one is better? I've read that it's the architecture of the processor that matters and well is the 2014 mac mini's processor architecture better than the 2012?

 

[Cox Orange]

Hi so after reading this thread and me being the not so technical person I am, should I get a 2012 mac mini and upgrade it with 16 gbs of ram and ssd or do I get a new 2014 mac mini? Which one is better? I've read that it's the architecture of the processor that matters and well is the 2014 mac mini's processor architecture better than the 2012?

Short, the 2012 and 2014 Mini are so close, I guess, one can take the 2012, if it is 100,- or more cheaper (add the RAM and HD price). For further considerations and why I am making a fuzz out of it, read on and look at the links.

Mind there is a 1,4GHz i5 2014, we are talking about the 2,6GHz i5 2014.

2012 2,5GHz i5 vs 2014 2,6GHz i5
is not a real difference, just a bit more energy efficient, but neglectably. Also it has two new instruction sets, so when comparing them, it is actually a question, how big the price difference is and if you are willing to pay the difference for 6% more power. I don't know, if the "M" (for mobile) in the 2012 Minis CPU makes a different, when the 2014 Mini's CPU has a "U" (for ultrabook).
http://www.cpu-world.com/Compare/17...M_(PGA)_vs_Intel_Core_i5_Mobile_i5-4278U.html (PS: the link talks about removable CPU, that is wrong in this case).

Hence I was aiming at the GPU topic. The 2012 has a HD4000 and the 2014 has an Iris Pro (5100). It is said, that the Iris GPU is somewhat like a landmark for Intel as a new GPU manufacturer.
The recent iMac has the Iris Pro 5200, whereas the Mini has the 5100.
Here is a read-up about the 5200 http://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-Iris-Pro-Graphics-5200.90965.0.html (it is only 15% behind a midrange desktop GPU, like the GT 750! Hence I was bringing up the GPU topic)
Oh, and here the 5100 https://www.google.com/url?q=http:/...ds-cse&usg=AFQjCNHP8_ptCVbwRoaClu6VxMKZetV7Gw

If the graphics is neglectable as well, for me the question would be more, if one should buy a 2013 iMac (it's the recent model!) that has a Quad i5 (instead of Dual i5 in the 2012) or even the 2012 i7 with older graphics. How much threads does the Dual i5 run, again?

It is crazy and one sees, what ranges are possible for apple. The starting point (outside the Apple shop) was 829,-EUR for the i7 2012 base model, the lowest price was 673,- in 6/2013
and now 1/2015 the last went for 899,-

and it gets even better, I found an old Apple link, somewhen they sold a refurbished one for 609,- http://store.apple.com/de/product/FD388D/A/generalüberholter-mac-mini-23-ghz-Quad-Core-Intel-Core-i7

(prices are in EUR, usually Apple just takes the USD prices and changes the currency sign. You would have thought that at least when 1 EUR was 1,40 USD, they would have "translated" the prices, but they really just changed the currency signs.)

In the end we buy "old" hardware in all cases, even with the recent iMac, though it is 1 year less "old". (If you consider shop prices and not searching for a used one, anyway).

 

[Cox Orange]

PS: I read (not proof) that you can't downgrade the OS to the OS the model was introduced with, but always only to the one, that was sold with it.

A 2012 Mini is introduced with 10.8, but at the end of 2014 and in 2015 sold with 10.10 preinstalled. You can't downgrade to 10.8 or 10.9, here, ist that true?

I need 10.9 for using an old Presonus Firepod (proofed to work with 10.8 and Logic 8 and 10.9 and Logic 9) and Logic. If I had to stay with 10.10 I would have extra costs for buying Logic-X (199,-eur) and a new Interface (300,- minus old Firepod = 150,-EUR).

 

[David58117]

I would stay away from the 2.6, as it runs too hot and thus the fan can quickly become annoying. IMHO the 2.3 is the sweet spot to aim for.

Are you sure about this?

I've never had an issue with mine since I bought it at release.

 

[Celerondon]

Oh Yes David, They Are Quite Sure About This!

I would stay away from the 2.6, as it runs too hot and thus the fan can quickly become annoying. IMHO the 2.3 is the sweet spot to aim for.

Which is correct? Get the 2012 2.6 or stay away from the sizzling beast.

I have a 2.3 but I never knew that the 2.6 was that different. My 2.3 is dead quiet until I put it to work. Does it take less load to make the 2.6 exceed the 1800 rpm fan idle speed?

Are you sure about this?

I've never had an issue with mine since I bought it at release.

They are also quite wrong.

There are a few persistent posters that are quite sure about your 2.6 i7 being a real toaster. Why do I doubt their claims?

Folks like you continue to post quiet rebuttals that are ignored. You know, "I've never had that issue..." or "Perhaps there is/was something wrong with your friend's 2.6". Folks like me keep asking for evidence of this supposed problem. None of them ever provides more solid proof than random accounts of individual problems. You know, "I had a friend and his 2.6 ran hot."

The two 2012 i7 chips should have similar thermal profiles. I say that because their numbers are so alike in every category. Although, I can conceive of a circumstance where the 2.6 i7 could produce more heat than the 2012 mini’s cooling system can handle, I have not seen proof that the 2.3 i7 would do better in that sort of situation. I say this because the CPUs are so similar and because of the power management and thermal protection strategies that Intel designed into their Ivy Bridge mobile chips.

If we provide advice that a shopper should avoid a particular configuration because of a performance issue then shouldn't we be able to provide proof that it has a defective design?

 

[Cox Orange]

@ David and Celerondon:

just for other readers to make clear: in my last comparison above, I was comparing the 2,6GHz i5 2014 against the 2012 i7 (here the 4x2,3GHz). I say this, just so no one will think I was talking about the 2012 i7 4x2,6GHz vs the 2012 i7 4x2,3GHz.


On the heat rumors:
I already noted in previous post in this threads, that I have gathered info from other users over at logicuser.de (doing complex audio-stuff). They and some here, were saying it is not horrably loud. Hence I was assuming the poster in this thread who said, his one (later of a friend's) was loud, had a broken fan or an overheating CPU, because he was the only one having heat issues.


On my purchasing story.

After I had bought a Mini 2010 2,4GHz with 8GB RAM and 500GB SSD (and surprisingly 1year warranty left on the SSD) I got a 2012 i5 2,5GHz (4GB, 500GB HDD). I sold the first (2010er), because the 20112er was quicker of course and made 49,-eur plus. But the latter (the 2012er) was in a smelling and yellowish condition (although the seller had said, he wasn't a smoker. In fact the small was more like sweat or kitchen).
So, where I could have been satisfied with either the 2010 or the 2012, I am nnow at the point again, that I am considering my choice/options from the beginning again. There is also new info, that I didn't have before. Trusted shops are selling 2012 leftovers.

So my new thoughts went along the line: get old hardware (2012) vs "newer" hardware (2013 iMac and 2014 Mac Mini, both have the same generation of HW, I guess Intel didn't release new CPUs/GPUs in 2014).
On top of that, since prices are dropping, I am thinking about buying the stuff new.

2012 Mini i5 2,5GHz
= 400-450 used (I got mine, the smelly, for 395,-)
= 539,- new, sealed, 1 year warranty (with local pickup in shop)

2012 i7 (limited supply)
4x2,3GHz = new, sealed 905,-eur (crazy, when you know, that apple introduced them for 829,- and went down to 609,- once).

2014 Mini i5 2,6GHz is only 633,- (compare to 2012), but not upgradable (if that is really needed... anyway)

2013 iMac, 4x2,7GHz = new 1124,- sealed, 1y warranty. (considering the price for a display on top to the Mini prices and the keyboard+mouse that comes with it, which I would sell, though) (195,- more for 16GB, if one doesn't want to undergow the Upgrade by taking the screen off).
or with GT 750m and 2,9GHz i5 = 1215,-

Also, this will be a longtime investment ('cause I use my stuff till the last breath), but with allready 3/2 year old hardware. I originally planned to wait till October, but I have to buy it now, for some reasons.

Also, one argument against getting an iMac is that it "might" be a tad more open to getting issues or defects.

Also, the 2012 Mini and 2013 iMac (recent) is compatible with my audio-HW. For the 20114 Mini, I don't know it (getting new audio-HW would make 150,-eur more, after selling the old one and getting Logic X for another 190,- more). IF the 2014 Mini and 10.10 isn't compatible (I think - though not sure - Logic 9 doesn't run under 10.10 anyway, so I don't have to think about the HW being compatible or not...)

 

[Celerondon]

...On the heat rumors:
I already noted in previous post in this threads, that I have gathered info from other users over at logicuser.de (doing complex audio-stuff). They and some here, were saying it is not horrably loud. Hence I was assuming the poster in this thread who said, his one (later of a friend's) was loud, had a broken fan or an overheating CPU, because he was the only one having heat issues...

Exactly!

That is the reasonable conclusion.

Sorry about your smelly Mac. It seems as if you have good options though. If you go the iMac route, I vote for paying for the 16Gb upgrade rather than popping that screen on a new machine.

Enjoy the process!

 

[Cox Orange]

Exactly!

That is the reasonable conclusion.

Sorry about your smelly Mac. It seems as if you have good options though. If you go the iMac route, I vote for paying for the 16Gb upgrade rather than popping that screen on a new machine.

Enjoy the process!

Better save than sorry. I saw some iMacs with cracked Display corners on Ebay (probably from HDD upgrades, since they were older models).

What is holding me back a bit is, that I assume the Mini is more solid. Someone here said, that the iMacs have several varying problems (failing GPU, overheating, Display errors), though I am not sure, if the person said that because of the history of iMac failures one can sometimes see with older (and some very old) iMacs.

 

[Cox Orange]

There is one thing I missed about the iMac, the reflecting display. I have very bright light (Argon-quecksilver tube) in my room.

(I assume the iMac has the better Price/performance ratio, but the display doesn't make it easy to decide (as well as people saying the iMac is audible). The i7 Mini is not available anymore, since I now want to stop buying used stuff, I am left with the iMac and i5 Mini... I know, people heavily recommend taking the Quad (or i7) for my uses, but I am considering, if I can not just cope with some more minutes to wait, at a lower buying price.)

 

[Celerondon]

Start Your Own Thread For A Prompt Focused Response

Guys,
Do you really do not recommend at all buying a new mac mini with fusion?
Reading here it seems more convenient going for a 2012, can I ask you why?
i was thinking mainly for watching movies and this kind of stuff, so having a better graphic i though it would have been better.
Should i care so much about the dual core processor if I mainly intend to use as a desktop machine and not for power-requiring tasks?

I am really ignorant in terms of mac mini. I'd rely more on your opinions since I can read you are very informed on this machine.

Who doesn't recommend Fusion Drives? They are great for folks who need speed and space but are not ready to purchase a large SSD. You can purchase FD from Apple or make your own by adding a moderate sized SSD to an existing Mac.

Both 2012 and 2014 model minis have their strong points. You need to learn their features and choose which is best for your needs.

Both machines are fine for watching movies and similar activities.

Quad core i7 processors are not required for most desktop machine tasks. Video production programs and other CPU intensive software can be written to take advantage of multiple cores in a CPU such as a the QC i7.

 

[Cox Orange]

Who doesn't recommend Fusion Drives? They are great for folks who need speed and space but are not ready to purchase a large SSD. You can purchase FD from Apple or make your own by adding a moderate sized SSD to an existing Mac.

Both 2012 and 2014 model minis have their strong points. You need to learn their features and choose which is best for your needs.

Both machines are fine for watching movies and similar activities.

Quad core i7 processors are not required for most desktop machine tasks. Video production programs and other CPU intensive software can be written to take advantage of multiple cores in a CPU such as a the QC i7.

If you read the two posts after his post you see, that he was confusing Core2-Duo with Dual Core and was mixing up the 2010 Mini with the recent two, thinking the i5s were Quads, which he states himself later.
For his living room purpose he doesn't need an i7 / Quad. What he should know though is, that 3D, blu Ray and 4k/5k gets a problem with the 2012s HD4000 vs the Iris 5100 in the 2014 Mini (mind Thunderedge, we are talking about the 2,6GHz 2014 Mini, not the 1,4GHz i5 2014 Mini. The 1,4GHz one has a HD5000 and I don't know about the multimedia capabilities of that card).