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MP 7,1 Where are the lucky ones?
- Thread starter chfilm
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I think I've read posts from a couple of members who have already received their 2019 Mac Pros so they're here but they're probably enjoying their new systems to post much. I'm sure we'll hear more from them as they've had a chance to play around.I thought first users were receiving their units yesterday... where are they? Report please
I thought first users were receiving their units yesterday... where are they? Report please
Well, you saw my post about TB3 ports on the base unit... I received my new Mac Pro this past Friday so I've had it a few days now (was away over the weekend so haven't used it that much yet).
To the extent that industrial design matters, this thing is another Apple work of art. There is some level of satisfaction having it just sitting there to look at. I don't know how you put a $ figure value on such satisfaction, but there is definitely something nice about buying quality equipment. There is some residual benefit to feeling like you don't own crap.
Otherwise, I am one of those guys who fits the "prosumer" model that struggles to find the right middle-ground Mac for me. I've never wanted to go the iMac route because I want flexibility in expansion and in swapping monitors, etc. So I've always been a Mac Pro guy. The price of this one was just enough too expensive for me to be uncomfortable right now in the early days with where I ended up. I got the base unit which, as I pointed out in my thread about TB3 ports, just seems lame. Although I'm now using one of the top ports to drive a 2nd monitor, it just seems stupid that I have this cord protruding out of the top of the unit and a large bulky cord for the monitor draped across the machine. Anything other than the base GPU would not have this problem.
I couldn't stomach the extra $1000 for the 12 core over 8 core and I'm regretting it, partially because i'm just not sure how limiting that will be in years ahead. If I can eventually swap out the CPU, then I will be at peace. I just want options to protect the investment down the line. I wouldn't have those nerves if the base unit wasn't so expensive, obviously.
I have moved from a 6,1 Trashcan to this. My 6,1 was a 6 core but with D700 graphics. I'd probably have stuck with but I was feeling limited in monitor choice and connectivity options (TB2 is old now...). Heck, even little things like SideCar not working with it annoy me and that's a new feature (but I do like running my iPad as a 3rd monitor very easily and "just works"... I had run Duet for a while back in the day). At some level we all might be nerds around this (posting on MacRumors, etc), so perhaps many here can commiserate with my sense of just falling too far behind and wanting to freshen up my tech. Every 6 years doesn't feel like an outrageous cadence for upgrading... I wish I could do it more frequently, but that's more on Apple than me!
In summary, I have some initial buyers remorse around not getting the 12 core. I have no buyers remorse about the graphics card choice simply because the other BTO options are so expensive and I don't need *that* much power for graphics (I do some 4k video work, but nothing where time becomes a big $ trade off for me). I do want two more TB3 ports, so I guess I'm "suffering" with that for a bit.
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Hm well, understand that you feel a bit bad about the CPU... it should still leave your trashcan 6 core in the dust though, right? Also I'm pretty sure that you'll be able to swap CPUs down the line. iFixit already confirmed that it's swappable (at least on the Hardware side, but even on the trashcan it worked, so I'm sure here it also will.). If you're a prosumer, the 8 core is probably enough for now.
About the displays, yeaaaaaa. I still didn't get what kind of display you are attaching. LG 5k?
I think you should get the WX5700 when it comes out separately and rest in peace about both your port and performance situation. It'll be like another 1k probably.
I understand the pros and cons of referencing benchmarks, but I'm super curious to see the 8-core and 12-cores Geekbench scores for single- and multi-threaded.
LG 5k, new with this setup. I was on an old Apple Thunderbolt display before (now my 2nd monitor). I've lusted over a better monitor for a long time (I primarily do a lot of photo work).
With the confirmation that I can swap CPUs, I'm feeling just fine. I always want things faster, but the 8 core step up from my 6 core 6,1 is about 250% improvement in multicore according to Geekbench. That's pretty notable on a benchmark basis, I'll run some more real world tests between the two as time permits before I had off the old 6,1 (sold it to a family member, so I have about a week to play around with both).
Any chance you can post the actual Geekbench results?
I hate to be annoying, but knowing the exact numbers would be very helpful to me.
Not annoying at all! Here's the tests I ran across my three current Macs:
| Single Core | Multi-Core | Compute | |
| Mac Pro 6,1 6 core with D700 | 809 | 4,587 | 29,654 |
| MacBook Pro mid-2015 (i7) | 914 | 3,450 | 11,204 |
| Mac Pro 7,1 8 core with 580X | 1050 | 8,471 | 39,062 |
Three TB3 needs: LG 5k, Thunderbolt Display, series of disk arrays (old TB2, now daisy-chained together). So, for now, something has to connect to the top. It works, it just looks stupid and bothers me.
crazy that with just 2 cores more it DOUBLED the multicore test!!!
I hate how it's not possible to just write "mac pro" into the geekbench browser - it always shows me only macbook pro results...
Ours is arriving on Thursday. Can't wait to test it out and upgrade it etc. We've already had the Belkin GPU cable kit arrive.
I read your post in full and honestly I would advise you to return it. You've bought the base spec correct which is:
8 Cores, 256GB SSD, 32GB of RAM and a 580 GPU. This is not at all worth $6,000. It's a $1,500 PC in performance and component specification in a $2,000 platform. (Case, PSU, Motherboard etc). It is incredibly bad value to get the base spec of this system.
I would advise anyone looking at this to at minimum purchase the 16 Core / 1TB SSD / 32GB-64GB of RAM / Vega or 5700 XT models.
This is a case where it's like buying a very expensive vehicle that has very poor base options and you really need to spend the extra money to make the whole endeaver worthwhile. Like leather heated seats, upgraded sound system, Car Play, higher performance engine etc
Otherwise you just bought a very expensive case.
I understand the suggestion and I've considered it. I did bump up the SSD to 2TB. That said, your spec is very nearly $11,000 which is significantly more in practical $ terms and in % terms than what I paid. It is an expensive case, that is the reality of it. The Apple tax is real here.
I follow the car metaphor very well as I live in that world, too. I don't think it is a direct parallel, but there is something to buying a base stripped, say, Cayman, to a loaded Mustang. In reality, no one "needs", either. In the computer world, we might argue if someone needs a Mac vs. other OS, but at least people work on these machines (your car metaphor somewhat suggests it isn't a work car/truck). But depending what you're into the cars for and how you enjoy them, one's decision between platforms may be different. In our case as Mac users we are already in the "Porsche" world and leave the "Ford" world to Windows folks... The difference here is at least, theoretically, one can easily upgrade the "car" (case) with heated seats (more ports), CarPlay (additional GPUs), and higher perf engine (RAM and CPU) over time - and quite easily (more easily than upgrades in a car in most modern situations!).
Where I'm sitting today with this machine is it is better performing than my old Mac Pro, I've moved on to a nicer monitor which is helpful, and I expect to be able to improve performance in the next few years with upgrades as $ permits. I have basically bought the flexibility to be able to do that. I do not think the value is recognized until one takes advantage of that flexibility, though.
Ironically I own a base model car with no heated seats, manual seat adjustment, manual climate control, no dimming rearview mirror, manual transmission, and I had to swap out the factory radio for an aftermarket one with CarPlay, etc., so I've made the "better base" decision in the car world once or twice, too... Though, in the car world I just about never buy new.
One question, is the actual motherboard different for the 8 core than the 12 core? Given the 8 core uses slower memory, I do worry that there is something else - like the board - that will limit upgrades. If the board is identical and I can freely change the CPU someday, even if I need to change the RAM, I'm fine with my current machine. If the current 8 core board limits CPU upgrade, then I will consider returning for the 12 core.
Nah, it's the same board. The 8-core Xeon is the W-3223 and it's only capable of 2666 MHz RAM. It's the CPU itself that's the limit; as soon as you pop one of the other Xeons in, the RAM you have in the rig will speed up a bit.
It's the same motherboard you won't have any issues upgrading the CPU and Memory yourself. In a few years you'll be able to pickup the 22 to 28 core XEON for this socket at a fraction of the cost it is today and you can already buy a lot more RAM for a lot less than Apple is charging right now.
The multi-core score has gone from 4,587 to 8,471. This is not 250% improvement, is it?
I took a different route with my Mac Pro 6,1. I upgraded the CPU to 10 core, among SSD and RAM. The average Geekbenchmark 5 multi-core score is 7,150 for my unit. This is just a bit lower than the 8,471 score.
The main application that stresses my Mac Pro the most is my photography apps. It seems that you are into photography too. I don't do videos. So do you see much benefit for upgrading to 7,1?
I would return it too. Its clear that you are not happy about the purchase and you are just making "excuses" for what you like etc. In the end, I would keep the trashcan a little longer and save up for better system. If you have survived this long then you can survive a little longer.
I think if you keep the machine you will probably regret it as you already are right now.
In the end, its your call but from what you have told us here, the return is the clear winning choice.
Good luck
I think if you keep the machine you will probably regret it as you already are right now.
In the end, its your call but from what you have told us here, the return is the clear winning choice.
Good luck
I was surprised to see the 8,471 score too. This is not too far from the 7,150 of my 10-core Mac Pro 6,1. My Mac Pro 6,1 is also very quiet. For my intended applications (photography post processing and AI/ML prototyping work), I just don't see a reason to upgrade.
True but it's not just about the CPU, my totally souped up 5,1 has an ancient bus architecture that poos itself every time it tries to access anything through that bottleneck of architecture. Your Mac doesn't do anything without leaning on the RAM and storage. This is where I hope the nMP will speed up the workflow x10
The Geekbench scores are not just about CPU. With the algorithms they use, accessing RAM is part of the picture. You are right that it is not related to disk speed. However, I have seen some benchmark of Mac Pro 5,1 NVMe speeds that are pretty good, IMO. They are even faster than my Mac Pro 6,1's 1.35GB/sec R/W speeds.
I don't use any applications that need 1.35GB/sec of disk speed. But I wonder what applications would need 3GB/sec of disk speed that newer machines have?
if go base model, that is no big different between old 12 cores 6.1 and new 8cores 7.1
but I can see how important cores in my work flow, i already order a 28cores cpu and upgrade myself, and then will not worry about upgrade in next 7 years I guess,
and new cpu like this, wont drop much price in next 4-5 year, calculate how much time you will save in 5 year, and see if it worthy for you.
but I can see how important cores in my work flow, i already order a 28cores cpu and upgrade myself, and then will not worry about upgrade in next 7 years I guess,
and new cpu like this, wont drop much price in next 4-5 year, calculate how much time you will save in 5 year, and see if it worthy for you.
Keep in mind a 64-core Threadripper chip is coming next year which will be almost 3x faster than the 28 Core in the Mac Pro. So if cores matter this system will be invalidated very quickly. It already loses to the 32-Core Threadripper.
All of these chips support 2933MHz ECC Memory. The Threadripper chips however only address upto 256GB of RAM. The XEON's go 768GB to 1.5TB.
Just thought I'd mention it and of course the Threadripper chips are not being offered by Apple so if macOS is a requirement your only option is the XEON equipped Mac Pro.