MP 1,1-5,1 Why Mac OS?

[Oldmopars]

First off, PLEASE, this is in no way meant to say that Mac OS is in anyway bad. I am truly ask this question for my understanding and to help me know what the right thing is for my use.
I have several cMPs. 3 are/were 3,1, 2 are 4,1. After fighting to get my 4,1 to 5,1 and failing, I used Dosdudes Catalina installer. It worked, kind of. Catalina was loaded, but the graphics suffered. My stock GT120 and being on 4,1 firmware was likely the issues.
It seems I am going through a lot of trouble to keep or even get an operating system that at best is outdated.
For me, not all of the programs I use are available for Mac OS, or if they are, I have to do a work around to use it. (My Macbook Pro M2 Max)
I know I can use Windows 11, with some work, but have yet to try.
I just put Linux Mint on one of the 4,1s and it was easy. I installed my RX580 8gb, updated the AMD drivers and it is working perfectly. Way better than Catalina.
So, again, no insults or disrespect to Mac OS, but I am wondering if there are any advantages to me continuing to do battle with this to get some new version of Mac OS on it.
And, I am familiar with Mac OS, I have a new Macbook Pro M2 Max that is on the latest version (Sequoia 15,5).
Yes, I have an iPad and an Apple Watch that pair to it and that is nice, but I don't think I need that on the old Mac Pro.
Is there any real advantage, or is this more of a nostalgia thing to have a vintage Mac running Mac OS?

 

[avro707]

It is down to what applications you need to use. And if you don’t mind using a different OS.

 

[mcnallym]

This is not a Mac OS question but that hitting the issues of insisting on keeping around an old Mac and then running an old version of Mac OS that not intended to be on there.

So going to say yes is a nostalgia thing to have a vintage Mac.

When using a computer to perform tasks then should be spending time looking what is on the screen, not the screen itself.
Same as should be spending time in Applications not the OS.

If the applications you require aren’t available on Mac OS then run an OS that does support the application.

applications are what allow you to get you tasks done.

I love my Mac Studio and is great but I am. It going to spend time trying to faff about to play games when windows PC will get it done hassle free.

 

[eyoungren]

I have a 2009 MacPro 4,1 upgraded to a 5,1. I got it in May 2020 and it became my primary Mac, bringing me solidly into the Intel era.

Since around 2014, I have had Macs with six displays attached, primarily because at that time the Mac at work had three. And I had to do better. This was with a G4 Quicksilver, then a G5 2.3DC and ultimately a G5 Quad. My current MacPro replaced the Quad.

When I got the MP, I hung out on High Sierra for a while until I could afford Metal GPUs. Once I got those, I went up to Mojave. Until last year that is what I was running. Currently, I am on Sonoma 14.7.6. I will be upgrading to Sequoia when MacOS 26 drops later this year.

I followed all the steps here on MacRumors back in 2020 to get my 4,1 to a 5,1. This MacPro has 56GB ram and 24TB of storage between three SSDs and three HDs. All four drive bays are occupied, and I replaced the two optical drives with hard drives. My boot drive is a 1TB SSD.

I'm a graphic designer, so my tools are largely graphic oriented. I can run the Adobe CC24 suite and I manually installed Illustrator and Photoshop CC25 because they run on my Intel Mac, but Adobe won't let you install them using the Creative Cloud app.

I use MacOS because I like it and am familiar with it. Macs have been putting food on my table and paying the bills for me since 1999.

And I like what I can do. Right now, my 2009 MacPro has ten displays attached. Five 30" Cinema Displays, one 23" Cinema Display, one 20" Cinema Display, a 55" HDTV and two smaller Dell monitors. If you don't believe me, click the link in my signature.

 

[mattspace]

First off, PLEASE, this is in no way meant to say that Mac OS is in anyway bad.

Modern macOS IS bad, appalling, in fact.

I am truly ask this question for my understanding and to help me know what the right thing is for my use.
I have several cMPs. 3 are/were 3,1, 2 are 4,1. After fighting to get my 4,1 to 5,1 and failing, I used Dosdudes Catalina installer. It worked, kind of. Catalina was loaded, but the graphics suffered. My stock GT120 and being on 4,1 firmware was likely the issues.
It seems I am going through a lot of trouble to keep or even get an operating system that at best is outdated.
For me, not all of the programs I use are available for Mac OS, or if they are, I have to do a work around to use it. (My Macbook Pro M2 Max)

Why not use it with Linux, and virtualise macOS for the macOS apps you need? That's he great advantage of Mac Pros, they have enough RAM capacity to make that a viable option.

I know I can use Windows 11, with some work, but have yet to try.
I just put Linux Mint on one of the 4,1s and it was easy. I installed my RX580 8gb, updated the AMD drivers and it is working perfectly. Way better than Catalina.

There's your solution. I would also say that KDE Plasma is BY FAR a better looking UI than anything Apple has produced post-Catalina.

So, again, no insults or disrespect to Mac OS, but I am wondering if there are any advantages to me continuing to do battle with this to get some new version of Mac OS on it.

Not unless you need a mac-only app, or to maintain iCloud / iDevice connectivity.

And, I am familiar with Mac OS, I have a new Macbook Pro M2 Max that is on the latest version (Sequoia 15,5).
Yes, I have an iPad and an Apple Watch that pair to it and that is nice, but I don't think I need that on the old Mac Pro.
Is there any real advantage, or is this more of a nostalgia thing to have a vintage Mac running Mac OS?

Your old Mac Pro is like a classic car - you CAN use it for transport, it's not particularly safe if you take it on the highway, but the experience of using it can be fun. One might also suggest it's like a Tamagotchi, in that it will be constantly demanding you take care of it, and keep you worried that it will just up and die for some reason.

 

[Michael0816]

I don't get what's really being asked here? 🤔

 

[eyoungren]

I don't get what's really being asked here? 🤔

OP wants to know if, at the end their struggles to get a 4,1 to a 5,1, there is a payoff in using MacOS. And what might that payoff be for them.

If MacOS isn't worth this struggle, in OP's view then, what's the point? Just install something else that will run on a 4,1.

That's what's being asked.

 

[OS6-OSX]

 

[Oldmopars]

Modern macOS IS bad, appalling, in fact.



Why not use it with Linux, and virtualise macOS for the macOS apps you need? That's he great advantage of Mac Pros, they have enough RAM capacity to make that a viable option.



There's your solution. I would also say that KDE Plasma is BY FAR a better looking UI than anything Apple has produced post-Catalina.



Not unless you need a mac-only app, or to maintain iCloud / iDevice connectivity.



Your old Mac Pro is like a classic car - you CAN use it for transport, it's not particularly safe if you take it on the highway, but the experience of using it can be fun. One might also suggest it's like a Tamagotchi, in that it will be constantly demanding you take care of it, and keep you worried that it will just up and die for some reason.

Thank you. I really love the "Look" of the cMP, I love the design, the all Aluminum shell, the rugged industrial design. To me, they are the perfect housing for a computer. I just don't know if I like Mac OS. I use it all the time on my MacBook Pro M2 Max, but I spend 8+ hours a day working on a Windows computer and so Mac OS feels clunky and quirky. Like they had to find ways of doing things that were different than Windows, just to be different then Windows. If all I ever used was Mac OS, I am sure I would feel the opposite.
As for the hardware. If I upgrade the 2 CPUs to the best ones (Forgot the number) and max out the RAM, or close, would it run programs like Fusion 360, Mesh Mixer, Blender, etc. as good or better than say a Ryzen 7 5800XT? Or is it a waste of my time and money upgrading it when it will never be close? I don't mind spending money on it, but I don't want to build something that is just not useful.
The one thing it may be useful for is a server. I need a place to dump large 3D scanned files. Being able to use it as a large storage device might be the best use of it. With a ton of space, ECC memory and 2 Dual core CPUs, it could be a very good personnel server.

 

[Oldmopars]

OP wants to know if, at the end their struggles to get a 4,1 to a 5,1, there is a payoff in using MacOS. And what might that payoff be for them.

If MacOS isn't worth this struggle, in OP's view then, what's the point? Just install something else that will run on a 4,1.

That's what's being asked.

Thank you for your reply. I need to figure out how this thing will fit in my work flow. Using it as a server may be my best bet. It would not matter if it is a 4,1 or a 5,1.

 

[mattspace]

Thank you. I really love the "Look" of the cMP, I love the design, the all Aluminum shell, the rugged industrial design.

Yeah, I prefer the look of the 5,1 to that of the 7,1 I use now. Granted, the 7,1 has some advantages. They're both machines with compromises that really don't seem particularly smart in retrospect, but the architecture of the 5,1 is very elegant.

I just don't know if I like Mac OS. I use it all the time on my MacBook Pro M2 Max, but I spend 8+ hours a day working on a Windows computer and so Mac OS feels clunky and quirky. Like they had to find ways of doing things that were different than Windows, just to be different then Windows. If all I ever used was Mac OS, I am sure I would feel the opposite.

macOS is very much a living history of the political ascendencies of the technologies which have enamoured Apple at different times. A lot of what many would argue is wrong with macOS has come from trying to make it more like Windows, but trying to do it on the cheap.

Case in point - multiple display support, which worked perfectly since about 1985 when we had a completely different operating system called System (), then MacOS, with a single menubar and all displays as a single extended desktop. Then Apple tried to get something like the Windows way of having menus available on separate windows, like Windows users have, but they did it a stupid way, making each display a separate desktop, so you couldn't span windows across them any more.

So now you either have one menubar, and display spanning, or multiple menubars, and no display spanning.

The alternative was simply to let the system have multiple menu instances in the one space, which is quite possible, since we have apps like Menuwhere which effectively do that, albeit as a free-floating palette.

As for the hardware. If I upgrade the 2 CPUs to the best ones (Forgot the number) and max out the RAM, or close, would it run programs like Fusion 360, Mesh Mixer, Blender, etc. as good or better than say a Ryzen 7 5800XT? Or is it a waste of my time and money upgrading it when it will never be close? I don't mind spending money on it, but I don't want to build something that is just not useful.

You're going to come up against a problem with the CPUs not supporting features those apps require, I suspect.

The one thing it may be useful for is a server. I need a place to dump large 3D scanned files. Being able to use it as a large storage device might be the best use of it. With a ton of space, ECC memory and 2 Dual core CPUs, it could be a very good personnel server.

If electricity is free, that might be the case, but I suspect a NAS would do the same job better.

What it's best for, is a machine to run legacy workflows, where you want more than a single display - which is a limitation of most virtualising, and where you want more than 16GB of RAM, which is a limitation of legacy-os-supporting Mac Minis.

 

[avro707]

Thank you. I really love the "Look" of the cMP, I love the design, the all Aluminum shell, the rugged industrial design. To me, they are the perfect housing for a computer. I just don't know if I like Mac OS. I use it all the time on my MacBook Pro M2 Max, but I spend 8+ hours a day working on a Windows computer and so Mac OS feels clunky and quirky. Like they had to find ways of doing things that were different than Windows, just to be different then Windows. If all I ever used was Mac OS, I am sure I would feel the opposite.
As for the hardware. If I upgrade the 2 CPUs to the best ones (Forgot the number) and max out the RAM, or close, would it run programs like Fusion 360, Mesh Mixer, Blender, etc. as good or better than say a Ryzen 7 5800XT? Or is it a waste of my time and money upgrading it when it will never be close? I don't mind spending money on it, but I don't want to build something that is just not useful.
The one thing it may be useful for is a server. I need a place to dump large 3D scanned files. Being able to use it as a large storage device might be the best use of it. With a ton of space, ECC memory and 2 Dual core CPUs, it could be a very good personnel server.

The CMP 5,1 even upgraded to dual X5690 is just a bit too old now. It had a good long run. OS support is limited and you have the problem of very old parts, when they fail, can you replace them?