Will the iPad be able to run new iPhone4 apps?

[Piggie]

No-one seems to have mentioned this yet?


The iPhone4 screen res of 960x640 will be fine.

Just means a black boarder around the app 32 blank pixels on either side one way and 64 blank pixels either side in the other direction.

So screen wise, as long as you don't mind black borders, then that's ok.

But then we have the ram difference (if it's true what we think about the iPad's ram being 256 and not 512)

I've not heard anyone talk about this yet.

 

[barkomatic]

Any iPhone 4 app that requires the three axis gyro won't function properly because the iPad doesn't have one. I don't think there will be many apps that require all of the 512 mb of ram the new iphone has -- but if there are some advanced games those won't run well on the iPad either.

I don't mind the iphone having better specs --but the timing of this sucks for first gen iPad users. Im concerned developers may now wait for the next iPad to release their apps since they pretty much know the next iPad will have at least 512mb of ram if not more.

 

[Piggie]

Any iPhone 4 app that requires the three axis gyro won't function properly because the iPad doesn't have one. I don't think there will be many apps that require all of the 512 mb of ram the new iphone has -- but if there are some advanced games those won't run well on the iPad either.

I don't mind the iphone having better specs --but the timing of this sucks for first gen iPad users. Im concerned developers may now wait for the next iPad to release their apps since they pretty much know the next iPad will have at least 512mb of ram if not more.

Oh, yes, of course I'd not expect an app that used hardware you don't have to work (such as a gyro)

I'm not sure how the 512mb of ram will make a difference though.

I totally agree in that I think the timing of the release of the iPad and iPhone4 was a cock up.

If the Ipad had launched with the 512MB and a gyro, and THEN then iPhone4 launched just afterwards with the same hardware then I think we'd both "be on the same page" as they say.

At the moment, the two products feel out of sync with each other which I feel is a mistake, and some are feeling that the iPad needs a hardware tweak now to get the balance right again, which is not how we should be feeling so soon after launch.

This puts Apple in a bit of a tricky position, Does it do nothing, and wait 18 months or so before changing the iPad, or does it just to a tiny tweak now, and get it over with THEN wait the 18 months or 2 years before the next major change.

Either way, seems difficult.

I don't think it will be good to see a whole raft of new Iphone apps that won't run on the iPad due to the ram issue.

 

[RobBookPro]

ram will be no more of a problem as running an intense game on the 3Gs.

The biggest problem is when the apps are implementing iOS4 code which cannot run on the iOS3.2 ipad.

iOS4 should have shipped to both products at the same time.

 

[Figbash Acrobat]

ram will be no more of a problem as running an intense game on the 3Gs.

The biggest problem is when the apps are implementing iOS4 code which cannot run on the iOS3.2 ipad.

iOS4 should have shipped to both products at the same time.

+1 for this and many other reasons. Guess they wanted to hurry and get it out the door OR they just wanted the impact of iOS4 features to hit with the iPhone instead.

 

[Zillio]

Yes this was a major cock up iPad should of had the same RAM and gyroscope of the iPhone 4. Why has the physically larger product aimed at productivity got less RAM than the bloody phone??

 

[sakanagai]

Aside from apps that require any camera or the gyroscopic sensors, the iPad should be able to run apps designed for the iPhone 4. As you said, the native iPhone 4 resolution is the same as the iPad uses for 2x scaling of current iPhone apps. The keys are A) how the apps themselves are written, B)how the iPad's "emulation" recognizes these new apps (does it default to 3GS resolution or let the app choose), and C) whether these apps require iOS4 to run.

(Assuming, of course, that apps in question do not require camera/gyro)

A) We know that 3GS apps run on the iPad and these can be tweaked to make use of the iPhone 4 display. These will most certainly continue to run on older devices. Luckily, roughly half a year of iPad app development has gotten many developers to embrace Universal apps that can operate at both resolutions, so there is much hope.

B) The iPad can run iPhone apps at both 1x and 2x scales. Resolution should be no worry as 2x is the same resolution as the iPhone 4, however it will look blockier since the physical size of the pixels is greater. Either the iPad will detect the new resolution and run accordingly (best case) or detect an iPhone compatible app and run it at the standard 1x/2x scale. In the latter case, a software update would be all that is necessary to fix.

C) While the iPhone 4 ships with iOS4, the iPad won't get the official update until the fall. Any apps that require iOS4 to operate will not yet run on the iPad.

 

[ditzy]

I don't think that the RAM or the gyro will cause issues as IOS4 is designed to work on the 3GS too. But the software could cause some problems.

 

[dazcox5181]

I've thought of this too.

I'd guess that the iPad won't be running any updated iPhone apps for a while until iOS 4 for iPad is released.

Never know, might be a dev beta 1 for iPad out as well....

It does seem odd as iPhone compatibility was a major selling point in their marketing...

I can understand why there's the delay though - having forked the OS into 2 branches whose dev teams weren't allowed to talk would probably make merging them quite a task - the extras in 3.2 such as backgrounds were probably known about, or already finished at the time the code split - the extra bits such as UI are added on top.

Now I suppose the task is to agree on what is iPad specific and ensure it all switches off on the relevant devices etc.

I don't by any means think there are any top secret iPad features planned - those can wait for iPad 2...this is after all!

 

[nafai23]

Aside from apps that require any camera or the gyroscopic sensors, the iPad should be able to run apps designed for the iPhone 4. As you said, the native iPhone 4 resolution is the same as the iPad uses for 2x scaling of current iPhone apps. The keys are A) how the apps themselves are written, B)how the iPad's "emulation" recognizes these new apps (does it default to 3GS resolution or let the app choose), and C) whether these apps require iOS4 to run.

(Assuming, of course, that apps in question do not require camera/gyro)

A) We know that 3GS apps run on the iPad and these can be tweaked to make use of the iPhone 4 display. These will most certainly continue to run on older devices. Luckily, roughly half a year of iPad app development has gotten many developers to embrace Universal apps that can operate at both resolutions, so there is much hope.

B) The iPad can run iPhone apps at both 1x and 2x scales. Resolution should be no worry as 2x is the same resolution as the iPhone 4, however it will look blockier since the physical size of the pixels is greater. Either the iPad will detect the new resolution and run accordingly (best case) or detect an iPhone compatible app and run it at the standard 1x/2x scale. In the latter case, a software update would be all that is necessary to fix.

C) While the iPhone 4 ships with iOS4, the iPad won't get the official update until the fall. Any apps that require iOS4 to operate will not yet run on the iPad.

not the same....

 

[poloponies]

The iPad's resolution is close enough to the iPhone 4G's that pixel doubling will no longer be necessary for iPhone-only apps.

iPhone 4g: 960 x 640

iPad; 1024 x 768

 

[sakanagai]

not the same....

(NOTE: In reference to: "Resolution should be no worry as 2x is the same resolution as the iPhone 4")

Thank you for your in-depth clarification. The original iPhone ran at 320x480 pixels. The iPad does a 1:1 bordered display for iPhone apps. The iPad also includes an option for 2x scaling, meaning each pixel in the original app are replaced with a 2x2 pixel square with the same data (color), a process called "Pixel Doubling", maintaining consistency with the original, though we have seen that the result is rarely pretty. For a 320x480 app, the 2x resultant is 640x960. The resolution of the iPhone 4 is 640x960. From where I stand, those are the same.

 

[cmvsm]

Any iPhone 4 app that requires the three axis gyro won't function properly because the iPad doesn't have one. I don't think there will be many apps that require all of the 512 mb of ram the new iphone has -- but if there are some advanced games those won't run well on the iPad either.

I don't mind the iphone having better specs --but the timing of this sucks for first gen iPad users. Im concerned developers may now wait for the next iPad to release their apps since they pretty much know the next iPad will have at least 512mb of ram if not more.

+1

I was just talking about this the other day that apps for the iPad have been slow to get started. The Apple guy at the store said that's because it takes a little longer initially for a new device, and although I agree with that somewhat, it is all starting to make sense that the developers are anticipating a new model with 512MB down the road, so why waste time with the current crippled version. Again, the virtually non-existent timeline on this whole thing really sucks.

I was playing Rock Band the other night, and got a "low memory error, please restart" message from my iPad. First time I had seen this, and I had nothing else running at the time, and my iPad is not jailbroken. Restarted and it was fine, but this is just the beginning of the limitation in memory once new apps start coming out.

 

[Piggie]

I think we can summarise this, in three simple words.

I can actually see Steve Jobs in an interview in a couple of years time saying these three words also:

"Apple cocked up"

I don't think any of us here (no matter how much we love Apple) would have "planned" this exact series of events, and I can't believe this is the path Apple would have ideally chosen to take.

So unless there is some grand master plan behind all this, I'm rather confused.

 

[sakanagai]

The iPad's resolution is close enough to the iPhone 4G's that pixel doubling will no longer be necessary for iPhone-only apps.

iPhone 4g: 960 x 640

iPad; 1024 x 768

That depends on how fast developers are to update apps for the higher resolution; hopefully they don't take the easy way out and do a lazy pixel doubling as their fix. Sadly, the aspect ratios still do not match so that border is there to stay.

 

[Piggie]

Just to add, I don't think any of this would of mattered if Apple had made the iPhone and iPad totally different products with totally different O/S's

Then no-one would see them as related and probably we've not be comparing them to each other so much.

the fact they are 90% the same is I feel part of this issue, and means the products will be stacked up against each other.

Personally I don't want to run any iPhone apps on my iPad, so I'd of been happy for it to be totally incompatible and have it's own brand new O/S created for the device.

Stupid things like you go to a web site and the web site thinks you are on a tiny mobile screen despite the fact you have a 1024x768 display.

I suppose part of me has a feeling that this was all thrown together in a hurry with the iPhone O/S just being tweaked to run on it as they didn't have anything else to use.

This concept I could understand from someone else (small company,) rushing to get something out the door quickly to compete, but Apple have been working on this for years and years. I guess I'm surprised about this has unfolded.

Perhaps in time we will see a totally new rewrite, a "PRO" version if you will. Perhaps the real O/S was not going to be ready in time and this was indeed done quickly.

It all seems strange from a "grand master plan" type of path you would wish to follow for the next "X" number of years ahead. Without causing problems/issues as things get changed.

 

[nafai23]

Right if you mean there will be a small black border around the screen on the ipad.
Running in the "zoom" mode there will be pixel sharing and the image will be blurry just like running non native rez on a monitor.

I think apple with update ipad os soon and the 1x/2x button will just be a zoom icon or button and iphone 4 apps with have a small black border or zoomed in full screen and old apps will look like they do now with large borders or zoomed.

That's just a guess.

That depends on how fast developers are to update apps for the higher resolution; hopefully they don't take the easy way out and do a lazy pixel doubling as their fix. Sadly, the aspect ratios still do not match so that border is there to stay.

 

[freep]

So does this mean that a developer would have to create three versions of the app to cover all devices:

iPhone/3G/3GS
iPhone 4
iPad??

 

[Piggie]

So does this mean that a developer would have to create three versions of the app to cover all devices:

iPhone/3G/3GS
iPhone 4
iPad??

4 Versions.

iPhone/3G/3GS
iPhone 4
iPad
iPad2

 

[dagomike]

Well, Apple makes a huge stink about only supported APIs, so major OS upgrades should be completely smooth. I'd expect anything that's not iOS 4/iPhone 4 specific to run just fine on the iPad.

 

[NorfolkMustard]

be careful which apps you update from today (iOS4)

A word of warning for those with iPads as well as iPhones. be careful which apps you choose to update to their latest versions as they may require iOS4, meaning they will not work on iPad yet.

If you already have a compatible version of an app on your iPad then it will not get updated or removed but if you have it in iTunes but don't already have it on your iPad and you upgrade the app, you won't then be able to put it onto your iPad until iOS4 is also on the iPad.

NB. If you're quick, you'll find the previous version of an app in your Trash until you empty it.

RadioBox is an example which has just released an updated app which requires iOS4 (rather than just being compatible with it).