Wise to buy a new Mac Pro late 2013?

[Xde]

Hello all,
we all know, the Mac Pro hardware is outdated.
And we know, the price for this outdated computer is much to high.
We know, Thunderbolt 2 is death.
As today, many Mac sites and blogs recommendation is "not buy".

Nevertheless, for my personal needs the power accepable.
I like different port options to plug in different devices.
I want to stay with 10.9. No dependencies to newest software.
I like the form factor of the 2013 MacPro.
iMac for me is absolutely a nogo, aside I already have a nice Apple display.

But what I need is a stable computer and my doubts are the known GPU problems.
Apple has a (not official) repair program for machines build around April 2015.
But many user report problems before and after this time frame.
Nobody is sure, what the problem really is.
Software related, hardware related, design concept failure?

Apple changes GPUs, sometimes twice, but often without success.
How often do they have success?
A internet petition is made to Apple, to ask to clear up the problems.
Around 400 users have signed this petition.
Maybe, some other users still dont know that they also have problems, or are
ignoring them.

A actual Consumer Reports test criticized the new MacBook Pro late 2016.
Apple will now work together with CR to investigate the problems.
But Apple dont want to investigate the Mac Pro problems!
Maybe CR should test the Mac Pro, to get Apple to move? Phil?

As far as I see, Apple does not much to investigate problems for Apples
most expensive 3000+ dollar “Pro”-computer selling to his customers.
Additionally with this doubts, one needs an Apple care protection plan for 250 dollars, too.

What we all dont know, is this problem related to few cases, say
500 cases of 50000 computers sold?
We dont know, how many Mac Pros Apple has sold. 10000, 50000?
Or if this problem is really fixed?

Intesting, what do you think, in relation to the known technical problems only,
is it still recommendable and wise to buy an actual Mac Pro late 2013?

Or better not, to avoid surprises, traveling between home and Apple Service,
and angry hours?

 

[Macist]

Given that a Hackintosh with an overclocked i7 Skylake and some cheap ass 280x graphics cards that you could build for £900 or less is a little, or a lot, faster than the MacPro (depending on task) you'd have to be a complete div to buy a MacPro.

My Hackintosh is as stable as any Mac I've used and hackintoshes have never been easier to set up, especially when you choose 'just works' parts. In fact, I'm not sure it's ever had a proper crash.

 

[H2SO4]

Hello all,
we all know, the Mac Pro hardware is outdated.
And we know, the price for this outdated computer is much to high.
We know, Thunderbolt 2 is death.
As today, many Mac sites and blogs recommendation is "not buy".

Nevertheless, for my personal needs the power accepable.
I like different port options to plug in different devices.
I want to stay with 10.9. No dependencies to newest software.
I like the form factor of the 2013 MacPro.
iMac for me is absolutely a nogo, aside I already have a nice Apple display.

But what I need is a stable computer and my doubts are the known GPU problems.
Apple has a (not official) repair program for machines build around April 2015.
But many user report problems before and after this time frame.
Nobody is sure, what the problem really is.
Software related, hardware related, design concept failure?

Apple changes GPUs, sometimes twice, but often without success.
How often do they have success?
A internet petition is made to Apple, to ask to clear up the problems.
Around 400 users have signed this petition.
Maybe, some other users still dont know that they also have problems, or are
ignoring them.

A actual Consumer Reports test criticized the new MacBook Pro late 2016.
Apple will now work together with CR to investigate the problems.
But Apple dont want to investigate the Mac Pro problems!
Maybe CR should test the Mac Pro, to get Apple to move? Phil?

As far as I see, Apple does not much to investigate problems for Apples
most expensive 3000+ dollar “Pro”-computer selling to his customers.
Additionally with this doubts, one needs an Apple care protection plan for 250 dollars, too.

What we all dont know, is this problem related to few cases, say
500 cases of 50000 computers sold?
We dont know, how many Mac Pros Apple has sold. 10000, 50000?
Or if this problem is really fixed?

Intesting, what do you think, in relation to the known technical problems only,
is it still recommendable and wise to buy an actual Mac Pro late 2013?

Or better not, to avoid surprises, traveling between home and Apple Service,
and angry hours?

I'm going to say a, "Don't buy". Curious though, what makes TB2 dead?

 

[Xde]

Curious though, what makes TB2 dead?

I don't want to go far off topic with Hackintosh or Thunderbolt. Only to reply:
You're right. We can still go on using TB2. But developments I think will be stopped for TB2.
One can find merely a few accessories supporting TB2, and I don't think, the market will see new ones.
The TB3 future just started has a new plug. Adaptor costs again additional 50 dollars.
I think in choice of TB2 or 3, TB2 is "out" related to a new computer. We won't see them anymore.

 

[crsh1976]

If Apple is adamantly killing all ports to go with USB-C, forcing us to use dongles until USB-C is on all mainstream devices, then I think it's safe to say the mini-DP connector for TB2 devices is effectively dead.

To answer the original question tho, I think the current Mac Pro is a terrible purchase right now - the hardware is capable, but the price is whacked for something this "old" that won't see a solid upgrade path. Wait for the next revision or build yourself a hackintosh.

 

[antonis]

TBH, though, TB2 never really took off since PC market never adopted it at a high ratio. Nobody can ensure that TB3 will have a better luck.

Regardless, even if 2013 MP performance is enough for your needs, still its unrealistic price makes the purchase very hard to justify.

 

[BenTrovato]

There's no need to debate the specs/power of the Mac Pro as in 2017 it's severely over priced.

I'd sell your Apple display and buy a 5k iMac. It's a "better" buy in my opinion but I would still wait until the new models are announced.

 

[pat500000]

I don't want to go far off topic with Hackintosh or Thunderbolt. Only to reply:
You're right. We can still go on using TB2. But developments I think will be stopped for TB2.
One can find merely a few accessories supporting TB2, and I don't think, the market will see new ones.
The TB3 future just started has a new plug. Adaptor costs again additional 50 dollars.
I think in choice of TB2 or 3, TB2 is "out" related to a new computer. We won't see them anymore.

There is tb2 to tb3 connector.

 

[0488568]

Given that a Hackintosh with an overclocked i7 Skylake and some cheap ass 280x graphics cards that you could build for £900 or less is a little, or a lot, faster than the MacPro (depending on task) you'd have to be a complete div to buy a MacPro.

My Hackintosh is as stable as any Mac I've used and hackintoshes have never been easier to set up, especially when you choose 'just works' parts. In fact, I'm not sure it's ever had a proper crash.

Your hack is as stable as a any Mac?

Does the possibility of trashing your system every time there is a new update include "stable as any Mac"?

 

[Ph.D.]

This is one of those "if you have to ask, the answer is no" questions. The current Pro is pretty much obsolete, at least given the price (though it will still do its job well). Yet you sound like you think this is the right computer for you. You like the form-factor, don't want an iMac, etc. So, if you want one and understand the cost/performance issue, etc., go ahead.

I wouldn't worry about reliability much. These are pretty solid machines. But do get Applecare and then relax. Just consider it a normal part of the price of any machine at this level.

My advice, also, would be to avoid the hackintosh route. It's fraught with problems and is an especially-bad choice for someone like yourself who is concerned about reliability and support.

 

[Macist]

Your hack is as stable as a any Mac?

Does the possibility of trashing your system every time there is a new update include "stable as any Mac"?

I'd far sooner buy a real Mac. There's something 'icky' about earning a living with the aid of a hackintosh where I'm 'on my own'.

But I'm not an idiot. Apple's current Mac lineup is a world of silly, slim-for-no-reason, over-priced, outdated, under-featured nonsense.

If Apple hadn't made a grossly overpriced trash can and continued with the tower format that's what I'd use now. An overclocked Skylake hackintosh is way cheaper and way more powerful than maxing out some cMP in almost all scenarios.

 

[Xde]

Thanks to all answers til now.
But my primary question was,
"Is it wise to buy, when there are concerns about GPU problems, when it seems,
that Apple is not willing to investigate in that problems".

Noone likes to buy a system that maybe has design failures or not fixed production failures.
If the poll is used to say that the Mac Pro is overpriced and outdated,
then the poll makes no sense. Everyone knows that already.

If the poll is used with the primary question in mind,
it could be a statictic or feedback of the amount of problems out there,
and if these concerns are really appropriate.

Maybe I should have opened that poll like "are you satisfied with your Mac Pro"

 

[Hrududu]

At this point, I would be more inclined to recommend a used 5,1 Mac Pro to most anybody. If you must buy new, then get Apple Care.

 

[Lightsaber]

In regard to the "Are you satisfied with your new mac pro" question. I have one that I have used daily for the past two years as a daily driver work machine and have zero complaints. This is a machine that stays turned on without sleeping for weeks at a time. It is the four core base model upgraded to 64gb memory. It is currently running Sierra and has three monitors attached. All around nice machine.

 

[ActionableMango]

There are no good answers here.

The cMP is ancient. The nMP is old, overpriced, and has problems. Hackintoshes work great until they don't. Windows is not OS X.

 

[Flint Ironstag]

Do I need it?
Can I easily afford it?
How soon will it pay for itself?

 

[Ph.D.]

Thanks to all answers til now.
But my primary question was,
"Is it wise to buy, when there are concerns about GPU problems, when it seems,
that Apple is not willing to investigate in that problems".

There are no wide-spread concerns about video cards. And even if you do have a problem, Apple will take care of you.

 

[slughead]

Given that a Hackintosh with an overclocked i7 Skylake and some cheap ass 280x graphics cards that you could build for £900 or less is a little, or a lot, faster than the MacPro (depending on task) you'd have to be a complete div to buy a MacPro.

My Hackintosh is as stable as any Mac I've used and hackintoshes have never been easier to set up, especially when you choose 'just works' parts. In fact, I'm not sure it's ever had a proper crash.

This and totally this. If you're intimidated, just do this:

1. Get a jar
2. Buy the components for your hackintosh build
3. Start assembling the build and getting the software to work
4. Every hour, place a $100 bill into the jar
5. when finished, set all that money on fire

You will STILL save money, even if you run into a bunch of problems and it takes twice as long as it should. Make sure to get two 280x cards if you're going to go that route.

 

[jeff7117]

Sell the Apple display and get an iMac. The retina display in the iMac is arguably better in just about every spec than the apple display. Plus, the hardware in the iMac is slightly newer than the nMP. Unless you need the xeon and dual GPU, it would be cheaper in the long run to go with the iMac.

A Hackintosh is another good alternative, although most "golden" builds are running components other than X99 chips, so you might not have the CPU horsepower / core count that you would find in the nMP.

 

[pat500000]

I don't think hackintosh is appropriate for those who aren't technical with it. If something goes down, you won't get technical support...unless you get advice from mr members.

 

[NY Guitarist]

There are no good answers here.

The cMP is ancient. The nMP is old, overpriced, and has problems. Hackintoshes work great until they don't. Windows is not OS X.

I had to say almost these exact words in a meeting about equipment purchases planned for 2017. We're testing the move to windows and if it goes well moving about 80% away from Apple by the end of 2017 and completing the transition in spring of 2018.

It's sucks because everyone here wants to be using MacOS.

 

[JamesPDX]

Yeah. It's actually sad. I've been pricing RADAR systems. I found a thread by a guy who's gone/going through what's going on here, but on a larger scale:
http://tapeop.com/columns/end-rant/115/
[doublepost=1483136524][/doublepost]

Hello all,
we all know, the Mac Pro hardware is outdated.
And we know, the price for this outdated computer is much to high.
We know, Thunderbolt 2 is death.
As today, many Mac sites and blogs recommendation is "not buy".

Nevertheless, for my personal needs the power accepable.
I like different port options to plug in different devices.
I want to stay with 10.9. No dependencies to newest software.
I like the form factor of the 2013 MacPro.
iMac for me is absolutely a nogo, aside I already have a nice Apple display.

But what I need is a stable computer and my doubts are the known GPU problems.
Apple has a (not official) repair program for machines build around April 2015.
But many user report problems before and after this time frame.
Nobody is sure, what the problem really is.
Software related, hardware related, design concept failure?

Apple changes GPUs, sometimes twice, but often without success.
How often do they have success?
A internet petition is made to Apple, to ask to clear up the problems.
Around 400 users have signed this petition.
Maybe, some other users still dont know that they also have problems, or are
ignoring them.

A actual Consumer Reports test criticized the new MacBook Pro late 2016.
Apple will now work together with CR to investigate the problems.
But Apple dont want to investigate the Mac Pro problems!
Maybe CR should test the Mac Pro, to get Apple to move? Phil?

As far as I see, Apple does not much to investigate problems for Apples
most expensive 3000+ dollar “Pro”-computer selling to his customers.
Additionally with this doubts, one needs an Apple care protection plan for 250 dollars, too.

What we all dont know, is this problem related to few cases, say
500 cases of 50000 computers sold?
We dont know, how many Mac Pros Apple has sold. 10000, 50000?
Or if this problem is really fixed?

Intesting, what do you think, in relation to the known technical problems only,
is it still recommendable and wise to buy an actual Mac Pro late 2013?

Or better not, to avoid surprises, traveling between home and Apple Service,
and angry hours?

If you need a GPU/VFX-heavy machine NOW, then go here: http://www.boxx.com/

If you need a custom Pro Tools workhorse, go here: http://www.izcorp.com/dealers/build-a-radar/

If you can get by w/o Thunderbolt 2, check out the BTO 2010/2012 units. You can even get custom GPUs, PCIe SSD, and USB-C. https://ibuildmacs.com/


[doublepost=1483137064][/doublepost]

This and totally this. If you're intimidated, just do this:

1. Get a jar
2. Buy the components for your hackintosh build
3. Start assembling the build and getting the software to work
4. Every hour, place a $100 bill into the jar
5. when finished, set all that money on fire

You will STILL save money, even if you run into a bunch of problems and it takes twice as long as it should. Make sure to get two 280x cards if you're going to go that route.

I'd love to do this, but stick it into a G5 case. I've never built a computer before. I'm good with SSD and RAM mods. Definitely enthusiastic, but I'm extremely cautious regarding PC build timidity factors and my PC build gifts. If I'm good with Legos and 2 SSD's into a Mini (instructions by memory) upgrades, would you say I'm ready? Thermal paste concerns me...

 

[linuxcooldude]

Thanks to all answers til now.
But my primary question was,
"Is it wise to buy, when there are concerns about GPU problems, when it seems,
that Apple is not willing to investigate in that problems".

Noone likes to buy a system that maybe has design failures or not fixed production failures.
If the poll is used to say that the Mac Pro is overpriced and outdated,
then the poll makes no sense. Everyone knows that already.

If the poll is used with the primary question in mind,
it could be a statictic or feedback of the amount of problems out there,
and if these concerns are really appropriate.

Maybe I should have opened that poll like "are you satisfied with your Mac Pro"

Yeah, that question just flew above everyones head...lol. Had my Mac Pro 6,1 Hexcore D700 almost a year with no problems. Phenomenal machine. Reports are that the ones that had graphics problems were being fixed, even out of warrantee. Not sure if verified.

 

[JronMasteR]

I would definitely not buy this thing. It is totally outdated and massively overpriced.
The old Thunderbolt 2 is just one thing, but the GPU's are ancient. Your basically paying a huge sum of money for GPU's that were introduced back in 2012. The CPU's are still decent, there has not been that much of an improvement so far.
If you could get a decently priced used one, maybe yes. But for retail price, no way.
And the other thing, you cannot really upgrade this thing. RAM upgrades are easy, GPU's is a no, CPU's yes if your are comfortable taking to whole thing apart.

 

[rawweb]

Runn

Thanks to all answers til now.
But my primary question was,
"Is it wise to buy, when there are concerns about GPU problems, when it seems,
that Apple is not willing to investigate in that problems".

Noone likes to buy a system that maybe has design failures or not fixed production failures.
If the poll is used to say that the Mac Pro is overpriced and outdated,
then the poll makes no sense. Everyone knows that already.

If the poll is used with the primary question in mind,
it could be a statictic or feedback of the amount of problems out there,
and if these concerns are really appropriate.

Maybe I should have opened that poll like "are you satisfied with your Mac Pro"

I've been running a maxed 8 core as my daily driver at work since 2014, zero problems. Not one. It's been solid.

I wouldn't be buying a new one in 2017 though...

Come to think of it, mine will be out of warranty soon, hard to believe nothing new has come out we can replace it with...