MP 1,1-5,1 2010 Mac Pro—what am I getting into?

[eicca]

I could get a brand new iMac for $1200, or I could get this:

12 Core Mac Pro 2010 2x 3.46ghz 64gb RAM 1Tb SSD

$1,200.00 12 Core Mac Pro 2010 2x 3.46ghz 64gb RAM 1Tb SSD for sale in Bountiful, UT on KSL Classifieds. View a wide selection of Apple Laptops/Desktops and other great items on KSL Classifieds.

classifieds.ksl.com

Obviously the specs on the used cMP are light years ahead of any new iMac. HOWEVER:

It’s running Catalina. I know Catalina isn’t officially supported on the 2010. The first thing I’d do to the cMP is wipe it and start fresh, but I suspect there’s some background hackery going on to make Catalina run on it.

It obviously doesn’t come with a warranty. Even though the rest of the computer is upgraded and fresh, the main board is ten years old. If that craps, how far up the creek am I? Easily fixed like tower PCs of yore or a nightmare?

I want power, but I need reliability more. Should I pass on this?

 

[tsialex]

I could get a brand new iMac for $1200, or I could get this:

12 Core Mac Pro 2010 2x 3.46ghz 64gb RAM 1Tb SSD

$1,200.00 12 Core Mac Pro 2010 2x 3.46ghz 64gb RAM 1Tb SSD for sale in Bountiful, UT on KSL Classifieds. View a wide selection of Apple Laptops/Desktops and other great items on KSL Classifieds.

classifieds.ksl.com

Obviously the specs on the used cMP are light years ahead of any new iMac. HOWEVER:

It’s running Catalina. I know Catalina isn’t officially supported on the 2010. The first thing I’d do to the cMP is wipe it and start fresh, but I suspect there’s some background hackery going on to make Catalina run on it.

It obviously doesn’t come with a warranty. Even though the rest of the computer is upgraded and fresh, the main board is ten years old. If that craps, how far up the creek am I? Easily fixed like tower PCs of yore or a nightmare?

I want power, but I need reliability more. Should I pass on this?

The problem with early2009 to mid-2012 (they are the same platform) Mac Pros is the very low single core performance, any new Mac today have more than double of the single core of a fully upgraded Mac Pro of this era. While multicore performance is still solid, if you don't edit video or compile programs all day, you won't see the multicore performance.

Mac Pros are very easy and affordable to repair if you have the skills, there are lots of parts on the used market, but it's insane to pay this asking price. It's worth, being very generous, maybe 2/3 of that.

If you really need a Mac Pro look at someone selling a dual 2010 Mac Pro and do yourself the upgrades. With some searching you will find a dual 2010 Mac Pro for around $500~600, maybe even less. A RX 580 is less than $200 new (~$130 used), a very good NVMe SSD can be bought for less than $100 brand new. RAM you can buy from China for around $80. A pair of X5680 can be bought for $80-$90.

 

[AndreeOnline]

I've said it before: the 4.1/5.1 Mac Pro is the best computer—and computer experience—I've owned/had.

But I've had mine for a few years and I feel I came late to the game.

Think carefully about investing into this platform in 2020. There ARE options and ways to configure the Cheesegrater so that its price/performance spikes in ridiculous ways—for certain isolated tasks. Is that what you have in mind, or are you looking for a general computer and/or a project to dive into?

tsialex gives sage advice above. For a general purpose computer the single thread performance of the 5.1 is a non-negotiable roadblock going forward. But you can still upgrade it to current day graphics with even dual Radeon VIIs or super fast storage with RAIDed SSDs over PCIe.

In my mind the $1200 asking price is "OK", i.e. not a scam, considering it's "fully" upgraded. If we add up tsialex's DIY prices they still add up: 500+130+100+80+80 = $890. And I don't see the WiFi in there. Add labor and some risk... and I don't think the price is insane.

The problem with starting at $1200 is that if that is just a jumping off point and you pour additional money into it, then it gets ugly fast. Some guys picked up dual CPU Mac Pros two years ago for $150 (rare and lucky). That's another scenario.

And if you buy this Mac Pro to keep as is, with a single 1TB SSD and the rest HDD, slightly misconfigured RAM (4 sticks instead of 3) and a 590X... well, it's not a beast in today's world.

I don't know what the used market looks like for something like "last year's" 27" iMac. But I bought a cheap late 2015 5K iMac with i7 and 1TB SSD a while back and it's actually a pleasure to use for general computing.

What do you need your "power" for?

 

[minifridge1138]

That's a lot to pay for that machine. I've had a cMP since 2009 when I bought mine new. It's one of the best things I've ever bought. But would I pay $1,200 for a used one today? Not unless I had a very specific task that needed (1) multiple cores (2) could run on Mojave forever.

 

[eicca]

Honestly my 2011 MBP 13 is still running flawlessly for my day-to-day needs, but when the time comes to do some (relatively simple) projects in Logic or Final Cut or Photoshop it gets unbearably slow and sometimes almost unusable.

It would be nice to run the Master Chief Collection via Bootcamp when that gets released, but this isn’t essential.

If I were to buy something immediately I’d have a budget of ~$1200. Maybe it’d be best to save a little more and grab a refurb iMac 27 from Apple in the $1600-1800 range

 

[AndreeOnline]

The thing is: the 5K iMac I picked up late last summer (2015 i7) has a Geekbench 5 single core score of 1118. If you count the scores within just a few points as 'more-or-less-the-same', it's basically right at the top.

Paired with a 1TB SSD and 32GB RAM, plus the 5K screen of course!, it's still a really nice general computing machine. Software like Photoshop, Lightroom or Affinity's Photo/Designer, Pixelmator Pro or Xcode all run and look great on this iMac. I have lots of fun in Blender as well and smaller projects with Eevee is fine—especially for learning (transitioning from Cinema 4D).

The weak spot is probably the GFX. Only 2GB ram. I have to limit timeline resolution in DaVinci to HD, but it's not a problem to cut a sequence with P6K footage otherwise.

I paid $1200 for this machine late last summer and that was a good price in my market. Maybe you can find a generation newer now (2017) for that price?

 

[eicca]

I just found a guy selling a 2015 27” for $550 with a small chip in the edge from his 1TB SSD upgrade. Says it’s otherwise perfect. That might be something I’m willing to take a chance on.

 

[AndreeOnline]

Note that my recommendation is only for the i7 CPU. These are old computers, so it's always a question of cherry picking (since you don't mention any other specs). Also, a failed user upgrade is always a flag. But that's up to you.

 

[eicca]

There’s a 2010 cMP with some upgrades for $500, maybe that’s a better option?


2010 Mac Pro 8 Core 2.4Ghz / 12Gb RAM /NEW Graphic
https://classifieds.ksl.com/listing/59489306

 

[bsbeamer]

CPUs in all 2009, 2010 and 2012 Mac Pro's (even the non-OEM upgrade CPUs) are EOL'd by Intel. All will be vulnerable to current and future security holes and will be unpatched by Intel. Yes, you can upgrade to Mojave with standard methods (with a METAL GPU) but anything beyond that is not officially supported.

When spending around $1K+, most people would be better off with a modern iMac or MacMini at similar price points for most desktop configurations.

 

[eicca]

That $500 one may yet get more consideration, because I use the optical drive quite frequently.

 

[bsbeamer]

You can get a brand new DVD +/- RW USB optical drive for under $20-25 with shipping or a brand new full size 5.25" SATA enclosure for well under $50. Do not base any desktop machine purchase on the presence of an optical drive in 2020.

 

[eicca]

I'm so out of practice on all this computer-buying stuff...

 

[blindpcguy]

honastly id buy a 2018 mini core i5 gives ya 6 cores to play with and later on a egpu enclosure like the razer core x and a graphics card that way you get a modern officially supported mac with later on good gpu power plus you can upgrade the ram yourself and expand the storage with fast tb3 drives

 

[tsialex]

There’s a 2010 cMP with some upgrades for $500, maybe that’s a better option?


2010 Mac Pro 8 Core 2.4Ghz / 12Gb RAM /NEW Graphic
https://classifieds.ksl.com/listing/59489306

This one is very affordable, good price for the configuration. For what seems a very good cosmetic wise dual 2010 Mac Pro with a RX 580, you probably won't find much better.

The problem here is if this is the best Mac that you can buy for your workflow. Single core performance will be similar of your 2011 13" MBP, but multithreaded apps will be absurdly better. If you don't expect more than that, go for it. With more RAM and a fast SSD you will be very pleased with FCPx and Logic. Photoshop will use every RAM that you will install, but it's practically a single core app and won't fully use all cores available except some rare situations.

 

[eicca]

This one is very affordable, good price for the configuration. For what seems a very good cosmetic wise dual 2010 Mac Pro with a RX 580, you probably won't find much better.

The problem here is if this is the best Mac that you can buy for your workflow. Single core performance will be similar of your 2011 13" MBP, but multithreaded apps will be absurdly better. If you don't expect more than that, go for it. With more RAM and a fast SSD you will be very pleased with FCPx and Logic. Photoshop will use every RAM that you will install, but it's practically a single core app and won't fully use all cores available except some rare situations.

Can the processors/mainboard be upgraded? Modularity really appeals to me.

 

[tsialex]

Can the processors/mainboard be upgraded? Modularity really appeals to me.

Yes, the CPU tray accepts up to 12-core (2x Westmere X5680 or X5690).

 

[eicca]

Yes, the CPU tray accepts up to 12-core (2x Westmere X5680 or X5690).

I assume that I'm limited to a certain age range of processors.

 

[tsialex]

I assume that I'm limited to a certain age range of processors.

I just told you:

2 hexacore X5680 or X5690.

X5680:

Intel® Xeon® Processor X5680 (12M Cache, 3.33 GHz, 6.40 GT/s Intel® QPI) Product Specifications

Intel® Xeon® Processor X5680 (12M Cache, 3.33 GHz, 6.40 GT/s Intel® QPI) quick reference guide including specifications, features, pricing, compatibility, design documentation, ordering codes, spec codes and more.

ark.intel.com

X5690

Intel® Xeon® Processor X5690 (12M Cache, 3.46 GHz, 6.40 GT/s Intel® QPI) Product Specifications

Intel® Xeon® Processor X5690 (12M Cache, 3.46 GHz, 6.40 GT/s Intel® QPI) quick reference guide including specifications, features, pricing, compatibility, design documentation, ordering codes, spec codes and more.

ark.intel.com

 

[eicca]

I just told you:

2 hexacore X5680 or X5690.

X5680:

Intel® Xeon® Processor X5680 (12M Cache, 3.33 GHz, 6.40 GT/s Intel® QPI) Product Specifications

Intel® Xeon® Processor X5680 (12M Cache, 3.33 GHz, 6.40 GT/s Intel® QPI) quick reference guide including specifications, features, pricing, compatibility, design documentation, ordering codes, spec codes and more.

ark.intel.com

X5690

Intel® Xeon® Processor X5690 (12M Cache, 3.46 GHz, 6.40 GT/s Intel® QPI) Product Specifications

Intel® Xeon® Processor X5690 (12M Cache, 3.46 GHz, 6.40 GT/s Intel® QPI) quick reference guide including specifications, features, pricing, compatibility, design documentation, ordering codes, spec codes and more.

ark.intel.com

So that's a yes, meaning I can't take a modern-day processor and slap it on in there.

 

[tsialex]

So that's a yes, meaning I can't take a modern-day processor and slap it on in there.

No. Most recent processor supported by a Mac Pro 5,1 is X5690.

 

[eicca]

No. Most recent processor supported by a Mac Pro 5,1 is X5690.

Understood. Those aren't exactly slow though, and seem to be quite affordable.

 

[bsbeamer]

I had/have been running an MP5,1 with dual X5690's. It's a great machine within the limitations for certain tasks. The biggest concern from specific clients is/was continuing to use the machine with unpatched security vulnerabilities.

Was also in a situation where Catalina was required by April 2020, but using the workaround methods for MP5,1 to install technically was against the client agreements and not worth the risks. In an isolated setting with proper firewalls, this might not be a concern for some. Many here would still argue it's not a concern regardless, but if the client says "NOT ON MY PROJECTS" that really sets the tone quickly.

I also had a late 2013 MBP 15" Retina machine that the MP5,1 could almost do circles around, especially with Adobe software. The only advantage the MBP had was the built-in NVIDIA GPU, but that benefit really disappears with macOS Mojave and higher. At least that machine can "properly" run Catalina and be put to use in limited capacity as a spare if/when needed.

The late 2019 16" MBP is an overall 25-30% faster machine than the max'd MP5,1 for most tasks. Some isolated and properly multithreaded apps were still better on MP5,1 but that was only when it came to actual processing/rendering. Actual working was almost always in favor of the 16" MBP.

Same is true with most modern 27" iMacs (non standard models). Even the MacMini can outperform in several common tasks. eGPU and TB3 expansion go a long way to making both of these viable options. Many client offices went that route when waiting for MP7,1 late last year and that use has expanded these past few weeks with so many working from home for the indefinite future.

 

[eicca]

Power for money wise, I think the $500 cMP is gonna be my best bet. If it craps out, I haven't broken my bank, and it's worlds beyond my current laptop GeekBench scores of 490 single and 1069 multi. A relatively-cheap 5690 upgrade would put it at over 2k single and 22k multi, never mind the Sapphire Radeon 580 it's got. The thing's a beast.

 

[eicca]

Will any old x5675 from eBay be compatible? This price seems like the best bang for buck as far as upgrades go. Benchmarks don't put the 5675 far below the 5690.

Intel Xeon X5675 - 3.06GHz Hexa-Core (AT80614006696AA) Processor for sale online | eBay

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