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richinaus

macrumors 68020
Oct 26, 2014
2,432
2,187
I never had this issue even b4 I purchased the eGPU. No fans unless I was playing a game or doing something taxing in Windows under Parallels. It was always connected to an external Dell Monitor via USB C. 5500m and worked without issue. I know people are having this issue, however, I personally did not experience it.



I considered that one but it cost about as much without the 2 Thunderbolt 3 channels, SSD bay and all the USB A and SD slots.
I have the Razer core and used a W5700 and a EVGA 2080 Super. The latter spanked the former when used in bootcamp.

But as someone else said, from my personal experience, the competition is even worse.

Lucky we have Apple Silicon. Very interested to see how the pro machines perform, but as I have also said the current 5600m MBP is excellent if you need windows [and native mac apps].
 

panzer06

macrumors 68040
Sep 23, 2006
3,286
230
Kilrath
I never bothered doing that too much and just tended to disconnect the gpu only. It did cause issues though, so i guess your process is more thorough, but I am just lazy.

An egpu is also rock solid in bootcamp [with an RTX card].
I contemplated using Nvidia but all the pundits said it would cause an issue on the Mac side while working great in windows.

How was native Mac OS with the nice Nvidia??
 

Grohowiak

macrumors 6502a
Nov 14, 2012
768
793
I have Catalina. I dislike the UI in the new OS.

There are specific steps I have to take when powering off the eGPU enclosure while the MBP 16 is still on. I must close all apps running on the eGPU, which is most everything started after the system booted. Almost everything defaults to open on the external display (which is marked as my primary). One I close the apps I then unmount the volumes associated with the SSD mounted inside the eGPU enclosure. Finally I click on the small eGPU icon on the top of the screen and disconnect Radeon RX 5600 XT. Once all of that is done I can power down the eGPU. If I don't follow those steps and leave apps open that have accessed the eGPU it will most likely crash.

In catalina it worked great.
Only crashed once for several months of use.
Big sur crashes every single time I press the disconnect button.
I'm happy I didn't pay too much for it.
Going on ebay this weekend. Tired of the ********.
 
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IceStormNG

macrumors 6502a
Sep 23, 2020
517
676
I contemplated using Nvidia but all the pundits said it would cause an issue on the Mac side while working great in windows.

How was native Mac OS with the nice Nvidia??
There are NO Nvidia drivers for macOS. It's not entirely clear whether Nvidia has no interest or whether Apple doesn't want to sign Nvidia drivers. Both say it's the other's fault (typical for companies. It's never their own fault).

And with AMD, you're limited to the AMD cards that are supported by the macOS included drivers. There are no AMD drivers you can install yourself. For example this means: No Big Navi cards. And as long as Apple won't release a Mac with Big Navi, they have no reason to include the driver.
eGPU will be dying faster than it rose.
 

panzer06

macrumors 68040
Sep 23, 2006
3,286
230
Kilrath
There are NO Nvidia drivers for macOS. It's not entirely clear whether Nvidia has no interest or whether Apple doesn't want to sign Nvidia drivers. Both say it's the other's fault (typical for companies. It's never their own fault).

And with AMD, you're limited to the AMD cards that are supported by the macOS included drivers. There are no AMD drivers you can install yourself. For example this means: No Big Navi cards. And as long as Apple won't release a Mac with Big Navi, they have no reason to include the driver.
eGPU will be dying faster than it rose.
Hopefully, the AMD support will last on the MBP 16 until I decide to get rid of it in 5 years or so. I still haven't sold my 2011 MBP 15with a 512GB SSD. It still handles Office 365 and Parallels for MS Project etc.

The eGPU works on my Alienware so hopefully it will be of use in the Windows world even if it fades on the Mac.
 
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venom600

macrumors 65816
Mar 23, 2003
1,312
1,169
Los Angeles, CA
I largely agree with this, except that I don't think Apple deliberately chose to disregard this issue. Rather, they probably took off most of their personnel working on Intel MBP thermal design, GPUs, etc and put them on Apple Silicon projects about 1-2 years ago, and they never looked back.
So two things. First, if that were the case, the 5600M would have similar issues. It doesn't. Second, Apple is the richest company in the world. Resources are not an issue for them. If they cared to fix the problem, they would. You know how I know? If a lawsuit forced them to you can be sure they'd jump on it and get it taken care of.
 

dukee101

macrumors 6502
Jan 17, 2009
294
147
So two things. First, if that were the case, the 5600M would have similar issues. It doesn't. Second, Apple is the richest company in the world. Resources are not an issue for them. If they cared to fix the problem, they would. You know how I know? If a lawsuit forced them to you can be sure they'd jump on it and get it taken care of.
I hear you on this, and it's also boggled my mind how all kinds of bugs get past Apple's product development teams. The reason, I think, is largely that Apple notoriously understaffs teams and keeps things 'lean', despite having tons of cash on hand. It's part of their "organizational secret sauce", they'd like to think. Something about not having too many cooks in the kitchen, as it were. And who knows, maybe that works for them, if you measure success by "customer sat", stock price, cash pile, etc. But it does result in these ridiculous bugs and other issues that seemingly never get fixed, even though they're the world's biggest company, by many measures.

The 5600M doesn't have these issues because they sought to fix them -- it's because it's architected differently, the byproduct of which is less heat and noise. Having to spend more $$$ to fix something doesn't qualify as a fix in the traditional sense.
 

leonchu1225

macrumors newbie
Oct 15, 2020
12
8
Got a question and hopefully someone could help me test if you have the environment. :)
Since in my use case (would like to keep the lid open) the power draw will be high anyways, I plan to do something M1 Mac can't do super well now. Get 2x cheap 4k monitors (with DP port and HDMIs only) and connect them to my laptop. Would like to get a CalDigit TS3+ as well if I can "disconnect" monitor and cool laptop easily.

Plan to connect 2 monitors and a HD used for TimeMachine to TS3+.
My question is, because I will be powering via TS3+ as well as having a HD connected to TS3+ so I don't want to disconnect that one cable. I also don't want to go to the back of the monitors or TS3+ whenever I want to disconnect the monitors.

Would simply click the power button on the monitor (looking at Dell S2721QS, no power through, no USB-C) "release" me from the external monitors? My current one (NEC 2690WUXi2) doesn't. I have to physically disconnect from it. Or is there anyway to do what I want to do easily?

Also, would a 2 external + 1 bulit-in monitor be any more demanding than 1 external + 1 built-in monitor? When doing office work. Since it's already taking all the power that Radeon High Side need when it's one 1 EXT + 1 Built-in.

Hope my question is clear. Thanks
 

sg9

macrumors member
Jan 7, 2019
61
43
Also we mac users are big complainers

I got the HP Zbook Studio G7 and it is vastly worse than the MBP 16". We all dont love the heat, but I can tell you with absolute certainty that Apple have done a much better job than HP.

So my top tip of the day is - DO NOT BUY A HP WORKSTATION LAPTOP. YOU WILL REGRET IT MASSIVELY.

Mine is up for grabs if anyone wants it? 4 days old and in mint condition :) Can also be used to heat up a banquet hall.
Really that bad? Apart from soldered memory I thought HP did s good job. There are not many reviews so far.
 

leonchu1225

macrumors newbie
Oct 15, 2020
12
8
Got a question and hopefully someone could help me test if you have the environment. :)
Since in my use case (would like to keep the lid open) the power draw will be high anyways, I plan to do something M1 Mac can't do super well now. Get 2x cheap 4k monitors (with DP port and HDMIs only) and connect them to my laptop. Would like to get a CalDigit TS3+ as well if I can "disconnect" monitor and cool laptop easily.

Plan to connect 2 monitors and a HD used for TimeMachine to TS3+.
My question is, because I will be powering via TS3+ as well as having a HD connected to TS3+ so I don't want to disconnect that one cable. I also don't want to go to the back of the monitors or TS3+ whenever I want to disconnect the monitors.

Would simply click the power button on the monitor (looking at Dell S2721QS, no power through, no USB-C) "release" me from the external monitors? My current one (NEC 2690WUXi2) doesn't. I have to physically disconnect from it. Or is there anyway to do what I want to do easily?

Also, would a 2 external + 1 bulit-in monitor be any more demanding than 1 external + 1 built-in monitor? When doing office work. Since it's already taking all the power that Radeon High Side need when it's one 1 EXT + 1 Built-in.

Hope my question is clear. Thanks
Just answering to myself.


The remote control or the old fashion on/off switch on extension cord seem to be a traditional but neat solution.
Would you say that would harm the monitors in anyway?

Or is SwitchResX a good solution in your opinion?
 

richinaus

macrumors 68020
Oct 26, 2014
2,432
2,187
Really that bad? Apart from soldered memory I thought HP did s good job. There are not many reviews so far.
it is phenomenally bad. My 5600m is so much better in bootcamp it isn't funny - actually it is an embarrassment to HP. I strongly advise everyone to stay away from the HP Zbook create / studio G7 if you can. It is unusable as a laptop, which given it is designed as a laptop means it is one big fail.

It is faster than the 16" MBP but it comes at a very hot expense.
 

richinaus

macrumors 68020
Oct 26, 2014
2,432
2,187
You've never heard of the concept of a desktop replacement?
But they aren’t in my experience. Not even remotely close in fact. My desktop spanks the i9 10 gen zbook with 2070super in all ways (except being able to move it....).
My purchasing from now on is desktop power & laptop for quick work. I have been burnt (nearly literally) from buying laptops as desktop replacements.

maybe the new M chips will change all this .......
 

kzqbfxob

macrumors newbie
Oct 1, 2011
8
4
Yeah there is absolutely a class action brewing here with the 5300M and 5500M.

My response from apple was straight up dismissive: throttling the system to keep it cool is normal. Which equates to "you're holding it wrong"...

This MBP (2.4GHz i9, 64GB, 5500M-8GB) might as well be a goddamned macbook air because that's about the level of performance i can achieve before the system refuses to participate.

I have kernel_task completely taking over and throttling at modest workloads/modest ambient temperatures when using external monitors. My old 15" with a fraction of the specs handled the same monitors, software and workload without a sweat.
 
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sg9

macrumors member
Jan 7, 2019
61
43
it is phenomenally bad. My 5600m is so much better in bootcamp it isn't funny - actually it is an embarrassment to HP. I strongly advise everyone to stay away from the HP Zbook create / studio G7 if you can. It is unusable as a laptop, which given it is designed as a laptop means it is one big fail.

It is faster than the 16" MBP but it comes at a very hot expense.
Good to know, thanks. I was considering getting one for my company once they are available. Shrunk bezels compared to G6, lighter, centered trackpad, no numpad and trackpoint (worthless without middle button), seemed like a nice improvement to me.
 

dukee101

macrumors 6502
Jan 17, 2009
294
147
My old 15" with a fraction of the specs handled the same monitors, software and workload without a sweat.
This is the key. The 16" MBP marketing page is chock-full of false advertising. Quoting, with emphases my own:

"Designed for those who defy limits and change the world, the 16-inch MacBook Pro is by far the most powerful notebook we have ever made. With an immersive Retina display, superfast processors, advanced graphics, the largest battery capacity ever in a MacBook Pro, Magic Keyboard, and massive storage, it's the ultimate pro notebook for the ultimate user."
The 16-inch MacBook Pro brings a whole new class of performance to the notebook. Thanks to a more advanced thermal design, the Intel Core i9 processor with up to 8 cores and 16 threads of processing power sustains higher performance for longer periods of time — and delivers up to 2.1 times the performance of a quad-core MacBook Pro.
More advanced thermal architecture enables faster processing. The thermal architecture in MacBook Pro has been completely redesigned, featuring larger impellers with improved fan blades for optimal airflow and more heat-dispersing fins for more effective cooling. The resulting gain in cooling capacity allows MacBook Pro to deliver up to 12 watts more maximum sustained power.
This may all be, in a narrow sense, true, except that it's not practicably true, when one of the most common use-cases, especially this year, is to have the MBP docked to an external display, and connecting to said external display negates the new "advanced thermal architecture" and hinders performance. Add the fact that most people don't have a separate webcam, and rely on the MBP's built-in one, very few people run it in clamshell mode, which may or may not mitigate the issue (it certainly doesn't mitigate it for me).
 

richinaus

macrumors 68020
Oct 26, 2014
2,432
2,187
Good to know, thanks. I was considering getting one for my company once they are available. Shrunk bezels compared to G6, lighter, centered trackpad, no numpad and trackpoint (worthless without middle button), seemed like a nice improvement to me.

I am in the fortunate position to have maxed out versions of a 16” MBP, HP Zbook G7 and 13” M1 MacBook.

The 16” MBP is better in all ways to the HP, except if you want an SD card slot.
The MacBook has a
better screen [and I got the 4K dreamcolour version...]
Better trackpad
Better keyboard layout, and keys themselves are both as good as each other
better shell design
better thermal design

the HP has a slightly better CPU and slightly better GPU. Not worth the trade off at all.
Get the MBP and just run boot camp. It will run better than the HP. Unless you need CUDA, in which case get the HP [which is why I got it, but it gets too hot to type on when running those apps, so is useless to me].

Although I have to say the fans still do come on the MBP and it still gets warm at the rear, but at least you can still type on it. Just not close to as bad as the HP Zbook Create G7.

The MacBook M1 is awesome I have to say. Runs super cool and I will be 100% be moving to these when the higher end pro machines are released.
It is amazing what Apple has done with the new chips.
 
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WilliamG

macrumors G4
Mar 29, 2008
10,008
3,894
Seattle
I for one cannot wait for an Apple-processor-equipped MacBook Pro. I really, REALLY do not like my MacBook Pro 16" (5500M) very much. The thermals are an utter joke, the battery seems particularly flawed on my unit (41 cycles and already down 10%? Come on...), and not being able to use multiple displays of any sort (clamshell only) unless I want to suffer the wrath of a preposterously-loud system? Pfft.

So disappointing. So, so disappointing.
 
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richinaus

macrumors 68020
Oct 26, 2014
2,432
2,187
I for one cannot wait for an Apple-processor-equipped MacBook Pro. I really, REALLY do not like my MacBook Pro 16" (5500M) very much. The thermals are an utter joke, the battery seems particularly flawed on my unit (41 cycles and already down 10%? Come on...), and not being able to use multiple displays of any sort (clamshell only) unless I want to suffer the wrath of a preposterously-loud system? Pfft.

So disappointing. So, so disappointing.
I hear you. Probably the worst Mac product in a long time, but I think Intel have to shoulder a lot of the blame.
Based on my experiences I will never buy an intel mobile product again [desktops with good cooling are fine].

We are lucky Apple saw all this coming and developed their own chips. Apple mobile computers will completely obliterate PC mobiles for the foreseeable future I imagine. The experience between my HP and the new M1 in insanely huge [and both have basically come out at the same time !].
 

rioriojc

macrumors newbie
Sep 17, 2020
11
4
Los Angeles
A lot to dig through here...Is an eGPU (Razer Core X for example) still the best/only move to calm the fans and heat at this point? I'm a music producer with a 5500m equipped machine- mostly working in clamshell mode- and it is SO loud and obnoxious. Logic really makes this thing scream when its connected to my external (which is all the time). I have SwitchResX but Im not sure I was able to get anywhere with a custom resolution...

Not sure if the rest of the specs are helpful but here they are:

2.4GHz 8‑core 9th‑generation Intel Core i9 processor, Turbo Boost up to 5.0GHz
64GB 2666MHz DDR4 memory
AMD Radeon Pro 5500M with 4GB of GDDR6 memory
1TB SSD storage

Connected to: Asus PB278Q 27" WQHD 2560x1440

Thanks in advance!
 

flowsy

macrumors 6502
Aug 16, 2009
356
299
Germany
I hear you. Probably the worst Mac product in a long time...
If it weren't for this thread, I wouldn't know this machine is such a pos. (It is not!)
 

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panzer06

macrumors 68040
Sep 23, 2006
3,286
230
Kilrath
A lot to dig through here...Is an eGPU (Razer Core X for example) still the best/only move to calm the fans and heat at this point? I'm a music producer with a 5500m equipped machine- mostly working in clamshell mode- and it is SO loud and obnoxious. Logic really makes this thing scream when its connected to my external (which is all the time). I have SwitchResX but Im not sure I was able to get anywhere with a custom resolution...

Not sure if the rest of the specs are helpful but here they are:

2.4GHz 8‑core 9th‑generation Intel Core i9 processor, Turbo Boost up to 5.0GHz
64GB 2666MHz DDR4 memory
AMD Radeon Pro 5500M with 4GB of GDDR6 memory
1TB SSD storage

Connected to: Asus PB278Q 27" WQHD 2560x1440

Thanks in advance!
I guess I was lucky or a USB C connected monitor doesn't have this issue. I never had any issue unless I was using Final Cut Pro X or playing a Mac native game.

Once I bought the eGPU I haven't had fan issues even under most loads. It works with my Alienware computer as well (with Nvidia mobile 2070 that system was really loud under gaming load).
 
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