2020 Air Heatsink Modification Thread

[involuntarheely]

What about Safari while watching 4k videos?

yeah I mean it will run hot and loud doing anything that actually makes the 2020 different from the 2019.
people who do word processing or light tasks don't need any of the power increase, or (as the youtuber said) don't need to spend more for the i5 vs the i3.

and yes definitely Apple did this to not cannibalize sales of the macbook pro because the CPU on the Air is now very close to the CPUs on the macbook pros and Intel CPU have totally plateaued so the performance difference is minimal.

 

[KPOM]

I've got a heat sink question or two:

If you look at the MacBook Air teardown on iFixIt - https://www.ifixit.com/News/36480/theres-something-new-in-the-macbook-air - They show the design changes from 2018 to 2020 - both only have a heat sink (not looking at the 2015 version). The 2020 heat sink is even a bit bigger.

So was the 2018 MBA a bad design? Or was that adequate for a 7W chip (2018) compared to a 9W chip (2020)?

Is it wise to compare these to the 2015 MBA that had a 15W chip?

Instead of a heat pipe - can't someone design a thin add-on heat sink? One that someone else would work the kinks out of before I ever tried to use one?

I'm sure the heat sink has thermal paste underneath - Has anyone (youtuber?) tried to take a look and determine the sloppiness of it?

I'm a vim user over Visual Studio - but I'd like to know what the heat/fans are like for VSCode 'power user' - please let us know.

It seems to me that Apple designed the MacBook Air with the current generation in mind. They knew Intel's roadmap, and that it would no longer support fan-less designs like the 12" MacBook. The MacBook Air chassis seemed like overkill for the 7W Amber Lake chip (which wasn't that much faster than the 5W chip used in the 12" MacBook).

 

[high heaven]

yeah I mean it will run hot and loud doing anything that actually makes the 2020 different from the 2019.
people who do word processing or light tasks don't need any of the power increase, or (as the youtuber said) don't need to spend more for the i5 vs the i3.

and yes definitely Apple did this to not cannibalize sales of the macbook pro because the CPU on the Air is now very close to the CPUs on the macbook pros and Intel CPU have totally plateaued so the performance difference is minimal.

We dont know that especially since 13 inch MBP is rumored to have a whole new design with different monitor sizes to distinguish its identity. We dont know if it starts from 4 cores to 8 cores with AMD APU that Apple intentionally added AMD related codes.

 

[KPOM]

Define the intended uses. It's not Apple to decide who to use MBA or not. If you cant define the term correctly, this conversation is meaningless.
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I am arguing because that's how Apple designed. It's not just about the performance, it's also about stability. Since KPOM is not able to define the INTENDED, this topic wont gonna end.

It's marketed as a general purpose computer, which it is fine at.

Note that Apple specifically markets the 13" Pro for Photography, Coding, Video Editing, Audio, Gaming

MacBook Pro

MacBook Pro with M3, M3 Pro, and M3 Max chips. Up to 22 hours of battery life. The world’s best laptop display. Now in a new color: Space Black.

www.apple.com

They don't say DON'T use the Air for any of those purposes, but they aren't really touting it for specific higher-end tasks. They just say that it is up to twice as fast as the previous model, and talk about general features.

MacBook Air 13-inch and MacBook Air 15-inch

MacBook Air 13- and 15-inch laptops, now with the superfast M3 chip, perfect for AI. Lightweight, with all-day battery life and Liquid Retina display.

www.apple.com

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We dont know that especially since 13 inch MBP is rumored to have a whole new design with different monitor sizes to distinguish its identity. We dont know if it starts from 4 cores to 8 cores with AMD APU that Apple intentionally added AMD related codes.

Apple is unlikely to switch to AMD, at least not in 2020. I think claims of an AMD/ARM hybrid processor are a bit outlandish. And it's unlikely the MacBook Pro would be the first to introduce an ARM Mac. The Air or a resurrected MacBook would make more sense.

 

[high heaven]

r
It's marketed as a general purpose computer, which it is fine at.

Note that Apple specifically markets the 13" Pro for Photography, Coding, Video Editing, Audio, Gaming

MacBook Pro

MacBook Pro with M3, M3 Pro, and M3 Max chips. Up to 22 hours of battery life. The world’s best laptop display. Now in a new color: Space Black.

www.apple.com

They don't say DON'T use the Air for any of those purposes, but they aren't really touting it for specific higher-end tasks. They just say that it is up to twice as fast as the previous model, and talk about general features.

MacBook Air 13-inch and MacBook Air 15-inch

MacBook Air 13- and 15-inch laptops, now with the superfast M3 chip, perfect for AI. Lightweight, with all-day battery life and Liquid Retina display.

www.apple.com

Like I said before, that does not justify MBA's poor cooling system because there are a lot of people using MBA more than just simple tasks. We are talking about 10~15W CPU, not 4.5W CPU. How many times do I have to say that?

 

[Bolanders]

Like I said before, that does not justify MBA's poor cooling system because there are a lot of people using MBA more than just simple tasks. We are talking about 10~15W CPU, not 4.5W CPU. How many times do I have to say that?

I'm sorry but you are so off here. The Air is an entry level computer designed for folks like myself, my counterparts at work, my wife, etc which means a traveler who uses Office, some PDF manipulation, web, email, an occasional photo edit, messaging, calendar, streaming some Netflix or watching a movie or playing some music.

How you don't; get this is beyond me. The cooling is fine for its target market which as I just said is someone like me. AS someone just posted you want to do 4K video, large image edits, etc then move to a pro.

The fact that people who should have a pro are trying to push it to do more is irrelevant.

You can use the side of a wrench to hammer in a nail but it isn't the right tool or the best tool. Use it for what it is. What you are arguing is akin to saying the side of your wrench isn't a very good hammer.

 

[throAU]

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I agree with the eGPU as it's a waste, but I game on bootcamp on my MBP 16 and if I didn't get 32gb/2TB, it would be less than $3000 and it's faster than GTX1650 equipped Win10 "gaming" laptops (albeit the lower end). I'm able to play many recent titles on it, of course OS X stinks for gaming on it. I wouldn't consider it subpar(maybe you're thinking of price then yes it is). However based on price, the MBA is a horrible value for gaming as most Win10 gaming laptops at $1000 will kill it mercilessly (and I admit if I dumped $3000 on a win 10 laptop, I could get a 8 core cpu, 2080 Max q and a Miniled/OLED screen!)

if you “care” about gaming and own a mac it is far cheaper to just buy a dedicated console for it to get a better experience. it’s also far cheaper to buy a second computer for it than up spec a mac to handle it.

unless you need the gpu hardware for non gaming mac use, buying a gpu for a mac for gaming is about the most expensive way to get a second tier experience you can achieve.

 

[high heaven]

I'm sorry but you are so off here. The Air is an entry level computer designed for folks like myself, my counterparts at work, my wife, etc which means a traveler who uses Office, some PDF manipulation, web, email, an occasional photo edit, messaging, calendar, streaming some Netflix or watching a movie or playing some music.

How you don't; get this is beyond me. The cooling is fine for its target market which as I just said is someone like me. AS someone just posted you want to do 4K video, large image edits, etc then move to a pro.

The fact that people who should have a pro are trying to push it to do more is irrelevant.

You can use the side of a wrench to hammer in a nail but it isn't the right tool or the best tool. Use it for what it is. What you are arguing is akin to saying the side of your wrench isn't a very good hammer.

I guess you didnt read my thread carefully.

1. We are talking about 10~15W CPU on MBA. If we dont care about the cooling performance then it would be 4.5W CPU. Y series was intended to be a fanless laptop and yet we are talking about 10~15W CPU. Do you really think it's enough? TDP is at least 10W and still higher than 4.5W for fanless.

2. Your example does not represent all people. Steam already proves that people with MBA play games which is way more than simple tasks. When I mentioned video editing, it was about FHD editing with FCPX, not 4K. There are people editing 1080P videos with MBA. Some Adobe software are also meant for simple works.

3. Lack of proper cooling systems can cause a hardware issue. If it was TDP 4.5W, I wouldn't mind but guess what? Ice Lake TDP is around 10~15W.

4. Better than nothing. Apple is doing the same mistake over and over again. Even for normal uses, the MBA is way louder than an old gen MBA because the fan is not actually cooling instead of blowing hot airs.

5. Intel's TDP is not even accurate and it is a well-known issue. How do you even know if it's TDP 10W? Anandtech.com already argued about this several times.

6. Quad-core became useless due to thermal throttling as MBA 2020 can not exhaust the heat properly. So what's the point of adding quad-core if MBA 2020 cant use it properly for 100%?

 

[Bolanders]

Again pointless. If it doesn’t suit your needs then move on. It is absolutely adequate cooling for many as proven by numerous posts of people who have it and have had no issues. You saying a lot of people play games when 240,000 out of 24 million does not prove your point at all. It either is enough cooling or it isn’t. If it isn’t return it and get something else. It apparently is enough cooling for those who keep it

 

[KPOM]

Like I said before, that does not justify MBA's poor cooling system because there are a lot of people using MBA more than just simple tasks. We are talking about 10~15W CPU, not 4.5W CPU. How many times do I have to say that?

It’s a 9W CPU custom increased to 10W (Intel also offers a 12W cTDP). The 15W TDP U-series can be custom increased to 25W. It is a very different comparison. Apple is keeping it very close to 10W and not letting it stray higher. Intel designed the i5/i7 for short bursts of up to 3.5/3.8GHz, but not sustained output. How many times do I have to say that?

 

[kdm0505]

i think the pro 2020 MBA heat sync for intended use case are winning so far

 

[amit81]

2nd day using the macbook air i5, and ive noticed the idle temperature has dropped now. With Safari open, music app and whats app, it idles at 41-43 degrees.

Did a quick comparison running chess with my buddies 2018 Macbook Pro i5 2.3ghz. His cpu temperature stays around 90 degrees, while his turbo boost stays comfortably around 3.6.

My Macbook Air, the temperature is around 95-100 degrees, and the turboboost is around 2.9-3. After a little while, the fans do come on.

I personally never play games or will tax the laptop for consistent heavy use, that is what my desktop is for.

 

[nolenium]

It apparently is enough cooling for those who keep it

Is "enough cooling" really subjective, though?

So perhaps I'm just super ignorant about how Apple laptops are supposed to run now. When did it become the norm for an Apple portable to reach 90-100C during mundane or day-to-day tasks? I'm not asking sarcastically or in bad faith here, I genuinely am curious if that's ok for the life of the machine. I get it, Apple engineers know stuff and are smart. Just seems hot.

I'm typing this on a 2015 13" pro that never gets above 50 or 60C when tooling around (3-5 apps open, 10-30 chrome tabs). From what it *sounds* like, the new Air will get scorching hot (close to or at TJmax) when running a web browser + a software update. Is that ok? OK defined as "doesn't hurt the life/longevity of the machine" maybe.

If most ultrabooks run this hot (hitting TJMax when running almost anything that stresses the CPU) then I'll zip my lid, because I guess this is just a thing in this segment... computers running super duper hot. I just struggle to think of a time that my sister's old 11" air got that hot with a basic day-to-day spread (iTunes, iMovie, browser) open. That machine is still kicking 9 years later... will these Airs?

 

[throAU]

So perhaps I'm just super ignorant about how Apple laptops are supposed to run now. When did it become the norm for an Apple portable to reach 90-100C during mundane or day-to-day tasks?

Probably since 2015 with broadwell when apple decided to turn the fan OFF until required.

My 2015 13" Pro is right now sitting on 83 degrees with the fan running (but inaudible at the moment) and all i have open is outlook, a web browser and skype for business (idle). Maybe something kicked off in the background. I do have a VPN running to work.

Intel rate their CPUs as ok up to 105C, so below that it is up to the OEM to determine the noise/boost/heat trade-off.

Apple have gone for less noise and high boost before ramping fans up on a lot of their machines as they are aimed at "spiky" workloads (short periods of boost interspersed with long periods of idle), not continual sustained throughput (e.g., the air).

If you're doing continual sustained throughput you will be FAR better off with a desktop that has the cooling capacity to deal with that. Even apple's "pro" portables make a lot of noise when pushed because there simply isn't the space for large heat sinks and large slower spinning fans like there is in a desktop.

My 2020 i7 air should arrive today and will be doing the same workload so i'll have a direct comparison shortly. I don't care if it runs warm, so long as it is acceptably quiet.

 

[dgdosen]

One thing's for sure - with the COVID-19 and working from home, I'm more apt to work on my desktop mac and therefore have no real need for a new mac laptop (sure I want one, preferably nimble, new keyboard, lots of memory and no track bar)

I'll be happy to wait for the magical 14" MBP or hear if there's more shakeout on this issue over the next few weeks.

 

[amit81]

I have 13 tabs opened in Safari, whats app, music app, podcast app, photos and imessages open. My Macbook Air right now is at 50 degrees. Dont know why its reaching near 100 for others doing daily tasks.

Is "enough cooling" really subjective, though?

So perhaps I'm just super ignorant about how Apple laptops are supposed to run now. When did it become the norm for an Apple portable to reach 90-100C during mundane or day-to-day tasks? I'm not asking sarcastically or in bad faith here, I genuinely am curious if that's ok for the life of the machine. I get it, Apple engineers know stuff and are smart. Just seems hot.

I'm typing this on a 2015 13" pro that never gets above 50 or 60C when tooling around (3-5 apps open, 10-30 chrome tabs). From what it *sounds* like, the new Air will get scorching hot (close to or at TJmax) when running a web browser + a software update. Is that ok? OK defined as "doesn't hurt the life/longevity of the machine" maybe.

If most ultrabooks run this hot (hitting TJMax when running almost anything that stresses the CPU) then I'll zip my lid, because I guess this is just a thing in this segment... computers running super duper hot. I just struggle to think of a time that my sister's old 11" air got that hot with a basic day-to-day spread (iTunes, iMovie, browser) open. That machine is still kicking 9 years later... will these Airs?

 

[dgdosen]

2nd day using the macbook air i5, and ive noticed the idle temperature has dropped now. With Safari open, music app and whats app, it idles at 41-43 degrees.

Did a quick comparison running chess with my buddies 2018 Macbook Pro i5 2.3ghz. His cpu temperature stays around 90 degrees, while his turbo boost stays comfortably around 3.6.

My Macbook Air, the temperature is around 95-100 degrees, and the turboboost is around 2.9-3. After a little while, the fans do come on.

I personally never play games or will tax the laptop for consistent heavy use, that is what my desktop is for.

Curious - does it still get hot doing something like playing a video in Chrome?

 

[vyruzreaper]

All this talk and debate. Anyone find a solution to add a pipe?

 

[throAU]

All this talk and debate. Anyone find a solution to add a pipe?

Yeah, buy a desktop or pro macbook.

 

[vyruzreaper]

Yeah, buy a desktop or pro macbook.

lol, im more worried about heat/longevity than performance. I have a iMac for heavy duty work. Im "downgrading" from a 2017 MacBook Pro 15. Don't want a pro. Want portability without it burning my lap.

 

[amit81]

Curious - does it still get hot doing something like playing a video in Chrome?

Nah, its warm, but not hot.

 

[Bolanders]

Is "enough cooling" really subjective, though?

So perhaps I'm just super ignorant about how Apple laptops are supposed to run now. When did it become the norm for an Apple portable to reach 90-100C during mundane or day-to-day tasks? I'm not asking sarcastically or in bad faith here, I genuinely am curious if that's ok for the life of the machine. I get it, Apple engineers know stuff and are smart. Just seems hot.

I'm typing this on a 2015 13" pro that never gets above 50 or 60C when tooling around (3-5 apps open, 10-30 chrome tabs). From what it *sounds* like, the new Air will get scorching hot (close to or at TJmax) when running a web browser + a software update. Is that ok? OK defined as "doesn't hurt the life/longevity of the machine" maybe.

If most ultrabooks run this hot (hitting TJMax when running almost anything that stresses the CPU) then I'll zip my lid, because I guess this is just a thing in this segment... computers running super duper hot. I just struggle to think of a time that my sister's old 11" air got that hot with a basic day-to-day spread (iTunes, iMovie, browser) open. That machine is still kicking 9 years later... will these Airs?

Yes it is subjective. When I get mine tomorrow I will put it through my workload for a few days. If it stays cool and the fans are not constantly running then it has "enough cooling". If you put it through your workload and the fans constantly come on then it does not have "enough cooling".

BTW this is replacing a 2011 MacBook Air which still runs well.

 

[involuntarheely]

If you're doing continual sustained throughput you will be FAR better off with a desktop that has the cooling capacity to deal with that. Even apple's "pro" portables make a lot of noise when pushed because there simply isn't the space for large heat sinks and large slower spinning fans like there is in a desktop.

and you know what else desktops got? Fans on the heatsink
(jk here)

 

[KPOM]

lol, im more worried about heat/longevity than performance. I have a iMac for heavy duty work. Im "downgrading" from a 2017 MacBook Pro 15. Don't want a pro. Want portability without it burning my lap.

Don’t conflate CPU temp chassis temp. Even if the CPU is at 100 for the most part the chassis is fine.

 

[nolenium]

Yes it is subjective.

Fan noise and cool to the touch, perhaps.

Having the system (CPU) reach 100C/brushing against TJmax routinely as a daily driver? Without doing anything crazy intense? Objectively, that would be pretty awful cooling.

I have 13 tabs opened in Safari, whats app, music app, podcast app, photos and imessages open. My Macbook Air right now is at 50 degrees. Dont know why its reaching near 100 for others doing daily tasks.

Which is why I'm super relieved to see folks reporting stuff like this. Having an Air at $1000 that finally has 256 standard with a 4-thread i3 (enough for most folks) that does not get super hot during normal usage is pretty great! 50C with all that stuff open sounds lovely.